Johnson warns EU against any 'Napoleonic' tariffs in no-deal Brexit

[evadgib]

Doris Karloff on form yesterday:

 

[Mavideol]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

We have been down this road so many times. Parliament made it binding by invoking art50.

Consequently, the European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Act 2017 empowering the prime minister to invoke Article 50 was enacted in March 2017.

 

thought it was TM (the conservative government) who invoked article 50 not MP's but could be wrong

[7by7]

9 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Quite a few links have been provided on various threads re. this ongoing court case, but I do agree that it's very hard to find via MSM ☹️.

 

Googling 'robin tilbrook court case' is the place to start.

 Not that difficult.

 

As well as the sources I named earlier, following your suggestion turned up many more; such this from the Daily Express: Brexiteer vows to PROVE Britain ALREADY left EU in court - ‘I’m VERY confident!’

 

Yet again, unsubstantiated claims that the MSM are ignoring pro Brexit news is proven to be rubbish.

[NightSky]

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

We have been down this road so many times. Parliament made it binding by invoking art50.

Fact, Article 50 can be revoked.

 

Fact, The referendum poll is non binding. 

 

Fact, A question to obtain a view point is all it was.

 

Fact, You are clutching at straws mate.

[cleopatra2]

18 minutes ago, evadgib said:

MSM aren't touching it 49 but your posts suggest you once again have a full bladder and i'm not going to post anything on which you can empty it ????

The legal challenge to Art 50 extension was dismissed from court as having no merit

[vogie]

2 minutes ago, Mavideol said:

Consequently, the European Union (Notification of Withdrawal) Act 2017 empowering the prime minister to invoke Article 50 was enacted in March 2017.

 

thought it was TM (the conservative government) who invoked article 50 not MP's but could be wrong

MPs had to vote on it, the vote was 498 in favour of invoking art 50, 114 were against.

[Mavideol]

1 minute ago, vogie said:

MPs had to vote on it, the vote was 498 in favour of invoking art 50, 114 were against.

ok, so ALL 498 are guilty of the same stupid decision

[7by7]

37 minutes ago, vogie said:

Hows about The Guardians own version of it, I trust this will be enough to satisfy your doubts, or not. He did use the expression country though.

"The European parliament’s president, Antonio Tajani, rebuked those MEPs who did not immediately get to their feet. “[It] is a question of respect; it doesn’t mean that you necessarily share the views of the European Union. If you listen to the anthem of another country you rise to your feet.”"

 

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/jul/02/brexit-party-meps-turn-their-backs-european-anthem-ode-to-joy

 I'll give you that. But was he calling the EU a country or making a general comment about respecting an anthem?

 

I guess our answer to that will be different.

 

Doesn't alter the simple fact that the most effective, let alone honest, way of showing their disapproval of the EU and it's Parliament would be to not attend at all.

 

But as doing that would have meant each and every one of them forfeiting tens of thousands of pounds of British taxpayers money, they chose to turn up and collect the cash instead!

[7by7]

10 minutes ago, vogie said:

MPs had to vote on it, the vote was 498 in favour of invoking art 50, 114 were against.

 Indeed, and they could have voted not to extend it; but chose not to do so.

[dick dasterdly]

12 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 Not that difficult.

 

As well as the sources I named earlier, following your suggestion turned up many more; such this from the Daily Express: Brexiteer vows to PROVE Britain ALREADY left EU in court - ‘I’m VERY confident!’

 

Yet again, unsubstantiated claims that the MSM are ignoring pro Brexit news is proven to be rubbish.

Hang on!

 

Gina Miller's case was all over MSM, and yet Robin Tilbrook's ongoing case is barely mentioned!

 

Which is why you had to ask for a link re. the court case....

 

 

[luckyluke]

Some here are amazed that an organisation do their best to try to keep one of their most valuable (in all aspects) member.

 

I personally think that is what an organisation has to do. 

 

Only when the other members decided the organisation has to let the member go, they have to act accordingly. 

