Tenant rights and penalties after move-out

[PingRoundTheWorld]

I have recently moved out of a condo after 3 years living there. No major issues during those 3 years, and I left the unit in good condition with 3 exceptions:

 

1. It needed a thorough cleaning. Last time I moved out they charged 500 to clean the same size room. Now they want 1000.

2. The mattress had a few small blood stains. I didn't think they would charge me at all for it, but they want 1000 to clean it.

3. There is a sliding glass door separating the bedroom from the kitchen - a while ago it broke on it's own (just exploded - lucky nobody was hurt).

 

The landlord is already keeping my deposit to cover rent I owe - this is fine with me - however now they want 15,000 baht to fix the glass, 1000 for cleaning the room, 1000 for cleaning the mattress, and 500 to clean aircon. My questions:

 

1. Do these amounts sound reasonable? 1000 for cleaning a 20sqm studio sounds excessive, and 1000 to clean a few blood stains from a mattress sounds ridiculous. 15,000 to fix a glass door also sounds like way too much, even if it's a big door.

2. Am I responsible for cleaning the aircon? Seems logical to me this would be the landlord's responsibility.

3. Am I responsible for the glass door? They don't believe it just exploded on it's own, said somebody kicked it (nobody did).

4. What can they realistically do if I just don't pay, or pay a lesser amount? I doubt they'd go to court over this, but can they get me in trouble otherwise, like file a police report or something similar? In most countries this is a civil matter, but I don't know Thai law and whether police would get involved in this.

 

Thanks in advance!

[worgeordie]

1000 Thb sounds reasonable to clean up after you, you could have done it

yourself and save a 1000 Thb, with the blood stains on the mattress ,most

landlords would have wanted you to pay for new mattress.

 

I don't understand how a glass door can explode,just like that,you should

not be paying for cleaning of A/c., don't know how big the glass door is but

15 K sounds expensive.

regards Worgeordie

 

 

[PingRoundTheWorld]

4 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

don't know how big the glass door is but 15 K sounds expensive.

It sounds like they're trying to pull one over. My guess is they got a high estimate to present to me but will actually get it done cheaper. Either way I don't even think I am responsible for it - it broke on it's own which is rare but does happen. There was construction going on in a nearby unit at the time so that's probably the cause (combined with faulty manufacturing).

[PingRoundTheWorld]

P.S. The glass door is about 1.5x2 meter.

[ThomasThBKK]

10 minutes ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

P.S. The glass door is about 1.5x2 meter.

and did u report that at the time and demanded it to be fixed?

[PingRoundTheWorld]

7 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

and did u report that at the time and demanded it to be fixed?

I did report it at the time and went back and forth about who's responsibility it is. I went to stay in a hotel (at my expense of course) for a couple of nights while someone from juristic covered it with cardboard. Figured there's no point to keep arguing about who's responsible and I'll deal with it when I move out.

 

My main concern is what happens if I don't pay for the door. What can the landlord actually do? I'm not worried about physical harm as they do not know my current location, however can they harm me otherwise? (police, court, etc)

[JHolmesJr]

Why not get an independent quote for the glass and compare?

Then negotiate....its a civil matter.....so if you just kept mum I doubt 

the landlord could do anything.

 

But the tenant after you might have to suffer some excessive deposit

and other measures.

[johng]

2 minutes ago, JHolmesJr said:

its a civil matter.....so if you just kept mum I doubt 

the landlord could do anything.

I seem to remember reading about  tourist's being detained at the airport  for "unpaid" bills

[PingRoundTheWorld]

9 minutes ago, JHolmesJr said:

Why not get an independent quote for the glass and compare?

I already moved out, so that's not really a possibility.

 

5 minutes ago, johng said:

I seem to remember reading about  tourist's being detained at the airport  for "unpaid" bills

I've read this before too, but would this apply in this case? Can she actually do it with only a complaint, or needs to go through court etc? It's worth mentioning she does not have a copy of my current passport (not even same country).

[steven100]

something wrong with this story ...

a glass sliding door doesn't just break/shatter on it's own ...  there must be a logical reason for it to break, either by a structural defect in that the beam or ceiling above the door moved downward which put enough strain and pressure on the glass and frame causing it to shatter. Either that or severe vibration from jack hammering caused it to shatter although highly unlikely, or you caused the brake/shatter yourself.

Also,  you mentioned the size of the glass door was 1.5mx2m ... this doesn't seem correct as standard height should be either 2.4m or 2.7m ... so i don't understand how you got 1.5x2.0 .

 

As mentioned earlier,  the cleaning fees all sound pretty much in line as 1,000 baht is only AUD$48 which is not excessive at all. 

Get another quote for a new glass installed and compare what the landlords price is to your, if yours is lower talk to the landlord and offer to meet in the middle.

[steven100]

I just noticed you mentioned you have already moved out .....   if so just pay the bill and move on ..

it's not huge money we are talking about. 

