Move to make health insurance mandatory for long-stay visas

[Mapguy]

As  Meechai wrote above:

 

2- bad for the individual because I hate to say it but many Thai medical systems are just as corrupt as other Thai systems. If doctors know you have a locked account of 1-2 million available to them "if" they claim certain emergency operations are needed then they WILL be needed.

I know from experience....

 

Gross generalisations regarding corruption are unfortunately common on ThaiVisa.  As usual, short of pleasing beer buddies after a couple, such comments are as useful as dregs left in the mug.

 

Unsubstantiated claims toss-off remarks like "I know from experience..." allude to evidence or claims to follow.  OK, provide your evidence.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mapguy

[Bo Lindblad]

This proposal is designed by commitee representing the insurance industry.l am not so sure it will pass and if it will there must be exemptions.

[holy cow cm]

looking at K Bank insurance, it is not acceptable per their requirement suggested for out patient 40,000 bht.

K Bank is 1500 thb for out coverage. They have to be flexible. This coverage is only 22,000 per year to satisfy a requirement for immigration

 

[meechai]

18 minutes ago, Mapguy said:

Gross generalisations regarding corruption are unfortunately common on ThaiVisa.  As usual, short of pleasing beer buddies after a couple, such comments are as useful as dregs left in the mug.

 

Unsubstantiated claims toss-off remarks like "I know from experience..." allude to evidence or claims to follow.  OK, provide your evidence.

Actually I don't drink & am a triathlete in fine shape

At the most popular Thai Hospital (Chiang Mai branch) I was informed I needed a surgery right away for kidney & UPJ problems

 

Went to the USA where after various tests they laughed at me...But of course I was happy I did not need any surgery.

 

What evidence would you like & where should I send it?

I thought name & shame was out but if it is now allowed I can post the hospital initial doctor & also a surgeon who claimed I need this OP who seems to be quite famous in Chiang Mai as he also teaches

Edited January 2, 2019 by meechai

[Mapguy]

Some unhappy news for some if the government (despite apparent intentions at this stage not to do so) institutes the same three Thai-insurance-companies-only requirement as for the relatively new OA-X "ten-year" visa (See the url above) to contact the companies.

 

Peruse each company's requirements for coverage. There are various problems regarding eligibility (age limits), cost, and coverage, particularly for existing conditions.  Also --- and perhaps someone else dealing with these companies can answer the question --- what about the question of guaranteed lifetime renewability for each of these companies?

 

Ouch!

 

 

[LucysDad]

1 hour ago, Mapguy said:

Hare-brained. Well, no, not really.  Nonetheless, there is indeed reciprocity to consider when it comes to certain visa issues.  The government does so although it might or might not be relevant in this case.  To flip to a different case, as an illustration, GB requires a national (as I recall) to pick up financial responsibility for some foreigners on tourist visas. Thailand doesn't have a reciprocal policy of which I am aware.

 

 

Ha ha, sorry  - yes - HARE-brained, my bad.

 

There is no requirement for insurance, or any financial responsibility (re health) on anyone, for a UK standard visit visa. There is a IHS (Health Service surcharge) for settlement visas.

[DonaldBattles]

On 12/24/2018 at 10:34 AM, USMC RETIRED 2015 said:

You don't need Medicare to use Tricare here in Thailand....I use it for me and my family (2Kids)....the catch is you pay up front and you get reimbursed via direct deposit after you upload your receipts via Tricare Online. 

Tricare is only for retired military and their families not for ordinary Americans. NO HELP FOR ME AND OTHERS.

[CMNightRider]

58 minutes ago, fforest1 said:

Well if we can create enough hoops for farang to jump through we can finally get rid of these damm foreigners....lol

I think you are 100% right about creating enough hoops for the farang, and they will leave.  I believe once the farangs do leave, they won't return. Travel writers will have to write about other destinations for retired farangs, and how wonderful Thailand used to be.

 

I suspect the Chinese will fill the void as the farangs leave.  Personally, I don't think that will work out so good for Thailand but it seems as though this is what they prefer. ????

