Guatemalan boy becomes second child to die in U.S. custody in December

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, simple1 said:

trump has dramatically reduced aid to Central American countries to assist them to improve security for their citizens, assist with initiatives to improve the economy and other measures to minimise law and order problems. Accordingly, In essence, trump is contributing to the exodus of the peoples of the three main source countries. trump is an ignoramus by making decisions pandering to his base, which only create more problems for his so called government.

 

No doubt you would be fully informed of the above and endemic gang violence in Central American countries, the huge murder rate, death threats to families if they refuse demands for children to join gangs and so on. Humanitarian visas are usually provided when threat of government oppression etc is not applicable, but trump has dramatically reduced the number of visas available on an annual basis One assumes you are already informed of these matters???

 

 

 

So they are fleeing gang violence in central American countries to flee to the USA where gun violence (according to many on TV) and gang violence is out of control in most major cities. That seems to be very similar to jumping out of the frying pan and ending up in the fire. That story only makes sense if the actual reason they are coming to the United States is for something such as better economic conditions. I don't know where you got the information regarding the number of visas issued by year (the latest data I could find was for FY 2012). However under President Trump (in 2017) the number of H-2B temporary worker visas actually increased by 45% for foreign workers in some industries. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/07/17/trump-officials-order-15000-new-visas-for-low-wage-workers/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.6c2de35c76ec

[Ahab]

1 minute ago, Credo said:

The law is very clear.   You have the right to apply for asylum once you reach the US border.   That was denied and is being denied or delayed for many.   So Trump is not following the intent of the law.   

 

Whether they are allowed to remain in the US depends on the voracity of their claim to asylum.   They are pre-screened first and if their claim is seen as credible, they are given a full asylum hearing.   

 

 

The law is clear. Another thing that is clear is that about 93% of these asylum claims are found to be not valid. Of course by the time this decision is reached the asylum seeker is long gone and very difficult to find and deport. They are not prescreened because doing that would violate their right to due process, and some are coached on what to say when applying for asylum. The full asylum hearing can take a year or longer due to the process and the people are free to roam the country until that time and most do not even bother to show up for their hearing. I am all for people with valid asylum claims being let into the USA, but that is not what is currently happening on the southern border. Fleeing a country for better economic prospects is not a valid reason to apply for asylum and the large number of false or invalid claims for asylum is one of the reasons that the system is not working properly and effectively for the people that have valid asylum claims..

[Scott]

10 minutes ago, Ahab said:

The law is clear. Another thing that is clear is that about 93% of these asylum claims are found to be not valid. Of course by the time this decision is reached the asylum seeker is long gone and very difficult to find and deport. They are not prescreened because doing that would violate their right to due process, and some are coached on what to say when applying for asylum. The full asylum hearing can take a year or longer due to the process and the people are free to roam the country until that time and most do not even bother to show up for their hearing. I am all for people with valid asylum claims being let into the USA, but that is not what is currently happening on the southern border. Fleeing a country for better economic prospects is not a valid reason to apply for asylum and the large number of false or invalid claims for asylum is one of the reasons that the system is not working properly and effectively for the people that have valid asylum claims..

If you are going to post facts, then it is a wise idea to back them up.   93% of the asylum claims are not invalid.   The number varies from country to country.   For the Central American countries which are the primary group crossing, it is in the 70% range.  

 

https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/03/world/us-asylum-denial-rates-by-nationality/index.html

 

Asylum seekers are given a pre-screening, often referred to as a credible fear assessment.  

 

As far as asylum seekers not showing up for a hearing, that is a problem, however, there is very little that is done to make a reasonable attempt to track them.   Recently, in Arizona, the Border Patrol brought a large bus load of migrants to the local bus station and dropped them off.   Perhaps there needs to be a re-think on how to best track them.   I doubt any of those dropped off have a P.O.Box or street mailing address.  

 

 

 

[simple1]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

So they are fleeing gang violence in central American countries to flee to the USA where gun violence (according to many on TV) and gang violence is out of control in most major cities. That seems to be very similar to jumping out of the frying pan and ending up in the fire. That story only makes sense if the actual reason they are coming to the United States is for something such as better economic conditions. I don't know where you got the information regarding the number of visas issued by year (the latest data I could find was for FY 2012). However under President Trump (in 2017) the number of H-2B temporary worker visas actually increased by 45% for foreign workers in some industries. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/07/17/trump-officials-order-15000-new-visas-for-low-wage-workers/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.6c2de35c76ec

Trump reduced vetted asylum seeker visas entry by 50% to 45,000 p.a., for 2019 down to 30,000.

 

https://www.vox.com/2018/9/17/17871874/refugee-news-record-history-asylum

 

As the US currently has a backlog of approx one million applications, I would guess applicants will be waiting for years, as they do for UNHCR, with all the issues such as no work, schooling and minimum medical care, including those in Mexico.

 

Regards the various criteria for Humanitarian Visas see URL below, though don't know numbers actually issued.

 

https://www.uscis.gov/humanitarian

 

Central America has a much higher gang violence / murder rate than the USA. Currently there is an annual cap of 66,000 H-2B visas, but are an entirely different matter, therefore Off Topic. 

