Holocaust survivor meets with California teens involved in Nazi salute photos

[SheungWan]

17 hours ago, giddyup said:

Even the Royals were ignorant.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-05-16/the-sun-shows-prince-harry-wearing-nazi-uniform/9752022

Certainly stupid.

[Rimmer]

A troll post and a reply have been removed

[metisdead]

Some more troll posts and the replies have been removed. 

[usviphotography]

On 3/7/2019 at 11:24 PM, dick dasterdly said:

I don't understand why it is being forgotten in Western countries, as surely WW2 is still part of the History curriculum?

In many Western Countries it is actually illegal to discuss the topic. You can't really teach something that could land the kids or teacher in jail. In America the 1st Amendment protects us from that kind of stuff so the schools mostly just sidestep the topic nowadays. When I was a kid we got assigned Night by Eli Weisel but that doesn't happen anymore for obvious reasons. 

 

Overall, knowledge of that time period is probably higher than any point in history because of all the great resources available on line, so it more a change in the way the kids get the knowledge rather than any reduction in overall competency on the subject matter. 

[SheungWan]

On 3/9/2019 at 12:17 AM, balo said:

I think the Western education will never forget WW2, it's a part of any students education. 

But kids can joke about anything. This was a bad joke and in today's world with social media , you can't make any jokes about wars and tragedy.  

These things are rarely jokes. The matter was dealt with appropriately. 

[SheungWan]

2 hours ago, usviphotography said:

In many Western Countries it is actually illegal to discuss the topic. You can't really teach something that could land the kids or teacher in jail. In America the 1st Amendment protects us from that kind of stuff so the schools mostly just sidestep the topic nowadays. When I was a kid we got assigned Night by Eli Weisel but that doesn't happen anymore for obvious reasons. 

Overall, knowledge of that time period is probably higher than any point in history because of all the great resources available on line, so it more a change in the way the kids get the knowledge rather than any reduction in overall competency on the subject matter. 

Its illegal in Germany to peddle Holocaust Denial. Some guys in this thread making efforts to push it though.

[metisdead]

An off topic deflection post and a reply have been removed. 

[dick dasterdly]

As far as I can see, pretty much every poster seriously dislikes the perpetuation of the swastika, nazi salute etc. - other than as lessons that need to be known and understood by everyone.

 

We're only worried as a few seem to think that the SS uniform is funny/acceptable as 'fancy dress'.  They clearly have no idea (or don't care......) about the horror behind the uniform etc.

[johnnybangkok]

6 hours ago, usviphotography said:

In many Western Countries it is actually illegal to discuss the topic. You can't really teach something that could land the kids or teacher in jail. In America the 1st Amendment protects us from that kind of stuff so the schools mostly just sidestep the topic nowadays. When I was a kid we got assigned Night by Eli Weisel but that doesn't happen anymore for obvious reasons. 

 

Overall, knowledge of that time period is probably higher than any point in history because of all the great resources available on line, so it more a change in the way the kids get the knowledge rather than any reduction in overall competency on the subject matter. 

There is no Western country that I am aware of where it is 'illegal to discuss the topic'. I think you are getting confused with it being illegal in Germany to deny the holocaust but it isn't illegal to discuss it.

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

There is no Western country that I am aware of where it is 'illegal to discuss the topic'. I think you are getting confused with it being illegal in Germany to deny the holocaust but it isn't illegal to discuss it.

You are absolutely correct. 

[MalandLee]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

4 minutes ago, johnnybangkok said:

There is no Western country that I am aware of where it is 'illegal to discuss the topic'. I think you are getting confused with it being illegal in Germany to deny the holocaust but it isn't illegal to discuss it.

You are absolutely correct. 

It should NEVER be buried under a blanket of political correctness - I believe it is right to be taught in schools. We as human beings must NEVER allow this to happen again.

 

Denial only exists among those who continue to believe the twisted Nazi rhetoric OR it would seem Islamist's (e.g.. Iranian dictatorship) with an agenda

[johnnybangkok]

4 hours ago, MalandLee said:

It should NEVER be buried under a blanket of political correctness - I believe it is right to be taught in schools. We as human beings must NEVER allow this to happen again.

 

Denial only exists among those who continue to believe the twisted Nazi rhetoric OR it would seem Islamist's (e.g.. Iranian dictatorship) with an agenda

Not sure what your point is here. Certainly in the West It isnt “buried under a blanket of political correctness “. It is taught in schools (usually under Modern History - I studied MH for 4 years) and theres very little denial other than crazy right wingers. 

Im sure it probably isnt taught in Iran but that can’t exactly be held up as a world standard or indeed a standard for Islam. 

There is ignorance of it for sure but there’s no need such alarmist rhetoric. 

[usviphotography]

7 hours ago, johnnybangkok said:

There is no Western country that I am aware of where it is 'illegal to discuss the topic'. I think you are getting confused with it being illegal in Germany to deny the holocaust but it isn't illegal to discuss it.

It is far more countries than Germany. France, Poland, Austria and many others have similar laws. And yes, such laws effectively do mean any academic discussion or research of the Holocaust is pretty much forbidden since any true critical analysis and objective discussion would almost certainly run afoul of the law and expose the student or teacher to accusations of being a "denier" of whatever the official state sponsored narrative about the Holocaust is in that particular jurisdiction. 