[Mapguy]

39 minutes ago, meechai said:

Actually I don't drink & am a triathlete in fine shape

At the most popular Thai Hospital (Chiang Mai branch) I was informed I needed a surgery right away for kidney & UPJ problems

 

Went to the USA where after various tests they laughed at me...But of course I was happy I did not need any surgery.

 

What evidence would you like & where should I send it?

I thought name & shame was out but if it is now allowed I can post the hospital initial doctor & also a surgeon who claimed I need this OP who seems to be quite famous in Chiang Mai as he also teaches

 

Well, glad to hear you are in apparently tip top health!  But you were Thai bashing, an unfortunately boorish sport here on ThaiVisa. 

 

Corruption?  I am no Holly-go-Lightly.  Yes, as in any place I have lived, there is some measure of corruption, but I haven't actually run into it personally in quite a few more than ten years in Thailand.  General Insinuation as favored by too many posters on ThaiVisa doesn't hack it; especially when you are talking about differences among medical practitioners.

 

I have personally run into a similar situation as the one you have written about involving a recommendation for surgery involving three Thai surgeons.  All three continue to be well-regarded in the medical community (one the chief surgeon at his very well-respected international hospital and the other two medical school professors in the same specialty).  All (operating in the same hospital) would have "profited" equally financially.  One recommended surgery, and we actually set a date.  I decided to get other opinions, usually considered a smart thing to, as you did.  The others said absolutely don't do it.  One was quite adamant.  Alternative medical treatment (fundamentally observation) was prescribed --- and, after two of three falls in this match --- I cancelled the surgery.  The initial surgeon acceded without complaint.

 

By the way, if there is a complication caused by the problem, it can be life-threatening --- so, yes, I keep a close watch. So far, so good.  But no triathlons!
 

Continue in good health!!  And a couple of beers might taste good with no harm done!

 

I will stand by my comment regarding cheap shots regarding corruption.

 

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mapguy

[CMNightRider]

1 hour ago, Pattaya46 said:

I don't see a problem. Any western card (visa, mastercard,...) allow you to buy online in Thailand and most countries, whatever currency this country uses.

 

You were IN Thailand, very different. People above suggested you should put 800k or 1 million baht in a Thai bank account to get your O-A visa, so you would have to open this account while you are in your country.... No way.

No one in their right mind would invest 800 to 1,000,000 baht while in their own country just to obtain a one year visa to live in Thailand and have to repeat this procedure year after year.

[Mapguy]

25 minutes ago, LucysDad said:

 

 

Ha ha, sorry  - yes - HARE-brained, my bad.

 

There is no requirement for insurance, or any financial responsibility (re health) on anyone, for a UK standard visit visa. There is a IHS (Health Service surcharge) for settlement visas.

Sorry, I guess I have been wrong, but I do remember something of the sort implicit within the invitation requirement.

 

Yes, the NHS is quite generous --- including with expatriate Brits who don't meet residency requirements but flee to the UK for treatment.

[Pattaya46]

8 minutes ago, CMNightRider said:

I think you are 100% right about creating enough hoops for the farang, and they will leave // Travel writers will have to write about other destinations for retired farangs, and how wonderful Thailand used to be.

Only a small minority of retired farangs stay in Thailand on a Non O-A. Impact would barely be noticeable.

 

1 minute ago, CMNightRider said:

No one in their right mind would invest 800 to 1,000,000 baht while in their own country just to obtain a one year visa to live in Thailand and have to repeat this procedure year after year.

Again. Easier and cheaper to use a yearly extension to live here, and as a  bonus you are not concerned by this health insurance requirement.

[Mapguy]

Not so fast, Pattaya 46! There might indeed be an insurance requirement coming up!  The current government proposal discussed for one-year long stay for retirement visas in The Nation article does require insurance, but not exclusively with a Thai company.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mapguy
spelling

[LucysDad]

15 minutes ago, Mapguy said:

Sorry, I guess I have been wrong, but I do remember something of the sort implicit within the invitation requirement.

 

Yes, the NHS is quite generous --- including with expatriate Brits who don't meet residency requirements but flee to the UK for treatment.