[Ahab]

1 hour ago, Scott said:

If you are going to post facts, then it is a wise idea to back them up.   93% of the asylum claims are not invalid.   The number varies from country to country.   For the Central American countries which are the primary group crossing, it is in the 70% range.  

 

https://www.cnn.com/2018/05/03/world/us-asylum-denial-rates-by-nationality/index.html

 

Asylum seekers are given a pre-screening, often referred to as a credible fear assessment.  

 

As far as asylum seekers not showing up for a hearing, that is a problem, however, there is very little that is done to make a reasonable attempt to track them.   Recently, in Arizona, the Border Patrol brought a large bus load of migrants to the local bus station and dropped them off.   Perhaps there needs to be a re-think on how to best track them.   I doubt any of those dropped off have a P.O.Box or street mailing address.  

 

 

 

While I will grant you that asylum rates vary from country to country, and I will also accept that my number was slightly off but was close for Mexico (89.9% denial rate vs my 93% number). http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/reports/448/  However your numbers are also off, the actual denial rates for Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador are closer to 80% (vice the 70% range). Overall my point was that the vast majority of asylum seekers requests from central American countries to the USA are denied and are not based on valid reasons to seek asylum but are more likely (my opinion) based on economic reasons and people seeking jobs.

[Scott]

28 minutes ago, Ahab said:

While I will grant you that asylum rates vary from country to country, and I will also accept that my number was slightly off but was close for Mexico (89.9% denial rate vs my 93% number). http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/reports/448/  However your numbers are also off, the actual denial rates for Honduras, Guatemala, and El Salvador are closer to 80% (vice the 70% range). Overall my point was that the vast majority of asylum seekers requests from central American countries to the USA are denied and are not based on valid reasons to seek asylum but are more likely (my opinion) based on economic reasons and people seeking jobs.

The rejection rates are:  

 

Guatemala, 74.7%

Honduras, 78.1%

El Salvador 79.4%

 

But it does not matter what the rejection rate is.   It matters that there are people, and a significant number, who do have a credible claim under the very strict US laws.  

 

Many of the people who are entering the US illegally have gone to the border and have not been permitted to apply for asylum.   After multiple attempts, they have entered illegally.  

 

I am not going to get into a discussion, but please stick with the facts.  

 

The law is the law and it is everyone's interest that it be applied as written and intended and that nothing is done to impede the law.   If the gov't wants to change the laws, there is a process of doing it.

 

For the record, asylum seekers are not refugees.  

 

 

[Ahab]

7 minutes ago, Scott said:

The rejection rates are:  

 

Guatemala, 74.7%

Honduras, 78.1%

El Salvador 79.4%

 

But it does not matter what the rejection rate is.   It matters that there are people, and a significant number, who do have a credible claim under the very strict US laws.  

 

Many of the people who are entering the US illegally have gone to the border and have not been permitted to apply for asylum.   After multiple attempts, they have entered illegally.  

 

I am not going to get into a discussion, but please stick with the facts.  

 

The law is the law and it is everyone's interest that it be applied as written and intended and that nothing is done to impede the law.   If the gov't wants to change the laws, there is a process of doing it.

 

For the record, asylum seekers are not refugees.  

 

 

From the link in my reply "Among the ten nationalities that had the largest number of Immigration Court asylum cases decided during FY 2011 - FY 2016, Mexico had the highest denial rate with nine out of ten (89.6%) turned down. The three Central American countries that have had large numbers arriving seeking asylum also had very high denial rates - El Salvador (82.9%), Honduras (80.3%), and Guatemala (77.2%). "  http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/reports/448/

 

I also do not plan on continuing this line of dialog. Bottom line is that most asylum requests from central American countries are denied.

 

Mahalo.

[bert bloggs]

13 hours ago, Credo said:

I have.   I took care of 3 refugee children for a number of years in Asia until they were resettled in another country.   No financial help, no medical insurance, no assistance to pay for schooling.   I paid for their medical, educational and all other costs.   Try that crap on someone else.  

 

We all believe you ,i have done the same paid for it all myself .

[simple1]

1 hour ago, Ahab said:

From the link in my reply "Among the ten nationalities that had the largest number of Immigration Court asylum cases decided during FY 2011 - FY 2016, Mexico had the highest denial rate with nine out of ten (89.6%) turned down. The three Central American countries that have had large numbers arriving seeking asylum also had very high denial rates - El Salvador (82.9%), Honduras (80.3%), and Guatemala (77.2%). "  http://trac.syr.edu/immigration/reports/448/

 

I also do not plan on continuing this line of dialog. Bottom line is that most asylum requests from central American countries are denied.

 

Mahalo.

From your link, more than likely still relevant today especially from those trying to enter from Central American at the US border with perhaps a 10 minute assessment...

 

in FY 2016 immigration judges denied these 4,515 unrepresented asylum seekers' claims 90 percent of the time. In contrast, if represented, the odds of denial last year was 48 percent. Or stated another way, more than five out of every ten represented asylum seekers were successful as compared with only one out of every ten who were unrepresented. This translates to a success rate that was five times higher when you had an attorney