Mangos Splitting

[007 RED]

Hello… Please accept my apology if this topic has been covered already, but unfortunately searches via TV and google did not throw up any answers.

Hopefully someone will be able to give me some indication as to why my mangos are splitting vertically as shown in the photo below, and how I might overcome the problem.

 

 

Background Info….

 

In early 2018 we created a small fruit garden in the plot which we purchased next to our house in Sampran, Nakhon Pathom.  We purchased 2 medium sized mango trees from a local supplier who delivered and planted them for us.  I understand that the trees are grafted stock.  Our soil this morning is reading pH 7. 

 

One tree is Salaya and the other is Nam Doc Mai.  Guess who likes mango and sticky rice?

 

Last year both trees produced a nice crop of fruit with only a few fruit splitting.  However, this year a high percentage of fruit which are currently growing on both trees are splitting.  Both trees appear to be healthy.

 

Any advice on cause and treatment would be much appreciated.  Organic solutions if possible would be preferred.

Edited October 4, 2019 by 007 RED
Typo

[Laza 45]

Anthracnose

Anthracnose is the most likely cause of mango fruit splitting before it is mature. Anthracnose is a common fungal disease that affects fruit and ornamental trees. The fungus is most active in warm wet conditions and overhead watering is a common cause for its appearance. The leaves will get black spots and small fruits will drop off the tree. Juvenile fruits split open before they are mature. Fungicide application in early spring has some effect against the disease, as do cultural controls such as watering from the base.

https://www.ehow.com/info_10073473_mangoes-split-young-tree.html

 

[007 RED]

@Laza 45  Many thanks for your input but I'm not sure that Anthracnose is the problem. 

 

The linked article indicates the following:-

 

a)  most active in warm wet condition - well that sums up Thailand fairly well as we're currently having a good downpour with temperature is 34c and humidity showing 60%.

 

b)  overhead watering is a common cause for its appearance - we only water the base of the tree as and when the soil becomes dry.  That said, the trees do get plenty of overhead watering during the monsoon season so not sure how one would prevent it - big umbrella maybe.

 

c)  the leaves will get black spots and small fruit will drop off the tree - No signs of any black spots on the leaves and I've not found any small fruit on the ground under the trees.  As I said originally, both trees look very healthy.

 

d)  mango fruits must be situated in full sun for best fruiting and production. - Both trees get full sun throughout daylight hours.

 

e)  mango fruits split open when they have been damaged by insects. - I have examined some of the split fruit closely under a magnifying glass and there doesn't appear to be any insect damage. 

 

To me (and I'm no expert hence I'm seeking advice) it looks as though there has been a build up pressure inside the fruit and this has caused it to rupture along its length.

[cooked]

To my inexperienced eye this is due to heavy irrigation after a long dry season.

[drtreelove]

On 10/4/2019 at 10:23 PM, cooked said:

To my inexperienced eye this is due to heavy irrigation after a long dry season.

You are too humble, and in fact highly experienced, and I believe you have hit on the most likely cause of the splitting. 

 

Disorders like this are rarely due to one factor only, comprehensive soil and water management should be considered. 

 

I suspect nutrient deficiencies are also a contributing factor. What have you done for building soil organic matter content and high nutrient density with mineral and biological amendments?  

 

https://homeguides.sfgate.com/fruit-splitting-95694.html

Edited October 6, 2019 by drtreelove

[007 RED]

On ‎10‎/‎6‎/‎2019 at 11:02 PM, drtreelove said:

You are too humble, and in fact highly experienced, and I believe you have hit on the most likely cause of the splitting. 

 

Disorders like this are rarely due to one factor only, comprehensive soil and water management should be considered. 

 

I suspect nutrient deficiencies are also a contributing factor. What have you done for building soil organic matter content and high nutrient density with mineral and biological amendments?  

 

https://homeguides.sfgate.com/fruit-splitting-95694.html

Many thanks for your comments and attached link.  Both are helpful.

