BREAKING NEWS Foreigners now need to keep 800k in Thai bank for three months AFTER retirement extension is granted

[kevinsan]

Maybe they are getting ready to devalue to sync the Thai Baht with other currencies in the region. Load up and cut the rate. Just like in 97.

[notamember]

19 minutes ago, madmen said:

22 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

Why double payment?
The verification will be made only when you will ask for a new extension,
so you still need only one trip to immigration per year.

How will you show money in your account for 3 months AFTER the extension.?? Agent is long gone by then

Au Contraire

the new rules will bind you to your agent who does actually have the 800,000 and multiples of 800,000 to share around their clients 

for good agents this is good news

there will be less shopping around by users to get cheaper prices from cheap agents

''Agents'' without 800,000 to deposit for clients and currently rely on an IO relationship who just stamps it for another year for 12,000 baht with no financial evidence on file, not even a bankbook, will be phased out by immigration officials themselves

Those type of ''agents'' put their whole system at risk

 

 

[MyFriend You]

18 hours ago, MikeOKitches said:

Phenom Penh, Cambodia here I come. ????

sorry, I lived there for 2 years, not a chance in hell would I live there again.  But, the visa's are easier..........it's just easier to die in Cambodia than Thailand.

[skatewash]

13 minutes ago, xylophone said:

This leads on to a question I have................

 

I get two pensions paid monthly into my Thai Bank account but at the moment in total they fall short of 65K baht. So can I transfer the shortfall to my Thai bank on a monthly basis, thereby covering the 65K and some??

 

I was considering the 800k lump sum method but have just committed funds at home to term deposits at longer terms and good rates, so don't want to break those.

 

 

A possibility:

 

Have your pensions paid into a bank in the home country.  Top off that account to make the 65K transfer to Thailand each month.

[xylophone]

1 hour ago, madmen said:

New rules state that the money needs to be there for 3 months after extension. So another trip to immigration

How will your agent handle that

Motorcycle or car I would think!

[wgdanson]

14 minutes ago, skatewash said:

Yes, you're right.  I can't edit my previous criticism.  But you're correct you can guarantee that you meet the 65,000 baht per month deposit threshold.  Because the actual exchange from home currency to baht occurs it doesn't matter what exchange rate gets used.  The Thai bank account will show the actual baht in the account, so my criticism was not valid.  It would be a concern if you were transferring the money into a foreign currency deposit account but that's not what you were talking about.  Sorry, for the misunderstanding on my part.

I do have a Foreign Currency Account in GBP with Bkk Bank. But when I, or my pension company transferred GBP into it, the statement simply said No Book Tansfer from AcmePension Co. or from myself. I do however, have the paperwork from my bank and the company showing that £XXXX were sent to Bangkok Bank one day before the deposit was made into my FCA. I shall go to my friendly IO and ask if he will accept those as Foreign transfers even though those words are not used. Keep post for further news !

[alphason]

14 minutes ago, xylophone said:

I get two pensions paid monthly into my Thai Bank account but at the moment in total they fall short of 65K baht. So can I transfer the shortfall to my Thai bank on a monthly basis, thereby covering the 65K and some??

If thats the case and they don't care about the source of the funds (pension or foreign income), then there would be nothing to stop people transferring in the whole 65K monthly (40K for marriage) monthly, spend what you need and then a few times a year send the excess back to your home country. 

[wgdanson]

5 minutes ago, skatewash said:

A possibility:

 

Have your pensions paid into a bank in the home country.  Top off that account to make the 65K transfer to Thailand each month.

That would make things a lot easier this end, just one monthly transfer of 65k. So Mr IO can see it plainly.

[55Jay]

58 minutes ago, skatewash said:

How to maintain a poker face and just tell someone what they want to hear is basically the first lesson taught in diplomacy school.  Maybe our diplomats at the USE were all sick that day.

JMO, I think they tried to massage the Thais to a reasonable position, but they weren't having it.  Even the Brits and their self-provided proof of pension/income, wasn't good enough.

 

This latest move is tantamount to excising a few weeds from the lawn using an axe.  The beatings will continue until morale improves.  ????

[Ctkong]

2 hours ago, wgdanson said:

Can a European foreigner get a Work Permit only earning 35k?

