16 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

I can see that "pattern" everywhere, and i happen to think that is not by chance.

Perceiving a pattern is a perception, it is not a fact. The well-known Rorschach Test shows us that. You "happen to think that is not by chance" is a belief; equally it is not a fact. Your perceptions are undoubtedly reinforced by confirmation bias

4 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

I can see that "pattern" everywhere, and i happen to think that is not by chance.

You are free to think what you pleased and make you happy.

 

5 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

If you want to believe that all we call "life" happened "by chance", i am ok with that.

That is  tolerant, good from you.

5 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

That is  tolerant, good from you.

Surely i am, even if sometimes, in the heat of the argument, i could give a wrong impression.

I put tolerance and patience very high on the list of what i consider "divine" qualities.

Just now, mauGR1 said:

 

I put tolerance and patience very high on the list of what i consider "divine" qualities.

It may be "divine"' for you,

and just fair-minded for another,

or whatever.

 

Being tolerant is what counts.

11 minutes ago, ThaiBunny said:

Perceiving a pattern is a perception, it is not a fact. The well-known Rorschach Test shows us that. You "happen to think that is not by chance" is a belief; equally it is not a fact

I can accept that, but you can't claim that perception is the same for everyone.

I have quite neutral feelings about other people's perceptions, in the end, what it matters is my perceptions, and the development of those perceptions.

As i said, and i repeat, to trust exclusively on the 5 physical senses to ascertain reality, creates a sort of "wall of prejudice" that makes impossible to see and enter spiritual realities.

Just now, luckyluke said:

Being tolerant is what counts.

Only for some. Fanatics (of all religions) have an entirely opposite view

2 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

As i said, and i repeat, to trust exclusively on the 5 physical senses to ascertain reality, creates a sort of "wall of prejudice" that makes impossible to see and enter spiritual realities.

And where have I denied the importance of spirituality? I just don't happen to think, on the balance of probabilities, that there's a "God" involved, or an "intelligent design"

1 minute ago, luckyluke said:

Being tolerant is what counts.

Not exactly, i am afraid.

Sometimes being tolerant can be wrong, if you tolerate an injustice.

I think justice is much higher than tolerance.

1 minute ago, ThaiBunny said:

I just don't happen to think, on the balance of probabilities, that there's a "God" involved, or an "intelligent design"

Fair enough, but on the balance of probabilities i believe the opposite.

3 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

Not exactly, i am afraid.

Sometimes being tolerant can be wrong, if you tolerate an injustice.

I think justice is much higher than tolerance.

ok, than we can discuss the fact that justice may be impartial.

 

4 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

i believe

You are entitled to believe what you like, so are the others.

 

 

3 minutes ago, luckyluke said:

ok, than we can discuss the fact that justice may be impartial.

 

Yes, of course i was talking of "Justice" as an absolute, or impartial, if you prefer.

On 2/2/2020 at 8:08 AM, mauGR1 said:

Did Jesus say that ?

In my very personal opinion, Jesus was against fundamentalism and bigotry.

For what it's worth, I think he was a good man who could work with wood, the rest all came later when the exaggeration train got going ......

1 minute ago, geronimo said:

For what it's worth, I think he was a good man who could work with wood, the rest all came later when the exaggeration train got going ......

And in the end it was the wood what got him

4 minutes ago, geronimo said:

For what it's worth, I think he was a good man who could work with wood, the rest all came later when the exaggeration train got going ......

For what it's worth, i think he was an exceptional human being, his parables are maps of the highest realms a human being can reach.

Sometimes i am still surprised how the vibrant truth of his words has survived the corruption of the modern times.

12 hours ago, AsianAtHeart said:

 

Summarizing a few of the points from your posts shown above:

 

1) It's inexcusable to be ignorant and to be proud of it, too.

2) God created opportunities to better ourselves through knowledge.

3) You want to have greater knowledge of God, having a "longing for union with the divine."

4) You don't think God cares if you read His Word or not?

 

It looks like you are so close to the truth.  You want the truth.  And the Bible has it.

 

I can respect a man who has studied something and decided not to accept it.  I cannot respect someone who has deliberately rejected something before they learned anything about it.

 

I will tell you this:  God does care if you read the Bible or not.  He says in it:

It is difficult to believe or have faith without understanding, and understanding does not come through ignorance.  But without faith it is impossible to please God.

 

Is not faith a gift of God given to those who seek?

