Retirement extension refused, Samui

[delgarcon]

I tried to extend my non imm o visa on the 28th Feb using last year's requirements, but I was told that I had to show 12 months of pension payments into a Thai bank, which I thought was a requirement for extension applications from the 1st March. Anyway, now I have to leave the country by the 12th March and put 800000tbh in my Thai account, where it initially has to rest for 2 months.

My METV expires on the 5th May and MY QUESTION is this; when I return to Thailand (before the expiration of my visa) will I automatically get a further 90 day extension or do I have to apply for it?

[jacko45k]

7 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

My METV expires on the 5th May and MY QUESTION is this; when I return to Thailand (before the expiration of my visa) will I automatically get a further 90 day extension or do I have to apply for it?

You will get a 60 day stamp based on your METV. You will need to apply for a conversion to a Non Imm-O entry by showing the 800,000 from overseas in a Thai bank. I believe you need to do that with over 2 weeks remaining on your tourist entry. On approval you will be given a further 90 days.

Edited March 2, 2019 by jacko45k

[delgarcon]

Sorry Jacko, I don't understand, could you simplify please. Lets say I do a border run on the 11th march (using my non imm o visa, which expires on the 5th May) how long can I then stay? My problem is that it will take me probably until the end of March to get the funds into the bank!

[jacko45k]

11 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

Sorry Jacko, I don't understand, could you simplify please. Lets say I do a border run on the 11th march (using my non imm o visa, which expires on the 5th May) how long can I then stay? My problem is that it will take me probably until the end of March to get the funds into the bank!

You said you had a METV (Multiple Entry Tourist Visa) which expires on 5th May, and then later say you have a Non-Imm O Visa that expires 5th May so it's me that doesn't understand. 

Edited March 2, 2019 by jacko45k

[Tanoshi]

Do you have a METV or a Non Imm O Visa.

Two different answers depending on your Visa type.

[delgarcon]

I suggest you both read my initial post, this is what I wrote:

Posted 47 minutes ago

I tried to extend my non imm o visa on the 28th Feb using last year's requirements, but I was told that I had to show 12 months of pension payments into a Thai bank, which I thought was a requirement for extension applications from the 1st March. Anyway, now I have to leave the country by the 12th March and put 800000tbh in my Thai account, where it initially has to rest for 2 months.

My METV expires on the 5th May and MY QUESTION is this; when I return to Thailand (before the expiration of my visa) will I automatically get a further 90 day extension or do I have to apply for it?

 

[jacko45k]

14 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

I suggest you both read my initial post, this is what I wrote:

Posted 47 minutes ago

I tried to extend my non imm o visa on the 28th Feb using last year's requirements, but I was told that I had to show 12 months of pension payments into a Thai bank, which I thought was a requirement for extension applications from the 1st March. Anyway, now I have to leave the country by the 12th March and put 800000tbh in my Thai account, where it initially has to rest for 2 months.

My METV expires on the 5th May and MY QUESTION is this; when I return to Thailand (before the expiration of my visa) will I automatically get a further 90 day extension or do I have to apply for it?

 

Yes, this says both Non Imm O and METV. The question you asked in the last paragraph is where you said METV, that is what I initially answered. Do you have a METV, or a Non Imm O Multiple Entry Visa?

[delgarcon]

Ok, I realise how I created the confusion, I have a non imm O multiple entry visa, not an METV. Sorry about that, can we start again please

 

[jacko45k]

15 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

My ME Non Imm O expires on the 5th May and MY QUESTION is this; when I return to Thailand (before the expiration of my visa) will I automatically get a further 90 day extension or do I have to apply for it?

You will receive another 90 day permission of stay. In the last 30 days of that stay you can apply for a one year Extension based on retirement with 800k seasoned in a Thai bank for 2 months. 

Good Luck and pardon my edit of your quote. ????

Edited March 2, 2019 by jacko45k

[ubonjoe]

1 minute ago, jacko45k said:

You will receive another 90 day permission of stay. In the last 30 days of that stay you can apply for a one year Extension based on retirement with 800k in a Thai bank which has been deposited from overseas. 

There is no requirement to prove the money came from a abroad for the extension of stay application. That is only needed when changing from tourist visa or visa exempt entry to a non immigrant visa at immigration.

[ubonjoe]

1 hour ago, delgarcon said:

I tried to extend my non imm o visa on the 28th Feb using last year's requirements, but I was told that I had to show 12 months of pension payments into a Thai bank, which I thought was a requirement for extension applications from the 1st March.

