Why little or no consumer credit in Thailand?

[Brunolem]

26 minutes ago, rickudon said:

My wife never has any trouble buying fridge-freezers, fans, beds and many other things without any cash or cards - they just need an address. (alas!)

"they" just need an address...

 

Who are "they"?

[BestB]

Car can be repossesed and sold, washing machine or fridge not so easily and since local habits of not repaying are fairly standard, would be impossible for companies to recover money

[HHTel]

53 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

It's 68% according to my sources and whether we take your figure or mine as correct, that compares to 78.7% in the USA and 86.7% in the UK so I'm not sure why Westerners on this forum feel they are on some sort of moral high ground when it comes to consumer debt?

I don't see any evidence of Westerners taking the moral high ground.  The debt was only brought up in the context of this thread which is "Why little or no consumer credit in Thailand?".  That seems to have been proved wrong and has nothing to do with debts in other countries.

[Mark1066]

24 minutes ago, BestB said:

Car can be repossesed and sold, washing machine or fridge not so easily and since local habits of not repaying are fairly standard, would be impossible for companies to recover money

The non performing loans ratio in Thailand is currently around 2.9%, which would suggest that not paying money back is not a local habit but rather a ridiculous generalisation made by foreigners based on supposition rather than fact.

[Mark1066]

2 minutes ago, HHTel said:

I don't see any evidence of Westerners taking the moral high ground.  The debt was only brought up in the context of this thread which is "Why little or no consumer credit in Thailand?".  That seems to have been proved wrong and has nothing to do with debts in other countries.

People mentioning the 'local habit of not paying back' and stating that they wouldn't lend money to Thai people is not taking the moral high ground? Have you actually read the posts in this thread?

Edited September 11, 2018 by Mark1066

[BestB]

Just now, Mark1066 said:

The non performing loans ratio in Thailand is currently around 2.9%, which would suggest that not paying money back is not a local habit but rather a ridiculous generalisation made by foreigners based on supposition rather than fact.

Home loans ? Car loans ? Personal loans ? Unsecured loans ?

 

always a good idea to have a clue not only google before making comments on the “facts”

[HHTel]

1 minute ago, Mark1066 said:

The non performing loans ratio in Thailand is currently around 2.9%, which would suggest that not paying money back is not a local habit but rather a ridiculous generalisation made by foreigners based on supposition rather than fact.

Yep, let's knock all the foreigners for their stupid and inane remarks.  Obviously there are some who don't recognise a sensible post when they see one.  

[HHTel]

1 minute ago, Mark1066 said:

The non performing loans ratio in Thailand is currently around 2.9%, which would suggest that not paying money back is not a local habit but rather a ridiculous generalisation made by foreigners based on supposition rather than fact.

Yep, let's knock all the foreigners for their stupid and inane remarks.  Obviously there are some who don't recognise a sensible post when they see one.  

[Mark1066]

2 minutes ago, BestB said:

Home loans ? Car loans ? Personal loans ? Unsecured loans ?

 

always a good idea to have a clue not only google before making comments on the “facts”

NPL ratios include all of the above. It's a good idea to know what you are talking about before you presume to ciritise others.

[Mark1066]

1 minute ago, HHTel said:

Yep, let's knock all the foreigners for their stupid and inane remarks.  Obviously there are some who don't recognise a sensible post when they see one.  

here's some quotes from people not taking the moral high ground in this thread:

 

Probably because the words "lend" and "give" seem to have the same meaning here.

 

I wouldn't offer credit to anyone in Thailand. Would you?

 

Too many people in this country use credit and forget or decide not to pay it back.

 

Credit = Burnt fingers here

 

Not sensible posts, just a misplaced sense of superiority, something that seems to afflict many posters on this forum when it comes to discussing Thailand.

[BestB]

2 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

NPL ratios include all of the above. It's a good idea to know what you are talking about before you presume to ciritise others.

