1 hour ago, rixalex said:

I agree there would be pressure on negotiators to buckle down and sort out deals ASAP, but i don't agree it would be to the point of Britain having to "go begging for deals", and maybe having a bit of urgency might not be such a bad thing for focusing minds and getting on with things. I think this simply comes down to how much confidence and belief you have in the country and how much you don't.

 

UK is not in the mess it is in because people voted to leave. The politicians were the ones who decided that they would turn the decision over to the people. The politicians should have prepared for the vote going either way. They didn't. They prepared only for the vote going the way they wanted it to. It didn't, and ever since, they, or at least most of them, have been trying to find ways of getting out of following through on what they promised, cheered on and encouraged by remainers in the media and in the public, like you. Remainers have been behind this mess from start to finish.

Again, everything wrong in the Brexiteer’s world is the fault of someone else.

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Again, everything wrong in the Brexiteer’s world is the fault of someone else.

No. Everything wrong in the Remainer's world. which includes a Parliament that is almost entirely full of your fellow "let's try to thwart, undermine, disrupt and block the leaving process as much as we can" remain friends, is nothing to do with us.

4 minutes ago, rixalex said:

No. Everything wrong in the Remainer's world. which includes a Parliament that is almost entirely full of your fellow "let's try to thwart, undermine, disrupt and block the leaving process as much as we can" remain friends, is nothing to do with us.

Then you would have to blame yourself because you voted those people in. 

Again, everything wrong in the Brexiteer’s world is the fault of someone else.

And for Remainers it’s the fault of Brexiteers for deigning to vote Leave.
Why can you not see that the current problems are caused by our politicians and civil servants for not respecting the referendum result and proceeding to an orderly Brexit? For the most part they, with the combined Remain lobby and EU, have concentrated on subversion instead of getting on with the real job in hand.
You’ve all wasted three years, while we slip nicely into a No Deal exit.


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5 hours ago, samran said:

Boy that is a bit muddled written by someone who knows nothing about economics and trade. 

 

You know when people EXPORT goods that they don’t need to be inspected by customs on the way out from the EU (or anywhere else). 

 

And for someone who has just accused me of being some sort of heartless corporate so and so, your proposal to allow companies to ‘self regulate’ on payment custom duties comes right out of the playbook of a corporate lobbyist. All your proposal will do is lead to massive smuggling and under reporting. 

 

 

"Boy that is a bit muddled written by someone who knows nothing about economics and trade."

 

Do you personally know the person who wrote that?

 

Know his name, where he lives, his educational level, in fact do you know ANYTHING ABOUT HIM AT.

 

You arrogantly dismiss him as if he is of consequence yet believe yourself to be his superior.

 

Ignorance and arrogance combined. Wow.

Edited February 5, 20197 yr by billd766
Added extra text

2 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Then you would have to blame yourself because you voted those people in. 

So then when a politician is found to be corrupt or some other such indiscretion or failure of duty, welovesundayatspace is of the opinion that it is not the fault of the politician, but the fault of the public for having voted them in.

 

Yet another absurd argument brought to you by the people of remain.

 

 

3 minutes ago, Loiner said:

And for Remainers it’s the fault of Brexiteers for deigning to vote Leave.
Why can you not see that the current problems are caused by our politicians and civil servants for not respecting the referendum result and proceeding to an orderly Brexit? For the most part they, with the combined Remain lobby and EU, have concentrated on subversion instead of getting on with the real job in hand.
You’ve all wasted three years, while we slip nicely into a No Deal exit.


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You vote for something, you own it.

 

You don’t vote for something, you don’t own it.

1 minute ago, Loiner said:

Why can you not see that the current problems are caused by our politicians and civil servants for not respecting the referendum result and proceeding to an orderly Brexit? For the most part they, with the combined Remain lobby and EU, have concentrated on subversion instead of getting on with the real job in hand.

Complete nonsense. The Brexit is even written in law and that hasn’t been changed. The leave you voted for has been implemented and will be executed on 29 March, no subversion whatsoever. 

3 minutes ago, billd766 said:

"Boy that is a bit muddled written by someone who knows nothing about economics and trade."

 

Do you personally know the person who wrote that?

 

Know his name, where he lives, his educational level, in fact do you know ANYTHING 

So now we can’t make an assessment of somebody based on what they write or say.

 

 

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So now we can’t make an assessment of somebody based on what they write or say.

 

 

Of course you can but dismissing them in that manner shows ignorance and arrogance on the part of the poster.

 

Instead of responding to the post and replying to it individually it was simply dismissed as rubbish.

23 minutes ago, billd766 said:

"Boy that is a bit muddled written by someone who knows nothing about economics and trade."

 

Do you personally know the person who wrote that?

 

Know his name, where he lives, his educational level, in fact do you know ANYTHING ABOUT HIM AT.

 

You arrogantly dismiss him as if he is of consequence yet believe yourself to be his superior.

 

Ignorance and arrogance combined. Wow.

The person might be a very fine brain surgeon and save little kittens in their spare time. But based on what they wrote, I stand by my statement. 

19 minutes ago, rixalex said:

So then when a politician is found to be corrupt or some other such indiscretion or failure of duty, welovesundayatspace is of the opinion that it is not the fault of the politician, but the fault of the public for having voted them in.

 

Yet another absurd argument brought to you by the people of remain.

The only thing “absurd” is how you’re spinning things here. You never mentioned corruption in your post I was replying to. 

Yep, securing those borders..

