Septic tanks ?

[Joinaman]

Hi there

Looking for advice on the old style concrete ringed septic tanks

Have one installed in my house before I moved in

It's a three ring concrete tank with a concrete lid

Been here 2.5 years before I needed to empty it

Was emptied about 4-5 months ago, and is now full, and leaking out of the lid

Do these not have a way of leeching the clean water out onto the land ?

Due to the size of the tank, if not able to remove the water, then it would soon fill up , but not sure how we manage to last so long the first time. Have not seen pipe or water coming from this tank before, but had a properly sealed lid before , but since emptying , they haven't sealed the lid properly, so letting the water leak out

Anything I need to do ?", besides paying for it emptying , lol

Would I be better installing a plastic type septic tank that settles to the bottom and is eaten, leaving clean water to empty on to the land

Have not seen this type of tank before so don't know anything about them, so would appreciate any advice from more learned people

Thanks

 

 

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[grollies]

Buy a proper septic tank, bout B4,000. Install the outlet pipe to a soakaway. Your soakaway should be about 2m deep 2m square, fill with rubble to about 1m and cover back up.

 

Sounds like your existing concrete ring set up has a blocked outlet pipe.....it SHOULD have one, usually they just go to ground.

 

To get your microbes going get some EM from the garden centre and flush down the loo.

[Kwasaki]

You have old Thai style to make it work properly you may as well renew with a up to date system using the plastic septic tanks sold in DIY stores and having it correctly installed IMO. 

[grollies]

If you do go for a new tank make sure it's sat on a concrete base around 100mm thick with 9mm rebar. When backfilling the tank you should really use gravel as it won't compact like soil/sand. And fill the tank with water as you backfill around. It's quite simple if you have some diy experience.

 

Oh, and ONLY plumb in the toilet, not shower, sinks, etc.

 

Good luck with it.

Edited December 19, 2018 by grollies

[Joinaman]

thanks guys

will look for the blocked pipe, cos i assume i have one for it to last so long last time

but will also look at the merchants for new type tanks

jus a pain to dig the hole cos cant get a machine in so will have to be by hand

[Kwasaki]

11 minutes ago, Joinaman said:

thanks guys

will look for the blocked pipe, cos i assume i have one for it to last so long last time

but will also look at the merchants for new type tanks

jus a pain to dig the hole cos cant get a machine in so will have to be by hand

Three Thai guys dug out holes for 3 septic tanks in a day for us including trenches for pipes to make ready for installation. 

[Fruit Trader]

Blocked septic tank drama at aunts place recently. Replaced old cement tank with plastic and used concrete floor planks as base. New tank cased with rings because the ground is very soft and wet. Septic tank flows into cement ring tank which has a pipe running out into a gravel filled leach area approx 10M long.

 

 

 

 

 

[canopy]

You have a cesspit, not a septic tank. Cesspits are illegal in developed countries. A cesspit does not treat the waste, pollutes the ground water, and needs pumped out frequently. Cesspits do not have an outlet other than the bottom and you don't want one because that's raw human waste that will come out and smell bad and is a bio hazard. When a cesspit fills up you pay the pumping mafia whatever they shake you down for. Once the hole doesn't drain quickly enough for your needs you dig a new hole. It's a terrible system. But there is another way.

 

A septic tank treats the waste (though not 100%) and does not leak anything into the ground water. Secondary waste flows into a drain field underground where it is treated again and where grass can pull the nitrogen out of the soil. This system is long lasting, hassle free, and environmentally friendly. It's the smart choice. Why don't you get one.

 

[livram]

What is the approximate cost to replace concrete cesspit with plastic septic tank system?

 

Lived in this house 25 years. First 15 years it took over a year for 2 connecting 4 ring cesspit too fill up. Last few years it fills every two weeks. The water rises above the toilet outlet pipe and toilet doesn't flush properly. Air bubbles.

 

I have a feeling the ground under the cesspits have just gotten soaked.

[Mickmick]

26 minutes ago, livram said:

What is the approximate cost to replace concrete cesspit with plastic septic tank system?

