SURVEY: USA -- Headed in the right or wrong direction?

[Brunolem]

20 minutes ago, billsmart said:

 The whole reasoning behind a union is to band together to try to help solve, or at least ameliorate, the inevitable problems. Going it alone in the world today, like the UK and Trump advocates, is, IMO, just not an acceptable goal.

This is a wrong reasoning.

Nature shows that the more resilient things are the smaller ones, not the biggest ones...and like it or not, we are part of nature.

The problem is that our inflated egos lead us to believe that we are "smarter" than nature.

 

Being neither Democrat, nor Republican, or anything else, my own political guide would be Small is Beautiful, written by the economist EF Schumacher, who describes a society which as different as possible from the corrupt and decadent one we are living in.

 

 

[billsmart]

1 minute ago, Pedrogaz said:

Excellent comment. One of the problems in the US is the media and it is difficult go get any socialist agenda out when the very word 'socialist' is used as an insult.....as in socialised medicine, in use in all developed countries of the world except one. Bernie Sanders was labeled a socialist. And the first thing a deplorable will say about socialism is "Venezuela". They don't say Sweden or Denmark or Norway.....no always socialism/Venezuela/100000000% inflation. A simple but nonsensical argument shuts down debate. If you asked people if they felt that income should be doled out more fairly instead of the CEO hogging 95% of it, then maybe you would get a different answer....

Yes. The problem is that that in the US, "socialism," an economic system, has been inseparably linked to "totalitarianism," which is a governmental system; and "capitalism" has been linked to "democracy." Actually, socialism is the economic system that is most compatible with democracy, and capitalism invariably leads to some type of totalitarianism, like a plutocracy (rule of the rich.)

For those that still don't "get it," socialism is just an economic system where everyone contributes based on their abilities, and everyone receives based on their needs. In contrast, capitalism is an economic system where everyone competes and rather than contribute, take, and everyone receives based on their abilities.

Socialism is the same model most families follow. Everyone does whatever they can to help. and all share in whatever the family has. Capitalism is like the Law of the Jungle. The strong excel while the weak suffer or die. 

That's why I am a socialist.

[JAFO]

2 hours ago, rskdev said:

Ok, Mr. JAFO,

 

1. For one. Trump has done many things. Just look it up. Another is, many people around the world would give anything to live in the USA. As a matter of fact. I have lived in Cambodia, Thailand, Lao, Myanmar and they always are interested in my country. I am moving to the Philippines soon to see what it is all about. I just like to see how different countries operate.

 

2. Forget about the Clinton era and Obama era. That is over. Unless you are like the rest of the mindless herd. Like in Africa you are lost from the main part of the herd.

 

3. Forget about letting more illegals in. Your tax dollar and mine are going for nothing that will come good of it. Build the wall and electrify it.

 

4. Well, its up to you where you want to live. Yes cost are very expensive in the US. I use to live in Hawaii. But that is way out of control now. I had my own house, built it myself, all paid for, no mortgage. But with all the taxes and everything else it got to be to much. Sold it all and moved to Asia. Things are less expensive here.

 

5. Well, if you feel that you have to keep up with the Jone's then that may be your problem. Just take care of your own. Why do you have to worry about what other people think. Raise you kids the way you want to.  I live very good here in Asia. I am not over the top by any mean. Just comfortable. Way more happy.

1) No doubt Trump has done many things, Sadly the few good things he has accomplished are negated by his behavior. I personally expect more from the leader of the United States of America.

 

2) As for Clinton and Obama era, Didn't vote for either of them. They served and all wasn't all that bad. Look at it now. You like what is happening now with Trump at the helm? He has made being President his own reality game show. He is too old to be President. And while we are on this discussion, Notice how the public has seemed to ignore the fact that he openly admitted he paid for sex with a call girl while married? His wife hides now as she is ashamed and probably hopes it all goes away. 

 

3) Building a wall is laughable. That's like building a screen dam to hold water. Ever heard of tunnels? If you feel safer and that a big 30ft wall makes you feel better then donate more money to the cause. Its a big waste of cash. Let me be clear. I hate that the US has been over ran by immigrants. It bothers me even more that they seem to get preferential treatment that born and raised American citizens aren't afforded. It needs to stop but a wall is not the answer. Its just plain dumb.

 

4) Do not get me wrong, I love the USA. I am sad to see it losing some of its appeal. The people you say that would love to come live there from other countries, Sure they do...initially. It all looks so good on the news. Even my wife and her friends that have lived and visited said life you see in the news is not reality at all. 