Edited March 10, 2019 by usviphotography

[Morch]

3 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

It is far more countries than Germany. France, Poland, Austria and many others have similar laws. And yes, such laws effectively do mean any academic discussion or research of the Holocaust is pretty much forbidden since any true critical analysis and objective discussion would almost certainly run afoul of the law and expose the student or teacher to accusations of being a "denier" of whatever the official state sponsored narrative about the Holocaust is in that particular jurisdiction. 

 

That's because most of the "research" you're alluding to is, essentially, focused on denial, minimization or revisionism. There's no wide reaching "ban" on research.

[Morch]

9 hours ago, dick dasterdly said:

As far as I can see, pretty much every poster seriously dislikes the perpetuation of the swastika, nazi salute etc. - other than as lessons that need to be known and understood by everyone.

 

We're only worried as a few seem to think that the SS uniform is funny/acceptable as 'fancy dress'.  They clearly have no idea (or don't care......) about the horror behind the uniform etc.

 

Guess that old saying about seeing what you want to see applies. There's a pretty much constant segment of posters who are into Holocaust denial and revisionism. Hardly a semi-related topic without some showing up, and this one is/was no exception.

[Peasandmash]

some people just want to be offended... the kids are not fully aware of the meaning of holocaust and the media wants to makes news (aka get views) from what is a display of ignorance. the real shame is that the kids parents haven't beat the living sh@t out of their kids for being so <deleted> stupid.

[johnnybangkok]

48 minutes ago, usviphotography said:

It is far more countries than Germany. France, Poland, Austria and many others have similar laws. And yes, such laws effectively do mean any academic discussion or research of the Holocaust is pretty much forbidden since any true critical analysis and objective discussion would almost certainly run afoul of the law and expose the student or teacher to accusations of being a "denier" of whatever the official state sponsored narrative about the Holocaust is in that particular jurisdiction. 

I thought before you were just misinformed. Now I’m beginning to think you have an agenda. 

Research into the holocaust isn’t banned but as already mentioned, research that concludes it was some sort of hoax understandably is. What is this “state sponsored narrative “ that isn’t the actual truth? 

Theres only one fact that is needed; the Nazis committed terrible atrocities on the Jews (amongst many others) resulting in 6 million deaths. 

What “critical a analysis” or “objective discussion” is going to say differently?

 

[Morch]

23 minutes ago, Peasandmash said:

some people just want to be offended... the kids are not fully aware of the meaning of holocaust and the media wants to makes news (aka get views) from what is a display of ignorance. the real shame is that the kids parents haven't beat the living sh@t out of their kids for being so <deleted> stupid.

 

How do you mean "not fully aware", and on what is this assertion based on?

[manarak]

I think all pubs and schools worldwide schould be equipped with Israeli-paid emergency dispensers of signs reading "warning: these nazi symbols are only used for parody and/or thoughtless fun by stupid and/or drunk students/people".

 

while we should do everything to prevent the same from happening again, I can't help but think that in some cases the "awareness campaign" is overblown. difficult to draw a line though.

[Morch]

26 minutes ago, manarak said:

I think all pubs and schools worldwide schould be equipped with Israeli-paid emergency dispensers of signs reading "warning: these nazi symbols are only used for parody and/or thoughtless fun by stupid and/or drunk students/people".

 

while we should do everything to prevent the same from happening again, I can't help but think that in some cases the "awareness campaign" is overblown. difficult to draw a line though.

 

What you think is one thing. What you claim some imaginary we ought to do is another.

Israel is not even mentioned in the OP.

[SheungWan]

2 hours ago, usviphotography said:

It is far more countries than Germany. France, Poland, Austria and many others have similar laws. And yes, such laws effectively do mean any academic discussion or research of the Holocaust is pretty much forbidden since any true critical analysis and objective discussion would almost certainly run afoul of the law and expose the student or teacher to accusations of being a "denier" of whatever the official state sponsored narrative about the Holocaust is in that particular jurisdiction. 

Another effort to sneak in Holocaust Denial. Reference to academic research totally bogus. Looks like some of David Irving's mates might have turned up on the thread.

Edited March 10, 2019 by SheungWan

[Jingthing]

Another effort to sneak in Holocaust Denial. Reference to academic research totally bogus. Looks like some of David Irving's mates might have turned up on the thread.

Exactly.

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[manarak]

7 hours ago, Morch said:

 

What you think is one thing. What you claim some imaginary we ought to do is another.

Israel is not even mentioned in the OP.

hmm.... you don't want to be included in the we that wants to prevent another holocaust?

the we I used was generously inclusive.
if that kind of we doesn't suit you, you also may consider it a majestic we, in which case I would request to be adressed with "your highness".

[Morch]

2 hours ago, manarak said:

hmm.... you don't want to be included in the we that wants to prevent another holocaust?

the we I used was generously inclusive.
if that kind of we doesn't suit you, you also may consider it a majestic we, in which case I would request to be adressed with "your highness".

 

While the posturing above is dully noted, I think it was more like a "we" aimed at generating faux credibility for the view "you" push.

 

[Chomper Higgot]

11 hours ago, manarak said:

I think all pubs and schools worldwide schould be equipped with Israeli-paid emergency dispensers of signs reading "warning: these nazi symbols are only used for parody and/or thoughtless fun by stupid and/or drunk students/people".

 

while we should do everything to prevent the same from happening again, I can't help but think that in some cases the "awareness campaign" is overblown. difficult to draw a line though.

How did Israel get in to that?

 

Back of the head stuff is my guess.