[PingRoundTheWorld]

33 minutes ago, steven100 said:

a glass sliding door doesn't just break/shatter on it's own

I have no idea if the door is faulty, but wouldn't be surprised. I was not there at the time - a friend was staying at my place and said he woke up to a loud explosion noise, the door was shattered, and there was construction noise and vibrations (which I heard too when I came to look at it). I know for a fact he wouldn't cause this deliberately - the only other option I can think of is he tried to shut the door and the impact at the edge did it - which brings the question of why is there not even minimal padding at the point the door meets the frame, seems like a no-brainer to me but I guess cheap construction and lack of common sense will do that.

 

39 minutes ago, steven100 said:

it's not huge money we are talking about. 

I'll pay for the cleaning for sure, but I have a hard time swallowing the door thing, especially considering I didn't even cause it, and especially since I think they gave me a false quote. There is no way I could get the guy to pay so that's not an option. (he'll just tell me it's the responsibility of the landlord). I'll see if I can get an independent/generic quote for replacing door glass that size. You are right it's probably taller than two meters.

[JHolmesJr]

1 hour ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

I already moved out, so that's not really a possibility.

 

I mean just get a ballpark quote for the dimensions you listed..surely

you can remember what the glass looked/felt like

[ThomasThBKK]

1 hour ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

I already moved out, so that's not really a possibility.

 

I've read this before too, but would this apply in this case? Can she actually do it with only a complaint, or needs to go through court etc? It's worth mentioning she does not have a copy of my current passport (not even same country).

Nothing, it's a civil case if at all.

 

Opening the case is more expensive than this goddamn door. 

 

What you have read before is someone NOT PAYING his hotel, that is simply FRAUD and completely different.

[Matzzon]

2 hours ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

Thanks in advance!

Don´t worry. We take it the quick way.

You have: 100% responsibilities for ant penalties that can be forced upon you for the rest of your life, and 0 % chance of getting any rights. Not according to the law, but probably according to the people you try to fight.

[PingRoundTheWorld]

22 minutes ago, ThomasThBKK said:

What you have read before is someone NOT PAYING his hotel, that is simply FRAUD and completely different.

Yep, I looked it up. Definitely not the case here.

[steven100]

7 hours ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

I was not there at the time - a friend was staying at my place and said he woke up to a loud explosion noise, the door was shattered,

thank's for your info ....  i'm not a detective, but there's your answer ... was he drunk and accident head butted the door  ?  and he's not saying ....   imo.  thanks.

[baansgr]

"The landlord is already keeping my deposit to cover rent I owe"

 

You left the condo dirty, damaged and owing rent. Apart from the air con being the landlords responsibility, the rest is up to you. 

[scubascuba3]

Being a UK landlord myself, I'd be <deleted> off if the door window broke, you say it wasn't you, fair enough, offer 50% only. As for the bed, i had a tenant stain the mattress and they paid for a new mattress, you can't get stains out

[alex8912]

You sound like a really crappy tenant who is not responsible. Your friend should not be staying at your apt and sleeping there when you are not there. The chance he broke it is probably 100%. You are responsible for a friends damage. Why do you owe  

rent? Why do you think your blood on a mattress is not your responsibility ? Why do you think a cleaning fee of 1000 baht is excessive after a 3 year tenancy ?  Why do I know you have never been a landlord and never will be one?

Edited February 5, 2020 by alex8912

[Jaxxper]

21 hours ago, worgeordie said:

1000 Thb sounds reasonable to clean up after you, you could have done it

yourself and save a 1000 Thb, with the blood stains on the mattress ,most

landlords would have wanted you to pay for new mattress.

 

I don't understand how a glass door can explode,just like that,you should

not be paying for cleaning of A/c., don't know how big the glass door is but

15 K sounds expensive.

regards Worgeordie

 

 

I agree. All small money except the glass door.

 

[Foghorn]

sort it alone ,pay someone to clean 500 baht and 3000 for glass, landlords after his last chance payday from you

Edited February 5, 2020 by Foghorn

[newnative]

  I think you need to pay for everything.  It's likely your friend broke the door by closing it too hard or by doing something else to break it--maybe he ran into it thinking it was open.  Whatever.  You weren't there so you have no idea how it broke--but your friend doing it sounds the most likely.   An exploding door sounds highly unlikely--especially since you didn't witness it 'exploding'.  As others have said, if you want to go to the trouble of getting a second quote for a new door, that is an option.  

[PingRoundTheWorld]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

you say it wasn't you, fair enough, offer 50% only.

I did. They said no. This was all through the agent (I've never spoken to the landlord directly), but I got the feeling she is hard-headed and stingy and the agent is scared of dealing with her.

 

43 minutes ago, alex8912 said:

You sound like a really crappy tenant who is not responsible.

And you sound....let's not go there. I was a good tenant, paid on time for 34 months, never asked or demanded anything except one time on renewal they put shade screen on the windows for me (not a large expense). Aircon broke in the first unit renting from her - I paid for my hotel while waiting for her to fix it, despite it being her responsibility. When it turned out it would take too long to repair she offered to move me to another unit - and charged me 500 baht for cleaning...