 

5) You made it personal. I never said I was trying to keep up with the Joneses. My observation is I have watched many many people do it. The states is all about consumerism and one up the other guy. Bigger house, better car, gated community, bragging about what school their children go to etc etc. Very few seemed comfortable living for themselves and within their means. This constant competition keeps people in deep debt. Their children suffer as all I see now is obese kids with a tablet or cell phone stuffed in their face playing video games versus the parent actually paying attention to their child. 

 

Do I see things getting better....No. Is that Trumps fault...Absolutely not. He is just another pawn in a big chess game. He will come and go like they all do. The American voters got what they voted for.  The ball that's in motion cannot be stopped or changed. Its up to the individual to make the cognizant decision to make it a better place.  

[patsfangr]

2 minutes ago, Time Traveller said:

I'm pretty happy living in a country like that.

My problem is the rest of the world when they ask military help from United States to protect them from any agressor nation.

Or, ask for aid money.

Or, expect Amrica to resetlle millions of the citizens each year

Or, want to sell goods to America freely but then block American products from being sold into their nations then complain about free trade.

 

And let me add, Time Traveller, that the same people within the USA who insist that America take all of those actions are the ones who love to accuse the USA of "imperialism" and "interfering in the affairs of other countries". I guess it's only "interference" if it doesn't agree with the liberal agenda, huh?

[scorecard]

3 hours ago, Pedrogaz said:

I don't much care what happens within the US, if they want to live with huge numbers of guns, cops that shoot unarmed blacks claiming self defence, rich that pay no taxes, poor education that discourages critical thinking and endless greed then that is ok. That is why I left the country.

 

But my problem is with the world outside that suffers from US bullying and aggression based on lies and false flags. The US sees itself at having the right to depose elected leaders, meddle in elections, spy including bugging leaders' phones, start wars all over the globe killing millions and blighting the lives of billions...then I have real problems.

 

If you are so stupid and dense to want to live in the US  where democracy is bought and paid for by corporations and the mega rich elite; where you are encouraged to go deep into debt to consume the meaningless baubles and stays symbols that they produce at outrageous prices....then by all means do it. But please don't inflict your awful values and way of life on other countries that wish to live more quietly and sensibly.

 

And in case you think I was one of the losers in the US, you couldn't be more wrong. America was good to me for a long, long time with a high level, ultra secure job in a large immensely profitable corporation. The US changed under George W Bush, after 9/11. With endless war then being actively promoted as the way to economic glory. It was based oglies and still is. The US has a fascist economic model in the true meaning of fascism ie the state and government each supporting and profiting from each other. Trump has added another awful dimension to this economic model...and that is an autocratic style of government. The historical omens for this are very bad indeed.

 

Plus I find the clowns big loud claims about trade imbalance a total laugh and very hypocritical.

 

In the earlier years of so called 'globalization' the US had no hesitation to get the best end of deals with other countries / companies in other countries. 

 

 

[billsmart]

3 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

This is a wrong reasoning.

Nature shows that the more resilient things are the smaller ones, not the biggest ones...and like it or not, we are part of nature.

The problem is that our inflated egos lead us to believe that we are "smarter" than nature.

 

Being neither Democrat, nor Republican, or anything else, my own political guide would be Small is Beautiful, written by the economist EF Schumacher, who describes a society which as different as possible from the corrupt and decadent one we are living in.

 

 

I agree with your comment that we, humans, think "we are 'smarter' than nature.'" That's called "hubris," and will, IMO, be our ultimate downfall.

But, I disagree with you assertions that the smallest things the most resilient. There is a myriad of examples of successful unions in nature. Fish shool, bees swarm, birds flock, and humans live in, at a minimum, family-related unions. First, there is the mother-child union, then the family, the extended family, the village, the province, the nation, and finally, the world. The error you make in your "smaller is better" argument is that when you operate as an individual, you either succeed or fail. When you operate in a group, some individuals may fail but some may succeed. In such a case, the group, the union, has a better chance of survival.

[ReMarKable]

4 hours ago, mauGR1 said:

Never saw a foundation getting lost, but a thin layer of paint getting peeled by the weather, quite often.

That said, America is not worse than any nation on Earth, just different.

It is certainly worse than it used to be.  People I have known since high school have turned into raving racists Trumpites. I personally don't want to go visit the US until we get a new president.  The persons who were in high school during the sixties and seventies, the recipients of the civil rights Act, learned nothing apparently during their high school years and are destroying the progress that I thought was permanent. Hatred against racial and ethnic minorities and women and other "out groups" is growing - sad.