 

UK Post brexit plans includes waving goods through

 

https://www.ft.com/content/31b4d38e-28a9-11e9-a5ab-ff8ef2b976c7

You vote for something, you own it.
 
You don’t vote for something, you don’t own it.

So why won’t May allow Leaver politicians to do the negotiations? They would be happy to own it and probably come back with a realistic deal if necessary.


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3 minutes ago, Loiner said:

So why won’t May allow Leaver politicians to do the negotiations?

Wasn’t David Davis a Leaver politician? And Dominic Raab? How many others offered themselves for the job?

 

3 minutes ago, Loiner said:

They would be happy to own it and probably come back with a realistic deal if necessary.

Yes, they would come back with something realistic. Unfortunately, Brexiters expecting the unrealistic. 

6 minutes ago, Loiner said:

So why won’t May allow Leaver politicians to do the negotiations? They would be happy to own it and probably come back with a realistic deal if necessary.


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David Davis was a staunch Leave supporter.

 

What a fine mess he made of things.

At least this man knows what it is all about.

 

 

Then you would have to blame yourself because you voted those people in. 

They were voted in on Brexit respecting party manifestoes. They can be voted out again at the next GE. (June according to some rumours, although I think unlikely)
We also voted for Boris, Rees-Mogg, Davis, Raab, Redwood, Fox, Hoey(lab) and others. Why does May force them out of, or exclude them from negotiations? So she can surrender with her BRINO.


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On 2/1/2019 at 8:18 AM, Laughing Gravy said:

Someone tell me why the Irish government didn't put a border up when the IRA were killing Protestants (and Others) for years during the 1970s-1990s. Funny how it was important then but it is now!

ermmm there are lots of tiny pathways across thousands of meadows is there not ?

On 2/1/2019 at 6:18 AM, Pilotman said:

So yet again, the 'Ireland question' comes back to haunt the UK and hold the rest of the UK to ransom.  If they truly are part of the UK in the North then of course there must be a border with the EU, with appropriate controls.  The Irish can't have their cake and eat it,  it's one or the other.   Maybe this is just the right time to finally get real and address the idiotic historic anomaly that is the north and accept the blindingly obvious, that the island of Ireland is indeed just one country. 

It is actually 4 countries made into 1 by the mainland U.K (The 4 fields)

1 minute ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

The only thing “absurd” is how you’re spinning things here. You never mentioned corruption in your post I was replying to. 

Either politicians are responsible for their actions or they aren't.

 

The premise of your argument was that the public were the ones to blame when politicians screw things up, because the public voted them in. Hogwash.

1 minute ago, Liverpudlian said:

ermmm there are lots of tiny pathways across thousands of meadows is there not ?

Yes and they are still there . Whats your point exactly. There was a no border then so why need one now. All political.

5 minutes ago, rixalex said:

The premise of your argument was that the public were the ones to blame when politicians screw things up

I never said the public were to blame when politicians commit fraud or corruption. Stop spreading lies. 

 

 

14 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

I never said the public were to blame when politicians commit fraud or corruption. Stop spreading lies. 

 

 

As i said, the premise of your argument was that the public is culpable for what the politicians do, as the public vote them in. I wasn't lying about what you said, i was just applying the premise of your argument to politicians behavior in general.

 

If you think that defining the things that the public is culpable for with regards the actions of politicians, and the things that they aren't, really makes it a more credible or a less ridiculous argument that you are making, then go ahead.

22 minutes ago, rixalex said:

As i said, the premise of your argument was that the public is culpable for what the politicians do, as the public vote them in.

No, that’s not the premise of my argument. You better never do a GMAT; you would score terribly in the logical reasoning section.

 

Quote

 

If you think that defining the things that the public is culpable for with regards the actions of politicians, and the things that they aren't, really makes it a more credible or a less ridiculous argument that you are making, then go ahead.

If you really wanna disagree then I’m afraid you’re the one looking ridiculous. 

Edited February 5, 20197 yr by welovesundaysatspace

David Davis was a staunch Leave supporter.
 
What a fine mess he made of things.

He quit after May’s Chequers meeting. She was insisting on pursuing her/Merkel’s appeasement agreement.

He was obviously going to beat Barnier until she pulled the rug from under.


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1 hour ago, Loiner said:

So why won’t May allow Leaver politicians to do the negotiations? They would be happy to own it and probably come back with a realistic deal if necessary.


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They are too busy posturing from the back bench in an effort to get May's job.

 

Far be it that they actually follow through on their commitments, but having to fall flat on their faces dealing with the practical reality of how to handle brexit means that its better they sit on the back bench pretending they can do a better job rather than be shown up for being....well, fibbing SOB's.

 

But at least one of them will be PM at the end of it. That's all they really care about.

1 hour ago, Laughing Gravy said:

At least this man knows what it is all about.

 

 

Yes. His own pocket.

 

As he said, at least he doesn't have to deal with awful people after stepping down from UKIP!  (Would they be Brexiters by chance?)

2 minutes ago, Loiner said:

He was obviously going to beat Barnier until she pulled the rug from under.

Hard to imagine Davies beating anyone else than his little David. 

Complete nonsense. The Brexit is even written in law and that hasn’t been changed. The leave you voted for has been implemented and will be executed on 29 March, no subversion whatsoever. 

How much nonsense??? The subversion is exactly what’s happened over the past two and a half years.

Love it that you agree with the now legal situation that we’re out on 29th March, although May’s most recent ‘agreement’ tries to repeal that too.
How did we arrive at that legal requirement of 29th March? ROFL It was a result of Gina Miller’s legal attempt to prevent Brexit!!


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