If I am using a visa service, how early do I need to renew my extension of stay?

[KhunFred]

17 minutes ago, Sophon said:

His 2019 application is based on having money in the bank, and one of the requirements is that the money remains in the bank for three months after the application (and 400k for the rest of the year). Even though his 2020 application will be based on income, they will most likely also check that he maintained the funds required to qualify for his 2019 application. 

 

Sophon

No, that is NOT what I said. My INCOME is about 80k Thai Baht. What I will transfer will be 65 k Thai Baht. The rest is kept in my American credit union to pay credit card bills.

[essox essox]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

Why are you doing it?

its obvious WHY !!

[piston broke]

 

you lot are like a bunch of giggling school kids .....

 

He's here for help and sensible advice - not smarmy, holier than thou, comments ....

[JohnnyBD]

59 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

There is no proof for what you wrote.

Immigration offices have been directed to be lenient this year since the rules did not go into effect until December. His 6 months should not be a problem.

I didn't say he needed an agent and I didn't tell him they wouldn't accept his 6 xfers in Oct. He said he was going to use an agent to help this year because he only had 6 xfers by Oct. Someone else told him he could not use the income method this year and had to use the 800k. My statement still stands that he should have no problem in 2020 having more than 12 xfers of 65k+ for 2020. Other person, Sophon was telling him they would not accept his income method next year if he used an agent.

Edited March 18, 2019 by JohnnyBD

[Sophon]

14 minutes ago, KhunFred said:

No, that is NOT what I said. My INCOME is about 80k Thai Baht. What I will transfer will be 65 k Thai Baht. The rest is kept in my American credit union to pay credit card bills.

The point is that the agent will not use your income for the application, but instead will fake proof of you having 800k in the bank and pay the immigration officer to approve the application. So even though you genuinely have the income to qualify, your extension will still be based on fraud and corruption. That will become a problem next year, when you have the required transfers to qualify on your own based on income.

 

There is a separate, recent thread from a ThaiVisa poster, who used an agent out of convenience even though he qualified in his own right. But when he went to do his 90 day report, he found out that not only had the agent not used his documentation, the extension had also been approved in a different province from where he lived (because the agent had contacts in that province). That poster is now leaving Thailand, because he is afraid what will happen, if immigration finds out that his extension was obtained illegally.

 

Sophon

[Sophon]

1 minute ago, JohnnyBD said:

I didn't say he needed an agent. He said he was going to use an agent to help this year because he only had 6 xfers by Oct. Some else told him he could not use the income method this year and had to use the 800k. My statement still stands that he should have no problem in 2020 having more tha 12 xfers of 65k+ in 2020.. Other person, Sophon was telling him they would not accept his income method next year.

He will qualify for the extension in 2020 based on income. What you don't seem to realize is, that under the new rules a requirement for his 2019 extension (based on funds in the bank) is that those funds remain in the bank after the extension is granted. In 2020 they will check that he actually complied with this requirement. What do you suggest he tells immigration, when they ask for proof that the funds (that he never had) was kept in the bank for the required period?

 

If you have obtained an extension by means of corruption, would you really want a different immigration officer that hasn't been paid off to examine that extension the following year? I wouldn't.

 

Sophon

[scottiejohn]

32 minutes ago, KhunFred said:

I have not seen ONE communication from Immigration which suggests that I will be locked into using an agent permanently. Next year, I should be able to transfer 65K Baht every month into my Thai account. Can't do it this year because they were late in making their declaration. We were three months into the year before their terms were clear.

So you are still intending to break the law. 

If you, as a frequent poster,  were not aware of the changes in time, and failed to react, I have no sympathy.

I suggest you get your own house in order before blaming others!

Please read Ubunjoe's  comments.  It may help you to understand your failing to understand the correct and legal procedures.

 

PS.  Anyone who uses an illegal system tends to get locked into them.  (in some ways it is similar to loan sharks!)

In many cases it is called extorsion, as a person has knowingly broken the law to solve an immediate problem but then cannot get out of the loop.

All the best at IDC, i.d.c. if it all goes t*ts up going down the slippery slope/road

[ubonjoe]

11 minutes ago, Sophon said:

The point is that the agent will not use your income for the application, but instead will fake proof of you having 800k in the bank and pay the immigration officer to approve the application. So even though you genuinely have the income to qualify, your extension will still be based on fraud and corruption.

How do you know that?

It appears to be suppostion rather than fact.

[marcusarelus]

20 minutes ago, essox essox said:

its obvious WHY !!

He is a regular poster so certainly knew when he should have gotten an embassy letter.  You figure it out. 

[Lacessit]

I use an agent for convenience. We normally set the wheels in motion with regard to extension paperwork 2 - 3 weeks before the due date of extension. IMHO the OP should not have any problem.

