New School Year: Positions And Salaries Available

[aussiestyle1983]

Torito- comments on others' English writing ability as a way of scoring points in arguments are not really encouraged here in the Teacher's Forum, unless someone is specifically curious about their suitability for an English teacher's position (for example). Ever hear the English idiom about people in glass houses?

I agree that Aussie1983's post is angry and contains some derogatory descriptions of Filipinos in their stereotypical working roles here in Thailand, but it is not racist. He does not refer to the Filipinos as a race, or to anything regarding their ability or behavior as a racial characteristic. Whether or not his depiction is correct is still open to question, but the depiction is not a racist one any more than negative descriptions of white European non-native speakers in their attempts to teach English here are racist (and believe me, there are a few of those descriptions around here somewhere, too).

"S"

Ijustwannateach I considered that his note was doing exactly the same "comments on other's ablities". Having said that, you are the moderator and I accept your statement with no further comments.

If you think my post was racist driven you obviously don't know the deffinition of racist. My post was based on what I have seen during my 20 months of teaching here.

[PeaceBlondie]

The formerly strict term racist applied only to race (Caucasoid, Mongoloid, Negroid, etc.). Now the term is being stretched to apply to all forms of demographic discrimination (and discrimination used to be a positive word!). On the subject of the hiring and the salaries of Thai EFL teachers, demographics matter. I cited the example where a school couldn't find a White/Caucasian/native speaker math teacher for 34K, and paid a Filipino 19K. That's discrimination, but it's a fact of life in Thailand.

When a person states his personal, informed opinion, it's not a fact, and he may be wrong. My informed opinion of remote provinces is that the schools there are remote and provincial, whereas in capitals like Bangkok and Neuw Yahwk City, everyone is urban, urbane, sophisticated, and higher priced.

[Naam]

Most of the Western qualified teachers here are people who have ended up here either becasue they are loosers, they have family here, they like the Thai lifestyle or they like other attractions Thailand has to offer.

i have realized several times that "native" english speakers (in this specific case a teacher) cannot differentiate between a "loser" and a "looser".

[PeaceBlondie]

Most of the Western qualified teachers here are people who have ended up here either becasue they are loosers, they have family here, they like the Thai lifestyle or they like other attractions Thailand has to offer.

i have realized several times that "native" english speakers (in this specific case a teacher) cannot differentiate between a "loser" and a "looser".

But Dr. Naam, if you'll read aussiestyle's signature, he's cleverly made a disclaimer. You're right, though, that this is a fairly common error for native speakers, partly because spellcheck doesn't catch it as a misspelled word. He spelled because wrong, also, because he can.

Other common errors include its/it's and your/you're. But we have a general rule about pedantry: only pedants can be criticized for errors! And you, good Doctor, have made no errors in your post.

[aussiestyle1983]

Most of the Western qualified teachers here are people who have ended up here either becasue they are loosers, they have family here, they like the Thai lifestyle or they like other attractions Thailand has to offer.

i have realized several times that "native" english speakers (in this specific case a teacher) cannot differentiate between a "loser" and a "looser".

But Dr. Naam, if you'll read aussiestyle's signature, he's cleverly made a disclaimer. You're right, though, that this is a fairly common error for native speakers, partly because spellcheck doesn't catch it as a misspelled word. He spelled because wrong, also, because he can.

Other common errors include its/it's and your/you're. But we have a general rule about pedantry: only pedants can be criticized for errors! And you, good Doctor, have made no errors in your post.

PB is correct, please read my signature. I admit my spelling is bad, but this is because I try to type as quickly as I can and I don't use a spell check or edit my posts. I am also sorry that I don't use what I believe is called "Nettiquite"

I however have learnt about looser and loser before but as long as I continue to type posts like a jack rabbit, the occasional looser might be typed instead os loser.

[Ijustwannateach]

Flaming is *still* not permitted in the Teacher's Forum. If you feel a post is objectionable, you are free to use the REPORT function on that post, or to PM a mod with *specific* details about which post you find objectionable and exactly why. Your feeling that another poster has posted objectionably does not excuse you from penalties for breaking the rules of Thaivisa or the guidelines of the teacher's subforum.

"Steven"

[garro]

I'm a bit confused. If people are leaving in droves why is there so few teaching positions availible for the next term. I understand that the new rules are making it tougher to recruit but that doesn't seem to explain it. I suspect that despite all the talk, just as many people are coming to Thailand to teach English as always. Looking at other websites there are people everyday saying that they are on their way to LOS to teach.