 

Of course if the member categorically/sincerely wants to leave, he can just smashed the door, and completely ignore the tentatives of the organisation. 

 

 

[7by7]

Just now, dick dasterdly said:

Hang on!

 

Gina Miller's case was all over MSM, and yet Robin Tilbrook's ongoing case is barely mentioned!

 

Which is why you had to ask for a link re. the court case....

 

 

 I asked for a link because, unlike @evadgib, I believe in providing evidence to substantiate my claims.

 

As he had not done so, I went looking for such, and as shown in two posts found plenty; both in the MSM and elsewhere.

 

 

[dick dasterdly]

16 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

The legal challenge to Art 50 extension was dismissed from court as having no merit

Link please - as finding anything about this court case is still difficult.

[evadgib]

15 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 I asked for a link because, unlike @evadgib, I believe in providing evidence to substantiate my claims.

 

As he had not done so, I went looking for such, and as shown in two posts found plenty; both in the MSM and elsewhere.

In that case please post what happened next?

[7by7]

51 minutes ago, nauseus said:

I did. Not an official Scouting Association site or song!

 

It's a big NO from me. 

It's called A Scout Is: The Boy Scout's Anthem

 

It's on a website called Scout Songs.

 

Ok, it's American; doesn't mean it doesn't exist, though!

[vogie]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

I did. Not an official Scouting Association site or song!

 

It's a big NO from me. 

The only scout song I know is 'Gin gan gooly gooly gooly gooly what's your gin gang goo'

[CanterbrigianBangkoker]

1 hour ago, NightSky said:

Don’t confuse Brexit and democracy..

 

..the referendum was a ‘non binding’ poll, I quote the difference from google..

 

”A referendum is a vote by all enrolled electors on a question. ... A binding referendumrequires the result to be acted upon or implemented. An indicative referendum doesnot require the result to be acted upon or implemented. Citizens' initiated referendumsare indicative or non-binding.”

And which was the national referendum of 2016 described as by the government then? None of the above - anywhere in the literature or broadcast info - it was simply stated that 'what you decide will be implemented' - its an 'in or out decision to be made by the public on June 24th' and 'it will be a one way ticket not a return' among other guarantees made publically, verbally and in print. If you can't take the PM and acting government at their word on such a publicised, singular and prominent issue and on such a simply put binary choice then when can you!?  

 

Moreover who initiated it?? The Tory government did - elected in a GE on a manifesto promising it. ???? 

 

57 minutes ago, vogie said:

We have been down this road so many times. Parliament made it binding by invoking art50.

 

And this was the final confirmation/passing of it into legal statue. It is incredible how quickly people are willing to overlook facts, cry foul and totally re-write recent history just because they didn't get their way. Childish barely begins to cover it. Very sad that we have quite so many such adults in the UK. What went wrong!?

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by CanterbrigianBangkoker

[7by7]

2 minutes ago, evadgib said:

In that case please post what happened next?

So yet again you want me to do your work for you!

 

The case was dismissed as it had no merit.

 

As already explained, this is because the extension was laid before Parliament by means of a Statutory Instrument, to which no MP objected. It would have been odd had they done so, as the request for an extension had previously been approved by the House with a significant majority.

 

Therefore the extension is legal.

 

Tilbrook has requested leave to appeal, a request which is pending. As nothing has happened for a while, that is what has been reported recently; nothing.

[cleopatra2]

30 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Link please - as finding anything about this court case is still difficult.

See Robin Tilbrooke twitter feed

I do not know of any MSM who covered the rejection of the case

 

Only covered in legal circles as far as i know

[7by7]

5 minutes ago, CanterbrigianBangkoker said:

57 minutes ago, vogie said:

We have been down this road so many times. Parliament made it binding by invoking art50.

 

And this was the final confirmation/passing of it into legal statue. It is incredible how quickly people are willing to overlook facts, cry foul and totally re-write recent history just because they didn't get their way. Childish barely begins to cover it. Very sad that we have quite so many such adults in the UK. What went wrong!?

 The decision to extend Article 50 was also approved by Parliament.