 

Lived in this house 25 years. First 15 years it took over a year for 2 connecting 4 ring cesspit too fill up. Last few years it fills every two weeks. The water rises above the toilet outlet pipe and toilet doesn't flush properly. Air bubbles.

 

I have a feeling the ground under the cesspits have just gotten soaked.

a 1000 litre septic can cost 4000 baht and up, plus a couple of days labour, plus some extra piping for the overflow.

[steve73]

Most likely cause of a cess-pit repeatedly blocking is occasionally using toilet paper... It disintegrates, but doesn't biodegrade, and forms an effective seal on all the "leak points" between the rings, and blocks the ground pores further away.  Condoms, etc, an other non-biodegradables act the same way obviously.

But the point is, it can take years until the ground gets "blocked up", and then the tank fills repeatedly.

 

Check also for a permanently overflowing toilet cistern.

[livram]

1 hour ago, steve73 said:

Most likely cause of a cess-pit repeatedly blocking is occasionally using toilet paper... It disintegrates, but doesn't biodegrade, and forms an effective seal on all the "leak points" between the rings, and blocks the ground pores further away.  Condoms, etc, an other non-biodegradables act the same way obviously.

But the point is, it can take years until the ground gets "blocked up", and then the tank fills repeatedly.

 

Check also for a permanently overflowing toilet cistern.

Our cesspits have no ground pores further away but I think that over the years toilet paper has been flushed down the toilet. Do not have problem with overflowing toilet.

 

Live in village outside Korat Khamthaleso area. Finding anyone to do manual labor is helpless. People that want to work already have job and what is left are not very motivated and I wouldn't trust to install a install a septic tank system.

[eyecatcher]

On ‎12‎/‎19‎/‎2018 at 6:57 PM, Joinaman said:

thanks guys

will look for the blocked pipe, cos i assume i have one for it to last so long last time

but will also look at the merchants for new type tanks

jus a pain to dig the hole cos cant get a machine in so will have to be by hand

Yes digging is a pain, but not if you hire roadside labour for 500bt a day. two men will have it dug out in half a day., The disadvantage of a new septic initially is where to put 10 cubes of soil.

 

There is another way.....you could increase the volume of your existing tank. First and most important, get it sucked out as you will be removing the 2,3,4 rings and jumping in.

highly unlikely its built on concrete, so get some bod down the hole and dig out another 1m depth.

**Just make sure you shore up the sides to prevent collapse especially if it exceeds 2m deep**

Rings only about 150bt each, and gravel up around the chambers, this will allow excess to overflow out of the joints and prevent surface water in the soil getting in, although a high water table will negate that effect.

[livram]

6 minutes ago, eyecatcher said:

Yes digging is a pain, but not if you hire roadside labour for 500bt a day. two men will have it dug out in half a day., The disadvantage of a new septic initially is where to put 10 cubes of soil.

 

There is another way.....you could increase the volume of your existing tank. First and most important, get it sucked out as you will be removing the 2,3,4 rings and jumping in.

highly unlikely its built on concrete, so get some bod down the hole and dig out another 1m depth.

**Just make sure you shore up the sides to prevent collapse especially if it exceeds 2m deep**

Rings only about 150bt each, and gravel up around the chambers, this will allow excess to overflow out of the joints and prevent surface water in the soil getting in, although a high water table will negate that effect.

Digging deeper  and using gravel sounds good. Now only to find somebody around here to jump in and get it done.

[steve73]

55 minutes ago, eyecatcher said:

Yes digging is a pain, but not if you hire roadside labour for 500bt a day. two men will have it dug out in half a day., The disadvantage of a new septic initially is where to put 10 cubes of soil.

 

There is another way.....you could increase the volume of your existing tank. First and most important, get it sucked out as you will be removing the 2,3,4 rings and jumping in.

highly unlikely its built on concrete, so get some bod down the hole and dig out another 1m depth.

**Just make sure you shore up the sides to prevent collapse especially if it exceeds 2m deep**

Rings only about 150bt each, and gravel up around the chambers, this will allow excess to overflow out of the joints and prevent surface water in the soil getting in, although a high water table will negate that effect.