In my opinion anyone deciding to leave teaching will not really be missed. There is probably about five people waiting to take their jobs. Some of them may even be qualified to teach. Of course I could be wrong.

[aussiestyle1983]

I'm a bit confused. If people are leaving in droves why is there so few teaching positions availible for the next term. I understand that the new rules are making it tougher to recruit but that doesn't seem to explain it. I suspect that despite all the talk, just as many people are coming to Thailand to teach English as always. Looking at other websites there are people everyday saying that they are on their way to LOS to teach.

In my opinion anyone deciding to leave teaching will not really be missed. There is probably about five people waiting to take their jobs. Some of them may even be qualified to teach. Of course I could be wrong.

I doubt it. The job advertisements have been increasing rapidly over the past 4-6 weeks and come May, there will be hundreds if not thousands of teachers needed.

And, their may be teachers comming here, but are they qualified? They are most likely just as un-qualified and also have a lot less experience than some of the ones leaving.

It would be good to see a few 747 loads of BEd and TEFL qualified teachers arriving next week to fill all the job vacancies, but with Thailands current problems and the salary and visa issues, I don't think that will happn for a long time, if not ever.

[Furbie]

What is all the fuss about.

As far as I know there is no law forcing you to stay in Thailand teaching. If you don´t like the teaching conditions

you are free to leave the country. Remember you are a guest

worker in Thailand.

Although not a teacher, a healthy English teaching industry is VITAL for the future of Thailand, and as such concerns me greatly - I will admit the system has a loooong way to go. As such, my response to this post has to do with your comment. It is comments like this that drive me crazy. If you don't like it - leave, if you have a problem – go, if you want to complain about Thailand – get out. What a load of c**p. As long as people are working to improve the system in positive ways, what possible objection could you have? Qualified, motivated and properly compensated English teachers will only help the Thai people. Why bother to post such a comment, it does not add anything to the discussion?

[PeaceBlondie]

Thailand may decide, haphazardly, that it doesn't need English proficiency for the masses, only for the elite. After all, doesn't that agree with self-sufficiency? Isn't it nearly futile to try to get qualified teachers who will actually make more than 3% of Thai students reasonably fluent in English? Surely they don't want to be paying 35,000 baht every month to backpackers or semi-fluent Azerbajanis, and they don't want to pay 55,000 baht to fully qualified BA's and BS, native speaking, well behaved, competent teachers.

To the extent that it's all a circus charade, they don't need or want good EFL teachers, and they won't get them. The few schools who really want good teachers, may get a few good ones.

[phosamton]

"Steven"

i never compared myself to the real teachers at the international schools. I believe if todays tefl teachers saw themsleves as english instructors for hire and went out and found privates to earn more money they would find themselves with alot of cash in their pockets.

actually, I work at a uni, 27k a month in bkk. I have lately been able to pick and choose freelance jobs, and am getting between 1000 and 1250 an hour. Last month I almost hit 80K (my highest monthly mark) between the various workshops and courses I was doing about the town. So, I have to agree fully with Steven...change your attitude. I got a CELTA, and never intended to do anything but be a language instructor.

I have to say I was pretty exhausted by month's end, and maybe won't continue to stretch myself that thin (to hit 78K again). Also, I'm lucky because my department knows the uni salary is too low, and therefore they don't keep me needlessly in the office (6 hours office time a week, plus 12 hours teaching), which allows me to find those higher paying jobs. Yeah, word of mouth gets you in the door. That's why hard work pays off.

[Ijustwannateach]

Phosamton, I'm afraid you are addressing the wrong person. The message you quoted is Garro's.

"S"

[phosamton]

Phosamton, I'm afraid you are addressing the wrong person. The message you quoted is Garro's.

"S"

Sorry about that.

Might as well add I am on the side of the teachers in this debate. I know many teachers who are good at what they do, but don't have the proper qualifications. But looking at the bigger picture...I've only been here 3.5 years, but it seems the powers that be in these places like the MOE only learn from their mistakes. Unfortunately, those lessons are at the expense of the citizens, or even people who honestly are trying to carve an existence for themselves here. better for us foreignors not to take it too personally. It may take a year, it may take five or more, but eventually they will realize they have to make concessions if they hope to fill their positions, and these things will become lax again.