Precisely , should have an idea before repeating the nonsense , as stats are provided only for the banks , not finance company’s 

Edited September 11, 2018 by BestB

[Mark1066]

3 minutes ago, BestB said:

Precisely , should have an idea as stats are provided only for the banks , not finance company’s 

The BOT supervises and regulates both financial and non-financial institutions that provide credit so they would have access to stats covering both.

Edited September 11, 2018 by Mark1066

[HHTel]

11 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

he non performing loans ratio in Thailand is currently around 2.9%,

Well you started with the comparisons.  NPL in the UK 0.8% in the UK and Australia and 1.8% in the US.  Should I get on the moral high ground?

[HHTel]

8 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

here's some quotes from people not taking the moral high ground in this thread:

 

Probably because the words "lend" and "give" seem to have the same meaning here.

 

I wouldn't offer credit to anyone in Thailand. Would you?

 

Too many people in this country use credit and forget or decide not to pay it back.

 

Credit = Burnt fingers here

 

Not sensible posts, just a misplaced sense of superiority, something that seems to afflict many posters on this forum when it comes to discussing Thailand.

Every thread has a handful of miscreants.  Have you not learned to recognise the authors and filter them out.

[BestB]

6 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

The BOT supervises and regulates both financial and non-financial institutions that provide credit so they would have access to stats covering both.

Please post a link which states NPL ratio included all financial organisations not just the banks or at least wording which mentions anything else but the banks 

[Brunolem]

9 minutes ago, HHTel said:

Well you started with the comparisons.  NPL in the UK 0.8% in the UK and Australia and 1.8% in the US.  Should I get on the moral high ground?

To be fair, you could also provide Spain's, Portugal or Italy's ratios, which are far worse than Thailand's!

[Brunolem]

7 minutes ago, BestB said:

Please post a link which states NPL ratio included all financial organisations not just the banks or at least wording which mentions anything else but the banks 

What are you calling "financial organisations"?

 

Please provide a few examples, names...

[BestB]

Just now, Brunolem said:

What are you calling "financial organisations"?

 

Please provide a few examples, names...

A finance shop on every corner, AEON, capital leasing 

 

just a few from top of my head 

[HHTel]

8 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

To be fair, you could also provide Spain's, Portugal or Italy's ratios, which are far worse than Thailand's!

You're right.  6.7%, 6.9% and a whacking 16.4% in Italy.  

 

Of the huge Italian stat, just 3.1% are consumer loans.

[Mark1066]

1 hour ago, HHTel said:

Well you started with the comparisons.  NPL in the UK 0.8% in the UK and Australia and 1.8% in the US.  Should I get on the moral high ground?

If you're prepared to conveniently ignore the fact that countries like Austria, Denmark, Belgium, France, Spain, Ireland and Italy all have higher NPL ratios than Thailand (ridiculously high in the case of Ireland) then feel free to take the moral high ground. At least you've finally admitted that is actually what you were trying to do in the first place.

 

The simple fact of the matter is that you, and a few other people on here with a rather ridiculous sense of superiority to the local population, cannot admit that you are wrong so you resort to nitpicking. Whether or not the NPL figure I found includes non-financial organisations is not something I can be bothered to research and even if the figure is just for bank credit, it demonstrates that the vast majority of Thai people do in fact pay back their bank loans and credit card debts.

 

The fact the consumer debt to GDP ratio is lower in Thailand than it is in the USA and UK speaks volumes for the mentality of the average consumer in these supposedly more advanced economies. We can look at government to GDP debt next if you like - around 44% in Thailand and 105% in the USA. Still feeling superior?

 

I'm not sure what you mean when you say 'you started with the comparisons'? Are you suggesting we shouldn't make comparisons? One cannot make a judgement as to whether consumer debt in Thailand is high without comparing it to other economies. You might like to I guess, because then you can make factually incorrect statements without being challenged.