Ci think work permit issuance depends not just the amount of pay but also the type of work you apply for. There are factories I know of who got work permits for Cambodian workers. Their pay is nowhere the teacher’s. 

[xylophone]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

The one part I've never been clear on with fixed deposit accounts and Immigration, assuming one's local office will accept them, is that they usually want you to update the passbook on the day of your application.  And at least in the past, I wasn't sure you could do a passbook update for a fixed deposit account unless there was some activity that occurred in that account, which there wouldn't be on the day you apply... So???

Used this method a while back and always got the bank to update my passbook the day before my Imm visit.....that way any accrued interest appeared in the book and statement, so Imm were happy.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, xylophone said:

Used this method a while back and always got the bank to update my passbook the day before my Imm visit.....that way any accrued interest appeared in the book and statement, so Imm were happy.

 

At Chaengwattana BKK, IME, they usually require the bank book to be updated the same day you apply...

 

[Lacessit]

37 minutes ago, skatewash said:

The light just went on.  You are right.  If the deposits are made in Thai baht then what you say is true.  I will go back and correct what I said about this previously if I can still edit it.

The problem with transfers from another country in Thai baht is running into what is called Dynamic Currency Conversion, which is another name for legalised theft by financial institutions.

[skatewash]

4 minutes ago, 55Jay said:

JMO, I think they tried to massage the Thais to a reasonable position, but they weren't having it.  Even the Brits and their self-provided proof of pension/income, wasn't good enough.

 

This latest move is tantamount to excising a few weeds from the lawn using an axe.  The beatings will continue until morale improves.  ????

 I can't forgive the embassies because nothing I have seen from anyone claims that Thai Immigration threatened to refuse to accept the embassy income letters.  As a matter of fact, all embassies that continued the letter are accepted.  The move by the "unilateral four" in stopping the letters was an unforced error that those country's citizens now have to deal with.  They were ill-served to say the very least.  Unilateral action is usually not considered the height of effective diplomacy.

[madmen]

If I had a family here and was struggling I would be applying for an immigrant visa to my home country.
In oz for example your wife after 2 years will get paid for actually not working [emoji16] and paid extra for having kids plus free Medicare and rent assistance and public schools that actually teach.

I will never understand why ozzies with family's choose to battle it out over here

[Ctkong]

2 hours ago, zydeco said:

Then why are they now tying up 400K that could be spent into a locked bank account?

It is all about financial ability to spend certain amount. Having 400 K in the bank is just the first level. With that amount untouched in the bank, you are free to spend whatever you have left. It is just like the Thai elite visa. Going to the bank to open bank account and credit card, I asked whether able to get platinum card instead of the general one. Why not? Said the officer. If you can pay one million baht for the visa, it shows the status level you are in. Moreover, regardless of what card you have, the limit is quaranteed by the same amount as in your fixed deposit. So thailand do not want you to spend your last penny .they want you to spend what you have and more. And not penny pinching either. That is the takeaway I get from their policies. 

[rumak]

18 hours ago, mlkik said:

800.000 baht is not very much if you genuinely have retired and have committed to living in Thailand.

Maybe the people getting worried do not really have enough to retire here? I know many people worry about the exchange rates,if that is the case again maybe they are not financially ready for retirement here?

I am far from being well off but I have put enough money in a Thai account to ensure a worry free retirement.

Interest rates here are no worse than my home country. I am not wealthy enough to speculate and possibly lose on the investment of stocks and shares . Therefore I see no reason not to have savings here.

 

So far there are 54 likes/ thanks      and 17 ...that do not like         I also did not make tons of money in my day, but managed to save so that I can live comfortably in my retirement.  This for me is by far more financially feasible in Thailand than my home country.  For others it may be different.  There are lots of choices in this game of life ( FYI....  i hate all the bureaucracy EVERYWHERE,  and the corruption (Everywhere),  and the preferencial treatment for some (everywhere).   I have changed countries,  changed living companions,  and changed lifestyles...... as life is change.   I think that 54 members will agree with me    and 17 will not  (so far).         stay tuned for the updates

[mokwit]

3 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The problem with transfers from another country in Thai baht is running into what is called Dynamic Currency Conversion, which is another name for legalised theft by financial institutions.