Incidentally, I taught at a workshop for Thai prathom English teachers in BKK last month, and they told me that the BMA is requiring every school in the city/province to hire at least one foreign English language instructor for the upcoming school year. Anybody hear anything about this? I find it difficult to believe they can achieve that goal in normal circumstances, let alone the current climate.

[mbkudu]

What is all the fuss about.

As far as I know there is no law forcing you to stay in Thailand teaching. If you don´t like the teaching conditions

you are free to leave the country. Remember you are a guest

worker in Thailand.

Although not a teacher, a healthy English teaching industry is VITAL for the future of Thailand, and as such concerns me greatly - I will admit the system has a loooong way to go. As such, my response to this post has to do with your comment. It is comments like this that drive me crazy. If you don't like it - leave, if you have a problem – go, if you want to complain about Thailand – get out. What a load of c**p. As long as people are working to improve the system in positive ways, what possible objection could you have? Qualified, motivated and properly compensated English teachers will only help the Thai people. Why bother to post such a comment, it does not add anything to the discussion?

I agree. The comment by Lennart2000 is a typical one that one sees posted in many discussions on many subjects. It is a weak cop out of a comment that has no place in any discussion where a solution to a problem is trying to be found.

[Jimjim]

I just perused the most popular teaching website in Thailand for jobs, you probably know the one. I'm not looking for a teaching job, but I saw about what seemed like half at about 30,000 baht. I actually saw several that were 40,000 and above. A few were 50,000 and one 60,000. So, as 40,000 seems pretty good a salary for teaching in Thailand, I suggest you all reach for the stars and go for those jobs. If you have one of those jobs, then no reason to complain about the cheap jobs. Just go for it, mates.

[Oakley]

I just perused the most popular teaching website in Thailand for jobs, you probably know the one. I'm not looking for a teaching job, but I saw about what seemed like half at about 30,000 baht. I actually saw several that were 40,000 and above. A few were 50,000 and one 60,000. So, as 40,000 seems pretty good a salary for teaching in Thailand, I suggest you all reach for the stars and go for those jobs. If you have one of those jobs, then no reason to complain about the cheap jobs. Just go for it, mates.

Many of the advertisers on 'the most popular teaching website in Thailand for jobs' are agencies supplying teachers to government and private schools. Unfortunately some of them like to exaggerate the salaries in their ads to draw people in. I've been to some interviews recently for these 40,000 baht jobs. The 40,000 only applies to BA ED qualified candidates which they don't tell you until you attend the interview. They are actually offering between 30,000 to 33,000 for applicants with any BA and little or no experience and up to 35,000 if you have at least a couple of years experience. Also a lot of the extra benefits they offer only apply if you complete your contract or pass a probation period which can be as long as 4 months. Also they won't apply for a work permit for you until you pass that probation period. The 50,000 - 60,000 jobs require high qualifications which most here don't have. The salary you can expect for working say a 22 hour a week monday to friday high school job through a run of the mill agency such as Siam, ECC, BFITS, Elite, LPS etc is 30,000 - 35,000.

[PeaceBlondie]

I answered an ad from that website, for hourly wages in Chiang Mai at 500 baht, which is well above the average. Early in the interview, the agency shill explained that was only for the Bangkok jobs, and proceeded to ask me to write 80 hours of lesson plans before I would be considered for the 300 baht per hour job. Caveat emptor. And, some employers will backtrack on the verbal promises made in the interview. Finally, some employers will violate the contracts. Or, never give you a copy of the contract!! Been there, done that.

[marquess]

In the 7 years that I have been here doing this, the wages have remained virtually static, but the cost of living has not, in truth teaching here is becoming less and less attractive. Unfortunately I can't see wages increasing any time soon! There are some lovely jobs that can be had by word of mouth, perhaps paying over 60k sometimes, but they are rare, and even 60k isn't that much either.!

[engrin]

Get everything in writing, email. When employers call me, I get all the information on the phone. I then say, "Can you email me all the details pay, schedule, etc" This way I have a written copy and there is no problems with communication. Check all details from email before going in for interview. Make sure contract follows what was discussed on phone and email.

If pay isn't where I want it. Ask for more. Highlight qualifications and experience. If they say "no", then say sorry but I was getting paid that amount at my old job. If they still say "no", forget them. Fortunately, I am not absolutely desperate for money..

It's up to us the teachers to grow the salaries. I doubt the Thais are going to sit down and say, "We've been paying our farangs XXXX for the last 5 years, it's time they got a raise."

