Trump says he will suspend all immigration into U.S. over coronavirus

[JackThompson]

40 minutes ago, mlmcleod said:

Finally, Trump has his way!  This has been his number 1 priority since the day he took office.  Next he will deport all of the unworthies!

 

The USA will become a whites only nation!

African-Americans have been in the USA longer than many of European extraction.  They aren't going anywhere, since Lincoln's "send them back" plan was interrupted with his untimely death.  As well, many citizens of Mexico became American Citizens when the Treaty of Guadalupe Hildago annexed parts of former-Mexico into the USA.  Therefore, the idea that MAGA means "make white again" is historically-incorrect - just a smear-tactic.

 

The notion that Trump voters - many who were 2x Obama voters - are "racist" is a rhetorical-trick to use left-cover to advance a very anti-left agenda.  It is used by those wittingly or unwittingly supporting transnational-corporations getting access to low-wage labor.  They use it to attack anyone who opposes their cheap-labor agenda, which relies on flooding the labor-market. 

 

That said, are there some Trump-voters who are racist?  Sure - and that's terrible.  But there are not a fraction as many of those, as the hard-core, anti-European-racist anti-Trump voters, who have laws on-the-books, and policies in place at major institutions (like universities) and businesses, to enforce their discriminatory practices.  Asian-Americans are the hardest-hit on university-admissions - punished for being "too high achieving" per-capita.

 

The quantity and power-differential between these two groups of racists is not even close.   We need to focus on the ones with power and numbers, not some scattered internet memers - many of whom are Repeatedly Caught in false-flag "hate crimes", to create the illusion of a "big problem" that barely exists in modern America (web-search: "fake hate crimes" on duckduckgo). 

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, Tongjaw said:

There are plenty of skilled Ozzy workers sitting at home whilst oil companies continue to bring in workers via loopholes from US, UK NZ, Norway. They also allow citizens from Thailand, Philippines into work through agents etc who get paid low wages. 

I get the low-wage worker part of the equation. But why do those companies want to hire US, UK, workers instead of trained-Australians?  Is there a tax-advantage, or something?

[earlinclaifornia]

7 hours ago, Cryingdick said:

 

I guess I am just happy that all of the previous talk of open borders has now been completely rejected hopefully forever. 

I have asked this question so, so, so many times and never, never, had any response. Your post said "talk of open borders". I always ask who ever in America has professed that, verifiable?

[sirineou]

 The economic problems are a function of the lockdown , how would suspending immigration change that? The suspension of Immigration is simply more lockdown.   People immigrating to the US need a medical certificate, why not simply include Covid 19 in the certificate?

I will tell you why not, because this just another distraction by trump. Instead of giving us solutions, with every issue trump gives us distractions.  

[Rimmer]

An abusive post has been removed

[RANGER55]

6 hours ago, stevenl said:

"the WHO said on January 24th that corona could not be transmitted from person to person."

 

Not true, please provide the WHO quote in full and you'll see your presumption is incorrect.

January 14 – The WHO tweets saying there is ‘no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission in China’, though later clarifies and says there may have been limited transmission via family members. All the statements put out by the WHO.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8220887/China-concealed-coronavirus-trying-evade-blame-says-ex-MI6-chief-John-Sawers.html#comments

[sirineou]

27 minutes ago, sirineou said:

 The economic problems are a function of the lockdown , how would suspending immigration change that? The suspension of Immigration is simply more lockdown.   People immigrating to the US need a medical certificate, why not simply include Covid 19 in the certificate?

I will tell you why not, because this just another distraction by trump. Instead of giving us solutions, with every issue trump gives us distractions.  

Are we not sick of this???  Think about it . take an issue ,  any issue. Immigration, balance of trade, medical insurance, nuclear proliferation, global warming  etc.

No solutions just distractions. Four years of just talking about c*rap.  No close to solving any of the above, just outrageous statements reactions , conversations rallies, and BS

Are you not sick of this??? 

[earlinclaifornia]

Crying and Jack you both think American workers will take over the San Joaquin farming jobs? Having lived close by for 50 years there, in High Tech industry I honestly am laughing my butt off. I could be wrong and in six months from now we will see. Right before that election too.

Edited April 22, 2020 by earlinclaifornia
spelling

[Odysseus123]

13 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Are we not sick of this???  Think about it . take an issue ,  any issue. Immigration, balance of trade, medical insurance, nuclear proliferation, global warming  etc.

