MEV Refused entry

[riclag]

6 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

That's true in some cases, but there are many cases where the illegal activity has been going on for months and only ends when an IO stops them from coming back into Thailand.  So a lot of legitimate tourists pay for the transgressions of others. 

 

Not unlike a lot of life...

 

On a side note, I've never understood the mentality that says it's better to show your long term apartment lease than a hotel reservation when protesting your status as a "tourist".   With computers, printers and refundable online bookings, that's just lazy.

 

Some how you changed the context  of  my meaning ! Requirements met to come half way around the world to be denied is wrong ! To blame others for some people who abuse the system is wrong 

[BritTim]

20 minutes ago, impulse said:

That's true in some cases, but there are many cases where the illegal activity has been going on for months and only ends when an IO stops them from coming back into Thailand.  So a lot of legitimate tourists pay for the transgressions of others. 

If someone has been working illegally in Thailand, that is a legitimate reason for denied entry (to be precise, entry should be denied under Section 12 (3))

While not publicly disclosed, the denied entry for those with tourist visas seems almost always to be because you have been enjoying Thailand for too long. Activities that were fine in your first month or two in Thailand are now against Thailand's interests when you are doing exactly the same six months later.

Edited May 22, 2019 by BritTim

[gunderhill]

You may as  well bang your head against the wall as you are dealing with cretins.

[ericthai]

3 hours ago, SteveK said:

It's seems odd to me that there are still so many long-term visitors to Thailand who don't understand what the tourist visa is intended for. However, I think at least some of the blame for this should be placed on the various Thai embassies around the world, websites and advice should be updated to explain that back to back tourist visa users should expect to be questioned, if not refused entry.

 

I'm sure that there are some genuine tourists who are plodding around the country very slowly under their own steam and taking many months to explore what Thailand has to offer. However, I suspect the vast majority of tourist visa abusers are simply spending a lot of time enjoying their newly-found teerak. Are they real tourists? Well, in their eyes I am sure that they are, they are exploring, spending money, taking photos etc, it's just the amount of time that they may end up spending means that they are no longer viewed as genuine tourists, I know for a fact that Thailand is not the only country in the world to take this very sensible stance!

 

At what point you are no longer a tourist and could be considered to be living in the country is not clearly defined, if at all, and with rules being what they are in Thailand, the more you push it the more trouble you will encounter. Western tourists are almost certainly used to clearly defined and enforced rules and regulations, but the goalposts are always changing in Thailand, but then it's the differences from my awful home country which makes Thailand so great for me.

 

Now that I am used to the way things are done here, I allow the right amount of time to get things done. Yes, I still get annoyed, particularly with my bank, but I no longer let things get to me. I just have to sit down, drink a manao soda and think "I could be at home, I could be at home, I could be at home", and suddenly, I feel a lot better.

The problem is for decades Thailand didnt care less if you overstayed, or were living full time on visa exempts, tourist visas etc. Then Thai immigration started cracking down on things (early 2000's) and it's never stopped. How long can some hold out? I think it's getting close. Maybe a few more hoops? 

[samsensam]

 

i had been using METVs for years but it was clear that things were changing as far as immigration were concerned, so i changed to a more appropriate visa. you can't really blame immigration as METVs are not intended as a way for foreigners to stay in the kingdom long term.

[PingRoundTheWorld]

Great to see that as usual people on TV are experts on interpreting Thai law, considering there is not a single mention of a limit on how long you can remain as a tourist, and not a single immigration official ever publicly announced such a limit. The Thai embassy in my home country has a poster saying there is no limit on how long one can stay on tourist visas.

 

Bottom line is the law does not mention a limit, and any mental gymnastics to justify rejecting people who otherwise are law abiding and went through the trouble of getting a visa (and showing financial ability to support themselves in the process) is an exercise in self-righteousness. Next.

[impulse]

3 hours ago, riclag said:

Some how you changed the context  of  my meaning ! Requirements met to come half way around the world to be denied is wrong ! To blame others for some people who abuse the system is wrong 

 

No, I just pointed out that there are possibilities besides the one you put forth.  Like the guys coming to work in Thailand illegally who get an METV because that's really all they qualify for.

 

If nobody abused recreational drugs, we wouldn't need drug laws, either.   Life is full of examples where some people ruin it for everyone.

 

Edited May 22, 2019 by impulse

[Caldera]

6 hours ago, impulse said:

Like the guys coming to work in Thailand illegally who get an METV because that's really all they qualify for.

Do you really believe that this is a common scenario? Illegal work is typically not paying a lot (except for those who run their criminal empire in or from Thailand and can easily afford Thai Elite), so that trip back home for a METV comes at quite a cost. Many embassies and consulates also ask for proof of employment.

[essox essox]

On 5/22/2019 at 8:44 AM, jacko45k said:

Apparently not, it seems to vary. These 'rules' are being applied to people with Visas and without.  Heard of a few. Usually land borders (except Poi-Phet) are Ok though. 

The 15 days flight out does not make sense .

 

What type of Multiple Entry Visa do you have?

is there NOT only one kind of MEV....the one that allows you to go out and re enter as many times one wants within a 12 month period???

