7 hours ago, nauseus said:

You are trying to split the leave vote. 

Of course, since the vote was split between no deal and some kind of deal. With many variations in that.

A post with innapropriate terminology has been removed.

2 hours ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

JRM and his ERG are splitting the leave vote. They blocked to leave. So is the other side. That’s your reality. Don’t run away from it. 

You make it sound like May's "deal" was actually leaving. 

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

You make it sound like May's "deal" was actually leaving. 

For some voters it is. You should respect their vote same as you want yours respected. 

3 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

For some voters it is. You should respect their vote same as you want yours respected. 

For some voters it is? Remain voters maybe?

Just now, nauseus said:

For some voters it is? Remain voters maybe?

For voters who voted to leave in the referendum, then for May’s deal in the Commons and against no-deal subsequently. So no Remain voters. 

On 9/8/2019 at 6:50 PM, puipuitom said:

Why not a simple question to the British peieople:

a) seen all information what popped up the last 3 1/2 year: you still prefer "leave" above "remain"?

b) if leave: which form:

b1) the Boris/Cummings way: out, whatever the consequences, so no if's and but's, better die in the ditch as member of the EU ?

b2) the May deal

b3) the Canadian (CEPA) condition

b4) the Norway agreement

b5) the Swiss agreement

b6) an agreement we cannot specify yet, so goverment, come with a better proposal as till now.

 

Why people have to vote indirect = or Cons or Labour or LibDem or Green or... and then pray for the outcome of "Brexit".

 

Ah.. wait.. it's a) who is your fear = "remain"

We have had one already. We don't want to follow the Dutch and just ignore referendum results. It is interesting how so many non Brits like to tell us what to do when they really need to tell their own countries the same. How about c

c. Leave the EU, the SM, CU, ECJ and No more funding the EU.

 

42 minutes ago, nauseus said:

You make it sound like May's "deal" was actually leaving. 

Sadly it is what Europhiles and many remainers believe. The EU is the holy grail of entities and can't believe that someone wouldn't actually want to have their identity took away, get there food sources and industries raped and tell them under a disguise of being independent what to do.

 

That coupled with paying for a load of free loaders and allowing millions of people enter your country and reap the benefits the people have had, whilst working for years. Who would dare say no!

Just now, Laughing Gravy said:

Sadly it is what Europhiles and many remainers believe. The EU is the holy grail of entities and can't believe that someone wouldn't actually want to have their identity took away, get there food sources and industries raped and tell them under a disguise of being independent what to do.

 

That coupled with paying for a load of free loaders and allowing millions of people enter your country and reap the benefits the people have had, whilst working for years. Who would dare say no!

Oh, we are back at telling people what they actually voted for. So that’s the kind of democracy you want to be respected. 

 

Your problem is, once you start telling people what Leave means, others might do the same and force their interpretation on you. 

2 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

Oh, we are back at telling people what they actually voted for. So that’s the kind of democracy you want to be respected. 

 

Your problem is, once you start telling people what Leave means, others might do the same and force their interpretation on you. 

What on earth are you on about. Tell me where I have stated what people actually voted for or are have you been drinking or smoking exotic cigarettes which clouds your judgement

1 minute ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Tell me where I have stated what people actually voted for

When you agreed that May’s sea doesn’t mean to leave. It’s factually incorrect because it would end EU membership. It’s also incorrect because there are leave voters who voted for this in the Commons. 

 

2 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

When you agreed that May’s sea doesn’t mean to leave. It’s factually incorrect because it would end EU membership. It’s also incorrect because there are leave voters who voted for this in the Commons. 

 

Again show me where I have stated where I said what people actually voted for. Until then I will not reply to your posts.

 

I hope you are not going to do a sammie1 who realises he wrote an untruth and just wouldn't admit it.

 

4 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Again show me where I have stated where I said what people actually voted for. Until then I will not reply to your posts.

 

I hope you are not going to do a sammie1 who realises he wrote an untruth and just wouldn't admit it.

 

Someone claimed May’s deal doesn’t mean to leave. You seemed to agree to that. Should I have misinterpreted your post and you in fact agree that May’s deal means leaving then please correct me and I’m more than willing to apologize for misinterpreting you. 

48 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

For voters who voted to leave in the referendum, then for May’s deal in the Commons and against no-deal subsequently. So no Remain voters. 

They are not the same people though, are they? May's "deal" is not even a deal. Pay up and but stay subject to EU rules and the ECJ for years, without any say, not knowing what trade arrangements the beneficent EU might allow us someday never. It's better to get clean out; then the EU will negotiate properly.  

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

They are not the same people though, are they?

An MP who voted to leave in 2016, for May’s deal, and against no-deal is the same person. 

 

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

May's "deal" is not even a deal.

It’s an agreement between two parties. That’s a deal. 

 

1 minute ago, nauseus said:

It's better to get clean out; then the EU will negotiate properly.  

You are certainly allowed to have your opinion. 

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

You make it sound like May's "deal" was actually leaving. 

Please explain why it isn't.

4 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

An MP who voted to leave in 2016, for May’s deal, and against no-deal is the same person. 

 

It’s an agreement between two parties. That’s a deal. 

 

You are certainly allowed to have your opinion. 

Your "voters who voted to leave in the referendum" suddenly now become MPs "who voted to leave in 2016".