No solutions just distractions. Four years of just talking about c*rap.  No close to solving any of the above, just outrageous statements reactions , conversations rallies, and BS

Are you not sick of this??? 

"Are you not sick of this??? "

 

Sirenou-blame it on R.Descartes whose famous aphorism "I tweet therefore I am" has enabled Zuckerberg to make a fortune and hypnotized a large part of humankind....we have become "talking heads"...

[stevenl]

53 minutes ago, RANGER55 said:

January 14 – The WHO tweets saying there is ‘no clear evidence of human-to-human transmission in China’, though later clarifies and says there may have been limited transmission via family members. All the statements put out by the WHO.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8220887/China-concealed-coronavirus-trying-evade-blame-says-ex-MI6-chief-John-Sawers.html#comments

Exactly. That statement, or even better those statements, clearly differ from yours, and others', 'WHO said no transmission possible from human to human'.

Edited April 22, 2020 by stevenl

[Skeptic7]

12 hours ago, Slip said:

Let us hope that the rest of the world immediately responds in kind.

 

11 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

NZ banned all but returning Kiwis a while back.

 

As for the US, better late than never.

And so did Thailand. Only returning Thais and foreigners with work permits. Trump's order will include exceptions such as permanent residents, green card holders, etc. 

[Upstate]

10 hours ago, AussieBob18 said:

You misunderstand the quote and who wrote it.  ????

 

You are taking the 'liberal view' that Trump is bad and is racist and is a nazi - and I know you will not change that view.

 

But I take the view that Trump is a rude arrogant New York billionaire who's heart is in the right place, and who is trying to do the right thing for most Americans.  I take the view that what he has been saying for decades, and what he said to get elected, and what he is doing as POTUS, is what is the right thing to do for most Americans.  I take the view that he is definitely 'clumsy' and not an experienced smooth-talking deceitful two-faced politician. And I take the view that is why he was elected and will be re-elected. I take the view that Trump is fighting against the grain and going against decades of liberal left-wing doctrine that has infested western societies - and they hate him for that.  I take the view that he is doing his best and that a weaker man would have succumbed to all the hatred and abuse by now. But I also take the view that he has done that, because he is a rude arrogant New York billionaire (water off a duck's back) - and I take the view that he is 'immune' to liberal hate.

Very well said sir,the lefties will be spitting nails.

[AussieBob18]

52 minutes ago, Upstate said:

Very well said sir,the lefties will be spitting nails.

I just heard a rumour going round the White House that will make them spit bricks next - it is of course as credible as any CNN anti-Trump story.   Trump has said to someone that after he is re-elected on his last day on office, before the new POTUS is sworn in, he is going to put on a dress and makeup and 'identify' as a woman.  He will then not only be the best POTUS since Reagan, he will also be the first woman POTUS.  Brilliant !! 

 

Apparently he was asked what if the next POTUS is a woman. The un-named source said he replied: 'if it is a GOP woman then I will refrain, and I will think of something else' to leave them screaming'.  Apparently he then said: 'the day I started they were screaming - and I am going to make them scream again on my last'.  

 

Now I do have something in common with a liberal Trump hater - we are both looking forward to his last day in office ????

 

Edited April 22, 2020 by AussieBob18

[Throatwobbler]

Just a typical Trump distraction to hide his own failings. And the morons keep on cheering.

[Upstate]

20 minutes ago, AussieBob18 said:

I just heard a rumour going round the White House that will make them spit bricks next - it is of course as credible as any CNN anti-Trump story.   Trump has said to someone that after he is re-elected on his last day on office, before the new POTUS is sworn in, he is going to put on a dress and makeup and 'identify' as a woman.  He will then not only be the best POTUS since Reagan, he will also be the first woman POTUS.  Brilliant !! 

 

Apparently he was asked what if the next POTUS is a woman. The un-named source said he replied: 'if it is a GOP woman then I will refrain, and I will think of something else' to leave them screaming'.  Apparently he then said: 'the day I started they were screaming - and I am going to make them scream again on my last'.  

 

Now I do have something in common with a liberal Trump hater - we are both looking forward to his last day in office ????

 

They fall for it hook,line and sinker every time and he keeps on reeling them in.The faux outrage is hilarious to watch.

[JackThompson]

7 hours ago, earlinclaifornia said:

I have asked this question so, so, so many times and never, never, had any response. Your post said "talk of open borders". I always ask who ever in America has professed that, verifiable?