 

[stevenl]

5 minutes ago, essox essox said:

is there NOT only one kind of MEV....the one that allows you to go out and re enter as many times one wants within a 12 month period???

 

There is tourist and non-immigrant ME visa.

[essox essox]

2 minutes ago, stevenl said:

There is tourist and non-immigrant ME visa.

never knew this....there again we all do not know the so called RULES and Laws here.....

What is  a rule and what/which is  A LAW????

[jacko45k]

21 hours ago, gamini said:

Have you been in the kingdom more than 180 days in the past year? If so, you cannot call yourself a tourist

Yes, I don't. 

[jacko45k]

1 hour ago, essox essox said:

is there NOT only one kind of MEV....the one that allows you to go out and re enter as many times one wants within a 12 month period???

 

There is a Multiple Entry Tourist Visa, a Non-Imm O Multi, an OA and an OX and an Elite. All different. 

Edited May 23, 2019 by jacko45k

[freedomnow]

13 hours ago, CelticTam said:

You are not allowed to leave Thailand and return same day - even if you have a valid visa. This regulation Was introduced around 2014. I know, as I experienced a non-entr on theses grounds at Sadao. Came back next day, no problem.

INCORRECT.

Mae Sai/Mae Sot Burma. Out/in same hour/day, whether it's to activate next portion of a 'valid until' visa or visa-exempt run of 2 allowed in 1 year by land.

[JackThompson]

18 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

I'll stand corrected but as far as I know, a visa doesn't guarantee entry. I believe immigration officers have a degree of discretion - I know they do in the UK.

In Thailand, there is a list of very specific reasons for which denied entry is legal.  Discretion is not one of those reasons. 

 

The denials we see here occur when an IO declares a rule that does not exist to the visitor, then stamps a different inapplicable reason regarding "inadequate means of support" in the visitor's passport.  The "stamped" reason is not applicable to a Tourist entry, and the visitor is given no way to prove the charge false.   This is beyond the 20K cash requirement, which is all that is needed in terms of money-proof for a 60-day tourist entry.

 

It's very different scenario from the UK, USA, AU - where people are trying to get in from all over the world to get access to the handouts and higher-paying jobs.   The Western folks being targeted in Thailand would have no reason to 'downgrade' their incomes, by trying to live here and work under-the-table. 

 

18 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Granted, that discretion probably has ground rules which are probably abused but isn't living in Thailand on tourist visas a form of abuse too?

It is not abuse according to any published rules, no.  But some unofficial "guidelines" about Visa Exempts came out some years ago - those being issued by immigration - not the MFA.  Contrary to what I first believed, they hold no legal weight - were not an official Police or Ministerial Order.

[Briggsy]

18 hours ago, CelticTam said:

You are not allowed to leave Thailand and return same day - even if you have a valid visa. This regulation Was introduced around 2014. I know, as I experienced a non-entr on theses grounds at Sadao. Came back next day, no problem.

 

18 hours ago, CelticTam said:

On a separate note, if you enter Thailand 3 times within a rolling period of 180 days without a  valid visa, you may be considered as a non-tourist with the the prospect of being denied entry. I understand this rule can be applied to those entering by air, so be aware that you think you can enter multiple times without a visa. Maybe, Ubonjoe can confirm

Neither one is a rule, law or police order. All laws and police orders are published. Please feel free to show the regulation/law/police order you are referring to. You won't because you can't. You will try to bluster your way out of your inaccurate statements by saying that it what happens. I know that is what happens but it is wrong to state it is a regulation when it is just a made-up interpretation of the laws at some border entry points but not others.

 

Please refrain from making up statements that are not true. Thank you.

[JackThompson]

15 hours ago, samsensam said:

i had been using METVs for years but it was clear that things were changing as far as immigration were concerned, so i changed to a more appropriate visa. you can't really blame immigration as METVs are not intended as a way for foreigners to stay in the kingdom long term.

They are "designed" to allow multiple 60-day stays through the expiration date (6 mo after issuance), each entry of which can be extended by 30 additional days at an immigration-office.  Any "how often" or "how long" issues would need to be stated in the conditions, if they were/are needed, for some reason.

 

To qualify to get this Visa, you must show money held in an account for an extended period, and some consulates also require proof of employment or another income source.  If that isn't good enough for Immigration, they need to take it up with their superiors - not the holders of valid visas who correctly followed the official instructions.

 

 

[DJ54]

A friends wife (legally) has been to US 5 times they have a house, 

two business in US. They’ve started longer stays in US. Generally 

flies through Chicago. The found a good price air ticket to another 

airport. 

 

Traveling together (he’s a US citizen) no problems for him. US denied entry and put her back on airplane. She’s probably 45

and he is 60. All businesses are legal and no background 

problems for either.

 

The IO in the US maybe had a bad day or he thought something.

They don’t go through that location anymore. She’s been to US

a couple times since no problems. 

 

Ive been jaw jacked by US IO I’m 65 and don’t wear clothes that 

might spark them. I told the IO why all the questions and by the

way I’m a US Citizen. Turns out someone with same first and last

as mine their looking for. 

 

I cant use the automated machines in the US because of name.

Get th big X and go over there..