Thailand Is Down...

[farang prince]

I am no expert - but here is my half penny worth

A friend from Malta who before has come twice a year, this time says he is not coming again -- Pattaya dead.

Another went on a visa run to Cambodia -- people more friendly than Pattaya -- he is going there in future.

A very large Short Time Bar which before was always crowded with golfers in the afternoon -- for the last three weeks has only had three or four customers and many of the girls are saying they are going homeat the end of the month

Many rooms for rent which I cannot remember seeing in this area at theis time of year before.

A Thai owned food business -- the owner says they he is not getting the customers that he had before -- he reckons his takings down by 60% -- He wants to sell as he is unable to continue paying the rent -- Bars that four months agao were for sale at 3 million now priced at half than but still no buyers

aah, I hate to say I told you so but ........

The above comment mirrors what I've been saying (and getting flamed for) for months.

On the other hand, Cambodia and Vietnam's tourism industries are thriving, as is the inflow of foreign capital to their markets.

It's simple; Thailand has shot itself in the foot. It doesn't need Farangs?

As we know, once a place goes cold and your competitors pick up the ball and run with it (in this case VN,Cambo & Malaysia) it takes a very long time, if at all, to recover.

Told us what? That you can't hack it in Thailand? What do you think will happen in VN and Cambodia once the locals get fed up with the 'Ugly' Americans, Brits, Germans,Aussies, etc........the Cambodian smiles will disappear just as they have here in many places. There will come a day when expats will flock 'back' to Thailand because of the unfriendly Cambodian locals.......everything cycles. Meanwhile, I'll still be here.....in RURAL Thailand.....the real Thailand.

its beyond me why some people think that cambodia is the next big thing.

the place is wracked with poverty and god help you if you get real sick and need a proper hospital.

i feel that the few people that say thailand is going down the gurgler need to go back to farang land as there time in los is finished.

im not critisising the naysayers but only passing an observation.

as mr blues has stated, all things cycle, thailand will cycle and then return to its normal state and things will carry on as normal.

western countries cycle as well so its not a new phenomenon.

there two distinct groups we are dealing with here regards there opinions on los.

1. = business people

2. = retired people.

some of the business people are having a big spit and want to leave.

the self funded retiries are complaining about exchange rates and i can understand why.

anyway its all a load of bollicks as los is los and id rather live here than in cambodia.

thank you very much.

But since, as I recall, you live in Australia most of the time, you really don't know what is happening in the LOS do you? So your comments are really smoke from your arse, aren't they? In truth, Cambodia is no solution. And I spent two of the worst years of my life in Vietnam back in the late '60's. I won't be back. I'll hunker down here in Bangkok and ride out any storm. Have I noticed a slowdown in Bkk over the past few months? Maybe a little, but no one that I know is getting ready to jump off a bridge. But if this government keeps shooting itself in the foot about business matters, it could get a whole lot worse. Don't forget, Kuala Lumpur is just down the road and it would gladly snap up any spare foreign investment money. And China keeps looking better every day for foreign investment and for retired farangs.

[jasreeve17]

You have not been attacked by me .... you have had the fallacy of your initial supposition and the following ones ... pointed out ..

You repeat the same silliness over and over in an attempt to reinforce your p.o.v. and dismiss others. it begs to be answered ... (as for ignoring YOUR thread .... that is indicative of the issue here. ) I don't know you <to like you or not> and as far as your ideas go ... I only know one of them ... I don't dislike it .. I think it is silly.

NOW ----- a mild attack would look like this ..." How F'n stupid does a sex-pat have to be when wandering up Suk for 2 hours popping into "entertainment venues" to think he could use this to draw conclusions about tourism in BKK on a broad scale?" ------ Note ... I never said that. I just said that the idea of drawing any conclusions from your walk up Suk was silly

Please read the original post again.

I posed a question. I didn't draw any conclusions.

I made no initial supposition. I offered a view, and posed a question.

I used three personal examples to get the thread started; lack of customers, high rate of job offers, low hotel price for next weekend.

Only going out once every three months, I must be the worst sexpat in Thailand.

On the drinking in Suk point, and the fact of low custom. I've actually been convinced by other postees arguments that it indicates nothing other than the time of year. It's a bad indicator. That's what I like to do; discuss with postees, be enlightened, get more information, evolve my opinions, etc.