If the policies being advocated are that doing anything to stop illegal immigration (like a wall) is immoral - and anyone in the country illegally can stay, get a drivers-license, open a bank-acct, get "free" healthcare citizens don't get, and take a job from a citizen, and get a "pathway to citizenship" without even going back home to apply - what else does one call that, other than "open borders"?

 

6 hours ago, earlinclaifornia said:

Crying and Jack you both think American workers will take over the San Joaquin farming jobs? Having lived close by for 50 years there, in High Tech industry I honestly am laughing my butt off. I could be wrong and in six months from now we will see. Right before that election too.

I guess you were not among the tens of thousands who contacted John McCain, to take him up on his lettuce-picking gig?  I was - had just lost my career to illegal aliens in a skilled-trade.  I never heard back from him - nor did the thousands of others. 

 

Having sold everything I owned to pay for trade-school, it was not a happy-time when, early in my first year in the field, I was Replaced by someone offering to work for less than 1/2 of what citizens were being paid. 

 

McCain offered $50/hr - but I offered to do it for $17 ($22/hr in today's dollars) - a bit less than the starting-wage of grads for several years prior to the start of illegal-hiring. 

 

Sadly, Trump excluded ALL work-visas, so Americans are still (bleeped).  What a lowlife sellout he is.  Wish there was a better alternative.

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, Cryingdick said:

NYC will never recover to what it was. Nor will London for that matter.

No tears from me if London goes down the gurgler. Full of trendy people getting rich moving money around sitting in pavement cafes drinking wine that cost more than what I earned in an entire day of hard graft doing a real job.

[earlinclaifornia]

8 hours ago, JackThompson said:

If the policies being advocated are that doing anything to stop illegal immigration (like a wall) is immoral - and anyone in the country illegally can stay, get a drivers-license, open a bank-acct, get "free" healthcare citizens don't get, and take a job from a citizen, and get a "pathway to citizenship" without even going back home to apply - what else does one call that, other than "open borders"?

 

I guess you were not among the tens of thousands who contacted John McCain, to take him up on his lettuce-picking gig?  I was - had just lost my career to illegal aliens in a skilled-trade.  I never heard back from him - nor did the thousands of others. 

 

Having sold everything I owned to pay for trade-school, it was not a happy-time when, early in my first year in the field, I was Replaced by someone offering to work for less than 1/2 of what citizens were being paid. 

 

McCain offered $50/hr - but I offered to do it for $17 ($22/hr in today's dollars) - a bit less than the starting-wage of grads for several years prior to the start of illegal-hiring. 

 

Sadly, Trump excluded ALL work-visas, so Americans are still (bleeped).  What a lowlife sellout he is.  Wish there was a better alternative.

Thanks for admitting as so many others have refused. Your opinion is Open Borders.

[earlinclaifornia]

Just now, earlinclaifornia said:

Thanks for admitting as so many others have refused. Your opinion is Open Borders.

I tried and failed to pick I did however work a entire Summer as the one who verified the pickers completions

[frenetic]

On 4/22/2020 at 10:22 AM, jimmybcool said:

That comment as well as this one from the article:

 

""The move, which the Republican president announced on Twitter, effectively achieves a long-term Trump policy goal to curb immigration, making use of the health and economic crisis that has swept the country as a result of the pandemic to do so.""

 

Both imply something that isn't factual.  The implication is Trump does not want any immigration to the USA.  What Trump advocated, and many Americans supported, was an end to ILLEGAL immigration.  Pretty sure most nations have the same goal in mind and work to prevent people ignoring their borders and walking in.  I've no idea your nationality but I assume if 20,000,000 people were living in your country and driving down wages for manual labor you might be peeved as well.  

 

Legal immigration has never been an issue with most in the USA.  Controlled legal immigration.  Including Trump who is married to a legal immigrant.  

 

A major part of the surprise win by Trump in 2016 that the DEMs didn't understand was that blue collar workers understand on a basic level that they can't demand higher wages when someone there illegally will do the work for less.  Mind you there are alternatives to a wall to achieve control of illegal immigration.  For one - seriously crack down on any business that employs illegals.  If the jobs aren't here they will stop coming.  It has surprised me that hasn't been part of his effort.  But then maybe he likes the issue and will run on it again.

 

The only people who tout that 20,000,000 figure are organizations like Fair that have a tarnished history. Most experts say the number is more like 11,000,00

And there is another way to raise wages for blue collar workers. Support a rise in the minimum wage. Something Trump opposes.