[patsfangr]

3 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

I’ll submit my vote to this Survey in November 7th.

Damn, Chomper, you're going to be a day late. The election will be held on November 6th!

[jcsmith]

1 hour ago, patsfangr said:

The fact that Americans rejected socialism by electing a President who truly wants to put AMERICA FIRST is proof that the country is headed in the right direction. President Trump is leading America to precisely what Samui Bodah described. 

So many of the posters here have no idea about what is happening in America. They get their information from the extremely left wing American media; which uses a combination of lies, exaggerations, and biased speculation to hide the truth. The FACT is that the American economy is reversing the path to disaster that Obama's socialism had created. The unemployment rate is nearing an all time low, and that INCLUDES black Americans! Businesses are returning manufacturing plants from foreign countries. Taxes are lower, giving all Americans more money to improve their quality of life. And for the fool who said that "the rich pay no taxes", do a little research. The top 10% of income earners in the USA pay 75% of the taxes! Stop reading the lies from people like Hillary Clinton, Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, and the rest of the George Soros funded Democrats. America is doing MUCH better than it ever did under Barack Obama, the man who truly divided the country and incited the discontent and violence that grew during his 8 disastrous years in office. If the country can keep its borders secure, and prevent the invasion that the Democrats want, the REAL Americans will see improvement continue under its modified capitalist economy, with real opportunity for ALL  citizens continuing to rise. America will continue to be the bright shining light in the darkness that threatens to destroy the world. 

How exactly is he putting America First? By picking fights with the rest of the world and tearing down alliances? The stock market has continued to rise out of its slump from the recession created under Bush, but it was trending that way already under Obama. Corporate profits have skyrocketed but it hasn't trickled down to most American's, wages are completely stagnant while entitlements are being decreased, and the cost of living is rising. You mention unemployment, it was already trended down from 10% to 5% under Obama. See attached image to illustrate that. 

How can you say America is doing better now? We've been condemned by the U.N. over human rights violations. Our allies world wide are wondering if they can trust us? The U.S. image around the world dropped from 48% to 30% favorable, and unfavorability rose from 28% to 43% in Trump's first year in office. To put that in perspective that's 4% lower than it was after the invasion of Iraq. He's started trade wars, imposed tariffs on allies, attacked the justice system, and made a mockery of the office of president. Hyper-partisanship. Family separations. Increasing wealth distribution gap. Neutering of healthcare and entitlements. That's winning to you? 

 

 

 

[Brunolem]

8 minutes ago, Time Traveller said:

 

My problem is the rest of the world when they ask military help from United States to protect them from any agressor nation.

 

Yes sir, if you're dumb enough to not realize jut how positively America impacts the world, then by all means detach yourself from America and go and live without internet, TV, electricity, automobiles, aircraft, and anything else America created.

Since 1945, which countries have asked the US to protect them from aggression?

Vietnam? Irak? Libya? Syria? Yemen? ???

 

America today doesn't impact the world in the same way that it did a hundred years ago when the discoveries you mention were made.

 

Since the turn of this century, the declining American empire has become a bully, taunting the world with "you are either with us or against us" (W junior) to "we will completely destroy you" (Trump), imposing sanctions as if it was the teacher of all these lesser nations, that barely no American citizen can locate on a map.

 

Difficult to think of any positive impact that today's America is having on the world...

[jcsmith]

2 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

Since 1945, which countries have asked the US to protect them from aggression?

Vietnam? Irak? Libya? Syria? Yemen? ???

Actually many do. Europe (via NATO), Japan, South Korea to name a few. Protection doesn't always involve wars, prevention also matters.

[ReMarKable]

24 minutes ago, JAFO said:

1) No doubt Trump has done many things, Sadly the few good things he has accomplished are negated by his behavior. I personally expect more from the leader of the United States of America.

 

2) As for Clinton and Obama era, Didn't vote for either of them. They served and all wasn't all that bad. Look at it now. You like what is happening now with Trump at the helm? He has made being President his own reality game show. He is too old to be President. And while we are on this discussion, Notice how the public has seemed to ignore the fact that he openly admitted he paid for sex with a call girl while married? His wife hides now as she is ashamed and probably hopes it all goes away. 