The victim attitude of the farang teachers here is not helping wages.

[Loaded]

The victim attitude of the farang teachers here is not helping wages.

True. There's a big shortage of teachers in Thailand - THEY need us!

[aussiestyle1983]

The victim attitude of the farang teachers here is not helping wages.

True. There's a big shortage of teachers in Thailand - THEY need us!

The shortage will only grow..................

[engrin]

^^^^

And we need their money. A match made in heaven.

For teachers it should be about the money first, education second. Same as the Thais are running it.

Prosperity. Not just Survival.

[Jimjim]

Don't go through agencies, in my opinion. They will just take money you deserve.

[PeaceBlondie]

Folks, today is the 4th of May, and school starts next week (for teachers at most schools). I just reviewed a number of provinces on the ajarn.com jobs board, and many of them come up EMPTY, as in vacant, null and void. MaeHongSon, Chiang Rai, Lamphun, even Pitsanalouk for Pete's sake. And the few northern provinces that have any listings at all, like Chiang Mai and Lampang, haven't had any new postings since April 30 or April 25. Good grief, you can find an English teacher on almost any corner in Chiang Mai, and there are virtually no ads.

Maybe Bangkok is full of job openings at over 35,000 baht, but it ought to be. In spite of what some cocky Bangkokians would have you believe, Thailand is not just Bangkok.

Perhaps the agencies not only have most of the openings, but aren't even bothering to list them on a jobs board! Perhaps the Thai teachers just got back from Songkran, and they have good intentions to post something later this month, Buddha willing and the creek don't rise. However, the creek is rising, and those administrators may find themselves up the creek without a paddle.

[colino]

I have just started my 2nd term with the same school and agency,,my wage is ok and what some people over look is you get your hourly rate from the agency,,, but you can make your money up by teaching extra lessons ,, with students who's parents are willing to pay up to 300baht i do this twice a week with a max of 4 students in any one class ,, so this bumps my money up another 6000baht a month, my agency has no problem with this as long as it doesnt get in the way of my job ,,, also the school lets me use my class room (very handy)

[PeaceBlondie]

I have just started my 2nd term with the same school and agency,,my wage is ok and what some people over look is you get your hourly rate from the agency,,, but you can make your money up by teaching extra lessons ,, with students who's parents are willing to pay up to 300baht i do this twice a week with a max of 4 students in any one class ,, so this bumps my money up another 6000baht a month, my agency has no problem with this as long as it doesnt get in the way of my job ,,, also the school lets me use my class room (very handy)

That's fine, since you're still working/teaching at the same location listed on your work permit (assuming you're legally assigned to that location). But, most teachers do private lessons at the students' homes or at their own homes - which is almost surely illegal. If that really matters (and to me, it does matter).

[colino]

Hi peaceblondie

well pointed out yes i do after hours at my school so to be 100% legal sorry i forgot to put that in ,,

[BlackArtemis]

It seems a starting of 20k and 22k after probation is common in CM Govt. schools. Personally I chose to teach in these schools rather than at the private (Prince, Dara, Montfort etc) Some of these schools only pay marginally better, but require you to come in on weekends and perform other tasks. Some pay quite a bit more, but stories I have heard made me decide the headache isn't worth the extra 7-9k a month. I find it easier to work at a Govt. school and make up the difference with tutoring classes. Tutoring IMHO is the money maker when it comes to teaching English in Thailand.

[PeaceBlondie]

I'm amazed. Today is the 8th of May, and school starts very soon. Some schools already have their teachers on campus, preparing for the new year. Okay, so northern Thailand isn't all of the country either, but still four days further along, there are no new postings for the northern provinces. And what there previously was, was nothing to write home about ("Hey Mom, I'm in Thailand and I have the BA you paid for, and the TEFL I paid for, and I still can't make $880 per month in spite of the currency ratio, even if I take a hard job in a crappy school!!").

Parents, when you drop your kids off for their third day of school, hang around and see if there are any teachers.

[Luckydog]

All jobs in Thailand including teaching industry are at an all time low. Most of my friends that are/were teachers are and have called it a day. Even tomorrow a university English teacher friend that lives around the corner returns home. Others not getting contract renewals. I also see only a few familiar faces ( all industries) hanging on at some bars I frequent. 20-30K in Bangkok will not work for long.

Hope the conditions and reputation improve for the industry.

Yep. A DAY!