[KhunFred]

20 minutes ago, Sophon said:

The point is that the agent will not use your income for the application, but instead will fake proof of you having 800k in the bank and pay the immigration officer to approve the application. So even though you genuinely have the income to qualify, your extension will still be based on fraud and corruption. That will become a problem next year, when you have the required transfers to qualify on your own based on income.

 

There is a separate, recent thread from a ThaiVisa poster, who used an agent out of convenience even though he qualified in his own right. But when he went to do his 90 day report, he found out that not only had the agent not used his documentation, the extension had also been approved in a different province from where he lived (because the agent had contacts in that province). That poster is now leaving Thailand, because he is afraid what will happen, if immigration finds out that his extension was obtained illegally.

 

Sophon

Well, it just appears that I am the latest victim of Thai law. You really cannot win here. I can see why many posters are advising moving to Vietnam or the Philippines. A very sad situation for people who clearly qualify under the monthly income method, but are caught up in the web of destruction spun by Immigration. Their country, their rules. Yeah.....RIGHT.

[KhunFred]

11 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

He is a regular poster so certainly knew when he should have gotten an embassy letter.  You figure it out. 

I got the last Embassy letter that was available to me. That was used in October for my latest extension. After that, I could only have gotten a letter that was good for six months. Do the math.

Edited March 18, 2019 by KhunFred

[marcusarelus]

8 minutes ago, KhunFred said:

I got the last Embassy letter that was available to me. That was used in October for my latest extension. After that, I could only have gotten a letter that was good for six months. Do the math.

Yup you are correct.  Guess it would have been better to get a letter and go out of the country - start over and get a new retirement visa. 

Edited March 18, 2019 by marcusarelus

[Sophon]

15 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

How do you know that?

It appears to be suppostion rather than fact.

That may be, but it is supposition confirmed by several posts from users using those services. You should remember posts over the years of people moving provinces and being told by the new immigration office to go back to his old province, because they could see that the paperwork didn't add up.

 

Here is a recent example of someone using an agent:

Quote

My visa was obtained through official bribery and I did not know what was going on until after the fact.  I thought I was paying for an expeditor.  I was brand new in Thailand,  had used expeditors for my India and Chinese visa from Texas. I was stupid and uninformed that tge level of offical corruption and bribery was as it was (is) in Thailand.   I even had the Embassy letter.  They did not use it, deposited 800k in my bank account abd withdrew the next day. 

 

I have to produce my bankbook for a renewal,  and have been strongly advised against that. Oh, I went for my first 90 day report in Bkk, and was really shaken when the IO told me my address was in Chunburi. I lived in Bangkok.  Cost me a lot of stress and running around and 5,000 baht, but was made right.  

 

My second 90 day report? They grilled me for an hour of the address stuff.  I had all my records and receipts.  They were not happy campers.   I made the decision after talking to friends that I trust to leave under my own steam. 

Sophon

[watcharacters]

With all my paperwork completed the agent I use said it would take a week for my passport to be returned to me.

She explained this was due to recent changes in immigration rules.

 

I only use the agent for convenience.

[watcharacters]

4 hours ago, mokwit said:

Can't be that legit as the application form distinctly says that attendance in person is required.

 

Not quite true, mokwit.   "Can't be that legit"

 

I had to go to Imm. office with an appointment and company  escort to have my photo taken. 

 

Took about 4 minutes from moment I walked into the building.

 

The service is simply one of convenience.     Works well for me.

[JohnnyBD]

44 minutes ago, KhunFred said:

I got the last Embassy letter that was available to me. That was used in October for my latest extension. After that, I could only have gotten a letter that was good for six months. Do the math.

KuhnFred,

I wouldn't worry too much. Just go for your extension as normal. I agree 100% with Ubonjoe that you should not have a problem in Oct with the 6 monthly transfers and you should not have to use an agent. You're doing everything you can do right now by making the xfers. If for some reason, they do not grant you the extension then you can go to plan B. I would be asking Ubonjoe what the best plan B would be if your extension is not granted.

Edited March 18, 2019 by JohnnyBD

[owl sees all]

1 hour ago, Sophon said:

There is a separate, recent thread from a ThaiVisa poster, who used an agent out of convenience even though he qualified in his own right. But when he went to do his 90 day report, he found out that not only had the agent not used his documentation, the extension had also been approved in a different province from where he lived (because the agent had contacts in that province). That poster is now leaving Thailand, because he is afraid what will happen, if immigration finds out that his extension was obtained illegally.

This has happened to me. I did the 90 day at Udon Thani but the visa was done by an agent in Chonbury. The check-in officer had a moan but changed the location for a photocopy charge of 500 bhat (box on the desk).

 

If they rock the boat people will be out of pocket. Not worth fretting too much.

