3 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Wasn't he foreign secretary not too long ago. Which great ideas did he contribute at that time?

he did, one of them was ..... we will not accept the back stop 555

25 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Boris promised his "Plan B" (supposedly with help from such geniuses as Mogg, Gove and Farage) years ago.

 

Nowt has been provided. Zilch, not one inclination of a plan.

 

You reckon he's got something up his sleeve? Probably only an expensive watch!

You know as well as most that May and Sir Olly were the only ones that were privy to the EU/UK negotiations and they were not going to let anyone else into their inner sanctum. All the Brexit ministers were there in name only and were not allowed any input towards the negotiations, so any blame on Boris is totally unfounded.

 

As for anything up his sleeve, Boris is not saying and would be very unwise to do so, he has had the only negotiation tool in his toolbox removed from him with the duplicitious MPs who do not want to leave the EU, namely a no-deal. So unlike Mrs May who broadcast to everyone her ideas to all and sundry, Boris is keeping his cards close to his chest, and rightly so.

 

And incidentally, when I read some of your posts I think to myself you are the best Brexiteer we never had, a bit like Cloughie and the England managers job, so it's still not to late to convert, go on, you know it makes sense.????

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by vogie

And that is new??? He offered this plan already to EU and was rejected. ????

The plan is expected to be based on the creation of an all-Ireland "economic zone" which would allow agricultural and food products to move between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland without checks at the border, the report said.

 

So next to all the other questions. Boris wants to build the complete infrastructure for two new borders in 31 days?

How dumb is that?

 

Due to the temporal impossibility, that would mean a further postponement of the withdrawal date.

 

 

The plan is expected to be based on the creation of an all-Ireland "economic zone" which would allow agricultural and food products to move between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland without checks at the border, the report said.
 
So next to all the other questions. Boris wants to build the complete infrastructure for two new borders in 31 days?
How dumb is that?
 
Due to the temporal impossibility, that would mean a further postponement of the withdrawal date.
 
 

As i understand it, an agreed deal triggers the two year implementation/transition period so the have this time which is still probably not enough.


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1 hour ago, Libai said:

The EU has borders with Belarus, The Ukraine, Moldova, Turkey and Albania. Nobody is ever, ever, going to convince me that the Irish border, compared to all these others, is so problematic. It has been exploited purely for political reasons, to make Brexit as difficult, and irreversible, as is possible.

If a chlorinated US chicken is exported to N Ireland / UK, it can walk to Ireland and from there to the EU.

What will stop it?

3 hours ago, vogie said:

The great double act of May and Robbins were the only two people privileged to make decisions on a deal, any others may have come up with ideas beneficial to the UK and not the EU, so were intentionally ignored.

Please publish a link to any article about any of those ideas which Boris had and which were ignored.

Or did he have them only in secret in his head?

Can’t he just use one of those loopholes or just ignore the Benn act? That would at least give us Europeans more to laugh; either he will make a fool of himself again or (should there really be a working loophole) he will divide and ruin Brexit-Britain even more. That’s the sweet thing about Brexit — Brexiteers always lose, whatever way they take. And it was clear from the beginning because unicorns just don’t exist, even when you vote for it. 

23 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

Please publish a link to any article about any of those ideas which Boris had and which were ignored.

Or did he have them only in secret in his head?

Are you saying that May and Robbins listened to anybody else but each other, seriously?

7 minutes ago, vogie said:

Are you saying that May and Robbins listened to anybody else but each other, seriously?

So what ideas did Johnson put forward that May ignored?

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

So what ideas did Johnson put forward that May ignored?

Remember when Boris urged Mrs May to chuck the chequers plan, and he himself "threw his weight behind a Super Canada Deal".

 

"And, in a 4,600-word essay published just before the Conservative conference gets underway in Birmingham, he called on the Prime Minister to push the EU for more time to avoid a hard border in Northern Ireland."

