If you currently live in Thailand or even if you plan on moving to Thailand but are considering other options in case you need to leave Thailand for whatever reason, what are your current SPECIFIC leading locations for a Plan B backup to Thailand?

By SPECIFIC I mean more than just saying a country.

Where exactly in the country?

For example don't say Mexico, say Queretaro Mexico instead.

ALSO -- why are these options high on your list?

To explain that, talk about the personal priorities that you have for what you want in an expat destination country.

Personally, I have not identified even one place in the world that checks all of my boxes.

If such a place existed, it would become a Plan A.

This is NOT about options in your home country. That's a different topic.

I’m choosing Vientiane, Laos. Most Pattaya expats already know the layout of the city and the local bars purely from decades of doing desperate, last-minute visa runs there anyway. It’s a seamless transition.

My "Plan B" would definitely not be to post another version of this same topic again.

I've seen at least two versions of it in the last 6-8 months and maybe even more if you go back further. If you do some searching on the forum surely you'll find those other topics along with the answers to your questions.

The criteria that I personally look for in a Plan B:

-- Must qualify for their visa REQUIRED

-- Their visa leaders to permanent residence VERY HIGH PRORITY

-- Affordable on my budget (up to middle level) REQUIRED

-- Has good options or excellent health care even without private insurance, most desirable a good national program retired expats can join. Not in a remote place where you need to travel far for anything serious. VERY HIGH PRORITY

-- Realistic to live with a car or bike, either good public transport or low cost taxis/ride shares VERY HIGH PRORITY

-- Weather, ideally year round mild weather, not always hot or hot and humidl, and no cold winters FLEXIBLE

-- Delicious local food and a wide variety of international options, especially good Chinese food, restaurant delivery apps popular FLEXIBLE

-- Safety, reasonable crime levels if you don't go looking for trouble HIGH

-- Not exceptionally homophobic culture HIGH

I have a few Plan B places on my current list but I've got nothing that meets all my criteria. Not even close. So it would be a matter of making massive compromises prioritizing one major want and sacrificing another.

11 minutes ago, BilllyGOAT said:

My "Plan B" would definitely not be to post another version of this same topic again.

I've seen at least two versions of it in the last 6-8 months and maybe even more if you go back further. If you do some searching on the forum surely you'll find those other topics along with the answers to your questions.

Snipers and pests not welcome.

There has not been another topic framed in the way this one has been framed.

Why are you desperate to leave? someone looking for you?

15 minutes ago, Nemises said:

I’m choosing Vientiane, Laos. Most Pattaya expats already know the layout of the city and the local bars purely from decades of doing desperate, last-minute visa runs there anyway. It’s a seamless transition.

So it sounds like your criteria rates a smooth transition from living in Thailand highly.

1 minute ago, scubascuba3 said:

Why are you desperate to leave? someone looking for you?

Snipers and pests not welcome.

3 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Snipers and pests not welcome.

You just seem always banging on about it, Fredwordy is the same always moaning about Thailand, never leaves

My list changes a lot over time but I do have two that are high on my current list.

Neither comes close to checking all my boxes.

Iloilo City, Philippines

-- Qualify for visa

-- SRRV is permanent residence

-- Middle level budget, could afford a decent condo in a convenient area

-- Above average hospitals for the Philippines, similar problem as Thailand as far as costs for serious stuff

-- No problem without a car

-- Weather hot, not ideal

-- It's a culinary culture city for Filipino food, but international options more llmited than I want

-- Safety good

-- Homophobia level acceptable

David, Panama

-- Qualify for visa

-- Permanent residence from visa

-- Middle level budget, rents low for Panama, not really a condo place, morelike a house

-- Best hospitals outside Panama City, different schemes to get affordable health care without private insurance

-- Without a car possible, but challenging, a spread out more rural feel city

-- Weather very hot, cools a bit in rainy season

-- Panamanian food OK, international options limited

-- Safety good

-- Homophobia level just barely acceptable

As you can see NEITHER of these are dream places based on my list.