 

I'm aware that most plants/trees don't like their roots sitting in water, and if this was the case, I would have expected to see the leaves turn yellow.  In my case, yes we have had some fairly heavy tropical downpours during the past couple of months but the soil has never been saturated and on digging a hole (2/3ft deep) nearby indicated that water was draining away freely.  Also the leaves on both trees appear very healthy.

 

I have mulched around both trees with rice husks and ground coconut shells in order to keep weeds an bay and I've used proprietary fertilizers as per instruction on the packet.  

 

I should be grateful for any advice you could give (in lay person terms) on how to "build soil organic matter content and high nutrient density with mineral and biological amendments" as per your comments.

[drtreelove]

2 hours ago, 007 RED said:

Many thanks for your comments and attached link.  Both are helpful.

 

I'm aware that most plants/trees don't like their roots sitting in water, and if this was the case, I would have expected to see the leaves turn yellow.  In my case, yes we have had some fairly heavy tropical downpours during the past couple of months but the soil has never been saturated and on digging a hole (2/3ft deep) nearby indicated that water was draining away freely.  Also the leaves on both trees appear very healthy.

 

I have mulched around both trees with rice husks and ground coconut shells in order to keep weeds an bay and I've used proprietary fertilizers as per instruction on the packet.  

 

I should be grateful for any advice you could give (in lay person terms) on how to "build soil organic matter content and high nutrient density with mineral and biological amendments" as per your comments.

The mulching is a good start.  And then there is a new attitude in the world around fertilizers, avoiding high NPK chemisty and going with slow release mineralized COF:  https://www.motherearthnews.com/organic-gardening/garden-fertilizer-zmaz06jjzraw

[007 RED]

@drtreelove  Once again many thanks for your comment and suggestion (link).  The only problem with the information contained within the link (as others have commented), the author does not give any indication as to the quantity of the 'ingredients'.

[drtreelove]

Yes, complete information is not always easy to come by.  That article is written by Steve Solomon, author of the book The Intelligent Gardener, in which he has a whole chapter on COF. But even there, I had to study it and try to pull out a formula with products that I could get my hands on. And that is an issue in Thailand, availability of products that are mentioned in articles from other countries are not always available. And some authors don't want to give away details of their proprietary formula that comprises products they sell. 

 

I make my own COF, but found it hard to find all the ingredients I wanted in Thailand, and believe me I tried. It's getting better with AMD www.bonemeal.net building their product line.  But It took me a couple of years and a paid course of study with Michael Astera, author of The Ideal Soil, in writing soil amendment prescriptions before I found an "ideal" recipe from products I could source.  

 

There is a good, ready made COF in "bokashi" form (Japanese technology, EM embellished and minerailized compost)  that is made and sold in Samut Prakan.  Organic Totto is the company. I have given the website here before and location, last was in the discussion on EM ("what is this stuff good for") I don't know if you can order online yet.  The company is located near where we live so I just pick some up when I need it.  Samut Prakan is the neighboring province to Bangkok, along the gulf coast at the mouth of the Chao Praya River. The company is near the "crocodile farm", near the end of the BTS Sukhumvit line between Kheha station and Sai Luat. A 25 kilo sack of their blue bag Bokashi COF sells for 350 baht. Before I was making my own, I used this fertilizer and was happy with results.  I also gave some to friends and even trialed some at my friends organic rice farm in Chiang Mai.  It is slow release, so you can't expect an immediate big flush of growth like with a high N chemical fertilizer.  But when it kicks in, that complete range of nutrients produces a balanced growth, luster and productivity, and resistance to pests and diseases, that only comes from healthy well nourished plants with good water management. .

