Anyone bought Testoviron 250mg-20amp of 1ml (Rotexmedica or Bayer)?

Would you please share pharmacy location and price?

I asked few pharmacies but no luck. 

Thank you very much

Very easy in Pattaya but no so much in CM.

There was a supply outage for a short time. I think it's back now.  I used to get it at Peera pharmacy Chiang Mai (google).  Dr Morgan's clinic HCMC (not Vietnam) does injections, too. 

Those who have tried it, does this really work? 

 

What are the side effects like shrinking ball size?

 

Why not take herbal alternatives which are safer?

1 hour ago, EricTh said:

Those who have tried it, does this really work? 

 

What are the side effects like shrinking ball size?

 

Why not take herbal alternatives which are safer?

The only alternative that I know that works is zinc which inhibits amrotese which is a enzme that converts test. to estrogen. I use a liquid zinc mixed in water. If you do not have a zinc deficientia then this will not work the mixture will taste horrible. If you need zinc the mixture will taste like water. You should have a blood test done for test and estrogen levels and 90 days later another one to see if they have changed.

It can really work and the effects are positive.  If you are taking it or "herbal alternatives" without

professional monitoring, the effects could be dire. 

Before seeing if zinc tastes like water, or visiting the home-brew chemist's shop run by goat-herders ...

 

Why not get a medical work-up, and metabolic/hormonal review by a competent physician ?  Maharaj Hospital (near Wat Suan Dok) has an excellent endocrinologist, fluent in English: Dr Ampica Sriphat Hospital 053 5394 6900/1

 

Are you dealing with erectile dysfunction, or general male malaise associated with aging, or are you dealing with illness, aftermath of physical trauma, side effects of other medications, stress and emotional problems ?  One size does not fit all, and size and firmness may/may not be the most important issue here.

 

~o:37;

 

Orang 37, thanks for that info.

Im 51 and defintely feel a malaise as you put it. Much lower libido and wondering what can be done about it.

Ridiculous question to ask i know, but do you think that dr could help?

You asked Orang37 but let me say it's quite likely the dr (and testosterone) could help. Did for me. (other endocrinologist, though). 

 

BUT you definitely should follow Orang37's advice about getting the inexpensive work-up so you know what your are doing. 

Testoviron works.  I have been on Testoviron, because my family doctor in Canada told me, that it is better than the stuff we have in Canada.  I take it, because it calms me  and makes feel about 20-30 years younger.  I shoot one of those little ampules, twice a month and it works great.  

The only side effects that I have from it is, that my cholesterol is very high and my red blood cell count too high, but I can live with that ;-)

Before I started testosterone therapy, my quality of life was way lower.  I will take it, until the day I day and don't care if that day comes sooner because of it.

 

As for supply, I have been told that there has been a supply shortage for quite a while, so I buy a pack, whenever I can find it.  Usually in the Pharmacy near Thae Pae Gate (inside the gate) or up on Chiang Moi Road, near the Chinese Gate

exercise everyday, eat a healthy whole food diet, regularly practice fasting, don't drink alcohol, don't smoke cigarettes, don't use non-prescription drugs, don't watch porn/masturbate. If you're overweight, lose it. Do this and your libido will improve immensely, in as little as 30 days, and you'll save money. Keep doing it and you'll surprise yourself and your partner(s) with your vitality. 

Yes, be perfect.

 

1 hour ago, kurtgruen said:

The only side effects that I have from it is, that my cholesterol is very high and my red blood cell count too high, but I can live with that ????

Those effects are manageable so you can live with that maybe longer. That's what endocrinologists are for. 

On 4/24/2019 at 6:36 PM, sidjameson said:

Ridiculous question to ask i know, but do you think that dr could help?

 

The question is not ridiculous !  Whether a medical review can help ... well, you'll only know if you have one, and consider the results. For myselves, I would want to make sure I was  using the right strategy for the one body/two minds' well-being.

 

Among other factors to consider: prostrate condition; patterns ... or changes in patterns ... of exercise, sleep; significant events ... positive and negative ... in your recent life; changes on socialization, and relationships.

 

best wishes, ~o:37;

On 4/25/2019 at 4:04 AM, kurtgruen said:

Testoviron works.  I have been on Testoviron, because my family doctor in Canada told me, that it is better than the stuff we have in Canada.  I take it, because it calms me  and makes feel about 20-30 years younger.  I shoot one of those little ampules, twice a month and it works great.  