5 hours ago, vogie said:

I wouldn't have thought so, leaked information says the plan includes two border check points, one away from the border in NI and one away from the border in S Ireland, I would be very surprised if the EU would be agreeable to this idea, infact I'd bet my favourite JC Juncker effigy on it.

Surely it would just put the border in the Irish sea?  On Breakfast TV today Johnson was talking about cows and cheese and avoiding answering any pertinent questions concerning the Irish border issue.

33 minutes ago, vogie said:

Are you saying that May and Robbins listened to anybody else but each other, seriously?

I don't know how much they listened.

But it's obvious that May was not able to bring up any good ideas to solve the Brexit mess.

Now imagine if Boris would have had any good ideas. Do you think he was too shy to talk about them? Or did he have so much respect for May that he didn't want to undermine her?

I am sure if he would have had any ideas to bring Brexit forward then he would not have hesitated to make them public. And in case he had any good idea then the public and his party would have been delighted to have a member with such good ideas.

Now why do you think all this did not happen?

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I don't know how much they listened.

But it's obvious that May was not able to bring up any good ideas to solve the Brexit mess.

Now imagine if Boris would have had any good ideas. Do you think he was too shy to talk about them? Or did he have so much respect for May that he didn't want to undermine her?

I am sure if he would have had any ideas to bring Brexit forward then he would not have hesitated to make them public. And in case he had any good idea then the public and his party would have been delighted to have a member with such good ideas.

Now why do you think all this did not happen?

It was clear when the EU came back with the figure for the divorce settlement and Johnson said "tell them they can whistle for it", just where he stood on leaving the EU.  He was always about leaving with no deal.  Then later when the ERG said that they had alternative proposals for an EU deal and failed to come up with anything.

40 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I don't know how much they listened.

But it's obvious that May was not able to bring up any good ideas to solve the Brexit mess.

Now imagine if Boris would have had any good ideas. Do you think he was too shy to talk about them? Or did he have so much respect for May that he didn't want to undermine her?

I am sure if he would have had any ideas to bring Brexit forward then he would not have hesitated to make them public. And in case he had any good idea then the public and his party would have been delighted to have a member with such good ideas.

Now why do you think all this did not happen?

I refer you to my post #44.

9 minutes ago, vogie said:

I refer you to my post #44.

You call that a plan???

Boris has been interviewed by 2 BBC outlets this morning but has understandably side-stepped ITV, presumably as a result of Peston's relationship with his latest accuser.

 

I quite like Piers Morgan but i'm not entirely sure this was fair but i'm looking fwd to their actual interview whenever that may be.

(The 'Rhubarb' brigade should note Robert Peston interviewed Boris last Weds before this blew up, or at least before we heard about it!)

 

Edit: It's worse that i thought:

 

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by evadgib

That the idea it might be a good idea to have a plan has at last dawned on Brexiteers is, I suppose, an improvement.

11 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

That the idea it might be a good idea to have a plan has at last dawned on Brexiteers is, I suppose, an improvement.

Spike Milligan once declared that "If you have a certificate showing that you're sane the last thing you should do it show it to anybody"

 

Think about it...

5 hours ago, Libai said:

The EU has borders with Belarus, The Ukraine, Moldova, Turkey and Albania. Nobody is ever, ever, going to convince me that the Irish border, compared to all these others, is so problematic. It has been exploited purely for political reasons, to make Brexit as difficult, and irreversible, as is possible.

The Irish want to avoid the same type of border the EU has with Ukraine, Moldova, Turkey and Albania, and want.. a 100% open border.

Time you learn SOMETHING of border crossings between countries.

8 hours ago, Franko666 said:

No, that’s not going to happen, the EU is not only about trade, it’s a Globalistic socialist entity with an undemocratic core. 

The EU is a union of STATES.

Therefore it exists of: a EU council, with as members the heads of government of the EU member states.

Second: the EU Commission, existing of appointed members, each EU member state one.

Third: the EU Parliament, with all members elected in individual member states, e.g. 75 members by the British.

 

The UK has a two-houses Parliament: one with elected members, the other by appoited members. Never such a thing in the EU.

