Is Thailand Pivoting Away From The US With Chinese Arms Deals?

The ruling junta has drawn criticism for ramping up arms purchases from China. Is this just practical diplomacy, or something more?

BY JITSIREE THONGNOI

 

A toy tank in Bangkok's Government House. Photo: REUTERS

 

Thailand’s military junta is pushing ahead with arms deals even as a long-promised election day looms, prompting critics to decry a lack of transparency in the procurement process.

 

Last week, the army announced it was seeking cabinet approval to buy 14 Chinese-made VT-4 battle tanks in a 2.3 billion baht (HK$568 million) deal between Bangkok and the China Ordnance Industries Group Corporation, also known as Norinco.

 

If approved, it will be the third batch of these tanks supplied by the arms manufacturer following a 4.9 billion baht deal in 2016 for 28 VT-4s and another 11 that were delivered in 2017 for 2 billion baht.

 

Full story: https://www.scmp.com/week-asia/politics/article/2183707/thailand-pivoting-away-us-chinese-arms-deals

 

-- South China Morning Post 2019-01-28

"...If approved, it will be the third batch of these tanks supplied by the arms manufacturer following a 4.9 billion baht deal in 2016 for 28 VT-4s and another 11 that were delivered in 2017 for 2 billion baht.

That same year, the cabinet also approved the procurement of three S26T submarines from China worth 36 billion baht..."

 

A cynic might say that this is the last time that they can get such a large quantity of arms through a legislature. Not to mention the expected "red' envelopes. And, holiday visits to Beijing. And, who knows what else?

 

Thailand must have the largest, most complex military of any country that doesn't particularly have an expected enemy now or in the near future...

 

Truly shameless.....

 

Truly, truly shameless...

 

 

18 minutes ago, webfact said:

Thailand’s military junta is pushing ahead with arms deals even as because a long-promised election day looms, prompting critics to decry a lack of transparency in the procurement process.

Quote edited to more accurately reflect reality.

Most certainly I think the future of this place is China related not the US.

20 minutes ago, Samui Bodoh said:

A cynic might say that this is the last time that they can get such a large quantity of arms through a legislature. Not to mention the expected "red' envelopes. And, holiday visits to Beijing. And, who knows what else?

 

Thailand must have the largest, most complex military of any country that doesn't particularly have an expected enemy now or in the near future...

That does sum it up. 

As for pivoting, another overused word, garf. That was something you could debate and shoptalk when Obama was POTUS, with Trump, doubt he knows where Thailand is or cares.

They've colonised Sihanoukville & Pattaya; Bangkok is almost there.  The tanks will mute murmurs of discontent from the locals.

China is where the money is regionally and internationally, so yes, inevitably.

 

Chinese "clans" are where the money is, within Thailand so yes inevitably.

 

As for armament procurement (and many other areas of government spending), a general tightening up of procedures regarding "commissions" and other benefits throughout much of the world has meant that China is an attractive place to do business.

 

Moreover, in the last 25 years or so, Chinas ability to supply the products Thailand (and other countries in the region) seek has increased considerably.

48 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Most certainly I think the future of this place is China related not the US.

When China takes over. They won't have to move so much military hardware, it will already be here. Very cost saving for the Commies.

1 hour ago, webfact said:

Is Thailand Pivoting Away From The US With Chinese Arms Deals?

of course , thailand is in china's sphere of influence

Thais are xenophobic and they'll always be asian centric.

 

A rethinking of arms bought, spending 2.3 billion on tanks that can be taken out by a small drone flown into the weak points of the tank,

a dam sight cheaper one would think.

So who do they choose if it comes down to "your with us or against us"

Cannon fodder for China or allied to the rest of the world?

 

Choose carefully.

Tanks a Lot

great! the people pay for the tanks that roll into bangkok to overthrow their elected officials. literally paying for their own oppression...but let's stamp out corruption right ? lol 

40 minutes ago, YetAnother said:

of course , thailand is in china's sphere of influence

Not exactly. Sure China is the regional economic and influential power, but Thailand has a long history of military cooperation with the US. Similarly, they have cooperated with China on large infrastructure and other projects. They have tried to strike a balance.

 

However, as the US under Trump has "pivoted" away from, not toward Asia in Trump's supporters' anti-globalism efforts, Thailand would be wise to assess whether this isolationist behavior will be a short term (Trump is impeached or serves one term), or long term policy (Trump survives and wins a 2nd term). 

 

Until then, Thailand's just doing its balancing act.

Edited January 28, 20197 yr by keemapoot

Surprised military hasn't made the argument that it is cheaper to not maintain Chinese equipment than to not maintain American equipment.

Wouldn't that be a convenient reason to postpone the elections again because the date collides with Thailand's entrance ceremony as the 35th Province of the motherland?

2 hours ago, JAG said:

China is where the money is regionally and internationally, so yes, inevitably.

 

Chinese "clans" are where the money is, within Thailand so yes inevitably.