If it is so silly, then why would you waste your time on it?

[Jet Gorgon]

Sorry to break up the discussion, but wanted to slide in a birthday message for Jas: Happy Birthday, JasReeve!

[jasreeve17]

Sorry to break up the discussion, but wanted to slide in a birthday message for Jas: Happy Birthday, JasReeve!

Thanks Jet. What a lovely lady you are.

[jdinasia]

Jas ... Happy Birthday

and your erroneous conclusions were drawn in the first page ... and your basic idea was obvious from the beginning ...

Why? better ask why not.

[jasreeve17]

Jas ... Happy Birthday

and your erroneous conclusions were drawn in the first page ... and your basic idea was obvious from the beginning ...

Why? better ask why not.

Thank you JD.

I hope that you have a happy day too.

[toptuan]

Another confirmation that the bar crowd is down! OMG! The sky really is falling!

Thailand's tourism industry really IS in shambles!

Notify all the southern islands!

...all the hill-tribe trekkers in Chiang Rai!

...all the tourists to Thailand's multitude of old Khmer temples and historical places.

...all the new health spa industry people!

...all the medical-vacation promoters and visitors!

...all the National Parks!

They need to know that the pub crowd has deserted them, and they should all go home too!

I can't believe this thread.

What do all these morally correct, high quality, temple-admiring tourists do in the evenings? Go to bed at 8?

No, they have a late dinner, perhaps at 8. Then read Lonely Planet over a glass of warm milk to get ready for the next day's adventure. Then they retire about 10 pm, to get a good night's sleep before arising at 5 a.m. or 6 a.m. to be the first one on the bus to get the best seat for the next exciting destination. Not exactly "an OlRedEye's regimen, eh? That's why they don't have perpetual red eyes.

Edited April 1, 2007 by toptuan

[ThaiFelix]

So, a possible conclusion to this thread could be:-

Now is a bad time of year to judge, it's normally very quiet in Bangkok, for several reasons (heat, Thai holiday period, tourist low season).

Generally, we think that a downward trend has started, based on personal experiences from good posters based in Bangkok, and others.

(Southern violence, bombs in Bangkok, foreign offices advice, coup, some bad press, high baht, anti-foreigner feeling, lack of investor confidence, change in visa rules).

Some posters (who don't live in Bangkok) don't believe in a down trend, and thus decided to offer flames, over reasoned thoughts.

It's very hard to tell in this country, one way or the other.

My belief is that there must be a downward trend. Logic dictates it.

I think the concensus is that one night out wandering from bar to bar for 2 hours is NOT a way to measure any downturn! But congrats on summing it all up to make it sound like you have it pegged and that folks that don't agree with you were dismissed out of hand Having been in Thailand ... AND not limited to BKK it is easy peasy to see that you just don't have a clue on this ..... a couple of hours at some bars was the basis for your thoughts.

Could there be a downturn? yes ... is it related to tourism? no Will this year's tourism numbers confirm this? I believe so

My concensus - Read and listen to everyones points and link them together, in particular, highlighting the most common views.

Your concensus - Your personal rant.

If you don't like me, or my ideas, then you have the right to ignore me, and my thread - it's very easy. A never ending attack just becomes boring.

"A never ending attack just becomes boring".

Oh, I dunno! I found it all quite entertaining for a Sunday morning

Anyhow, happy birthday Jas

[kratindaeng]

Happy Birthday Jas!

Have a good one!

[Thai-Spy]

P.S. I'm not, and never have been in the travel industry, and the forgoing is purely my opinion. Maybe the professionals out there would like to comment, and shoot me down in flames if I am wrong?

Other than pretending that sex industry is not Thailand's biggest attraction, you've hit the nail right on the head!

Well I'm not going to get into an argument over this, but I spent many years in the UK between 1983 and 2000, and I worked in the city. I can still recall literally dozens of people that I met/and or knew from all walks of life who, when they discovered I had Thai wife, would recount the wonderful holidays they had had in Thailand - many going for repeat visits.

I can put my hand on my heart and honestly say that not a single person that I met had the slightest interest in the Thai sex industry; they were all married couples - some old, some young,some with children, and they had their holidays all over Thailand, from Bangkok, to Phuket, to Koh Samui, and even one young Irish couple who adored Pattaya, enjoyed the red light district, but certainly never indulged in the sex for sale. I had six adult members of my family over during new Year's and before that some other married couples from the UK. They all had wonderful holidays, without the need to partake in sexual pleasures.