 

????  I wouldn't regard a British Airways flight from Bangkok to London as "fleeing".

[Mapguy]

What's BA got to do with it?  Actually --- come to think of it ---  it's about the quickest flight out!  Quickest for seeking medical treatment, perhaps.

 

"Fleeing" to the UK for treatment using a false residency address there to take advantage illegally of NHS services, perhaps not holding other health insurance valid in Thailand, or preferring regardless to get treatment with the NHS in the UK.

 

That approach to health care, unfortunately, might not work any longer under new Thai health insurance requirements for one-year long-stay retirement visas.  We'll have to wait and see.

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mapguy

[LucysDad]

7 minutes ago, Mapguy said:

What's BA got to do with it?   

 

 

 

I normally use British Airways if I go back for medical treatment.

 

 

(That obviously has nothing to with any Thai health insurance requirements on "O-A" visas).

Edited January 2, 2019 by LucysDad

[meechai]

42 minutes ago, Mapguy said:

But you were Thai bashing, an unfortunately boorish sport here on ThaiVisa.  ..... Corruption?  I am no Holly-go-Lightly.  Yes, as in any place I have lived, there is some measure of corruption, .....I will stand by my comment regarding cheap shots regarding corruption.

Call it what you like...We base our opinions on basically a sum of our actual experiences.

That yours may be different than mine does not make one right nor wrong

 

I do not think that calling a spade a spade is Thai Bashing & care not how long you have lived here ...I have been here since 2007 myself & Love Thailand & its citizens...that does not change certain things we have experienced. It is what it is & better prepares us for next time.

 

Lastly I will say unnecessary operations is not a Thai-centric  problem. It happens in many places

 

[Jumbo1968]

6 minutes ago, LucysDad said:

 

 

 

I normally use British Airways if I go back for medical treatment.

 

 

(That obviously has nothing to with any Thai health insurance requirements on "O-A" visas).

I am getting a bit confused as too what type of Visa and where obtained that the proposed Health Insurance will be mandatory.

i am looking at applying to the Thai Embassy in London for a Non O Multi Entry Visa based on me being in receipt of my U.K. State Pension. With this option I don’t require the 800k in the Bank and no Re Entry Permit is required although I need to leave Thailand every 3 months.

Whilst I normally return to the U.K. to visit my family every 3 months if I didn’t I could always do a ‘Border Run’ ?

[Jumbo1968]

23 minutes ago, Mapguy said:

What's BA got to do with it?  Actually --- come to think of it ---  it's about the quickest flight out!  Quickest for seeking medical treatment, perhaps.

 

"Fleeing" to the UK for treatment using a false residency address there to take advantage illegally of NHS services, perhaps not holding other health insurance valid in Thailand, or preferring regardless to get treatment with the NHS in the UK.

 

That approach to health care, unfortunately, might not work any longer under new Thai health insurance requirements for one-year long-stay etirement visas.  We'll have to wait and see.

A colleague of mine returned to the U.K. not for health reasons after living in Thailand for 10 years.

He suffered from a collapsed lung a few weeks after returning and was treated in an NHS Hospital,  I assume he was asked to sign a disclosure to say he had been resident in the U.K. for the previous 6 months ?

i believe if an expat returns too the U.K. after living out with the U.K. they have too wait 3 months prior to claiming benefits and free medical care.

Unfortunatelly if his skin had been a different colour he might have asked to provide proof of residency I think.

 

[Ban Phe Dezza]

On 12/24/2018 at 9:12 AM, giddyup said:

Correct, that's all it is, accident cover, and I believe they won't cover you over 70 either. At least my bank SCB wouldn't.

Hi I am 80 and have Bangkok Bank accident insurance cost is a little over 5000 Baht P A

 

[LucysDad]

24 minutes ago, Jumbo1968 said:

   I assume he was asked to sign a disclosure to say he had been resident in the U.K. for the previous 6 months ?

i believe if an expat returns too the U.K. after living out with the U.K. they have too wait 3 months prior to claiming benefits and free medical care.