 

As for armament procurement (and many other areas of government spending), a general tightening up of procedures regarding "commissions" and other benefits throughout much of the world has meant that China is an attractive place to do business.

 

Moreover, in the last 25 years or so, Chinas ability to supply the products Thailand (and other countries in the region) seek has increased considerably.

I agree... but do you really think the arms dealers from other countries don't give "bonuses" ? I think they all are willing to do so up to a certain amount.

 

Anyway Id be suprised if deals like this are for national security, they are of course for the army to get some money. Just so bad that the country has so much corruption. Almost every large purchase or project is riddled with it. Why do you think people want to be in power at all cost.. to get rich of course.

I think they read a bit to much into this - nobody really cares about the quality of the weapons and military hardware - it is mostly used against unarmed civilians anyway.
There is a simple explanation - the Chinese very likely pay more tea money than the Americans.


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1 hour ago, keemapoot said:

Not exactly. Sure China is the regional economic and influential power, but Thailand has a long history of military cooperation with the US. Similarly, they have cooperated with China on large infrastructure and other projects. They have tried to strike a balance.

 

However, as the US under Trump has "pivoted" away from, not toward Asia in Trump's supporters' anti-globalism efforts, Thailand would be wise to assess whether this isolationist behavior will be a short term (Trump is impeached or serves one term), or long term policy (Trump survives and wins a 2nd term). 

 

Until then, Thailand's just doing its balancing act.

That is my take, as well, Thailand doing its attempt to keep allowed independence by playing the two current dominant powers. I realize that it is more complicated with the Chinese family tradition here and increased reliance on Chinese tourism.

3 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

"...If approved, it will be the third batch of these tanks supplied by the arms manufacturer following a 4.9 billion baht deal in 2016 for 28 VT-4s and another 11 that were delivered in 2017 for 2 billion baht.

That same year, the cabinet also approved the procurement of three S26T submarines from China worth 36 billion baht..."

 

A cynic might say that this is the last time that they can get such a large quantity of arms through a legislature. Not to mention the expected "red' envelopes. And, holiday visits to Beijing. And, who knows what else?

 

Thailand must have the largest, most complex military of any country that doesn't particularly have an expected enemy now or in the near future...

 

Truly shameless.....

 

Truly, truly shameless...

 

 

And to make matters worse Samui Bodoh, there's some good allies of Thailand (including the US) out there that would come immediatley to Thailands aid if required, Thailand under Prayut plays a dangerous game if the intention is to pit one country against the other, in a serious stuff up ( War) Thailand may regret the out come. 

Hey!,  China is getting a high speed railway built through Thailand, so why should the greedy USA get anything, what has the USA done for Thailand since The Donald got elected anyway?

Geezer

2 hours ago, LomSak27 said:

that doesn't particularly have an expected enemy now or in the near future...

Thailand sides with China.

Whatever enemies China has or gets will be Thailand's.

China. A great friend to have.

14 minutes ago, wwest5829 said:

That is my take, as well, Thailand doing its attempt to keep allowed independence by playing the two current dominant powers. I realize that it is more complicated with the Chinese family tradition here and increased reliance on Chinese tourism.

That Thai-Chinese family tradition is more cultural than political. Most of those families have been here for so many generations they have little in common with a lot of other Chinese Diaspora and many do not speak any Chinese. However, I agree with you completely that Chinese tourism is the future for Thailand, so they need to nurture that.

Taiwan just stopped military conscription, and they actually are threatened.  Thailand maintains the practice and arms itself for no known threat.   Should be on the voters' minds come election day.

Not sure you can 'pivot' when you are sitting on the fencerying for handouts from all sides.

4 hours ago, mikebell said:

They've colonised Sihanoukville & Pattaya; Bangkok is almost there.  The tanks will mute murmurs of discontent from the locals.

Lots of Chinese tourists in Pattaya, thats for sure. Colonised is a little strong when you compare Pattaya with Sihanoukville.

2 hours ago, stud858 said:

5 hours ago, LomSak27 said:

that doesn't particularly have an expected enemy now or in the near future...

Thailand sides with China.

Whatever enemies China has or gets will be Thailand's.

China. A great friend to have.

Not my quote .... need to pick up the Original and who posted it ... just pointing out , not whinging.

I would not read too much into arms sales from China being interpreted as a pivot from the US. First of all the 3rd rate weapons purchased from China are not needed to wage war offensively or defensively with neighbors but keep the peace in Thailand, so first-rate top of the line weapons are not needed. Secondly, and more important, the 30% kickback is very difficult to collect from the US or any western powers as it is against the law in western countries. On the other hand China or Russia, this is standard business operating procedures. Be careful not to get caught but the risks are small and the rewards high.

Yes, Chinese don't care if the junta rapes it's country as long as they get to infiltrate it and eventually take over. Yanks are a bit nastier and yap about democracy and such frivolous things.