 

It's not like I'm screwing her in any shape or form - she made very good money off of me, and I could've (and maybe should have) negotiated lower rent due to the market going down after the first year which would've netted her 24-48k less overall. Also moved out a week early, to give her more time to find a new tenant - though I suspect that might be difficult with the current situation.

 

1 hour ago, alex8912 said:

Why do I know you have never been a landlord and never will be one?

Actually, I *have* been a landlord - which is why I will never be one again. I'm a nice guy at heart and ended up taken advantage of and screwed by tenants.

 

30 minutes ago, Foghorn said:

sort it alone ,pay someone to clean 500 baht and 3000 for glass, landlords after his last chance payday from you

That's exactly what it feels like. There is no way cleaning was actually 1000 or replacing glass is 15k. I doubted that quote the first time they made it and I doubt it now. Too late on doing it myself now though, all I can do is pay less and let them rip off someone else.

[PingRoundTheWorld]

14 minutes ago, newnative said:

It's likely your friend broke the door by closing it too hard or by doing something else to break it--maybe he ran into it thinking it was open.

I wasn't there so I don't know, but he had no injuries so he did not run into it. Maybe he did close it too hard, but that sounds like a construction defect - a door should be able to withstand a reasonable amount of force, and cushions should be in place to prevent exactly this scenario.

 

Either way, my issue is less about paying it and more about them inflating the amount. I will try to get my own quote and see from there.

[JimmyJ]

AC filters are the landlord's responsibility.

 

The cleaner will be paid 30 BHT for one hour.

 

No opinion on the rest.

Edited February 5, 2020 by JimmyJ

[Max69xl]

21 hours ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

I did report it at the time and went back and forth about who's responsibility it is. I went to stay in a hotel (at my expense of course) for a couple of nights while someone from juristic covered it with cardboard. Figured there's no point to keep arguing about who's responsible and I'll deal with it when I move out.

 

My main concern is what happens if I don't pay for the door. What can the landlord actually do? I'm not worried about physical harm as they do not know my current location, however can they harm me otherwise? (police, court, etc)

What about replacing the glass door yourself,I mean buying it and having it installed the proper way? It won't be expensive. 

What does your contract say about the aircon? Is it mentioned? My contract clearly states that the owner pays for maintenance and cleaning (on regular basis) of my 2 units. You can also have the mattress cleaned yourself,there are companies doing it all the time. Then you won't get ripped off by your landlord.

[scubascuba3]

45 minutes ago, PingRoundTheWorld said:

I did. They said no. This was all through the agent (I've never spoken to the landlord directly), but I got the feeling she is hard-headed and stingy and the agent is scared of dealing with her.

 

And you sound....let's not go there. I was a good tenant, paid on time for 34 months, never asked or demanded anything except one time on renewal they put shade screen on the windows for me (not a large expense). Aircon broke in the first unit renting from her - I paid for my hotel while waiting for her to fix it, despite it being her responsibility. When it turned out it would take too long to repair she offered to move me to another unit - and charged me 500 baht for cleaning...

 

It's not like I'm screwing her in any shape or form - she made very good money off of me, and I could've (and maybe should have) negotiated lower rent due to the market going down after the first year which would've netted her 24-48k less overall. Also moved out a week early, to give her more time to find a new tenant - though I suspect that might be difficult with the current situation.

 

Actually, I *have* been a landlord - which is why I will never be one again. I'm a nice guy at heart and ended up taken advantage of and screwed by tenants.

 

That's exactly what it feels like. There is no way cleaning was actually 1000 or replacing glass is 15k. I doubted that quote the first time they made it and I doubt it now. Too late on doing it myself now though, all I can do is pay less and let them rip off someone else.

She thinks the glass door is your fault, you think its design fault (can happen, my parents double glazed patio door just shattered one day), again offer 50% or nothing, then she can decide. 50% is a fair offer.

 

Let us know how it pans out

[steven100]

43 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

She thinks the glass door is your fault, you think its design fault (can happen, my parents double glazed patio door just shattered one day), again offer 50% or nothing, then she can decide. 50% is a fair offer.

 

Let us know how it pans out

glass doors don't shatter for no reason ....  his friend was there at the time and he's not saying what happened because he doesn't want to pay for it. imo

[Proper person]

I wouldn't want you as my tenant. 

 

1000 baht is fair to clean up after you. 

 

1000 baht for the blood stain is a gift. I would have wanted you to pay a new mattress. Who the hell wants to sleep on a blood stained mattress? 

 

15000 for the door sounds a bit ove the top if your telling the truth that it's only the glass. Anyway you should have replaced it at the time. 

I smell a rat here. You say you left the condo for 2 days while it was covered up. 2 days to cover up a hole???? 

 

My advice, be a man and pay up what you owe.