 

3) Building a wall is laughable. That's like building a screen dam to hold water. Ever heard of tunnels? If you feel safer and that a big 30ft wall makes you feel better then donate more money to the cause. Its a big waste of cash. Let me be clear. I hate that the US has been over ran by immigrants. It bothers me even more that they seem to get preferential treatment that born and raised American citizens aren't afforded. It needs to stop but a wall is not the answer. Its just plain dumb.

 

4) Do not get me wrong, I love the USA. I am sad to see it losing some of its appeal. The people you say that would love to come live there from other countries, Sure they do...initially. It all looks so good on the news. Even my wife and her friends that have lived and visited said life you see in the news is not reality at all. 

 

5) You made it personal. I never said I was trying to keep up with the Joneses. My observation is I have watched many many people do it. The states is all about consumerism and one up the other guy. Bigger house, better car, gated community, bragging about what school their children go to etc etc. Very few seemed comfortable living for themselves and within their means. This constant competition keeps people in deep debt. Their children suffer as all I see now is obese kids with a tablet or cell phone stuffed in their face playing video games versus the parent actually paying attention to their child. 

 

Do I see things getting better....No. Is that Trumps fault...Absolutely not. He is just another pawn in a big chess game. He will come and go like they all do. The American voters got what they voted for.  The ball that's in motion cannot be stopped or changed. Its up to the individual to make the cognizant decision to make it a better place.  

Actually gerrymandering districts in favor of republicans got Trump the presidency.  Clinton won the popular vote, the true Democratic vote, by 3 million.  I blame Trump for the violence and accompanying hatred erupting now and for people like myself leaving their homeland for a country run by dictator which is more peaceful than USA.

[Brunolem]

20 minutes ago, billsmart said:

But, I disagree with you assertions that the smallest things the most resilient. There is a myriad of examples of successful unions in nature. Fish shool, bees swarm, birds flock, and humans live in, at a minimum, family-related unions. First, there is the mother-child union, then the family, the extended family, the village, the province, the nation, and finally, the world. The error you make in your "smaller is better" argument is that when you operate as an individual, you either succeed or fail. When you operate in a group, some individuals may fail but some may succeed. In such a case, the group, the union, has a better chance of survival.

I agree, but the unions you describe are still very small in comparison with the human constructions.

 

A fish school is efficient, yet limited in size...what humans are trying to do is to regroup all the fish in the Pacific ocean in a single school!

 

Another kind of human achievement is to build fortunes so big that 3 Americans own as much as the lower half of the population...or that Google and Facebook collect more than 90% of all the advertising revenues on internet...

 

 

[mcambl61]

1 hour ago, billsmart said:

The reason behind their union might be different, but the idea behind a union is the same: to combine disparate strengths to make a more effective whole.

I don't know to what you're referring when you say "the EU is regulating speech." Even if that were true, regulating speech has nothing to do with socialism.

I am opposed to the 2nd Amendment as written, or at least as is currently interpreted. You can read my opinion on that at http://www.billsmart.com/writing/opinion/2nd_amendment/2nd_amendment.htm   . I will admit, however, that I have at times lately thought the prohibition imposed by the 2nd Amendment might indeed come in handy during Trump's administration.

the ideas and reasons behind the unions were not remotely the same in any way. there is no logical way for you to spin in into that. it is amazing the lack of logic and common sense progressives lack.

 

EU speech regulating:

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2018/10/its-not-free-speech-criticize-muhammad-echr-ruled/574174/

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/2018/10/22/government-bans-phrase-fake-news/

but I am sure you will agree with the socialist approach to speech, the college campuses are full of this type of progressive nonsense.

 

 

your opinion on the relacing the 2nd amendment is a joke, but a few much wiser people had a much better reasoning than your obtuse opinion:

 

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms."
- Thomas Jefferson, Virginia Constitution, Draft 1, 1776 

 

"The Constitution of most of our states (and of the United States) assert that all power is inherent in the people; that they may exercise it by themselves; that it is their right and duty to be at all times armed."
- Thomas Jefferson, letter to to John Cartwright, 5 June 1824

 

"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.... The great object is that every man be armed. Everyone who is able might have a gun."
- Patrick Henry, Speech to the Virginia Ratifying Convention, June 5, 1778

 

it is a joke to think this right will be taken away, but alas, the progressive loons will never stop trying.

[patsfangr]

3 hours ago, rskdev said:

American Dollar, USD. Will always rule! As it still does this second, minute and hour. Look at other countries. What currency do they prefer? Banks are based on the USD, exchange rate is always based on the buying and selling of all currencies against the USD.  Just take a look at the FOREX market. A Trillion Dollars more or less is traded every day around the world.  Who controls that? Use your brain. Nothing will change.