[seajae]

a lot of fruit/vegetable splitting is caused by too much water, I get the trunks splitting from too much water as well on my frangipani trees(we have around 600), to build up the soil I turn in  burnt rice husk, coir chips along and compost, I also add in sand and gypsum if the soil has clay in it to help break it down. You tend to get problems when you have droughts/extreme dry periods then flooding rains as the trees cannot handle such a large variation of conditions, part of growing in Thailand, you need to ensure you have well draining soil too so the ground doesnt fill with water, I find the coir chips usually maintain enough moisture to support the trees 

[007 RED]

@drtreelove.... Once again many thanks for your input, its very much appreciated. 

 

I'm certainly interested in the range of COF that are available from Organic Totto.  Looking at their website ( https://www.organictotto.com/ ), it appears that you can purchase their products online.  However, as the shop is relatively easy to get to from our home Nakon Pathom, we will take a ride out there next week and have a look.  No doubt Mrs MoneyBaht will be doing some shopping and I foresee that we will come back home with a boot full of COF.

[007 RED]

@seajae... Many thanks for your observations. 

 

As I said in an earlier post I'm mindful that most plants/trees don't like their roots sitting in water, and if this was the case, I would have expected to see the leaves turn yellow.  In my case, yes we have had some fairly heavy tropical downpours during the past couple of months but the soil has never been saturated and on digging a hole (2/3ft deep) nearby indicated that water was draining away freely.  The leaves on both trees appear very healthy - no signs of turning yellow/fungus/falling off.  Also during the 'dry season' I water the base of the trees every 3 or 4 days, depending upon the temperature and the moisture of the soil.  I have also applied a good layer of rice husks and ground coconut mulch around the trees in order to help improve the soil and reduce weeds.

 

As @drtreelove said in an earlier post, the problem of my splitting mangos is probably due to a combination of factors rather than one specific cause, so based upon his advice I am adopting a multi pronged approach to try and solve the problem.  I am aware that this is likely to be long term project, but hopefully I will be able to reduce, or even eliminate, the splitting problem.

[Grumpy John]

Heavy watering is #2 on my list.  I am leaning to Anthracnose as #1.   We spray fungicide, started today, for several potential problems.  Surrounded by other mango farms we have to assume every potential problem will hit our orchard at sometime or another.   Last year we still lost some fruit due to splitting.  Some say another cause is insects burrowing into the fruit which leads to splitting but I am not convinced of that.  I think that will cause the fruit to rot, not split.

[007 RED]

@Grumpy John...  Thanks for your comment, but after looking up what Anthracnose is, its causes, its symptoms and the effect that it has on mango trees and fruit I am fairly certain that thankfully this fungus is not affecting my 2 trees.

 

 

 

Both my trees have very healthy leaves with no signs of any black spots on them and the fruit (even the ones that have split) have not shown any discolouration/decay as shown in the photos above (thanks to Google).

 

I would agree with your comment that insects are not necessarily responsible for the fruit splitting.  As I said in an earlier post, I carefully examined the split mango in the original photo and could find not sign or trace of any insect incursion.

 

I did read somewhere during my investigation (sorry I can't remember the source just now) but the author suggested that splitting normally occurs after heavy rain/prolonged watering.  The fruit sucks up more liquid than it can cater for.  That is to say the skin of the mango being fairly tough is unable to expand quick enough and when the sun subsequently appears, the fluid inside the mango heats up and tries to expand even further.  The pressure inside the mango builds up to a point where it rupture the skin.  Rather akin to someone drinking to much beer.  The stomach expands (pot belly) and the person either belches or vomits to get rid of the excess gasses inside them. Sorry for the graphic explanation. 

 

I tend to go along with @drtreelove explanation and suspect that the problem may well lay in the soil, or at least the lack of quality.  So to try and rectify this, I will be embarking on a programme of organic enhancement over the next few weeks.  I'm given to understand that it may be sometime before I see the benefits of my labours.  I will give feedback in due course.