 

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by puipuitom

Get on with it.

Yes. Squash no-deal Brexit.

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6 hours ago, Orac said:

So the answer to not having a hard border between Ireland and NI is to have two hard borders along with some DMZ/Twilight Zone between them where, I assume EU law applies.

 

Actually not a bad idea from a NI political point of view since  those border provinces are virtually all Sinn Fein so they will be able to act  as if it is now part of Ireland and it gives the DUP a stronger hand as it will make what is left of NI more predominantly Unionist and delay the looming demographic  issue they have. Maybe in a few years at this rate they will be down to just one or two counties.

Red = the future Northern Ireland ?

The great double act of May and Robbins were the only two people privileged to make decisions on a deal, any others may have come up with ideas beneficial to the UK and not the EU, so were intentionally ignored.

The things some nutty Brexiteers imagine.

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5 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Er, only the EU don't want that! They want an agreement but one they dictated. Especially the 39 billion GBP, ties on many things, like fishing ground entries, and to dictate all future negotiations. That way, they can demonstrate to other member nations the reality of trying to leave "on friendly terms".

 

The EU have no choice. Agree a Win/Win deal and then others will want the same or similar. 

 

But don't worry little Europeans. The new ruling political class, who are above the law, and most certainly not accountable to the electorate, will implement their socialist federal state of Europe, regardless of whether most people want it or not. A totally bureaucratic riddles state in which exploiting loopholes becomes the new currency of power. 

 

A Federal State of Europe - almost as if Orwell could predict this when he wrote animal farm !

That's why the ONLY party in the Netherlands, PVV, who wants a Nexit, was reduced in last EU elections for 4 to ZERO ( 0 ) seats. 

And these 39 Bn pounds.. are just a fraction of that the EU importt duty will be on British products imported into the EU, making the British products more expensive of even completely out-of-competition, with result loss of UK jobs. Or do you think, other (American, African, Asian) countries are waiting for British products now, they could not get earlier, from 1 Nov onwards... ? 

Edited October 1, 20196 yr by puipuitom

4 minutes ago, puipuitom said:

The EU is a union of STATES.

Theregfoe it exists of: a EU council, with as membeers the heads of government of the EU member states.

Second; the EU Commission, existing of appointed members, each EU member state one.

Third: the EU Parliament, with all members elected in individual member statwes, e.g. 75 members by the British.

 

The UK has a two-houses Parliament: oen with elected members, the other by appoitned members. Never such a thing in the EU.

 

And E.U. don't close parliament down as a undemocratic Boris did ….confirmed by 12 U.K. supreme judges unanimous 

You know as well as most that May and Sir Olly were the only ones that were privy to the EU/UK negotiations and they were not going to let anyone else into their inner sanctum. All the Brexit ministers were there in name only and were not allowed any input towards the negotiations, so any blame on Boris is totally unfounded.
 
As for anything up his sleeve, Boris is not saying and would be very unwise to do so, he has had the only negotiation tool in his toolbox removed from him with the duplicitious MPs who do not want to leave the EU, namely a no-deal. So unlike Mrs May who broadcast to everyone her ideas to all and sundry, Boris is keeping his cards close to his chest, and rightly so.
 
And incidentally, when I read some of your posts I think to myself you are the best Brexiteer we never had, a bit like Cloughie and the England managers job, so it's still not to late to convert, go on, you know it makes sense.[emoji6]

Boris has nothing and the Hard Brexiteers are more than happy with that. All the rest is dishonest spin from that crowd.

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5 hours ago, Mavideol said:

he did, one of them was ..... we will not accept the back stop 555

"I am against, but.. not even a beginning of an idea how to solve it then". 

8 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

The things some nutty Brexiteers imagine.

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Imagination is the mother of all remainers invention.

8 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Boris has nothing and the Hard Brexiteers are more than happy with that. All the rest is dishonest spin from that crowd.

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Boris has the country behind him, the reason a GE is not forthcoming.