Yes, there is a particular section of the tourist industry who come for the sex, and it's unlikely that many of these will be put off by the current negative factors. If anything it might encourage them, in the belief that there may be even more girls available.

How the sex tourists rate in their dollar spending compared to non- sex tourists' spending is anyone's guess.

Your arguments are good and well-supported by other facts. We saw a study someone had done trying to quantify sex-tourism from Farangland and it was estimated at just 5-15% of all tourism by farang adults.

[dgoz]

And I spent two of the worst years of my life in Vietnam back in the late '60's. I won't be back. I'll hunker down here in Bangkok and ride out any storm.

umm, the war's over buddy. Safe to come out.

[jumnien]

Hua Hin is booming! Obviously not everyone comes to Thailand for sex tourism, or they obviously wouldn't come here...

[Mobi]

And I spent two of the worst years of my life in Vietnam back in the late '60's. I won't be back. I'll hunker down here in Bangkok and ride out any storm.

umm, the war's over buddy. Safe to come out.

:D

[JacknDanny]

I cant say that I have really noticed a difference .

I have lived in BKK for the past 5 years.

Friday night I was on Soi 5 in Gullivers. Virtually standing room only and had to wait over 1 hour for a game of pool!!!!

Try walking into the Sheraton or Shangri-La hotel on a Sunday for lunch. You will get turned away, you have to make a booking sometimes 2 or 3 days before.

[baboon]

Just a couple of quick points.

Myself and other expats talk to quite a few visitors passing through on their way to and from Ko Tao. The theme seems to be "Thailand? Nice enough but I have seen it now and think I will try another destination next time." Back in the 90s everyone I met simply could not get enough of the place.

I am almost being begged to work as an [illegal] English teacher despite the fact I am completely unqualified and say so.

[ashacat]

Business as usual on Friday and Saturday night in Bangkok. Just depends where you go. A quiet night in the one pub that you happened to go to on one night does not mean that Thailand "is down".

[jfsdoll]

Hi my first post please excuse my English ,some words regarding how i feel situation is changed unless it's me who is looking through diferent glass wich i doubt seeing other people comments here .

Had been reading ocasionally this forum since i came here first in late 90's as a backpaker in my early 20's when i had such a good time and felt welcome almost everywhere i went tough in touristic areas one could always feel usual -everywhere in the world - hatred/love -more the latter - from locals working of tourism , i make living out of sports trader through internet - punter betting if you'd like - and decided 18 or so months ago to move to a low cost living place with coverage of european footy leagues to save money till i have enough to live from it's yield at home , i don't consider myself sex tourist have been just once in patpong area and such places wich really did not suit me with all hastling plus all those disgusting places with caged girls , do not enjoy company of smart girls either but i'm no one to judge and respect what other people do as long as no harm is done ..... of course i ain't a monk either just like to treat everyone with respect as i like to be treated really use of prostitution is another issue here we are talking plain racism .

Just came from long stay in Vietnam and lesser extent at Laos and Cambodia where i also felt some sort of xenofobia in some parts in contrast with my first trip there where specially in vietnam i had the best experiences i can remember of regarding people while now i had have clashes with locals and police over brawls couse i felt disrespected and abused .

So i just came back to Thailand after 6 months -had been 6 previous months based in north and south - and i just feel situation is agravated and feel hostility everywhere i go ,if as i read here its the start of down in tourism then things will get worse as people goes bankrupt etc -still remember years ago traveling in Egypt after tourist killings wich left ruined towns like Luxor with locals really blaming foreigners ,i could feel then the hatred too - .