The only side effects that I have from it is, that my cholesterol is very high and my red blood cell count too high, but I can live with that ????

Before I started testosterone therapy, my quality of life was way lower.  I will take it, until the day I day and don't care if that day comes sooner because of it.

 

My otherwise healthy father had his first and final heart attack at age 69 because of high cholesterol. 

 

It seems you are taking Testoviron after consulting doctor.  That's fine.  However I would caution others against self-medicating, or seeking medical advice on a non-medical internet forum.

A little off-topic but does anyone know where empty sterile vials can be purchased in Thailand?

Just to chime in; Rotexmedica and Bayer are still not available in Pattaya (at least not at "Tim's")  Rotexmedica is expected to be back in stock within a couple of weeks; maybe Bayer as well but most likely will take longer before supply chain is re-established.

 

In Chiang Mai, Peera was the go-to source IMO and they have been out of stock since last October.

 

The reason fro the out-of-stock situation, according to what I've been told is that Bayer has been re-vamping their distribution channel which supposedly accounts for the scarcity.  Personally that doesn't make sense to me but that's what I've been told by several different pharmacists here in Thailand.  

On 4/23/2019 at 10:24 AM, EricTh said:

Those who have tried it, does this really work? 

 

What are the side effects like shrinking ball size?

 

Why not take herbal alternatives which are safer?

Yes, it can work really well for most men with low T.  Side effects exist but for most men they are relatively minor and entirely manageable if your protocol is proper.  Herbal remedies (IMO) are a waste of time.  TRT with testosterone is very safe and highly effective if administered wisely.

 

Blood testing is critical, before and during therapy.  It's not just about testosterone levels.  A lot of associated hormonal changes occur when you introduce exogenous testosterone into your body.  Taking testosterone without proper blood work and consultation with a well informed doctor would  just be plain stupid!

 

Finding a "good" doctor to discuss TRT might take some effort but well worth it.  I can say that Dr. Nisachon Morgan in Chinag Mai is excellent!  She is an incredibly well informed and compassionate general practitioner (GP).  Stay away from the so-called "TRT clinics" since most of them are just prescription mills interested only in getting your money; find a good doctor!

 

 

 

 

On 4/25/2019 at 3:04 PM, kurtgruen said:

Testoviron works.  I have been on Testoviron, because my family doctor in Canada told me, that it is better than the stuff we have in Canada.  I take it, because it calms me  and makes feel about 20-30 years younger.  I shoot one of those little ampules, twice a month and it works great.  

The only side effects that I have from it is, that my cholesterol is very high and my red blood cell count too high, but I can live with that ????

Before I started testosterone therapy, my quality of life was way lower.  I will take it, until the day I day and don't care if that day comes sooner because of it.

 

Side effects (high RBC and Cholesterol) are entirely manageable when on TRT.  Periodically donating blood will address high RBC and cholesterol can be managed through your nutrition.

44 minutes ago, WaveHunter said:

Side effects (high RBC and Cholesterol) are entirely manageable when on TRT.  Periodically donating blood will address high RBC and cholesterol can be managed through your nutrition.

 

Theoretically, yes, and I appreciate your thoughtful comments, and advocacy of undertaking modification of the hormonal system under medical supervision.

 

A potential problem I see is that often the later-mid-life-male-hominid, finding he can't quite sing "come on baby, light my fire" on key, is prone to health risk-taking, and non-compliance with good health practices.

 

I also believe I observe, among the expat males I know here, frequent depression; imho, the depression can manifest physically as low-energy, lack of libido, etc. But, such observations are, of course, highly biased. 

 

But, consider the weather: who isn't depressed and lethargic, given the last 10 weeks of respiratory homicide in Amazing T ?

 

~o:37;

1 hour ago, WaveHunter said:

Finding a "good" doctor to discuss TRT might take some effort but well worth it.  I can say that Dr. Nisachon Morgan in Chinag Mai is excellent!  She is an incredibly well informed and compassionate general practitioner (GP).

I agree that Dr. Morgan is a good general practitioner but TRT may not be her thing. An endocrinologist at Ram, whom I regard very highly, disagreed sharply with her recommendations. 