The option to show the 65 baht going into a Thai bank account started in December. March 1st was when the new rules for the 800k baht option went into effect.

How were you proving your income? 

[delgarcon]

Thank you both, much appreciated

[Tanoshi]

6 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

Ok, I realise how I created the confusion, I have a non imm O multiple entry visa, not an METV. Sorry about that, can we start again please

 

If you do a border run on 12th March, you will be granted permission to stay until 9th June.

If you did a further border run on 5th May (the expiry date of your Visa) you'll be given permission to stay until 2nd August.

 

If you are married to a Thai, you can extend each 90 day permission to stay by a further 60 days at your local IO (1,900 BHT)

 

You therefore have a number of options available and giving sufficient time to transfer and season 800K in a Thai bank for 2 months, prior to applying to extend your permission to stay based on retirement at your IO.

[delgarcon]

2 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

The option to show the 65 baht going into a Thai bank account started in December. March 1st was when the new rules for the 800k baht option went into effect.

How were you proving your income? 

The last time I extended my visa was 2 years ago and I had to have the letter from the Brit embassy showing my annual pension and bank statements and a letter from the Bangkok Bank showing the difference between 800k and my pension sitting in the bank for 3 months. I never had to show the pension coming into my Thai account!

 

[Tanoshi]

12 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

The last time I extended my visa was 2 years ago and I had to have the letter from the Brit embassy showing my annual pension and bank statements and a letter from the Bangkok Bank showing the difference between 800k and my pension sitting in the bank for 3 months. I never had to show the pension coming into my Thai account!

 

You have an extension of stay based on retirement already, not a Non Imm O ME Visa.

A permit, not a Visa.

You cannot extend a Visa, you have been extending your permission to stay.

 

I'd now guess you have an extension giving you permission to stay until 5th May.

Extension should read; Permitted to stay until _______.

Guessing 12th March is when your next 90 day report is due.

 

Can you confirm?

Edited March 2, 2019 by Tanoshi

[delgarcon]

The old visa expired Tanoshi, I was in and out of hospital in Monaco for 10 months and had to get another visa, the one that expires on the 5th May and which has never been extended.

I think I've got it now anyway, I'm going to do a border run on or around 11 March and make sure I get 800k in the bank by the end of the month. Not what I wanted o do but at least it's uncomplicated.

[Tanoshi]

16 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

The old visa expired Tanoshi, I was in and out of hospital in Monaco for 10 months and had to get another visa, the one that expires on the 5th May and which has never been extended.

OK, thanks for your clarification.

 

Please understand you are not/cannot extend that Visa.

It will expire on the 'enter before' date.

You are extending your permission to stay for 365 days, from a 90 day entry on the Non Imm O.

The extension (permit) does not allow any entries into Thailand (unlike your current Visa.)

If for any reason you wanted to leave the Country whilst on an extension, you'd need to purchase a re-entry permit from your local IO, single entry 1,000 baht, multiple entry 3,800 baht.

This will keep any current permission to stay valid until the permission to stay date on your extension.

 

If you left the Country without obtaining a re-entry permit, your extension (permission to stay) would cease immediately and on re-entry you'd receive a 30 day Visa exempt entry stamp.

 

Are you married to a Thai?

Edited March 2, 2019 by Tanoshi

[onera1961]

48 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

The option to show the 65 baht going into a Thai bank account started in December. March 1st was when the new rules for the 800k baht option went into effect.

OP also says he was going to use last years requirements. last year requirements are "embassy income letter" Does he have an 'embassy income letter"? So, he could use it.

Mind boggling confusion and lack of comprehension is plaguing this board enormously.

[delgarcon]

Thanks for the info Tanoshi, I'm aware of the re-entry regulations having extended my "permission to stay" previously. It's the new requirements for extension which have caught me out.

I live with a Thai, but we never got married.

[onera1961]

45 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

The last time I extended my visa was 2 years ago and I had to have the letter from the Brit embassy showing my annual pension and bank statements and a letter from the Bangkok Bank showing the difference between 800k and my pension sitting in the bank for 3 months. I never had to show the pension coming into my Thai account!

Nobody had to show it. Now with no embassy letter, how could TI determine if you're getting any money or not? That's the reason for bringing money into Thai bank every month (not average over a year).

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

Thanks for the info Tanoshi, I'm aware of the re-entry regulations having extended my "permission to stay" previously. It's the new requirements for extension which have caught me out.