Edited October 10, 2019 by 007 RED
Forgot to upload photos

[drtreelove]

On 10/9/2019 at 7:56 AM, Grumpy John said:

Heavy watering is #2 on my list.  I am leaning to Anthracnose as #1.   We spray fungicide, started today, for several potential problems.  Surrounded by other mango farms we have to assume every potential problem will hit our orchard at sometime or another.   Last year we still lost some fruit due to splitting.  Some say another cause is insects burrowing into the fruit which leads to splitting but I am not convinced of that.  I think that will cause the fruit to rot, not split.

I'm with Red, I don't think in his case it is anthracnose.  The water issue can be not only heavy watering, but rapid changes, from dry conditons to wet, or visa versa. 

But I'm curious, what fungicide are you using? What are the "several potential problems"?  What is the timing in relation to the stage of the problems? Are you spraying proactively, for potential perceived problems, or do you have early signs, or advanced conditions? The use of fungicides should be specific, for the target pathogen, and the timing has to be appropriate for the stage of the disease.  Otherwise you are guessing and maybe wasting material and money.  If you are striving to transition into organic methods and materials, some fungal diseases can be prevented with biological fungicides, avoiding the heavy hitters, chemical fungicides.  And high nutrient density soil improvements will help with plant resistance to disease. 

Post or PM and I'll help best I can. 

[drtreelove]

On 10/9/2019 at 4:02 AM, 007 RED said:

@drtreelove.... Once again many thanks for your input, its very much appreciated. 

 

I'm certainly interested in the range of COF that are available from Organic Totto.  Looking at their website ( https://www.organictotto.com/ ), it appears that you can purchase their products online.  However, as the shop is relatively easy to get to from our home Nakon Pathom, we will take a ride out there next week and have a look.  No doubt Mrs MoneyBaht will be doing some shopping and I foresee that we will come back home with a boot full of COF.

PM me if you want my wife and daughter contact info. They know the shop and one or both of them may take you there. Try to see the English speaking owner manager, I forget her name. She also runs their organic farm in Phichit province.  Tell Mrs MoneyBaht to buy some of their EM too. 

 

Oh, I just realized, Nakhon Pathom, you are right down the road from the bone meal factory.  Connect with Evolare and his wife. They have a lot of good materials to get you started on your own COF. That's where I buy most of mine.  

 

And attached is an excerpt from Steve Solimon's book. from the chapter on COF.  

But dude, if ya ain't 'merican, ya gotta do the math. 

84 The Intelligent Gardener.pdf

Edited October 11, 2019 by drtreelove

[fruitman]

Namdocmai green is prone to split....when the trunk splits it is cause by a lack of boron.

 

I would spray the tree with seaweed extract or chemical minerals....it contains zinc, manganese, boron, iron and much more.

 

They sell packs of it in thailand, made for fruit tree's.

 

Yes rain also sure helps causing them to split...you can cover the soil with a tarp..

[Grumpy John]

On 10/11/2019 at 11:13 AM, drtreelove said:

I'm with Red, I don't think in his case it is anthracnose.  The water issue can be not only heavy watering, but rapid changes, from dry conditons to wet, or visa versa. 

But I'm curious, what fungicide are you using? What are the "several potential problems"?  What is the timing in relation to the stage of the problems? Are you spraying proactively, for potential perceived problems, or do you have early signs, or advanced conditions? The use of fungicides should be specific, for the target pathogen, and the timing has to be appropriate for the stage of the disease.  Otherwise you are guessing and maybe wasting material and money.  If you are striving to transition into organic methods and materials, some fungal diseases can be prevented with biological fungicides, avoiding the heavy hitters, chemical fungicides.  And high nutrient density soil improvements will help with plant resistance to disease. 

Post or PM and I'll help best I can. 

I leave it to the wife to diagnose any potential problem.  And I let her pick and mix the chemi.  It doesn't make sense me doing it if I can not read Thai!  I do know some chemi may have a duel purpose and some can be mixed together in the airbus. With 3 other orchards metres away from ours if they have it we will certainly get it.