8 minutes ago, orang37 said:

But, consider the weather: who isn't depressed and lethargic, given the last 10 weeks of respiratory homicide in Amazing T ?

Add in the socio-political situations in their home countries. Bummers.

5 hours ago, amexpat said:

Add in the socio-political situations in their home countries. Bummers.

 

As one born in CorporateOccupiedMallburgerland, I can only say: "Amen."

 

And, then, there's the movie playing now that could make me want to commit suicide ... no, it's not "13 Reasons Why" klikee-klikee ... it's in the mirror: however I just laugh at it because I know I'd never write anything that tasteless ????

 

Do things always get worse before you realize that things were better before they get worse ?

 

~o:37;

On 5/1/2019 at 10:59 AM, WaveHunter said:

 

Blood testing is critical, before and during therapy.  It's not just about testosterone levels.  A lot of associated hormonal changes occur when you introduce exogenous testosterone into your body.  Taking testosterone without proper blood work and consultation with a well informed doctor would  just be plain stupid!

 

 

Mind telling what are the hormonal changes? Beard, muscles ....

Non-authorized non-medical advise : if someone starts a prostat cancer he should avoid testosteron supplements, as it would make cancer expands much faster. Maybe consultation with urologist would be useful prior treatment.

This thread illustrates a problem I see a lot here in CM: People trying to be their own doctor.  As some commenters have suggested, find a *real* doctor and talk to her about your situation.

53 minutes ago, Kelsall said:

This thread illustrates a problem I see a lot here in CM: People trying to be their own doctor.  As some commenters have suggested, find a *real* doctor and talk to her about your situation.

Yes, Thailand is wonderful, come here and almost instantly become an expert in health care, personal finance, sexual relationships, traffic safety, intellect measurement and anything else you happen to choose.

On 4/27/2019 at 11:15 PM, heybruce said:

My otherwise healthy father had his first and final heart attack at age 69 because of high cholesterol. 

 

It seems you are taking Testoviron after consulting doctor.  That's fine.  However I would caution others against self-medicating, or seeking medical advice on a non-medical internet forum.

Cholesterol always gets a bad rap as the cause of coronary disease, when in fact there is not really a causal relationship at all.  It is only an associative relationship.  In other words, people who have heart disease also tend to have high levels of cholesterol, and it is not necessarily that high cholesterol cause the disease.

 

Cholesterol is simply the body's response to fight inflammation.  It’s a response to repair damaged arterial walls caused by metabolic inflammation.  It’s sort of like the body’s band-aid.  It is the underlying inflammation that is the cause of disease, not cholesterol.  

 

Yet this myth persists.  It’s like saying that every time there is a house fire, firemen are on the scene.  Therefore, firemen must be causing house fires!

 

Metabolic inflammation causes cholesterol response which can lead to plaques that may lead to coronary disease.  The goal should be to address the underlying metabolic inflammation.

 

This inflammation is usually the result of poor nutrition, and no, I'm not saying that dietary cholesterol is the cause either.  There is no science based reason to believe that consumption of dietary cholesterol result in increased levels of indigenous cholesterol in the body.  In a normal, healthy individual, the body produces far more cholesterol than most people will consume from dietary sources.

 

The dietary sources inflammation are those foods that disrupt the metabolic hormonal balance, principally those foods that unnaturally raise insulin levels such as highly processed carbohydrates, and nutritional habits of eating from the moment you wake up until the time you go to bed (food grazing) so that insulin levels are continually at unnaturally high levels and eventually will lead to receptor insensitivity.  "metabolic syndrome" is the result.  Google the term to understand it better.

 

Fixing your diet is the remedy to Metabolic Syndrome.  Simple dietary changes can result in reduced inflammation and therefore reduced release of cholesterol to address the inflammation, and thus less likelihood of developing arterial plaques that can lead to coronary disease.  It's actually pretty simple when you think about it.

8 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

Cholesterol always gets a bad rap as the cause of coronary disease, when in fact there is not really a causal relationship at all.  It is only an associative relationship.  In other words, people who have heart disease also tend to have high levels of cholesterol, and it is not necessarily that high cholesterol cause the disease.