I think if I had a high budget, I would find places closer to my ideal.

Or could live decently back in the US as a plan B.

For example Panama City is much better than David for many things on my list,

but a decent apartment in an interesting safe neighborhood would be like 1500 USD a month. A decent house in David is about 400 USD. Yeah the same type of Panama City place would be like 4000 in Miami, so that's attractive to people on a higher budget.

Edited June 13Jun 13 by Jingthing

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You just seem always banging on about it, Fredwordy is the same always moaning about Thailand, never leaves

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You just seem always banging on about it, Fredwordy is the same always moaning about Thailand, never leaves

7 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

You just seem always banging on about it, Fredwordy is the same always moaning about Thailand, never leaves

I've made it clear many times I don't want to leave,

Talking about Plan Bs.

Again. snipers and pests GO AWAY.

If you don't have anything to say related to the actual topic, then don't post.

Flame post removed @BilllyGOAT discuss the topic not the poster.

Eastern Europe. Novi Sad, Serbia, looks awesome.

3 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

Eastern Europe. Novi Sad, Serbia, looks awesome.

Agreed.

As I said what's on my list changes over time.

For some unexplained reason I'm not hot on Europe right now.

If I was Braga Portugal or a similar provincial city might do the trick.

Just for fun

- Qualify for D7 visa

-- Permanent residence

-- Middle level budget, apartment living

-- Good hospitals, access to Portuguese national health but I think you need private insurance to start, not sure if possible

-- No problem without a car

-- Weather moderate / pleasant

-- Portuguese food is fantastic, some international options

-- Safety good

-- Homophobia level acceptable

Another criteria that I left out -- language.

How widespread is English.

Do you need to learn the language.

Do you want to learn the language.

Is it hard.

Edited June 13Jun 13 by Jingthing

No definitive location yet, but I've narrowed it down to just 192 countries around the world.

I have lived in both David and Panama City the rainy season is brutal and at least 5 months long. April, May, June, July, August, September, October..wait, it's 7 months long! The only great weather months in Panama is the dry season Dec-Mar and even then it sometimes gets a lot of rain, you never know for sure.

1 hour ago, Nemises said:

I’m choosing Vientiane, Laos. Most Pattaya expats already know the layout of the city and the local bars purely from decades of doing desperate, last-minute visa runs there anyway. It’s a seamless transition.

Good food

Correction -- Braga being in Northern Potugal does get coldish in winter.

4 minutes ago, Furioso said:

I have lived in both David and Panama City the rainy season is brutal and at least 5 months long. April, May, June, July, August, September, October..wait, it's 7 months long! The only great weather months in Panama is the dry season Dec-Mar and even then it sometimes gets a lot of rain, you never know for sure.

Yeah I can see living in Panama City with enough money in a luxury high rise condo with sea view, run aircon all the time, and drive or Uber everywhere.

Yeah many expats move to Boquette for the scenery and cool weather,

Not for me and also it's getting more expensive "ruined" by too many expats.

Panama City with it's migration history has a big Chinese food scene. There are even lots of Jews there.

Edited June 13Jun 13 by Jingthing

Living in Thailand is starting to be a pain for me..but it has so many pros, especially the visa and cost of living. The loud motorbikes are driving me out, what a constant almost 24 hour nuisance!!!

I'm having skin problems due to Pattaya Air Pollution. Face/Neck get very red and itchy I'm still trying to solve this. Someone told me it could be the Pattaya micro-climate mixture of salt air/extreme vehicle pollution.

Laos sounds interesting, something I have to look into.

I'm now thinking:

Dec-Feb: Cheap Thailand

Mar-May: Southern Spain

June-Aug: Cheap Thailand

Sep-Nov: Back to Europe or Middle East/Central Asia

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah I can see living in Panama City with enough money in a luxury high rise condo with sea view, run aircon all the time, and drive or Uber everywhere.

Yeah many expats move to Boquette for the scenery and cool weather,

Not for me and also it's getting more expensive "ruined" by too many expats.