Not much time now - sundays busy days for betting - to dwell deeper into causes/consecuences just wanted to know why i'm being targeted -is it the coup wich arose agresive feeling , did queen mother or the mother of the queen for what it's worth or my beloved frecking king JCarlos do not send birthday card to the royal composer ...is it south unrest .. . i can guess is for the sex-tourist crap and so wich is so funny and hypocrital coming from where it comes and plainly wrong to aim at everyone just for being lone traveller falang , i bet Japanese group of sex tourist are not or any short term group of tourist -> (cowardice ?) - and just would like to warn any thais or pledge expats to tell thai friends that what goes around comes around & i will be host to them or run into in any neutral country and may feel like finishing the job i can't here dealing with poliice/jails is too fearfull tought to bear right now - i have allready have some dealings with local police and know about their 'justice' ,

for instance i may label all thais travelling in my country fathers that sold their daughters or mega pimps wich surely do not arise any respect on me , but do not worry i will be straight forward unlike some individuals i find here w/o any stupid mental game and too afraid to lose face -broad meaning - when asked to step up

,i'm even starting toi think my food is not in the best state served in some places .

Sure i can see big picture and i know just will have to leave not to be a collateral damage of this clash of toughts/cultures sadly i'll have to be in the area till june since money it's tied up just hope i can make it w/o loosing coolness/head wich worries me ,to be fair still run into friendly thais -mainly the 'people ' and no looking over shoulders more 'educated' ('bigocated' ) ones - wich i know to be very welcome for foreigners traditionally & can't imagine what would be happening in for instance some central european country if the same torist invasion had hapened , however that bad feeling is extending dunno if its an official thing or propaganda by tv perhaps people here are easily allignated .

All together let's please use more sabai sabai attitude so much fancied and known polite ways from Thai people prevail ..oh and excuse the book just wrote guess it's sort of therapeutic .

[jasreeve17]

"A never ending attack just becomes boring".

Oh, I dunno! I found it all quite entertaining for a Sunday morning

Anyhow, happy birthday Jas

Thank you very much Thai felix.

And I drank no beer today, Toptuan would be impressed.

[jasreeve17]

Happy Birthday Jas!

Have a good one!

Thank you Kratindaeng. It's a distinctly average one though, I have a busy work week ahead, and need to do some paperwork this afternoon.

I'm doing a bit of work avoidance as we speek.

[JacknDanny]

Hi my first post please excuse my English ,some words regarding how i feel situation is changed unless it's me who is looking through diferent glass wich i doubt seeing other people comments here .

Had been reading ocasionally this forum since i came here first in late 90's as a backpaker in my early 20's when i had such a good time and felt welcome almost everywhere i went tough in touristic areas one could always feel usual -everywhere in the world - hatred/love -more the latter - from locals working of tourism , i make living out of sports trader through internet - punter betting if you'd like - and decided 18 or so months ago to move to a low cost living place with coverage of european footy leagues to save money till i have enough to live from it's yield at home , i don't consider myself sex tourist have been just once in patpong area and such places wich really did not suit me with all hastling plus all those disgusting places with caged girls , do not enjoy company of smart girls either but i'm no one to judge and respect what other people do as long as no harm is done ..... of course i ain't a monk either just like to treat everyone with respect as i like to be treated really use of prostitution is another issue here we are talking plain racism .

Just came from long stay in Vietnam and lesser extent at Laos and Cambodia where i also felt some sort of xenofobia in some parts in contrast with my first trip there where specially in vietnam i had the best experiences i can remember of regarding people while now i had have clashes with locals and police over brawls couse i felt disrespected and abused .

So i just came back to Thailand after 6 months -had been 6 previous months based in north and south - and i just feel situation is agravated and feel hostility everywhere i go ,if as i read here its the start of down in tourism then things will get worse as people goes bankrupt etc -still remember years ago traveling in Egypt after tourist killings wich left ruined towns like Luxor with locals really blaming foreigners ,i could feel then the hatred too - .

Not much time now - sundays busy days for betting - to dwell deeper into causes/consecuences just wanted to know why i'm being targeted -is it the coup wich arose agresive feeling , did queen mother or the mother of the queen for what it's worth or my beloved frecking king JCarlos do not send birthday card to the royal composer ...is it south unrest .. . i can guess is for the sex-tourist crap and so wich is so funny and hypocrital coming from where it comes and plainly wrong to aim at everyone just for being lone traveller falang , i bet Japanese group of sex tourist are not or any short term group of tourist -> (cowardice ?) - and just would like to warn any thais or pledge expats to tell thai friends that what goes around comes around & i will be host to them or run into in any neutral country and may feel like finishing the job i can't here dealing with poliice/jails is too fearfull tought to bear right now - i have allready have some dealings with local police and know about their 'justice' ,

for instance i may label all thais travelling in my country fathers that sold their daughters or mega pimps wich surely do not arise any respect on me , but do not worry i will be straight forward unlike some individuals i find here w/o any stupid mental game and too afraid to lose face -broad meaning - when asked to step up

,i'm even starting toi think my food is not in the best state served in some places .

