The Climate Crisis, the reality, the challenges and indeed the ways forward!

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, gunderhill said:

Over  millions  of  years

Over hundreds of millions of years.

[gunderhill]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Over hundreds of millions of years.

I didn't specify 1-100000000000000000000000000000000 yrs

[rabas]

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Yes correct, the industrial release of CO2 that has been locked away in mineral deposits for hundreds of millions of years.

Why these processes are going on today. Did you think they had stopped?

[bristolboy]

21 minutes ago, rabas said:

Cement is made with lime, CaO.  CaO is produced by intensely heating limestone which is CaCO₃. 

 

So CaCO₃. + heat => CaO + CO₂

 

The CO2 returns to the atmosphere from whence it originally came. The limestone is mostly formed by lifeforms that convert CO₂ into CaCO₃ which is left behind in deposits.  The heat comes from burning of fossil fuels which also releases CO₂. The carbon fuel was deposited from plants that removed the CO₂  from the atmosphere.

 

CO₂ is involved with all lifeforms. It is the miracle of life.

 

 

 

Increasing carbon dioxide and decreasing oxygen make it harder for deep-sea animals to 'breathe'

https://phys.org/news/2009-04-carbon-dioxide-decreasing-oxygen-harder.html

Toxic blue-green algae adapt to rising CO2

https://phys.org/news/2016-08-toxic-blue-green-algae-co2.html

 

Edited February 12, 2020 by bristolboy

[rabas]

44 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

Increasing carbon dioxide and decreasing oxygen make it harder for deep-sea animals to 'breathe'

https://phys.org/news/2009-04-carbon-dioxide-decreasing-oxygen-harder.html

Toxic blue-green algae adapt to rising CO2

https://phys.org/news/2016-08-toxic-blue-green-algae-co2.html

 

Oh, no! Not the ones that produce the Earth's oxygen.

 

The oxygen gas in the atmosphere of earth is produced by cyanobacteria of this phylum, either as free-living bacteria or as the endosymbiotic plastids  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanobacteria

 

But they also sequester CO₂. 

 

BTW, climate is not the primary cause of dead zones. When, and if, someone discusses the environment from all sides, I may listen to them.

Edited February 12, 2020 by rabas

[WalkingOrders]

12 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

On TVF we do the debating on TVF.

 

Doh!

And someone repeatedly conjuring the sound of Homer Simpson is not serious debating. If you want a serious debate on climate, where "Doh!" Is not used in conversation, try judithcurry.com

[bristolboy]

10 hours ago, rabas said:

Oh, no! Not the ones that produce the Earth's oxygen.

 

The oxygen gas in the atmosphere of earth is produced by cyanobacteria of this phylum, either as free-living bacteria or as the endosymbiotic plastids  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanobacteria

 

But they also sequester CO₂. 

 

BTW, climate is not the primary cause of dead zones. When, and if, someone discusses the environment from all sides, I may listen to them.

Is there now some shortage of oxygen pending on planet earth that means we need more of it? How much more is necessary? Is there some emergency situation we need to know about? Next thing you know you'll be telling us that we need more CO2 to avert a pending resurgence of the glacierswhich scientists say, given the current levels of CO2, is about 150,000 years away. Come to think of it, didn't you claim that already? Funny how denialists calls the mainstream opinion on global warming "alarmist" but they worry about events that are 10's of thousands of years away.

[rickudon]

What many do not realise is that humans have been probably affecting climate for a lot longer than the industrial revolution. It is hypothesised that decreased population caused by the mongol invasions, the black death and the 'discovery' of the Americas were possibly causes of the little ice age, by allowing the reforestation of large amounts of arable land (therefore slightly reducing atmospheric CO2).

 

Quote

Some researchers have proposed that human influences on climate began earlier than is normally supposed (see Early anthropocene for more details) and that major population declines in Eurasia and the Americas reduced this impact, leading to a cooling trend.

The Black Death is estimated to have killed 30% to 60% of Europe's population.^[94] In total, the plague may have reduced the world population from an estimated 475 million to 350–375 million in the 14th century.^[95] It took 200 years for the world population to recover to its previous level.^[96] William Ruddiman proposed that these large population reductions in Europe, East Asia, and the Middle East caused a decrease in agricultural activity. Ruddiman suggests reforestation took place, allowing more carbon dioxide uptake from the atmosphere, which may have been a factor in the cooling noted during the Little Ice Age. Ruddiman further hypothesized that a reduced population in the Americas after European contact in the 16th century could have had a similar effect.^[97][98] Other researchers supported depopulation in the Americas as a factor, asserting that humans had cleared considerable amounts of forest to support agriculture in the Americas before the arrival of Europeans brought on a population collapse.^[99][100] Richard Nevle, Robert Dull and colleagues further suggested that not only anthropogenic forest clearance played a role in reducing the amount of carbon sequestered in Neotropical forests, but that human-set fires played a central role in reducing biomass in Amazonian and Central American forests before the arrival of Europeans and the concomitant spread of diseases during the Columbian exchange^{[101][102][103]}. Dull and Nevle calculated that reforestation in the tropical biomes of the Americas alone from 1500 to 1650 accounted for net carbon sequestration of 2-5 Pg^[104]. Brierley conjectured that European arrival in the Americas caused mass deaths from epidemic disease, which caused much abandonment of farmland, which caused much return of forest, which sequestered greater levels of carbon dioxide.^[11] A study of sediment cores and soil samples further suggests that carbon dioxide uptake via reforestation in the Americas could have contributed to the Little Ice Age.^[105] The depopulation is linked to a drop in carbon dioxide levels observed at Law Dome, Antarctica.^[99] A 2011 study by the Carnegie Institution’s Department of Global Ecology asserts that the Mongol invasions and conquests, which lasted almost two centuries, contributed to global cooling by depopulating vast regions and allowing for the return of carbon absorbing forest over cultivated land.^[106]

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Ice_Age#Decreased_human_populations

 

My own take on this is that warm periods are associated with growing world populations, and cold periods follow depopulation episodes. Why? clearing or abandonment of agricultural land, and this changes CO2 levels - or changes the Earths albedo.