If there's no concrete base (unlikely for a ring pit), you leave the existing rings in place and simply dig out the bottom... by digging under the lower rings, they will all slide down - just keep adding rings on top as you go, although you might need to put a sturdy plank across the first new ring with some lads jumping to "break the seal" of the old rings and get them to move initially.  The locals all know how to do it.

 

I've seen them using the same method to dig a well with over 40 rings in place, perhaps 15m deep, with water continually flowing in through the joints in the lower 4-5m, and being continually pumped out...  Great to watch with a beer or two... and the diggers were grateful for some as well.

Edited December 21, 2018 by steve73

[eyecatcher]

40 minutes ago, steve73 said:

If there's no concrete base (unlikely for a ring pit), you leave the existing rings in place and simply dig out the bottom... by digging under the lower rings, they will all slide down - just keep adding rings on top as you go, although you might need to put a sturdy plank across the first new ring with some lads jumping to "break the seal" of the old rings and get them to move initially.  The locals all know how to do it.

 

I've seen them using the same method to dig a well with over 40 rings in place, perhaps 15m deep, with water continually flowing in through the joints in the lower 4-5m, and being continually pumped out...  Great to watch with a beer or two... and the diggers were grateful for some as well.

sounds logical and of course protective shoring as you go.....but not sure you could stand in a 1m diameter ring and be able to dig out and launch the spoil?????

 

Sure you havnt been watching cartoons?

[steve73]

14 hours ago, eyecatcher said:

sounds logical and of course protective shoring as you go.....but not sure you could stand in a 1m diameter ring and be able to dig out and launch the spoil?????

 

Sure you havnt been watching cartoons?

They fill buckets, and hoist them up.. teamwork..!!

I've used the same technique for a 1.5m deep (5 ring) drainage pit..  difficult (nay, impossible) to throw the spoil out at that depth even - with the Thai "Chawp".

[Fruit Trader]

14 hours ago, eyecatcher said:

sounds logical and of course protective shoring as you go.....but not sure you could stand in a 1m diameter ring and be able to dig out and launch the spoil?????

 

Sure you havnt been watching cartoons?

Drop ring method very common in LOS

 

 

[bankruatsteve]

I probably missed something, but making a bigger cesspit doesn't seem like a good solution to me.  Adding a 2nd tank (optional) along with a leach field would make it a septic system that shouldn't need emptying for years at a time.

[kamalabob2]

Every Builders Merchants Store that sells DOS septic tanks or Safe Septic Tanks can hand you printed directions in Thai and English. With Photos. Cess pits are a situation to be avoided if you have 3000 baht in your sensible size house building budget. 

[Crossy]

21 hours ago, Fruit Trader said:

Drop ring method very common in LOS

Nah, none of these new fangled concrete rings, this is how to dig a shaft.

 

 

[livram]

On 12/22/2018 at 5:42 PM, kamalabob2 said:

Every Builders Merchants Store that sells DOS septic tanks or Safe Septic Tanks can hand you printed directions in Thai and English. With Photos. Cess pits are a situation to be avoided if you have 3000 baht in your sensible size house building budget. 

Do these builders merchant's store have install crews available? I went to HomePro in Korat today and they didn't even know of anybody to call. None of the sales people seemed to be interested in talking about septic tanks.

 

Usually HomePro is great with assistance but the septic tank department was a miss today.

 

It would be almost impossible around this village to find the labor or have confidence that it would be installed right.

 

How much should it cost, approximate, to remove 2 cesspits(4 high each) and install a proper septic tank with the drain pipes, etc?

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, livram said:

Do these builders merchant's store have install crews available? I went to HomePro in Korat today and they didn't even know of anybody to call. None of the sales people seemed to be interested in talking about septic tanks.

 

Usually HomePro is great with assistance but the septic tank department was a miss today.

 

It would be almost impossible around this village to find the labor or have confidence that it would be installed right.

 

How much should it cost, approximate, to remove 2 cesspits(4 high each) and install a proper septic tank with the drain pipes, etc?