[scubascuba3]

 
Not quite true, mokwit.   "Can't be that legit"
 
I had to go to Imm. office with an appointment and company  escort to have my photo taken. 
 
Took about 4 minutes from moment I walked into the building.
 
The service is simply one of convenience.     Works well for me.

a friend does the same process but not legit. they don't even bother with 800k now

[DrJack54]

1 hour ago, scubascuba3 said:

2 hours ago, watcharacters said:

 
Not quite true, mokwit.   "Can't be that legit"
 
I had to go to Imm. office with an appointment and company  escort to have my photo taken. 
 
Took about 4 minutes from moment I walked into the building.
 
The service is simply one of convenience.     Works well for me.

a friend does the same process but not legit. they don't even bother with 800k now

Does your "friend" think how how that pans out future?

[onera1961]

5 hours ago, KhunFred said:

The rest is kept in my American credit union to pay credit card bills.

This question may be unethical, so if you don't want to answer it is OK. I wonder why you're paying your credit card bills? Do you have real estate in America? If you don't pay, they cant touch your SS and if you don't pay, they cant put a  lien on your house if you don't have one. I have close to half a million dollars (in 70 cards. I am credit card collectors) of available credits in my credit cards. I won't lie but often I have the desire to charge and not pay. I don't care if they ruin my credits and it drops below 500.

Edited March 18, 2019 by onera1961

[Johnthplumb]

5 hours ago, KhunFred said:

NOTHING about my declaration of income is false. I make much more than the requirement. I have not been transferring it all to Thailand because I have bills to pay which cannot be paid from Bangkok Bank. Very simple. No fraudulent intent. No falsehood. Just the facts, very demonstrable by many documents ( none of which are accepted by Immigration).

Incorrect KhunFred,

I bank at the bank of Bangkok, i have there Visa card for my savings account, I can pay bills like my gas and electric, also council tax, in the UK by quoting to them my long card No and then the three security numbers on the reverse of the card, payment is made no problem, ( it is the same operation as you are in the UK ), Just bear in mind the exchange rate, but the rate is acceptable for the convenience,

 

[AAArdvark]

26 minutes ago, Johnthplumb said:

Incorrect KhunFred,

I bank at the bank of Bangkok, i have there Visa card for my savings account, I can pay bills like my gas and electric, also council tax, in the UK by quoting to them my long card No and then the three security numbers on the reverse of the card, payment is made no problem, ( it is the same operation as you are in the UK ), Just bear in mind the exchange rate, but the rate is acceptable for the convenience,

 

But you are actually paying the exchange rate coming and going plus a transfer fee from the UK unless the funds in the bank come for a Thai source.  

[AAArdvark]

1 hour ago, onera1961 said:

This question may be unethical, so if you don't want to answer it is OK. I wonder why you're paying your credit card bills? Do you have real estate in America? If you don't pay, they cant touch your SS and if you don't pay, they cant put a  lien on your house if you don't have one. I have close to half a million dollars (in 70 cards. I am credit card collectors) of available credits in my credit cards. I won't lie but often I have the desire to charge and not pay. I don't care if they ruin my credits and it drops below 500.

The question is not unethical but not paying legitimate bills certainly is.

[onera1961]

22 minutes ago, AAArdvark said:

The question is not unethical but not paying legitimate bills certainly is.

I know it is unethical but it is not illegal. One can declare bankruptcy and not pay so it is legalized ethical when done through a lawyer and the court system?

Edited March 18, 2019 by onera1961

[scubascuba3]

Does your "friend" think how how that pans out future?

He isn't worried and that agent says it carries on as before

[ubonjoe]

12 hours ago, Sophon said:

That may be, but it is supposition confirmed by several posts from users using those services. You should remember posts over the years of people moving provinces and being told by the new immigration office to go back to his old province, because they could see that the paperwork didn't add up.

Of course I am aware of it happening but you wrote it like it was fact in the OP's case.

Your example is typical of the person hiring an agent and not being aware of what the had been done. In the  case quoted they did not even notice that the extension was done in a different than where he was living.

It is up to the OP to start bringing his income into the country and insure that the extension is done for income.

[mtls2005]

Personally, I wouldn't use an agent.

 

Can you squeeze in a 7th transfer, which aligns with your current monthly schedule? I realize the 3 October date makes that more challenging.

 

In theory, it would have only been possible to make nine transfers (discounting December as the order was issued late in that month and in Thai only at first), so I think they might show leniency. We'll know more as we see experiences, bu office(s) for May, June, July, etc.

 

Worst case they may give you a two-month extension, then you prove continued monthly transfers. Failing that I would - and I'm in a similar position (28 Sep, only nine transfers) - I would leave, go to Vietnam for a stay-cation, then come back and start the visa-exempt to 90 day to extension mambo.