 

Yes, it is very easy for humans to affect climate.

[nauseus]

On 2/12/2020 at 4:47 PM, Kurtf said:

To all you global warming alarmists, are you aware of how much carbon is put into the atmosphere by one volcano erupting? Waaay more than humans do. Forcing all humans on the planet to do anything to lower their carbon footprint is first of all impossible. Secondly the impact on the climate would be negligible even if you could force everyone to comply. The pollution of the oceans by plastic is another exercise in futility. San Jose, Ca. Has eliminated all plastic bags in grocery stores. Plastic straws have been banned. Thailand has stopped giving out plastic bags. Wonderful you say. However 40% of the world population is in China and India. They haven't stopped using plastic bags. So what was accomplished? The people of San Jose and Thailand have been inconvenienced. And that's it.

As soon as I read "under the auspices of the UN" I knew it was BS. I want to know what caused climate changes up and down 200 years ago. You know way before there were SUV's. For every scientist or study saying it's all because of humans there are twice as many saying if you believe the <deleted> being shovelled at you, you deserve to be herded around like sheep and pay all the taxes that they will require to make the world "safe" again. Why are ma y denying your "facts"? Because they are refuted by thousands of other scientists who say don't be stupid and buy the <deleted> you are being fed by global alarmists. 

On an average annual basis, C02 additions from a single volcano of average size are not greater than total human contributions.  

[nauseus]

On 2/12/2020 at 5:21 PM, nobodysfriend said:

WalkingOrders : Talk to yourself , I do not want to talk to you . Too boring ...

Looks like it's you talking to yourself.

[nauseus]

On 2/12/2020 at 7:41 PM, canuckamuck said:

The high water mark is visible in both pictures

Hawkeye! 

[nauseus]

On 2/12/2020 at 10:29 PM, gunderhill said:

Over  millions  of  years

Well, Rome wasn't built in a day!

Edited February 14, 2020 by nauseus
+ built

[nauseus]

On 2/12/2020 at 10:31 PM, Chomper Higgot said:

Over hundreds of millions of years.

Rome didn't take that long!

[watso63]

What a bunch headless chickens flapping around because of weather patterns. Sure everyone should do their bit where they can but human activity never caused climate change and ice ages in the past. It's mostly linked to that big, hot, yellow thing up in the sky, nevermind asteroid impacts and volcanos. Polar bear numbers are up, Al Gore was wrong so It's carry on as usual for me☀️☀️☀️

[nauseus]

9 minutes ago, watso63 said:

What a bunch headless chickens flapping around because of weather patterns. Sure everyone should do their bit where they can but human activity never caused climate change and ice ages in the past. It's mostly linked to that big, hot, yellow thing up in the sky, nevermind asteroid impacts and volcanos. Polar bear numbers are up, Al Gore was wrong so It's carry on as usual for me☀️☀️☀️

Asteroid impacts are far more important than you seem to credit them for. 

[nauseus]

2 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Asteroid impacts are far more important than you seem to credit them for. 

   Confirmed. 

[watso63]

How dare you? Do as I say not as I do????????????

 

 

[sucit]

Human brains are obviously de-evolving. We are not talking to the point of neanderthal here, more like a turtle or maybe a slug.

[englishoak]

18 minutes ago, watso63 said:

How dare you? Do as I say not as I do????????????

 

 

Anyone who knows an autistic kid also knows not to indulge them too much... poor girl is really a victim of her disgusting self serving parents and entourage. Stupid is as stupid does,

 

Im going out this weekend in my gas guzzling V12 classic Jag, having an open BBQ fueled by wood and charcoal. keep your dirty virus infested public transport, pointless and limited cycle paths and electric cars that go no distance and no infrastructure I will continue to fly and drive everywhere I wish arrive on time and without breaking the bank or waiting half a day to continue on... 

 

I shall be changing nothing about my lifestyle, these hypocrites can go to hell. 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, englishoak said:

Anyone who knows an autistic kid also knows not to indulge them too much... poor girl is really a victim of her disgusting self serving parents and entourage. Stupid is as stupid does,

 

Im going out this weekend in my gas guzzling V12 classic Jag, having an open BBQ fueled by wood and charcoal. keep your dirty virus infested public transport, pointless and limited cycle paths and electric cars that go no distance and no infrastructure I will continue to fly and drive everywhere I wish arrive on time and without breaking the bank or waiting half a day to continue on... 

 

I shall be changing nothing about my lifestyle, these hypocrites can go to hell. 

Anybody who knows an adult male obsessed by a teenage girl knows there’s something not at all healthy going on.