Usage of พี่

[futurespy]

I was just wondering: can you refer to yourself as พี่ when talking to someone a few years younger than you from the beginning assuming both are young, or does it sound rude/arrogant?

[futurespy]

Apparently it's okay. I was called "อ้าย" (equivalent of พี่ in Northern Thai) by the other guy, so I guess it should be safe to call him "น้อง"...

[uhuh]

I would not do this. It's too easy to get it wrong. 

There is a tendency to call the other person พี่ anyway,  it's just polite, so as a foreigner i felt how can it be that 2 persons both call each other พี่???

 

I prefer neutral terms of address,  like a name or the very convenient Thai pronouns "I" and "you". No wonder young Thais like them. 

 

[jackdd]

Yes, no problem to do this, i've met Thais who talk like this, got the impression that this nothing special.

[futurespy]

8 hours ago, uhuh said:

I would not do this. It's too easy to get it wrong. 

There is a tendency to call the other person พี่ anyway,  it's just polite, so as a foreigner i felt how can it be that 2 persons both call each other พี่???

 

I prefer neutral terms of address,  like a name or the very convenient Thai pronouns "I" and "you". No wonder young Thais like them. 

 

Nope, I mean, he started calling me พี่, so I was referring to myself as พี่ too. He was using ผม to refer to himself. I was calling him น้อง until I knew his nickname. Then I started addressing him by his nickname.

 

You mean people will use พี่ even when they're not sure if the other person is older than them?

Edited August 24, 2019 by futurespy

[tgeezer]

Using Thai familiar titles is difficult because we don’t belong to the “Thai family”.   There are so many possibilities depending on our relationship to them.  You seem to have ‘cracked it’ with one individual but unless the circumstances of your meeting is known we can’t take much from your experience. 

For example, you could call a market trader almost anything ป้า แม่ ยาย it seems provided you buy something but since they could not imaging a farang related to them in that way would it work?   I would be interested in a Thai opinion but that could not be taken as the rule.

[futurespy]

1 hour ago, tgeezer said:

Using Thai familiar titles is difficult because we don’t belong to the “Thai family”.   There are so many possibilities depending on our relationship to them.  You seem to have ‘cracked it’ with one individual but unless the circumstances of your meeting is known we can’t take much from your experience. 

For example, you could call a market trader almost anything ป้า แม่ ยาย it seems provided you buy something but since they could not imaging a farang related to them in that way would it work?   I would be interested in a Thai opinion but that could not be taken as the rule.

You do have a point. So perhaps, even if I met another person under the same circumstances (someone just slightly younger than me), odds are that something different might happen? Does mentioning that I'm East Asian make any difference in this case? I mean, I wasn't born in Japan, but at least physically (not culturally) I'm full Japanese.

[1FinickyOne]

1 hour ago, tgeezer said:

Using Thai familiar titles is difficult because we don’t belong to the “Thai family”.

I have been here for a while, my conversational Thai is decent, I find it not unusual that someone calls me bpee - they usually don't know my name, and I find the familiar term flattering... 

[uhuh]

5 hours ago, futurespy said:

 

 

You mean people will use พี่ even when they're not sure if the other person is older than them?

Yes,  most definitely,  that's the default form of address.

 

And I have even heard conversations where both partners called each other พี่ (even when one of them looked quite a bit younger than the other one).

[uhuh]

Just now, kenk24 said:

I have been here for a while, my conversational Thai is decent, I find it not unusual that someone calls me bpee - they usually don't know my name, and I find the familiar term flattering... 

Agreed

[Slip]

There are some very interesting points here.  I hope I can add a few more.  I should point out that I'm a teacher of some years in the same school at upper Mateyom level.

I have a very friendly professional relationship with a woman who is about 6 months older than me.  She refers to me as bpee as I do to her.  She will also wai me first if she can get it in in time.

 

My immediate boss, who is about 15 or so years younger than me calls me 'daddy', or teacher but never bpee.  We have a very informal relationship so not much of an indicator perhaps. 

 

I have a colleague who is a good 10 years younger than me, who always gives me a big high wai but never calls me bpee- only teacher.   I will always wai him first if I can beat him to it.

Upper mateyom teachers regularly refer to their students as bpee when talking to other students or teachers. 