Never underestimate the power of USD.

USA is heading in the projected direction according to its own rules established many years ago.

 

And all the other issues that are going on now, don't really mean jack. What it all comes down to in the end is money and resources.

 

By the way, I trade on the Forex Market. Very profitable.

AHA! The voice of (unfortunate) reality is heard from! That simple truth, RSKDEV, is the precise reason why socialism will never succeed. Beneath that, the reason why "What it all comes down to in the end is money and resources" is that it is not possible to eliminate greed, envy, and lust for power from the human psyche. We are all born with it. The majority of us sublimate those to some form of moral structure, based, in most cases on religious teachings. In other cases the damage that can be caused by those evil urges have to be controlled by some form of law enforcement. But those evils will always drive some people to want more than "the next guy". The concept of sharing everything equally is simply not "human nature". It never was. It never will be. Capitalism, when managed by some level of control (the level of which will always be argued), is the only way for a society to flourish, as American society has flourished. Yes there are poor. Capitalism, much like nature herself, is a cruel "survival of the fittest" economic model. That's where the control, and the endless arguments about the proper amount of it, come in. But I must ask all of those clamoring for socialism, and touting to the "great success" of that economic model in Sweden, Norway, Denmark, etc., a couple of questions. What is the average annual immigration level into those countries? How many people are leaving their homes, and risking their lives to get into the heavenly socialist societies of Sweden, Norway, and Denmark each year; as compared to the number doing so to get into the capitalist society of the USA? OK, one more question. How many people emigrate from Sweden, Norway, and Denmark to the USA each year; versus those who reverse that path? (You can check immigration numbers here: https://read.oecd-ilibrary.org/social-issues-migration-health/international-migration-outlook-2018_migr_outlook-2018-en#page23 ... If you do so, note the surge in Germany since they opened their borders to Muslims. But that's a subject for another time.)

[Ahab]

2 hours ago, billsmart said:

The US had always historically been like the EU. It is the UNITED States of America, just like the EU is the European UNION. I do agree that many "leftists," like me, would like to see the diminishing of nationalism and the rise of globalism. Many on the left, again like me, would also like to see a move from capitalism towards socialism. And yes, I know, many, especially those on the right, would not like to see that at all.

That is indeed several aspects of the widening, and unfortunately increasingly violence-prone, political gap between us. ????

No violent proclivities from me, I genuinely enjoy civil discussions with people that have different viewpoints than I hold. I will say you would likely not convince me that socialism is something that is as good as capitalism for lifting people out of poverty, but I could discuss it over beers and would never think about violence or even name calling. Different opinions are great and should be peacefully resolved at the ballot box. Just because someone like Trump wins is not the end of the world, if enough people want him to be out of office he will lose his re-election in two years. If enough people, in key states, still want him, he will win. That is the way the war of ideas is fought peacefully, and purposefully.

[Brunolem]

13 minutes ago, ReMarKable said:

 Clinton won the popular vote, the true Democratic vote, by 3 million.  

True!

Now, how many of these votes came from California?

More than 4 millions!

Meaning that, California aside, Trump won the popular vote.

Meaning also that without the electoral college, California and a few other states would decide who gets elected and that the country would be indefinitely stuck with a Democrat government!

[patsfangr]

4 hours ago, wwest5829 said:

And there world citizens is what we Americans are facing. I am a pilgrim in an unholy land. Well, I am hopeful, that in spite of the Republican Party taking active steps to restrict or stop American citizens from voting, my fellow citizens will go to vote in overwhelming numbers and close these peoples wrongheaded actions down!!!

HUH? The only votes the Republican Party is trying to "block" are those from unregistered people, people who are voting more than ONCE, and DEAD people. In other words, illegal votes manufactured by Democrats! 

[allanos]

4 hours ago, wwest5829 said:

We agree but....looking at Europe, looking at U.S., Australia, etc. what is the root cause of the current right wing, nationalist moves? I believe the 30-40 years of economic squeeze on the working middle class is the cause of most of the reason for the justified frustration/anger. Unfortunately these folks are reacting with their gut emotions rather than searching for electing reasoned representatives who have some intelligence and are not beholding to money interests.

Like Hillary and Bill Clinton? 

[jcsmith]

2 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

True!

Now, how many of these votes came from California?

More than 4 millions!

Meaning that, California aside, Trump won the popular vote.

That's a silly argument considering 12.5% of the United States population lives in California. 