If you mean converting $ to baht before it reaches Thailand even though sent with instruction "remit as currency" you can reduce this risk by using a bank that has its own branch in Thailand and thus does not use a correspondent bank which is often the thief in these cases.

[Lacessit]

3 minutes ago, mokwit said:

If you mean converting $ to baht before it reaches Thailand even though sent with instruction "remit as currency" you can reduce this risk by using a bank that has its own branch in Thailand and thus does not use a correspondent bank which is often the thief in these cases.

You have obviously never dealt with an Australian bank. That's why we are having a Royal Commission now.

Edited February 1, 2019 by Lacessit

[skatewash]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

The problem with transfers from another country in Thai baht is running into what is called Dynamic Currency Conversion, which is another name for legalised theft by financial institutions.

I agree that it is almost always a big mistake to transfer baht into Thailand.  Baht is not a widely traded currency and therefore you will almost never get a better rate for buying it than in Thailand.  So yes, your home country bank is making money on doing the transfer from your country into Thailand if what is being transferred is baht.  

 

Dynamic Currency Conversion is another really horrible thing for the customer but it's really a different thing than what we are talking about above.  It comes into play when you agree to accept a bank's exchange rate (which is almost always considerably worse) than the major credit card (MasterCard, VISA) daily exchange rate you would otherwise be eligible to use.  It happens at some ATM machines and some Point of Sale (POS) locations.  The consumer should always decline the opportunity to get a much worse exchange rate.  But, of course, that's not how it's sold to customers.  They say they will show you what the cost is in your home currency and then they do.  So for seeing how much the cost is in your home currency, you pay a very high price.  Most everyone has a calculator on their smartphone.  Do your own conversion math if you need to know what the cost is in your own currency.  Decline the DCC offers from an ATM or a vendor.  Definitely not worth it for the consumer.

[mokwit]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

You have obviously never dealt with an Australian bank. That's why we are having a Royal Commission now.

No and I don't plan to knowing just a bit about the cozy moneymaking machine they have built themselves at customers expense.

[Pib]

17 hours ago, onera1961 said:

It says 2 months before and 3 months after. So, five months. After that you must keep 400K for the remaining of the year. 

 

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

I took that to refer to the original 2 month seasoning required. Otherwise 3 months. Unless they plan to drop the 3 month pre-seasoning requirement for subsequent extensions in favor or=f 3 month post-seasoning. But hard to see what that achieves, either way 3 months.

 

I think they mean 2 + 3 for the first extension then 3 + 3 thereafter.

 

But again, very poorly thoguh through - what are people going to live on during those 6 months?

 

My take (guess, vote, etc) is they changed the 3 month requirement to 2 months regardless of whether you applying the first time or subsequent times.  Instead of having a 2 months requirement for some (1st timers) and 3 months requirement for the rest, immigration just standardized on 2 months before applying. 

 

And then of course they threw the new 3 months after and also not dropping below Bt400K after that 3 months requirements.    

 

[mokwit]

5 minutes ago, skatewash said:

I agree that it is almost always a big mistake to transfer baht into Thailand.  Baht is not a widely traded currency and therefore you will almost never get a better rate for buying it than in Thailand.  So yes, your home country bank is making money on doing the transfer from your country into Thailand if what is being transferred is baht.  

 

Dynamic Currency Conversion is another really horrible thing for the customer but it's really a different thing than what we are talking about above.  It comes into play when you agree to accept a bank's exchange rate (which is almost always considerably worse) than the major credit card (MasterCard, VISA) daily exchange rate you would otherwise be eligible to use.  It happens at some ATM machines and some Point of Sale (POS) locations.  The consumer should always decline the opportunity to get a much worse exchange rate.  But, of course, that's not how it's sold to customers.  They say they will show you what the cost is in your home currency and then they do.  So for seeing how much the cost is in your home currency, you pay a very high price.  Most everyone has a calculator on their smartphone.  Do your own conversion math if you need to know what the cost is in your own currency.  Decline the DCC offers from an ATM or a vendor.  Definitely not worth it for the consumer.