 

Do your remarks include those Brexiteers who are against this extension approved by Parliament?

 

Especially to those who appear to be supporting the ludicrous court case to overturn it?

[dick dasterdly]

24 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

It's called A Scout Is: The Boy Scout's Anthem

 

It's on a website called Scout Songs.

 

Ok, it's American; doesn't mean it doesn't exist, though!

My school had a 'school song', and we were all required to stand up when it was performed....

 

As a kid, obviously I conformed to this stupid, pointless requirement.

 

As an adult, I am not as easily intimidated.

 

Which is why I still think the brexit EMPs should have just remained seated.

[luckyluke]

4 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

As an adult, I am not as easily intimidated.

I am occasionally at 8 a.m.

or 6 p.m. at Ekkamai bus station. I stand up, like everyone, when the National Anthem is playing. 

[evadgib]

11 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 The decision to extend Article 50 was also approved by Parliament.

 

Do your remarks include those Brexiteers who are against this extension approved by Parliament?

 

Especially to those who appear to be supporting the ludicrous court case to overturn it?

What did you make of this identical effort in t'other direction and the wall-to-wall coverage it received & how do you feel about the precedent it set....? 

[dick dasterdly]

47 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Link please - as finding anything about this court case is still difficult.

 

20 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

So yet again you want me to do your work for you!

 

The case was dismissed as it had no merit.

 

As already explained, this is because the extension was laid before Parliament by means of a Statutory Instrument, to which no MP objected. It would have been odd had they done so, as the request for an extension had previously been approved by the House with a significant majority.

 

Therefore the extension is legal.

 

Tilbrook has requested leave to appeal, a request which is pending. As nothing has happened for a while, that is what has been reported recently; nothing.

Again, link please.

 

"As nothing has happened for a while, that is what has been reported recently; nothing."

 

Pretty much nothing has been reported since the beginning of this court case - unlike gina millar's case that was all over MSM.

 

I have been told that this case has been rejected and an appeal will follow.  But again - not as a result of MSM.....

[dick dasterdly]

21 minutes ago, 7by7 said:

 The decision to extend Article 50 was also approved by Parliament.

 

Do your remarks include those Brexiteers who are against this extension approved by Parliament?

 

Especially to those who appear to be supporting the ludicrous court case to overturn it?

"The decision to extend Article 50 was also approved by Parliament"

 

Link please.

 

Not that I'm particularly bothered, as MPs have made it very clear that they are desperately searching for a BRINO that they can sell to the electorate ☹️.

[cleopatra2]

4 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Again, link please.

 

"As nothing has happened for a while, that is what has been reported recently; nothing."

 

Pretty much nothing has been reported since the beginning of this court case - unlike gina millar's case that was all over MSM.

 

I have been told that this case has been rejected and an appeal will follow.  But again - not as a result of MSM.....

Go to the source of the claimant 

Robin Tilbrooke

[evadgib]

5 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

Again, link please.

 

"As nothing has happened for a while, that is what has been reported recently; nothing."

 

Pretty much nothing has been reported since the beginning of this court case - unlike gina millar's case that was all over MSM.

 

I have been told that this case has been rejected and an appeal will follow.  But again - not as a result of MSM.....

Confirmed by Tilbrook himself here:

 

[NightSky]

36 minutes ago, CanterbrigianBangkoker said:

And which was the national referendum of 2016 described as by the government then? 

 

..it was a non-binding referendum, so basically it was an opinion poll.

 

I agree there are changes to be made on how EU rules are determined and implemented however Brexit isn't the way to do it unfortunately. Crashing out and burning bridges is never a good idea in the long run.

 

Edited July 3, 2019 by NightSky

[cleopatra2]

3 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

"The decision to extend Article 50 was also approved by Parliament"

 

Link please.

 

Not that I'm particularly bothered, as MPs have made it very clear that they are desperately searching for a BRINO that they can sell to the electorate ☹️.

Government motion on 14th March

[CanterbrigianBangkoker]

3 hours ago, 7by7 said:

Such as?