Seriously, you're surprised that Trump hasn't been cracking down on business that hire illegals? You do understand that the Trump organization has been hiring illegal immigrants for most of its history or did you miss reports about repeated expulsions of said persons from his organization? And you really think that the agricultural industry that has been so supportive of Trump will be pleased if he cracks down on their work force?

And while he does support restrictions on legal immigration such as the H1B program, Trump is fine with the H2B program. You know, the one that lets his hotels and resorts hire workers from Central America at very low wages. In fact, it has expanded greatly during his tenure.  What's more, unlike American workers, these foreign workers can't quit their jobs and look elsewhere for work. Nice to have a captive work fore.

 

Edited April 25, 2020 by frenetic

[jimmybcool]

9 minutes ago, frenetic said:

The only people who tout that 20,000,000 figure are organizations like Fair that have a tarnished history. Most experts say the number is more like 11,000,00

And there is another way to raise wages for blue collar workers. Support a rise in the minimum wage. Something Trump opposes.

Seriously, you're surprised that Trump hasn't been cracking down on business that hire illegals? You do understand that the Trump organization has been hiring illegal immigrants for most of its history or did you miss reports about repeated expulsions of said persons from his organization? And you really think that the agricultural industry that has been so supportive of Trump will be pleased if he cracks down on their work force?

And while he does support restrictions on legal immigration such as the H1B program, Trump is fine with the H2B program. You know, the one that lets his hotels and resorts hire workers from Central America at very low wages. In fact, it has expanded greatly during his tenure.  What's more, unlike American workers, these foreign workers can't quit their jobs and look elsewhere for work. Nice to have a captive work fore.

 

OK whatever the number is I have not researched that.  My bad.  The point was valid.  Blue collar workers see their work valued less because of illegals willing to do it for less.

 

And the minimum wage topic is a lengthy discussion in itself.  It won't really work IMO but I don't care to have that long discussion as I am off to golf in 30 minutes.  

 

I have never absolved Trump of anything regarding what he does.  I am merely pointing out to someone why blue collar workers voted for Trump.  Regardless of if one buys into  the idea he is fixing the problem he campaigned on restoring the value of blue collar labor.  That is the premise behind his MAGA slogan.  They bought it and voted for it.  Believing that they won't again might be whistling past the graveyard by DEMs.  I do not think DEMs in general are in touch with middle America.  It may cost them yet another presidential election.  Although screwing Bernie again was the right decision.  He really doesn't resonate with blue collar labor.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[frenetic]

43 minutes ago, jimmybcool said:

OK whatever the number is I have not researched that.  My bad.  The point was valid.  Blue collar workers see their work valued less because of illegals willing to do it for less.

 

And the minimum wage topic is a lengthy discussion in itself.  It won't really work IMO but I don't care to have that long discussion as I am off to golf in 30 minutes.  

 

I have never absolved Trump of anything regarding what he does.  I am merely pointing out to someone why blue collar workers voted for Trump.  Regardless of if one buys into  the idea he is fixing the problem he campaigned on restoring the value of blue collar labor.  That is the premise behind his MAGA slogan.  They bought it and voted for it.  Believing that they won't again might be whistling past the graveyard by DEMs.  I do not think DEMs in general are in touch with middle America.  It may cost them yet another presidential election.  Although screwing Bernie again was the right decision.  He really doesn't resonate with blue collar labor.

All Trump has to do to solve the illegal worker problem is to crack down on employers. Something he's not going to do.

The minimum wage increases voted on by many states, including red states, are already making a difference. About 1/3 of the wage increases gained by non supervisory workers is due to increases in the minimum wage.

And health care is going to be a huge issue for the Democrats just as it was in2018,

I don't know what you mean by "middle America" But if it's the suburbs you're referring to, they swung massively to the Democrats in the 2018 midterms. The issues that made for that change are still going to be present in the 2020 elections.

[thaibeachlovers]

4 hours ago, jimmybcool said:

That is the premise behind his MAGA slogan.  They bought it and voted for it.  Believing that they won't again might be whistling past the graveyard by DEMs.  I do not think DEMs in general are in touch with middle America.  It may cost them yet another presidential election.

You nailed it.

They still haven't addressed that problem by modifying their pro immigration for all druthers.

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, frenetic said:

And health care is going to be a huge issue for the Democrats just as it was in2018,

So long as they allow insurance companies to "rule the roost" they are not going to make much difference. The ACA was not, far as I can see "affordable".