Sure i can see big picture and i know just will have to leave not to be a collateral damage of this clash of toughts/cultures sadly i'll have to be in the area till june since money it's tied up just hope i can make it w/o loosing coolness/head wich worries me ,to be fair still run into friendly thais -mainly the 'people ' and no looking over shoulders more 'educated' ('bigocated' ) ones - wich i know to be very welcome for foreigners traditionally & can't imagine what would be happening in for instance some central european country if the same torist invasion had hapened , however that bad feeling is extending dunno if its an official thing or propaganda by tv perhaps people here are easily allignated .

All together let's please use more sabai sabai attitude so much fancied and known polite ways from Thai people prevail ..oh and excuse the book just wrote guess it's sort of therapeutic .

I dont want to sound rude, I understand that English is not your first language.

But I have got no clue what you are going on about or what point you are trying to make.

In view of the fact that it probably took you an hour to write, can anybody out there help me work out what the OP is saying or is it a cryptic, coded message?

[bingobongo]

Foreign investors fed up with Thai fumbles

"Who knows what the next rule change will be, but it's probably not far away. In the meantime, we view (the baht) as best avoided for anyone without a strong need to be involved."

"Thailand is not the only market in Asia, and it's not a sizable market either," he said. "So do we need to spend a lot of time and resources to monitor such an unclear but small market? I think obviously the answer is no."

http://www.borsaitaliana.reuters.it/news/N...r=0&summit=

[jfsdoll]

Hi my first post please excuse my English ,some words regarding how i feel situation is changed unless it's me who is looking through diferent glass wich i doubt seeing other people comments here .

Had been reading ocasionally this forum since i came here first in late 90's as a backpaker in my early 20's when i had such a good time and felt welcome almost everywhere i went tough in touristic areas one could always feel usual -everywhere in the world - hatred/love -more the latter - from locals working of tourism , i make living out of sports trader through internet - punter betting if you'd like - and decided 18 or so months ago to move to a low cost living place with coverage of european footy leagues to save money till i have enough to live from it's yield at home , i don't consider myself sex tourist have been just once in patpong area and such places wich really did not suit me with all hastling plus all those disgusting places with caged girls , do not enjoy company of smart girls either but i'm no one to judge and respect what other people do as long as no harm is done ..... of course i ain't a monk either just like to treat everyone with respect as i like to be treated really use of prostitution is another issue here we are talking plain racism .

Just came from long stay in Vietnam and lesser extent at Laos and Cambodia where i also felt some sort of xenofobia in some parts in contrast with my first trip there where specially in vietnam i had the best experiences i can remember of regarding people while now i had have clashes with locals and police over brawls couse i felt disrespected and abused .

So i just came back to Thailand after 6 months -had been 6 previous months based in north and south - and i just feel situation is agravated and feel hostility everywhere i go ,if as i read here its the start of down in tourism then things will get worse as people goes bankrupt etc -still remember years ago traveling in Egypt after tourist killings wich left ruined towns like Luxor with locals really blaming foreigners ,i could feel then the hatred too - .

Not much time now - sundays busy days for betting - to dwell deeper into causes/consecuences just wanted to know why i'm being targeted -is it the coup wich arose agresive feeling , did queen mother or the mother of the queen for what it's worth or my beloved frecking king JCarlos do not send birthday card to the royal composer ...is it south unrest .. . i can guess is for the sex-tourist crap and so wich is so funny and hypocrital coming from where it comes and plainly wrong to aim at everyone just for being lone traveller falang , i bet Japanese group of sex tourist are not or any short term group of tourist -> (cowardice ?) - and just would like to warn any thais or pledge expats to tell thai friends that what goes around comes around & i will be host to them or run into in any neutral country and may feel like finishing the job i can't here dealing with poliice/jails is too fearfull tought to bear right now - i have allready have some dealings with local police and know about their 'justice' ,

for instance i may label all thais travelling in my country fathers that sold their daughters or mega pimps wich surely do not arise any respect on me , but do not worry i will be straight forward unlike some individuals i find here w/o any stupid mental game and too afraid to lose face -broad meaning - when asked to step up

,i'm even starting toi think my food is not in the best state served in some places .