 

Whatever your thoughts on the EU are, there is one fundamental, vital difference between the EU and the old USSR.

 

The EU is a democratic institution where all decisions are made by democratically elected representatives, either by the European Parliament, the Council of Ministers or the Heads of Governments.

 

I doubt that these days you'd find even the most ardent socialist who would claim that the Soviet Union was ever democratic!

 

The EU doesn't have any gulags either.

 

'Remainers like to say that Leavers didn't know what they were voting for and while that might be true of many, the same can also be said of the other side. Back in 2016, they couldn’t say who their MEPs were or what the EU Council is or does or name any of the commissioners – and that’s a real problem because democracy only works when you understand how it works and who is working it. The EU is a sham democracy'.

 

I think that most people operate from a mistaken position (of naivety) around how transparent & actually democratic the EU really is. I have addressed this in an earlier post re: the commission, the toothless parliament and the litany of other components to this absurdly contrived, democratically diluted and opaque organisation that has far too much centralised power in Brussels - more so now than it ever has done before. 

It has engineered a sharp & escalating increase in its powers and impinged on its subjects liberties in some considerable ways over the last 50+ years. This is one way in which I draw the comparison to a (albeit more benign) nascent USSR - if the EEC had remained a single market / free trade area then I can guarantee you that neither myself or the vast majority of people who voted Leave would have done - an independence referendum would have been totally unneccessary if that were the case, after all.

The EU has morphed over time into what it is today - a faceless, autocratic juggernaught with its own flag, its own anthem, its own currency, its own fiscal policy, its own unilateral central bank, its own military (constantly denied until very recently), a single border policy, its own courts (ECJ) superceding and officiating above many domestic courts across the continent and of course the ever increasing economic and political assimilation that is proving more and more unpopular to a growing number of its nation states. Dissenting voices so often go unheard or if they are addressed, are addressed with scorn, condescension and political/economical sanctions and pressures - look at the abundant examples in recent years of different states resisting different policies and how they have been dealt with - Hungary, Poland, Ireland, Italy, France, Greece, Portugal, Catalonia, Macedonia and of course the UK. The issues that these former sovereign nation-states have raised and resisted and the way in which the Commission and the voting blocs within the EP have responded to them can not be overlooked or downplayed. What we're witnessing is the slow death of self-determination and democracy IMO and I'm not alone in it - and I do understand how complicit in this successive UK governments have been by the way, they don't escape my contempt - or many other informed peoples'. Many ministers reap their rewards for compliance in the form of comfy bureaucratic positions within the numerous EU departments when their political careers have ended or stalled in the UK.

 

Just to underscore the federalist wet-dream that was designed to be slowly and insidiously foisted on the nation states of Europe, you need only listen to the remarks made by people such as Barroso, Juncker, Monet and many others.

 

Here are a few choice examples of the arrogance and condescension of the EU elite:

On British calls for a referendum over Lisbon Treaty

'Of course there will be transfers of sovereignty. But would I be intelligent to draw the attention of public opinion to this fact?' - JC Juncker

 

On a French referendum over the EU constitution

'If it's a Yes, we will say 'on we go', and if it's a No we will say 'we continue' - JC Juncker

On the introduction of the euro

'We decide on something, leave it lying around, and wait and see what happens. If no one kicks up a fuss, because most people don't understand what has been decided, we continue step by step until there is no turning back.'

'They must simply keep voting until they get the decision right' - J.M. Barroso

I could reference dozens more - all from the architects of the EU - EC presidents / EP chiefs / E Council presidents etc. etc. 

Don't you smell the unnerving progression of an organisation that has many of the required components of and hence every possibility of becoming something very much resembling the old Soviet Union!? And moreover - do you really want to live on a continent where unscrupulous creeps that make such condescending, autocratic comments such as these are in charge!? If so - all power to you, but there are a growing number in EVERY major EU nation that disagree. Brexit is the only start IMHO.  

Edited July 3, 2019 by CanterbrigianBangkoker