 

At work there are various staff and concession stall holders who may well be referred to by all as 'bpaa' or 'loong'.  To a certain extent this has carried through to my persona in Thailand, and there is a fair chance I may call a market trader such.

 

I used to call a colleague who I didn't know well, and thought was older than me, bpee.  In the end a query came down through my work-friend about how old I was and why I was doing this with someone 10 years younger than me.  Oops.

The security at work will always wai me, regardless of age, unless I get there first.   They call me either bpee or by name with the salutation 'teacher'.

 

I have never been able to bring myself to call anyone nong unless they are a dek-serve or a very young student.

 

I do sometimes find difficulty in how to address people who are younger than me.  As someone said 'bpee' is kind of the default, and it leaves me a bit lost what to say to someone who is obviously younger than me.  Of course many parents I meet are younger than me, but they are socially more elite, which only complicates the issue.

 

For the question of whether you can refer to yourself as bpee.  If someone calls you it first then I would say absolutely no problem

[1FinickyOne]

29 minutes ago, Slip said:

a woman who is about 6 months older than me.  She refers to me as bpee as I do to her. 

I also have and know Thai people who are younger than I am but I refer to them as bpee in that in many ways they are like older brothers to me in that they know their language and culture and I can learn from them and they sort of look after me...

 

Calling younger people especially waitresses, Nong, is perfectly acceptable though it does not really trip off my tongue either...

 

Having a familial name for people is one of the things I love about the culture. Many people will call me 'loong' also. 

 

34 minutes ago, Slip said:

Of course many parents I meet are younger than me, but they are socially more elite, which only complicates the issue.

This is a really tough one as it is a more formal relationship... of course, if you know a name, Khun XXX would work but likely you do not know a name... I would just give a 'sawasdee' and be sure to follow with krubp... 

[Slip]

6 minutes ago, kenk24 said:

I also have and know Thai people who are younger than I am but I refer to them as bpee in that in many ways they are like older brothers to me in that they know their language and culture and I can learn from them and they sort of look after me...

 

Calling younger people especially waitresses, Nong, is perfectly acceptable though it does not really trip off my tongue either...

 

Having a familial name for people is one of the things I love about the culture. Many people will call me 'loong' also. 

 

This is a really tough one as it is a more formal relationship... of course, if you know a name, Khun XXX would work but likely you do not know a name... I would just give a 'sawasdee' and be sure to follow with krubp... 

 I am both dreading and looking forward to the first time I am referred to as loong.  A few years to go yet I hope.

 

The way to deal with not knowing the names of the mums, is 'khun mae', (or for dads k paw of course, but it's much more fun to chat with the mums haha.)

 

I think the truth of the matter is it is a feast with moveable goal posts, and it does get generally easier to spot over time.  (Now how do I explain that particular mixed metaphor to G12?)

[tgeezer]

1 hour ago, Slip said:

 

 

I think the truth of the matter is it is a feast with moveable goal posts, and it does get generally easier to spot over time.  (Now how do I explain that particular mixed metaphor to G12?)

Talking of mixed metaphors, I can not remember which Labour politician said this” The only way to make this government pull its sock up is to bring it to its knees”.  I shall never forget that! 

[1FinickyOne]

1 hour ago, Slip said:

 I am both dreading and looking forward to the first time I am referred to as loong

Wait until someone who is not your offspring calls you "papa" - the first time I had to look about behind me... Me? Papa? 

 

loong is not so bad in that light... 

 

I wondered about Khun Mer as a mix of very informal with formal... 

 

I have had ladies call me "ajahn" though I am not a teacher... maybe since my Thai is ok they think I am a wise old man... 

[tgeezer]

Among my running friends and acquaintances I am know as บ๋า or ป๋า I am not sure which, it comes from Papa. It also means the one from whom the money comes although that can not be the meaning in my case! 

[Damrongsak]

On 8/24/2019 at 8:54 AM, Slip said:

 I am both dreading and looking forward to the first time I am referred to as loong.  A few years to go yet I hope.  ...

My wife's siblings always used to call me "พี่  D!ck".  Now they refer to me  as "loong". Can't understand why.  Or maybe it's just the niece and nephew.

 

Edited August 27, 2019 by Damrongsak