Some version of the UK NHS is the best, as long as they solve the management problem.

Edited April 25, 2020 by thaibeachlovers

[simple1]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You nailed it.

They still haven't addressed that problem by modifying their pro immigration for all druthers.

Why not check current Dems policy rather than posting misinformation.

 

https://democrats.org/where-we-stand/the-issues/immigration-reform/

 

 

Edited April 26, 2020 by simple1

[jimmybcool]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

So long as they allow insurance companies to "rule the roost" they are not going to make much difference. The ACA was not, far as I can see "affordable".

Some version of the UK NHS is the best, as long as they solve the management problem.

My sister is a dyed in the wool Democrat and overall pretty smart person.  When the ACA was passed she was disappointed in it.  I of course simply opposed handing over that large a part of our economy on principle as a libertarian/conservative so didn't examine it in detail.  She did.  She said it lacked a significant factor.  Cost controls.  As it turns out she was right.

 

As a realist, which despite some true believers thinking I am not, I see no going back to a pure capitalist system of medicine.  It simply will not happen.  So the DEMs achieved their long term goal of controlling medicine with the ACA.  Now someone needs to fix it.  I recall Trump saying he would fix it but no sign of that yet.

 

Since we will not be going backwards the only system I see that offers cost controls and medical limits is Medicare.  It serves millions of Americans today and is fairly well run.  Provided it is limited in services as it is now, and force people to purchase ancillary insurance for services not provided, it is likely the best answer for the country.  Even then it will be expensive and with the current $24 trillion I'm not sure how much longer our government remains solvent.  Sure looks like the piper wants to be paid and it will hurt when suddenly federal services are cut to match true revenue.  

[Mama Noodle]

4 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Why not check current Dems policy rather than posting misinformation.

 

There was no 'policy' in that link at all. 

 

Once the left figures out their message and differentiates between illegal aliens and legal immigrants then we can talk. 

[Mama Noodle]

7 hours ago, frenetic said:

The only people who tout that 20,000,000 figure are organizations like Fair that have a tarnished history. Most experts say the number is more like 11,000,00

And there is another way to raise wages for blue collar workers. Support a rise in the minimum wage. Something Trump opposes.

Seriously, you're surprised that Trump hasn't been cracking down on business that hire illegals? You do understand that the Trump organization has been hiring illegal immigrants for most of its history or did you miss reports about repeated expulsions of said persons from his organization? And you really think that the agricultural industry that has been so supportive of Trump will be pleased if he cracks down on their work force?

And while he does support restrictions on legal immigration such as the H1B program, Trump is fine with the H2B program. You know, the one that lets his hotels and resorts hire workers from Central America at very low wages. In fact, it has expanded greatly during his tenure.  What's more, unlike American workers, these foreign workers can't quit their jobs and look elsewhere for work. Nice to have a captive work fore.

 

Several problems in this post, most of which derive from being half-truths and lack context, some are correct.

 

Now with that said, lets say everything in this post is true. Trump is STILL way more firm on immigration than any other democrat by a large margin so it doesn't make any sense to try and show how 'trump is failing'. 

 

Im 100% onboard with putting every illegal alien on a boat and shipping them off back where they came from and completely ending the importation of workforce unless it can be proven that they are subject matter experts that are difficult to find locally. 

 

That said, just because Trump isn't as firm as I want, does not mean that Im gonna vote for a Democrat next round who is exponentially weaker and I think most people think the same way. 

[simple1]

21 minutes ago, Mama Noodle said:

 

There was no 'policy' in that link at all. 

 

Once the left figures out their message and differentiates between illegal aliens and legal immigrants then we can talk. 

it's the Democrat National Committee statement providing policy outline. When I previously provided a direct link to Biden's policy position it was deleted by a Mod so go look it up yourself. Also there is an article with Reuters which talks to the differences between trump and Biden on immigration policy.

 

No point in 'talking', we have opposing POVs.  The bottom line is I believe trump is completely unsuitable as President of the USA, whilst you're a fervent supporter of trump. 

Edited April 26, 2020 by simple1

[Mama Noodle]

12 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Also there is an article with Reuters which talks to the differences between trump and Biden on immigration policy.

 

Really shouldn't be any difference in immigration policy at all considering illegal aliens are breaking the laws of the USA by being here. How that can be interpreted differently from person to person and party to party is beyond me.