Sure i can see big picture and i know just will have to leave not to be a collateral damage of this clash of toughts/cultures sadly i'll have to be in the area till june since money it's tied up just hope i can make it w/o loosing coolness/head wich worries me ,to be fair still run into friendly thais -mainly the 'people ' and no looking over shoulders more 'educated' ('bigocated' ) ones - wich i know to be very welcome for foreigners traditionally & can't imagine what would be happening in for instance some central european country if the same torist invasion had hapened , however that bad feeling is extending dunno if its an official thing or propaganda by tv perhaps people here are easily allignated .

All together let's please use more sabai sabai attitude so much fancied and known polite ways from Thai people prevail ..oh and excuse the book just wrote guess it's sort of therapeutic .

I dont want to sound rude, I understand that English is not your first language.

But I have got no clue what you are going on about or what point you are trying to make.

In view of the fact that it probably took you an hour to write, can anybody out there help me work out what the OP is saying or is it a cryptic, coded message?

Not sure youre not a fisherman here myself mate what i'm trying to say it's i do not feel welcome here nowadays unlike in the past and people more hostile towards me just for being a single male falang for wichever 'reasons' i'm also trying to say i'll remember it and since it's a common trend within 'educated' thai people it may bounce back and hits them right in the face as world its a small place .

Clearer now .

When i have acouple of hours i'll elaborate more .

Cheers.

[Ulysses G.]

I can put my hand on my heart and honestly say that not a single person that I met had the slightest interest in the Thai sex industry; they were all married couples - some old, some young,some with children, and they had their holidays all over Thailand, from Bangkok, to Phuket, to Koh Samui, and even one young Irish couple who adored Pattaya, enjoyed the red light district, but certainly never indulged in the sex for sale. I had six adult members of my family over during new Year's and before that some other married couples from the UK. They all had wonderful holidays, without the need to partake in sexual pleasures.

Yes, there is a particular section of the tourist industry who come for the sex, and it's unlikely that many of these will be put off by the current negative factors. If anything it might encourage them, in the belief that there may be even more girls available.

How the sex tourists rate in their dollar spending compared to non- sex tourists' spending is anyone's guess.

Maybe you and I CAN agree on something.

I don't think that every single person who visits Thailand is going to indulge in sex, but I do think that many of Thailand's visitors - including couples and families - find the sex industry to be interesting and just plain charming. They come here because they want to see what is like without feeling threatened, they enjoy the sights and atmosphere and they would go somewhere else if all they were looking for is beaches.

I also think that many of the supposedly "moral" men who come here for "romance" are utterly dulusional and end up paying a lot more than any sex tourist with even half a brain.

[CymruAmByth]

As far as tourism from places like the UK is concerned, I would say this.

The average Brit probably books his holiday in the sun at least 6 months in advance, and relies on travel brochures, travel agents, travel articles in magazines and newspapers, and the all important TV holiday programmes to make his choice. Price , of course is also big factor.

Now I have no idea to what extent the negative press about Thailand is seepoing to the outside world, but my guess is that not a great deal has yet. But when it does, it won't take long to get up a head of steam. It will only take a couple of negative pieces in the travel journals, and something uncomplimentary on one of the travel shows and the ball will begin to roll. Can you imagine a Tv travel slot where the presenter complains about the debauchery and sex industry in Pattaya, the dual pricing at National parks, and maybe the increasing anti - foreigner sentiment in the country. This is to say nothing of sensationalist stuff getting into the general news, like coups and tanks on the street, the killings in the South, the murders of tourists and so on.

All these things can be explained away till the cows come home - but it is the perception that counts. Not too long ago, Thailand with it's lovely, kind, smiling welcoming people, was one of the most coveted destinations for UK holidaymakers. Not sure that is true any more, and the word will soon be out, if it's not already.

Once booking's start to tail off a little, the tour companies will look elsewhere to find holidays to sell, and Thailand will start to feel a definite chill.

P.S. I'm not, and never have been in the travel industry, and the forgoing is purely my opinion. Maybe the professionals out there would like to comment, and shoot me down in flames if I am wrong?