The things you have at the moment are not cesspits. To be cesspits they would have to be waterproof tanks & I can be sure they are not. They are a variant of a septic tank and while they are not as efficient as one of the ones pictured above they can and do work perfectly well in the Thai climate.

 

installing one of the plastic tanks isn't rocket science and is virtually always installed by a Normal building crew, that would be why HomePro couldn't help.

 

there are a few things to the installation and you can easily supervise them yourself.

 

1) concrete base 150mm with reenforcement

2) 1 week later put the tank in place making sure the inlet and outlet is at the correct height.

3) immediately fill with water

4) backfill with sand (do not use the earth you dug out)

5) enjoy.

[canopy]

9 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

The things you have at the moment are not cesspits

 

The definition such as wikipedia says it is a cesspit. Cesspits do not have to have a bottom. That is a variant.

 

10 hours ago, sometimewoodworker said:

They are a variant of a septic tank and while they are not as efficient as one of the ones pictured above they can and do work perfectly well in the Thai climate.

 

By perfectly well I guess you mean a system that needs pumped frequently and pollutes the ground water.  Cesspits are not a "variant" of a septic tank. Cesspits do not treat the waste. And not having a bottom means concentrated, untreated waste goes down to the ground water. Cesspits are banned in developed countries even when the climate is the same as Thailand. They cost too much money to operate and do too much environment damage. It's amazing in the 21st century so many can't imagine doing something better than than pouring waste in a hole in the ground.

 

[tifino]

gee, that Soy'l'uz-like design looks great!

 

i am in orbit over it's down to earth way of spreading all that weight...

[sometimewoodworker]

1 hour ago, canopy said:

By perfectly well I guess you mean a system that needs pumped frequently and pollutes the ground water. 

No, the current ring tanks we have in our houses haven't been pumped for at least 10 years and are as polluting as any plastic septic tank, they certainly are as effective as a plastic tank. If you think that the waste is not "treated" then after that length of time the "untreated" waste would certainly be thousands of litres

Edited December 25, 2018 by sometimewoodworker

[lopburi3]

Two cement rings tanks or one with a divider can perform the same as the commercial plastic units.  But at today's prices commercial units would seem the logical choice for most people.  And indeed if properly working will hardly ever require pumpout.      

[Ahab]

Cement rings are almost impossible to seal and should probably not be used in a proper septic system. The black plastic septic tanks are cheap, they work and if installed properly (and chemicals that kill the bacteria are not added to the system) they should never need a pump out. Only toilet waste should go into the septic system (including toilet paper).

 

Spend a couple of extra baht and do this right will save you a bunch of headaches down the road. I don't know about you but I don't want to ever have to deal with my septic system. Attached is a good guide for septic systems.

Septic tank Guidelines_Aceh and Nias.pdf

[livram]

48 minutes ago, Ahab said:

Cement rings are almost impossible to seal and should probably not be used in a proper septic system. The black plastic septic tanks are cheap, they work and if installed properly (and chemicals that kill the bacteria are not added to the system) they should never need a pump out. Only toilet waste should go into the septic system (including toilet paper).

 

Spend a couple of extra baht and do this right will save you a bunch of headaches down the road. I don't know about you but I don't want to ever have to deal with my septic system. Attached is a good guide for septic systems.

Septic tank Guidelines_Aceh and Nias.pdf

I have been convinced and only wish I replaced my concrete cesspits long ago. As soon as I can find a crew to do it properly the septic tank will be the project for 2019.

 

Do it right the first time and only have to do it once.

 

Thanks for the PDF.

[Ahab]

17 hours ago, livram said:

I have been convinced and only wish I replaced my concrete cesspits long ago. As soon as I can find a crew to do it properly the septic tank will be the project for 2019.

 

Do it right the first time and only have to do it once.

 

Thanks for the PDF.

For our house the locals that dug the hole for the septic tank charged 1 baht per liter (tank size), so our 1600 liter tank cost us 1600 baht) and our leach field was a another 1500 baht.