[Grouse]

17 minutes ago, jcsmith said:

Actually many do. Europe (via NATO), Japan, South Korea to name a few. Protection doesn't always involve wars, prevention also matters.

Europe would prefer the USA to leave NATO. The USA is the only country to have called on NATO for assistance post 911. NATO already has two other countries with nuclear deterrents. The latest Trump disastrous decisions is the intermediate range nuclear missiles deal with Russia. Trump wants to throw Europe under a bus just so he can threaten China. American assistance is frequently late and frequently out of economic self interest. 

 

Save your huge money, stay home and play guns with your kids.

[allanos]

4 hours ago, rskdev said:

American Dollar, USD. Will always rule! As it still does this second, minute and hour. Look at other countries. What currency do they prefer? Banks are based on the USD, exchange rate is always based on the buying and selling of all currencies against the USD.  Just take a look at the FOREX market. A Trillion Dollars more or less is traded every day around the world.  Who controls that? Use your brain. Nothing will change.

Never underestimate the power of USD.

USA is heading in the projected direction according to its own rules established many years ago.

 

And all the other issues that are going on now, don't really mean jack. What it all comes down to in the end is money and resources.

 

By the way, I trade on the Forex Market. Very profitable.

 4 TRILLION dollars traded every day, and counting, in the Forex Market

[jcsmith]

Just now, Grouse said:

Europe would prefer the USA to leave NATO. The USA is the only country to have called on NATO for assistance post 911. NATO already has two other countries with nuclear deterrents. The latest Trump disastrous decisions is the intermediate range nuclear missiles deal with Russia. 

Nice of you to speak for Europe. Trump has certainly hurt relations there, but without the U.S. NATO would be vulnerable against Russian aggression.

[Grouse]

5 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

True!

Now, how many of these votes came from California?

More than 4 millions!

Meaning that, California aside, Trump won the popular vote.

Meaning also that without the electoral college, California and a few other states would decide who gets elected and that the country would be indefinitely stuck with a Democrat government!

Any chance of USA and EU swapping California for England&Wales? Win/win! ????

[billsmart]

17 minutes ago, Brunolem said:

I agree, but the unions you describe are still very small in comparison with the human constructions.

 

A fish school is efficient, yet limited in size...what humans are trying to do is to regroup all the fish in the Pacific ocean in a single school!

 

Another kind of human achievement is to build fortunes so big that 3 Americans own as much as the lower half of the population...or that Google and Facebook collect more than 90% of all the advertising revenues on internet...

 

 

I would like to see all human group together as a society regardless of where they are. Their geographic location is not important.

No, the capitalistic penchant for amassing large fortunes is not a unifying activity. As I've said in other of my recent posts, socialism is the unifying economic system that will allow all to both contribute and draw from the unified assets of the entire community. The larger that community is, the more assets, and yes, the more people that will need to draw from it. 

[Brunolem]

2 minutes ago, jcsmith said:

That's a silly argument considering 12.5% of the United States population lives in California. 

Not silly, just simple maths.

In a country where the population is roughly divided 50/50 between two political parties, one big state favoring overwhelmingly one of these parties is enough to tilt the balance...

[ReMarKable]

Maybe we should forget about Florida and Texas since they voted for Trump and might skew future elections similar to California?

[mcambl61]

52 minutes ago, Pedrogaz said:

One of the problems in the US is the media and it is difficult go get any socialist agenda out when the very word 'socialist' is used as an insult.....as in socialised medicine, in use in all developed countries of the world except one. Bernie Sanders was labeled a socialist

Socialist is insulting, unless you like to pay massive taxes.

Bernie is a socialist, and a complete idiot.

 

Socialism is merely a step towards communism, whether you like it or not.

"The goal of socialism is communism." Vladimir Lenin

 

Exactly what do you think this "socialised medicine" would cost if

the government provided all of it?

 

An independent analysis of Sanders's plan conducted by the left-leaning Urban Institute estimated that it would cost $32 trillion over 10 years. And those are just the financial costs. Socialized medicine's human costs are even greater. Single-payer systems the world over ration care and force patients to wait for treatment.

 

So stop preaching nonsense.

 

[CptnAhab]

1 minute ago, Brunolem said:

Not silly, just simple maths.

In a country where the population is roughly divided 50/50 between two political parties, one big state favoring overwhelmingly one of these parties is enough to tilt the balance...

Obviously you failed your math courses in high school...  ????

[mcambl61]

4 minutes ago, billsmart said:

Their geographic location is not important.

of course it is, so is their culture.