I previously mentioned I was having dinner this weekend with an old friend from the UK who heads up one of the Big Three Far East travel agents...his 'professional' comments follow:

Basically, his company is up 6-7% on last years numbers and he is very happy, as are Thailand's hoteliers (he visits once a year to secure contracts with 40+ 4-5 star hotels). This year he has holiday bookings in excess of 11,000 passengers, so I think his comments are broad enough to form an opinion!

His company's demographics are 45+ year old 'professionals' (business owners, accountants, solicitors etc) who bring their family to Thailand and stay an average of 14 days.

He wondered what the hel_l I was talking about when I mentioned this thread!

I hope this helps?

[raro]

I'm following this thread the whole day and I am amazed how much bashing the OP had to suffer! Read the post again, he just stated that he went to some tourist places and noticed that there were far less people than usual. Then he asked the question whether it was only him or if others did a similar observation - a quasi-survey so to say.

For fairness....those tourist places arerather expat places, but in the end of the day...where are the customers?

[bingobongo]

great thread jasreeve17

now now for the rest of you dreamers, i know reality can be painful......but it is best to live in reality, not fantasy

so best put away the alcohol and get out of the sun

UTTC to lower GDP target: Urges government to stimulate consumption

"In response to discouraging economic indicators, the University of Thai Chamber of Commerce Economic and Business Forecasting Centre expects to lower its GDP growth target."

"Indicators pointing to continued economic slowdown, according to Dr. Thanawat, include the consumer confidence index, which hit a five-year low, and the Thai Industry Sentiment Index (TISI—compiled by the Federation of Thai Industries), which fell below the 'normal' level for the 10th consecutive month, among other indexes, including those released by the Bank of Thailand. "

http://etna.mcot.net/query.php?nid=28701

Edited April 1, 2007 by bingobongo

[Johpa]

Meanwhile, I'll still be here.....in RURAL Thailand.....the real Thailand.

Thailand is a good place to live, but places like Pattaya have deteriorated to the point of only being a destination for a certain type of 'Tourist'.

The sea is dirty, the crime is rampant, traffic conditions are bad, even the police wear masks to protect against the air pollution. Rather odd for an international beach resort I think.

Thank god for Rural Thailand, as long as one has a Car to run to Pattaya for a few days every now and then.....

Pardon me, but I believe Pattaya, the lone town in Thailand where nary a single resident ex-pat pronounces the name correctly, deteriorated to what you accurately describe decades ago. That never bothered many folks and never prevented Pattaya from becoming a tourist boomtown.

Look, if there is a downtrend in Farang tourism, it is probably because increases in oil prices have put a damper on overall spending and not because of any foolish decsions by the Thai elite, nor by current events down south, nor by visa restrictions.

There was a recent interview on TV with the CEO of Walmart, Lee Scott. Scott noted that the primary causative influence on sales, and he has oodles and oodles of data, is the price of oil. People can not so easily afford to travel to Thailand anymore. Look at airfares from North America. For many years they hovered below $1,000. Today, apart from the few off-season months like September or October, fares are all well over that $1,000 psychological cost barrier. It is simply not as affordable to travel to Thailand for a vacation aas it once was. Really just Economics 101. By the way, the father of my newest Thai relative by marriage owns, arguably, one of the top ten tourist destinations in the Kingdom, and reports are that sales are down there.

[Tyree D.]

THAILAND JUMPED THE SHARK

you can go to these other places, you will still be second class.

[jdinasia]

Johpa , You and Maigo6 don't need to turn this into a Pattaya bashing thread .... <and based upon Maigo6's agenda that totally ignores the families that go to Pattaya ... and the rest of his remarks ..... well ... not certain he'd be who I was cozying up to!>

[wasabi]

This thread is getting long in the tooth so I'll just add a bit. I do feel increasing hostility towards foreigners. I live in the USA but chat online with many Thai's. I have been hearing, prices are higher because farang's came and started paying too much for a rai of land. Or that the media has been portraying Thailand in a bad light and doesn't understand the coup or Thai people. It seems there is a downturn and as usual people look for scapegoats, amongst some Farangs are an easy target. However nothing seems like a true seismic shift and I will continue to vacation in Thailand, but my career aspirations there have been put on hold indefinitely. I think in the region, Vietnam is making the best moves, opening up trade, investing in infrastructure and having a young education populace.