Do you have proof of income from your embassy before that stopped issuing them? They are valid for 6 months from the date they were issued.

Those are still accepted under the new rules unless Samui has made up their own rules saying only the money being transferred into a bank is accepted now.

[delgarcon]

1 minute ago, onera1961 said:

Nobody had to show it. Now with no embassy letter, how could TI determine if you're getting any money or not? That's the reason for bringing money into Thai bank every month (not average over a year).

The problem with that onera is that none of us have crystal balls do we! Had I known a year ago  that I was going to have to show my pension going into my Thai account every month, I would have complied, but unfortunately I'm not Dr Who!

[delgarcon]

3 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

Do you have proof of income from your embassy before that stopped issuing them? They are valid for 6 months from the date they were issued.

Those are still accepted under the new rules unless Samui has made up their own rules saying only the money being transferred into a bank is accepted now.

No Joe, I wasn't aware of the changes before 1 January this year, too late to get the letter

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

The problem with that onera is that none of us have crystal balls do we! Had I known a year ago  that I was going to have to show my pension going into my Thai account every month, I would have complied, but unfortunately I'm not Dr Who!

If you don't have the income letter you should only need to show a few months (2 or 3 should be accepted) of 65k baht transfers from outside the country going into your account this year. Immigration has been told to be lenient and flexible this year.

 

5 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

No Joe, I wasn't aware of the changes before 1 January this year, too late to get the letter

You and many others probably. 

[jimn]

3 minutes ago, delgarcon said:

No Joe, I wasn't aware of the changes before 1 January this year, too late to get the letter

The mistake you made was that once you were aware of the changes come Jan 1st 2019, that you didnt start transferring 65k a month from abroad into your Thai bank account. If you had done for Jan and Feb, immigration should have shown some discretion in issuing your extension as you would not have had time to do 12 payments. Good luck.

[delgarcon]

1 minute ago, jimn said:

The mistake you made was that once you were aware of the changes come Jan 1st 2019, that you didnt start transferring 65k a month from abroad into your Thai bank account. If you had done for Jan and Feb, immigration should have shown some discretion in issuing your extension as you would not have had time to do 12 payments. Good luck.

I did jimm, they showed no discretion at all! All I got was "I'll talk to the boss" and "sorry you need to show 12 months"

[jimn]

Just now, delgarcon said:

I did jimm, they showed no discretion at all! All I got was "I'll talk to the boss" and "sorry you need to show 12 months"

Thats disappointing and totally against the notice that was issued saying discretion would be shown. How on earth do you show 12 months when the new requirements have only been in operation for a few months. I am sure you pointed that out to them, what was there response? Mai dai?

[delgarcon]

Just now, jimn said:

Thats disappointing and totally against the notice that was issued saying discretion would be shown. How on earth do you show 12 months when the new requirements have only been in operation for a few months. I am sure you pointed that out to them, what was there response? Mai dai?

the response was "I understand but". I tried to tell the immigration officer all that I'd read on the subject but she just looked at me with sympathy but was obviously not going to investigate further. She has a list of requirements and absolutely no flexibility and nor has her boss apparently. One thing I've found out while living here for 7 years is that there is no point in arguing with a Thai official. Unfortunately I wasn't even asked to give anything to the Christmas fund!

[jimn]

1 minute ago, delgarcon said:

the response was "I understand but". I tried to tell the immigration officer all that I'd read on the subject but she just looked at me with sympathy but was obviously not going to investigate further. She has a list of requirements and absolutely no flexibility and nor has her boss apparently. One thing I've found out while living here for 7 years is that there is no point in arguing with a Thai official. Unfortunately I wasn't even asked to give anything to the Christmas fund!

Not good lets hope its just this office applying these rules. Another option for you would be a Non OA from your home country if going back there. If used right it will give 2 years stay. Some good info on a recent thread by Lucys dad

[Tanoshi]

14 minutes ago, jimn said:

Thats disappointing and totally against the notice that was issued saying discretion would be shown. How on earth do you show 12 months when the new requirements have only been in operation for a few months. I am sure you pointed that out to them, what was there response? Mai dai?

Previously the order just stated 'Must have evidence of having income of no less than Baht 65,000 per month'.

It didn't specify it had to be transferred into a Thai bank, however just as TI 'assumed' Embassies were verifying incomes, I believe they also 'assumed' these incomes were being transferred for living expenses.

 

That is now being put to test.

I also believe those still able to obtain Embassy letters, could well be asked to show Thai bank statements to support they are transferring the required incomes to Thailand.