Is faith an either or proposition, or is there not good to be had even in having even the smallest of quantities, for example the size of a mustard seed, as an analogy to mean a very small amount?

9 hours ago, sirineou said:

A syndrome we all suffer  from. 

Hung in there.

I wish politics would not be interjected here.

1 minute ago, WalkingOrders said:

I wish politics would not be interjected here.

and I wish you would participate by having something to say rather that reacting to what others have to say by your seal of approval or disapproval, but it seems neither one of as will get their wish. 

8 hours ago, luckyluke said:

Who is judging which opinions are informed or uninformed?

I am, all the time. On every opinion I read.

 

 

7 hours ago, sirineou said:

How is that? do you guys have another Comey waiting in the wings?

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2020/president/National.html

Why? Why post this, why turn this to a political discussion?

3 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said:

Why? Why post this, why turn this to a political discussion?

The answer would be easy to ascertain by following the exchange a step back. 

7 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

On the contrary, the barrister's informed opinion is merely a best guess, and as lots of people have found to their cost, sometimes their best isn't good enough when it gets before a judge. That's why an informed opinion is better decribed as an "hypothesis", either supported or disproved by evidence and therefore subject to change. The theory of evolution is better described as the hypothesis about evolution. Evolution isn't much in doubt any more (DNA research has given us much better tools to verify it) except by the lunatic fringe of religious believers, but theories or hypotheses about how it works are still a work in progress. The existence of God is another hypothesis, and whether you believe in God seems to depend on whether you prefer subjective experience (as Sunmaster clearly does) or subjective perception (such as "intelligent design" as favoured by MAUrg1) or measurable cause and effect (several sceptics here)

This is simply not true. An argument before a court is based upon facts, and knowledge - very precise knowledge - of case law, statutory law, and the precise definition of words, especially legal terminology. A judge is weighing the arguments made based upon his or her own knowledge, and understanding of the same base of knowledge, and making a decision. This is not guesswork, it is reason and logic, applied to the facts.

It's been great. Alot of fun. Interesting...tho seems to have gone totally off the rails now. Got my finger on the UNFOLLOW button. Try not to miss me too much!

Out in 3...2...1

????

5 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

Perceiving a pattern is a perception, it is not a fact. The well-known Rorschach Test shows us that. You "happen to think that is not by chance" is a belief; equally it is not a fact. Your perceptions are undoubtedly reinforced by confirmation bias

Seeing a pattern is perception, but that does not mean that the pattern itself is not a fact and mathematically definable as such. If I have a chessboard in front of me. It's there, it has a definable pattern on it, that I can see, and count. 

 

I could be fooled and think I am seeing a pattern, I could be mentally ill, and see patterns in everything and be wrong. My perception being wrong. Likewise I can see a pattern that others do not see, but mathematics could prove me correct, a pattern exists. Likewise pattern can exist that I could never see or perceive, but through mathematics. That formula applied could be proven, and a fact just like a chessboard.

 

45 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

It's been great. Alot of fun. Interesting...tho seems to have gone totally off the rails now. Got my finger on the UNFOLLOW button. Try not to miss me too much!

Out in 3...2...1

????

Don't go!!!!!!

5 hours ago, mauGR1 said:

Surely i am, even if sometimes, in the heat of the argument, i could give a wrong impression.

I put tolerance and patience very high on the list of what i consider "divine" qualities.

I think there are plenty of things, ideas turned into action, that should never be tolerated, and to tolerate them could called moral cowardice, or failure to act, or acting as an enabler.

58 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

It's been great. Alot of fun. Interesting...tho seems to have gone totally off the rails now. Got my finger on the UNFOLLOW button. Try not to miss me too much!

Out in 3...2...1

????

Not a moment too soon. ???????? 
But who is he kidding?...He'll be back of course. He loves it too much. 555

2 minutes ago, WalkingOrders said:

I think there are plenty of things, ideas turned into action, that should never be tolerated, and to tolerate them could called moral cowardice, or failure to act, or acting as an enabler.

In fact, if you had looked at my next post, i said that justice is higher on the list.

1 hour ago, sirineou said:

and I wish you would participate by having something to say rather that reacting to what others have to say by your seal of approval or disapproval, but it seems neither one of as will get their wish. 

I participate quite a bit. It's not politics here. I am not being unkind for saying so. And reactions should not bother you, everyone gets them.

7 minutes ago, Sunmaster said:

No a moment too soon. ???????? 
But who is he kidding?...He'll be back of course. He loves it too much. 555

I like his posts.