Ok Imisunderstood what was meant by DCC. I was referring to SWIFT transfers that involve a correspondent bank (in particular). I avoid any bank conversion I can e.g on Amazon after comparing the two. HSBC charges 340 pips off interbank for FX transfers - they buy it off you at their rate which is 340 pips below interbank and sell it in the market 340 pips higher

Edited February 1, 2019 by mokwit

[Ctkong]

1 hour ago, Sheryl said:

I took that to refer to the original 2 month seasoning required. Otherwise 3 months. Unless they plan to drop the 3 month pre-seasoning requirement for subsequent extensions in favor or=f 3 month post-seasoning. But hard to see what that achieves, either way 3 months.

 

I think they mean 2 + 3 for the first extension then 3 + 3 thereafter.

 

But again, very poorly thoguh through - what are people going to live on during those 6 months?

Like some poster said. It acts like a bond .you are supposed to have other means of income other than just the 800,000tb. So the 800,000 is supposed to be ‘untouchable ‘ for most people unless needed unexpectedly. 

[notamember]

1 hour ago, madmen said:

Sounds almost impossible to be true but it does look like BJ is attempting to close the door on agents without actually going after corrupt IO'S and arresting them

This way the agents will just disappear if a second trip to prove $ in your account is needed

no it won't 

they agent will simply deposit and show money in bank again and pay again for seasoning to be overlooked

this is a benefit to agents with 800,000 baht

use money twice, charge twice, and pay IO twice

[Pattaya46]

4 minutes ago, Pib said:

My take (guess, vote, etc) is they changed the 3 month requirement to 2 months

regardless of whether you applying the first time or subsequent times.  //

Agree. This is the simplification part of this addendum. 

For the other parts... 

[CMNightRider]

1 hour ago, Thaimarkz said:

Well, in the country where I come from Thai citizens have to pay tax and must have a health insurance. I don't have to pay tax in Thailand and I am not forced (not yet) to have a health insurance. I have one but it was my free decision. It seems logic to me, that a country requires something of immigrants. And I think Thailand does not require from immigrants too much. Expats, being unable or unwilling to abide the immigration monetary requirements are not welcome in any country and will be sent away. Personally, these expats do not affect me, unless I have to accept harder changes in the laws because of their inability to fulfill a minimum of requirements. If you get into trouble due to a reluctant emigrant or face higher demands, I would wonder to whom you would like to send the fleas of a thousand camels

I'm not certain where you come from but a Thai immigrant living in the US doesn't have to pay taxes unless they have a substantial income from their employment.  If I were to take my Thai wife back to the US, she would just be a deduction on my taxes as she is now.  

 

As to the flea comment, I would just hope the pompous haters posting smug comments about the many foreigners this nonsense is effecting be the recipients of those fleas.  Thanks for asking, and may you enjoy the fleas, lol ????

[JLCrab]

7 minutes ago, notamember said:

they agent will simply deposit and show money in bank again and pay again for seasoning to be overlooked

From the Thai Immigration Act 2522 (1979):

 

(3) Application for extension of temporary stay in the Kingdom under Section 35, per person, each time 2,000 baht

 

So as long as your friendly IMM officer is paid no more than 2000 baht for the TM7 type extension in total, maybe no big deal.

 

[Lacessit]

1 minute ago, notamember said:

no it won't 

they agent will simply deposit and show money in bank again and pay again for seasoning to be overlooked

this is a benefit to agents with 800,000 baht

use money twice, charge twice, and pay IO twice

You may be right. However, you could be wrong.

My experience with CM Immigration, over about 8 years, is as follows ( using an agent )

Up until last year, my extensions at CM were a breeze - about 30 minutes usually.

Last year, the head of CM Immigration was removed from his post. My extension in November took nearly 2 hours. Heaven knows how long it took for those without an agent. The officer looking over my bank statements did so very carefully.

From that, I am drawing the conclusion the days of IO's getting bribes to overlook deficiencies in extension applications could be over.

 

[madmen]

no it won't 
they agent will simply deposit and show money in bank again and pay again for seasoning to be overlooked
this is a benefit to agents with 800,000 baht
use money twice, charge twice, and pay IO twice

Remember we are talking about those that are struggling. Paying 50 k a year would have a big impact on a family with kids.

The guys that were paying agents for convenience are not going to pay double IMO. There is a point where common sense kicks in.

The wealthy expats just buy an elite visa.