 

Try another track - the one you're on dead-ends at a disused mine. 

7 minutes ago, DannyCarlton said:

Please explain why it isn't.

See #255. That's essentially why but there is a lot more. I didn't keep the list I posted before and I'm not doing one again.

24 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Your "voters who voted to leave in the referendum" suddenly now become MPs "who voted to leave in 2016".

I was talking about MPs all the time. MPs are voters. 

 

Quote

 

Try another track - the one you're on dead-ends at a disused mine. 

MPs are the only voters for whom we clearly know what they voted for because their votes are transparent. It tells us there are voters who voted to leave but with a deal and not without a deal. It also tells us there are voters who voted to leave but without a deal and not with a deal. That’s all I wanted to prove. I don’t need “another track”. 

QED. 

Edited September 10, 20196 yr by welovesundaysatspace

29 minutes ago, nauseus said:

They are not the same people though, are they? May's "deal" is not even a deal. Pay up and but stay subject to EU rules and the ECJ for years, without any say, not knowing what trade arrangements the beneficent EU might allow us someday never. It's better to get clean out; then the EU will negotiate properly.  

 

11 minutes ago, nauseus said:

See #255. That's essentially why but there is a lot more. I didn't keep the list I posted before and I'm not doing one again.

Pay up the 39bn divorce bill? That's 3.9 bn per year and payable with whatever deal we leave on, even no deal.

 

Falling under the jurisdiction of the EJC is there for the transition period, that's why it's called the "transition period". It's also beneficial for the likes of you and I. Most cases that are settled are victories for the little man against dictatorial governments and multinational corporations.

 

The only other tie that I can think of is remaining in thr CU until a suitable alternative to a hard border can be found. 2 years according to Boris.

 

Not exactly BRINO is it?

10 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

I was talking about MPs all the time. MPs are voters. 

 

MPs are the only voters for whom we clearly now what they voted for because their votes are transparent. It tells us there are voters who voted to leave but with a deal and not without a deal. It also tells us there are voters who voted to leave but without a deal and not with a deal. That’s all I wanted to prove. I don’t need “another track”. 

QED. 

You forgot Boris, he voted both ways.

13 minutes ago, welovesundaysatspace said:

I was talking about MPs all the time. MPs are voters. 

 

MPs are the only voters for whom we clearly know what they voted for because their votes are transparent. It tells us there are voters who voted to leave but with a deal and not without a deal. It also tells us there are voters who voted to leave but without a deal and not with a deal. That’s all I wanted to prove. I don’t need “another track”. 

QED. 

No QED. More like CYA.

So there we have it. Kick off with the latest Hard Brexiteer nonsense instructing us not to split the Brexit vote (defence line for the referendum vote). At the same time denounce the Soft Brexit position of Theresa May as not being Brexit. Conclusion? Everybody voted for no-deal in the referendum Leave vote. Gibberish from beginning to end, but hey! Keep saying the same thing and at least they might convince themselves.

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You forgot Boris, he voted both ways.

They haven't forgotten. The Hard Brexiteers here are more with Farage and that UKIP nutter, both of whom will turn on Boris if he softens.

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Sadly it is what Europhiles and many remainers believe. The EU is the holy grail of entities and can't believe that someone wouldn't actually want to have their identity took away, get there food sources and industries raped and tell them under a disguise of being independent what to do.
 
That coupled with paying for a load of free loaders and allowing millions of people enter your country and reap the benefits the people have had, whilst working for years. Who would dare say no!

Hard Brexiteers worried about their identities being taken away. [emoji1782]

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37 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Kick off with the latest Hard Brexiteer nonsense instructing us not to split the Brexit vote (defence line for the referendum vote).

 

29 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

They haven't forgotten. The Hard Brexiteers here are more with Farage and that UKIP nutter, both of whom will turn on Boris if he softens.

 

25 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Hard Brexiteers worried about their identities being taken away.

Give it a rest! ????

Edited September 10, 20196 yr by evadgib

Give it a rest! [emoji35]

The current conceit of Hard Brexiteers is that there are only Brexiteers and that no-deal is the only pathway. So Soft Brexit has to be written out of the narrative as equivalent to Remain and the lie kicks in that all Leave voters voted for the Hard Brexit concoction. And so it goes...

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They are not the same people though, are they? May's "deal" is not even a deal. Pay up and but stay subject to EU rules and the ECJ for years, without any say, not knowing what trade arrangements the beneficent EU might allow us someday never. It's better to get clean out; then the EU will negotiate properly.  

That is the Hard Brexit spin, but certainly not the reality in 2016. Boris still pushing he can get a "deal". UKIP supporters hope that Boris is lying. However difficult to push no-deal and deal in the same breath. Conspiracy nuts might get a little tangled up.

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2 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

The current conceit of Hard Brexiteers is that there are only Brexiteers and that no-deal is the only pathway. So Soft Brexit has to be written out of the narrative as equivalent to Remain and the lie kicks in that all Leave voters voted for the Hard Brexit concoction. And so it goes...

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Whilst we can all remember Red Rum winning the Grand National, I would struggle to think of any of the other horses names in the same race, if you get my drift?

Out of interest, would you be so kind to explain the difference between a "Hard Brexiteer", a "Brexiteer" and a "Leave voter"...?

Once Hard Brexiteers have jumped over the proverbial economic cliff they should get a full explanation about halfway down.

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