 

Unfortunatelly if his skin had been a different colour he might have asked to provide proof of residency I think.

 

 

 

In reality not true.

 

You will NEVER be denied treatment at A & E (I keep 'active' on my doctor's surgery just in case).

 

In fact as far as skin colour goes being white, ageing, Anglo Saxon means you will not be asked to evidence residential status. Don't let the scaremongers scare you; understand the rules and act accordingly. Contrary to scaremongering they don't routinely check your passport.

[LucysDad]

39 minutes ago, Jumbo1968 said:

I am getting a bit confused as too what type of Visa and where obtained that the proposed Health Insurance will be mandatory.

i am looking at applying to the Thai Embassy in London for a Non O Multi Entry Visa based on me being in receipt of my U.K. State Pension. With this option I don’t require the 800k in the Bank and no Re Entry Permit is required although I need to leave Thailand every 3 months.

Whilst I normally return to the U.K. to visit my family every 3 months if I didn’t I could always do a ‘Border Run’ ?

 

 

Yours is not long stay (you are restricted to 90 days) and you are not affected by the new proposals.

[Mapguy]

3 minutes ago, LucysDad said:

 

 

In reality not true.

 

You will NEVER be denied treatment at A & E (I keep 'active' on my doctor's surgery just in case).

 

In fact as far as skin colour goes being white, ageing, Anglo Saxon means you will not be asked to evidence residential status. Don't let the scaremongers scare you; understand the rules and act accordingly. Contrary to scaremongering they don't routinely check your passport. 

"In fact as far as skin colour goes being white, ageing, Anglo Saxon means you will not be asked to evidence residential status. Don't let the scaremongers scare you; understand the rules and act accordingly. Contrary to scaremongering they don't routinely check your passport.

 

This assessment of racial assumptions is cringe-worthy!  Otherwise, in future, some had better hope they won't ask for passports or other confirmation of residence!

[steve73]

I know a guy who had been in T/L for over 10 years, with just the odd visit back to the UK in that time.  He went back a few years ago needing a hernia operation.  He needed a permanent address (friend or brother), registered with a doctor, and said he was permanently re-locating back to the UK. He was in hospital within a fortnight being sorted. 

Stayed for 6 months, and is now back in T/L (although he does still keep his own permanent address and pays council tax). 

[stanleycoin]

1 hour ago, Mapguy said:

What's BA got to do with it?  Actually --- come to think of it ---  it's about the quickest flight out!  Quickest for seeking medical treatment, perhaps.

 

"Fleeing" to the UK for treatment using a false residency address there to take advantage illegally of NHS services, perhaps not holding other health insurance valid in Thailand, or preferring regardless to get treatment with the NHS in the UK.

 

That approach to health care, unfortunately, might not work any longer under new Thai health insurance requirements for one-year long-stay retirement visas.  We'll have to wait and see.

I would sooner any British citizen get free heath care in the uk,  regardless of residency.

Rather than what we have seen in resent years, with people just lying to get into the uk, then helping themselves to all our free benefits !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

British citizens first, the rest of the world sod off. 

Oops 

 

[Ban Phe Dezza]

Not a baseball fan so maybe the wrong terminology 

 

Strike one  My embassy stopped our letters for Income/pension

 

Strike two  the exchange rates for Brits, Aussies and other Non Americans has basically made it impossible to meet the Proposed 65.000 Baht per calendar month.

 

Strike Three Proposed health insurance for OAP long term stayers will rule many of us ineligible

one can almost be guaranteed most I/O will interpret   the rules to suit them self's

 

In my Limited Knowledge Three strikes and your out 

No doubt the supposedly rich Keyboard warriors will say GO Home

which is surprisingly just what I am doing in 4 weeks time

a while back I posted 23 baht AU was my breaking point

My $2000.00 a month brings in 45.312.74 today as i am single

I guess my partner will be left behind 

 

45,312.74THB

1 THB = 0.0441377 AUD1 AUD = 22.6564 THB

 

 

[Jumbo1968]

17 minutes ago, LucysDad said:

 

 

In reality not true.