Panama is not a place I recommend and yes, like Mexico it's too close to the U.S. so it's basically ruined. As I mentioned the weather there is just awful. Not worth the price. The only real beautiful place in up in Volcano/Boqette. If you live in David 100% your house will get robbed.

25 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

Eastern Europe. Novi Sad, Serbia, looks awesome.

I had 2 high school friends from Belgrade (we are talking friends from late 80s eatly 90s) visit me in Bangkok just before I left. They both seemed genuinely happy living there, lots of friends, don't want to live anywhere else. Unfortunately I left just before I got drafted and still have some resentment towards the country.

Aside from already speaking the language, I was looking into private healthcare costs and it is shockingly more affordable than Thailand. The women tho are another story. They usually don't like messing with foreigners especially Americans. It's considered "blam"..... something like cringe or embarrassment. It has always been like this, I don't know why.

13 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah I can see living in Panama City with enough money in a luxury high rise condo with sea view, run aircon all the time, and drive or Uber everywhere.

Yeah many expats move to Boquette for the scenery and cool weather,

Not for me and also it's getting more expensive "ruined" by too many expats.

Panama City with it's migration history has a big Chinese food scene. There are even lots of Jews there.

Panama City: You might now know about the cheaply refined gas they use. It ruins everything in your house/condo it was absolutely horrible.

27 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Agreed.

As I said what's on my list changes over time.

For some unexplained reason I'm not hot on Europe right now.

If I was Braga Portugal or a similar provincial city might do the trick.

+1 to Portugal. Of course as a European, I would not need to worry about visas. Portugal is surely the most laid-back in Southern Europe, you have great nature, an exciting array of food, and it is far less touristy in some spots still (compared to Spain).

Somebody mentioned the Balkans, Serbia? First, a country where the writing is cyrillic is an automatic no-go, why would I put myself in this hassle? Secondly, in many places in this region, there is frequent strife between the different ethnicities (I have friends from both Bosnia and Serbia, which can be "tricky") while living costs are shooting up as well. Nice nature though, so of course maybe worth a holiday, but not more.

Middle and South America countries... as the current foreign policy of their big neighbour in the north goes, I would not want to stay there. As an American, even less so, as the local people might react adversial if this form of politics goes on uninterrupted.

My 'Plan B', if I ever would seriously need one, would keep me in Southeast Asia. Indonesia, maybe, there must be a million places to explore to fill the rest of my lifetime. Malaysia, if I look for a place with stability to live, from which to travel.

22 minutes ago, Furioso said:

Panama is not a place I recommend and yes, like Mexico it's too close to the U.S. so it's basically ruined. As I mentioned the weather there is just awful. Not worth the price. The only real beautiful place in up in Volcano/Boqette. If you live in David 100% your house will get robbed.

No reason not to believe you.

Boquette and Vulcan too snall town and isolated for me.

I think there are some low rise condos in David -- maybe they would have good security.

The retirement visa is really good.

Of my current top 2 list, Ilollo City seems better, but downsides health care as I mentioned.

I'm not focusing here on places that would work better with my criteria list if I don't qualify for the visa.

Buenos Aires Argentina for example.

1 hour ago, rattlesnake said:

Eastern Europe. Novi Sad, Serbia, looks awesome.

I think buying ANY apartment (no minimum investment) gets you permanent residency in Serbia. In Novi Sad, it might cost 50-60K ??

Cold winters?

Eastern European women might be good women to date. I wouldn't know from experience.

2 hours ago, Nemises said:

I’m choosing Vientiane, Laos. Most Pattaya expats already know the layout of the city and the local bars purely from decades of doing desperate, last-minute visa runs there anyway. It’s a seamless transition.

What visas do they have

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Personally, I have not identified even one place in the world that checks all of my boxes.

If such a place existed, it would become a Plan A.

Every country is run by politicians who create problems.

How come you never mention Siem Reap?

After considering all the most important things like cost-of-living, accommodations, healthcare, food, crime, infrastructure, etc, I've now made my final decision. I'm leaving tomorrow!

Do you think Patts will notice I'm gone?