 

Cholesterol is simply the body's response to fight inflammation.  It’s a response to repair damaged arterial walls caused by metabolic inflammation.  It’s sort of like the body’s band-aid.  It is the underlying inflammation that is the cause of disease, not cholesterol.  

 

Yet this myth persists.  It’s like saying that every time there is a house fire, firemen are on the scene.  Therefore, firemen must be causing house fires!

 

 

If this is true please explain why:

 

1. People with homozygous FH (a mutation causing the LDL receptors that are responsible for removing cholesterol from the blood into the liver not to work) have massively high cholesterol from birth  (1200mg/dl or 30mM), and, untreated, get aortic atherosclerosis before puberty and die before 30 of sudden myocardial infarction.

 

2. FH homozygotes once treated by having simply having cholesterol physically removed from their blood weekly by  processes akin to dialysis (e.g. apheresis -their blood is run through columns that remove only LDL cholesterol leaving everything else intact, then returned) no longer die in their 30s, and angiography demonstrates the reduction and regression of the arterial lesions formed in their teens.

 

3. Drugs that work by completely different mechanisms whose only common feature is the end point of reduction in plasma cholesterol levels, have been shown in reliable large clinical trials to all reduce the risk and occurrence of coronary artery disease and stroke, including

 

(a) cholestyramine, a granular resin that when taken by mouth physically absorb bile acids (which are made of cholesterol) causing it to be excreted in the faeces, lowering blood cholesterol and heart disease occurrence

(b) statins, which inhibit the enzyme responsible for body cholesterol synthesis, and reduce blood cholesterol by 40 or 50%

(c) evolocumab, and other antibodies which work by binding specifically to a protein called PCKS9. This protein destroys LDL receptors and the antibody prevents it from working, increasing LDL receptor number and lowering plasma cholesterol, again with a concomitant reduction in arterial disease

(d) ezetimibe, a small molecule which inhibits Niemann Pick protein in the intestine. This protein's function is to actively reabsorb cholesterol from the gut and return it to plasma, increasing body cholesterol load. Ezetimibe stops it from doing this and so lowers plasma cholesterol, again with an additional proven reduction in cardiovascular events.

 

These observations that lowering cholesterol by a number of unrelated methods all result in reductions in vascular disease are only rationally explained by the hypothesis that cholesterol is directly causative.

 

Furthermore, though atherosclerosis is indeed an inflammatory disease, and so can be triggered and exacerbated by many inflammatory stimuli,  it is well understood how plasma LDL is it itself directly inflammatory and a primary cause of atherosclerosis.

 

In brief, LDL is transported in globules of plasma pinched off and carried through cells lining the artery wall.  Given the same volume, the more LDL you have in your blood the more is transported, and this is one simple reason why LDL concentration in the blood and severity of arterial disease are correlated.

 

LDL behind the cell wall of the artery is trapped by binding molecules, and oxidised (preventing both of these steps in animal models reduces atherosclerosis). Oxidised LDL is an inflammatory signaller: it attracts macrophages which engulf it to try to get rid of it, and this stimulates them to 1. release more inflammatory signals to attract more cells, and 2. die, full of cholesterol.

 

This in turn causes an inflammatory positive feedback loop: attracting more cells, more inflammatory signalling, more cholesterol engulfment, more cell death- the atherosclerotic lesion.

 

 

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Recommendations for the use of LDL apheresis.

Thompson GR1; HEART-UK LDL Apheresis Working Group.

 

J Clin Apher. 2005 Dec;20(4):252-5.
Long-term effects of LDL apheresis in patients with severe hypercholesterolemia.

Sachais BS1, Katz J, Ross J, Rader DJ.

 

The Lipid Research Clinics Coronary Primary Prevention Trial results. I. Reduction in incidence of coronary heart disease.

[No authors listed]

JAMA. 1984 Jan 20;251(3):351-64.

 

Am J Med. 2019 Jul 10. pii: S0002-9343(19)30564-9. doi: 10.1016/j.amjmed.2019.06.029. [Epub ahead of print]
Cholesterol lowering and stroke: no longer room for pleiotropic effects of statins - confirmation from PCSK9 inhibitor studies.

Salvatore T1, Morganti R2, Marchioli R3, De Caterina R4.
 

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Ezetimibe Added to Statin Therapy after Acute Coronary Syndromes.

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