 

You will NEVER be denied treatment at A & E (I keep 'active' on my doctor's surgery just in case).

 

In fact as far as skin colour goes being white, ageing, Anglo Saxon means you will not be asked to evidence residential status. Don't let the scaremongers scare you; understand the rules and act accordingly. Contrary to scaremongering they don't routinely check your passport.

Not scaremongering factual from personal experience, Yes you will never be denied emergency treatment, I am a U.K. Resident, if I go too outpatients they always ask me if I have been living in the U.K. for the last 6 months.

When my daughter lived in Croydon, she is a Insulin Dependant Diabetic she always had too produce her Passport as a means of ID.

[Mapguy]

Ban Phe Dezza, You really have been cutting it close.  $(AU?) 2000 a month must be close to or under the poverty line in most developed countries.

 

Perhaps get married, Ban Phe Dezza?

Edited January 2, 2019 by Mapguy

[David Walden]

On 12/31/2018 at 9:00 PM, Mapguy said:

Ouch! 

 

Not knowing any more than the very general terms of your post, It appears that Pacific Cross is one broker that couldn't be helpful. It appears that they have avoided lifetime limits and guaranteed renewability.  That is unfortunate.  Starting rates at US$10k per year seems extraordinarily high.  You must have detailed quite a generous level of coverage.  But not knowing specifically what you requested, assisting conditions, age, and other pertinent variables, it really isn't simple to come to any valid conclusion.

 

You sound to be at some advanced age eligible for senior rates of one sort or other.  If not, many countries have provisions for those who can not qualify by age but not all, I suppose.

 

Your case is hardly "at rest," certainly if you have no insurance.  So, what plans did you make for self-insurance?

1

I am at a fairly advanced age and by the grace of God I'm in fairly good health.  I did work in the Insurance Industry for a few years when I was a young man.  When seeking Accident or illness insurance cover, brokers themselves do not provide the cover but take your premium and redirect the risk to a usually larger company who are involved in taking the risk.  A bit like bookies laying off the risk to another bookie at the horse races.  Yes, insurance is just gambling.  Brokers often seek business and lay it off to whichever major insurance company that will pay them the most commission.  Sometimes,  I have done much better after using a Broker in my business days going directly to the insurance company and negotiated a much better deal with better cover, at a much lower premium.  Unfortunately, worldwide collusion and cartels have made this nearly impossible to do today.  

   Yes, your comments about my advanced age and no insurance are of a concern as I assume it is for thousands of farangs in Thailand who have no cover.   Getting travel insurance for an Australian overseas only provides that the company providing the cover in the event you need assistance will provide tempory medical assistance to allow you to be repatriated back to Australia where once you arrive back can receive the Govt funded treatment.  If you read the fine print in all the contracts they are the same.  If you break a leg in Thailand spend a few days in the hospital they'll put in a cast put you on a plane and send you back to Australia to get the Govt free Medicare treatment ( not so bad) end of contract for them, that is in all the fine print says they have to do.  No ongoing treatment will be provided for illness or accidents whilst overseas.  I have just about read all the Insurance Compay policies fine print and they are almost word for word with each other...it's not real cover if living long-term in Thailand.  So I don't have any insurance but I can provide repatriation if so needed ( yes could cost a lot)...But that is not stopping me living much of my time in Thailand.  I just take the risk and ride my motorbike very carefully not very fast and not very far.  Sometimes to the pub and back again...very carefully, bike knows its own way home it's called Neddy, good name for a horse also.

[LucysDad]

44 minutes ago, Jumbo1968 said:

Not scaremongering factual from personal experience, Yes you will never be denied emergency treatment, I am a U.K. Resident, if I go too outpatients they always ask me if I have been living in the U.K. for the last 6 months.

When my daughter lived in Croydon, she is a Insulin Dependant Diabetic she always had too produce her Passport as a means of ID.

 

I wasn't suggesting that YOU were scaremongering..... there are enough others doing that.

 

I went back last and was not asked for any such ID........ ID, of course, is somewhat different to establishing residence.