[Mark1066]

1 hour ago, BestB said:

Please post a link which states NPL ratio included all financial organisations not just the banks or at least wording which mentions anything else but the banks 

Do your own research, I'm not your secretary. You are just making yourself look ridiculous: when faced with the fact that 97.01% of Thai people do in fact service their loans, all you can do is nitpick about whether these figures include credit extended by non-financial institutions. You and others on here make uninformed assumptions about what Thai people do and don't do, perhaps due to the type of locals you associate with (?) and cannot bear it when it is clearly demonstrated that you are talking out of your backside.

[Mark1066]

1 hour ago, HHTel said:

Every thread has a handful of miscreants.  Have you not learned to recognise the authors and filter them out.

I have now. So that's what the ignore function is for....

[BestB]

9 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

Do your own research, I'm not your secretary. You are just making yourself look ridiculous: when faced with the fact that 97.01% of Thai people do in fact service their loans, all you can do is nitpick about whether these figures include credit extended by non-financial institutions. You and others on here make uninformed assumptions about what Thai people do and don't do, perhaps due to the type of locals you associate with (?) and cannot bear it when it is clearly demonstrated that you are talking out of your backside.

I thought so , as usual no credibility what so ever and google can not help , so will go on endless and pointless rants. 

[BestB]

9 minutes ago, Mark1066 said:

I have now. So that's what the ignore function is for....

Struggling with figuring out how to push this button ????

[rickudon]

2 hours ago, Brunolem said:

"they" just need an address...

 

Who are "they"?

Shops of course. Or companies. I have lost count of the times a new item appears and i am told - 'we pay in 3 months time, or xxxx baht every month'.Thank god she has her own shop now, so i do not get saddled with the payment!

 

Typically happens when i go back to the UK, so i am not around to say 'NO!'

[HHTel]

1 hour ago, Mark1066 said:

At least you've finally admitted that is actually what you were trying to do in the first place.

Is English your first language.  If so, you're not demonstrating a good command of it.  I have never taken the 'moral high ground' as you suggest most people are doing.

 

As for comparisons, you started comparing figures in Thailand with other countries unnecessarily.  I'm sure you can read and understand the question in the title.  Why not stick to answering that.

[Acharn]

On 9/10/2018 at 5:37 PM, CharlieH said:

Correct.

Lets not forget the extortionate % at the pawn shops too ! People handing in Gold. 

I don't believe I ever used a pawn shop, but I did pawn my gold necklace at a gold shop a few times back when I still had a gold necklace, and my memory is that their interest was quite reasonable.

[Acharn]

On 9/10/2018 at 5:49 PM, Brunolem said:

Quite a lot of exposure, and I indirectly mentioned the loan sharks credit in my opening post.

 

My point is not about getting credit in general, but getting it directly from the seller.

 

If Honda or Yamaha sell motorbikes on credit, a lot of them actually, why does Home Pro, for example, doesn't do the same for washing machines or flat screens?

 

Why let the population deal with dubious characters instead of using the classic system in place in most countries? 

 

If someone is ready to pay 20% to an outside lender, he will be more than happy to pay only 10% directly to Home Pro, or any other major retailer...

Well, providing credit is costly. You have to use money you could otherwise use to stock merchandise. Many businesses borrow that themselves. Most small shop owners don't have much capital. There's always a risk that the person buying on credit won't pay in the end. I was just in the Big C/V Square mall in Nakhorn Sawan and I noticed several booths with credit companies besides Aeon, which has the ATM/cash deposit machine up on the second floot. On the ground floor in the area with bank mini-branches Aeon had a good sized office, with two more of the ATM/ACD machines. Right after payday there are long lines at both locations, and there are friendly tellers/clerks at the ground floor office. Clearly this is the way the credit business developed here, rather than (most) individual businesses doing it themselves. These credit businesses don't charge the 20% the mafia types do, and they won't break your legs if you fail to pay. I don't remember what my late wife was paying, but I think it was about the same as we Westerners pay for normal credit cards.