Second year of an O-A visa

[claynlr]

I was issued an O-A visa from Chicago consulate “valid from” 24 JUN 2019 and “valid until” 23 JUN 2020. I entered Thailand on 6 JUL 2019 with “admitted until” 04 JUL 2020. What would be the date to leave and return to get almost another year out of my O-A? ( if the borders are open!)

[ubonjoe]

You have to enter Thailand on or before June 23rd to get another 1 year entry from your visa.

[claynlr]

Thanks Joe!

[Peter Denis]

I am in almost same situation as yourself. 

I entered Thailand with a Non Imm O-A Visa valid till 16 June 2020.

But I made a trip to Cambodia end of January and re-entered Thailand on that Non Imm O-A Visa and was provided once again a 1-year permission to stay till 29 January 2021.

Obviously I'd like to have the opportunity to do a border-run just before my Visa validity expires (16 June 2020), as that would provide me once again with a full-year permission to stay (till June 2021).  However, it looks with present border-situation that that will probably not be possible, and that I will lose the 4.5 months extra permission to stay that would provide me.

Since your permission to stay expires 4 July 2020 you are even less lucky, as it looks that you will probably lose the full 2nd year a border-run before 23th of June would provide you.

But at least till 31 July you will be covered by the Amnesty.

However, if you intend to stay long-term in Thailand it would be wise to already open a personal thai bank-account, and ensure that by end of May you either transfer 800K to that bank-account or start doing monthly transfers of 65K (with foreign origins proven). 

If the Amnesty is lifted end of July (and not extended), you would then be ready to apply for a 1-year extension of your present Non Imm O-A Visa at your local IO.  A first application for such  extension requires the seasoning of the money-in-bank funds for 2 months, or at least 2 monthly transfers of 65K.

Be aware that the 1-year extension of your Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement also requires a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy.

 

[PumpkinEater]

Hey Peter,

I thought IF you get the extension to a Retirement within Thailand that the Insurance is not required...?

Only if you apply for a new OA From out of country you need the Insurance requirement...

Cheers

[flexomike]

2 minutes ago, PumpkinEater said:

Hey Peter,

I thought IF you get the extension to a Retirement within Thailand that the Insurance is not required...?

Only if you apply for a new OA From out of country you need the Insurance requirement...

Cheers

If you are getting an extension of stay for an OA visa, you will be required to have insurance, if you are on an O visa for retirement, it is not required

[Peter Denis]

30 minutes ago, PumpkinEater said:

Hey Peter,

I thought IF you get the extension to a Retirement within Thailand that the Insurance is not required...?

Only if you apply for a new OA From out of country you need the Insurance requirement...

Cheers

Hi PumpkinEater,
As Flexomike already indicated, a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy IS required when you apply at your local IO for a 1-year extension based on your Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

In case you are interested in ways to avoid this thai IO-approved health-insurance scam, I did PM you a comprehensive guideline document outlining all options/details to convert to or apply for a Non Imm O - retirement Visa and subsequent extensions.  The requirements for a 1-year extension of such Non Imm O - retirement Visa are identical with those for a 1-year extension based on an original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement, but the extension for a Non Imm O - retirement Visa does NOT require the thai IO-approved health-insurance.

To access your PM-messages just click the letter-icon next to your profile when logged-in to the Forum.

[Tasmania Terror]

Hi Peter Denis

 

I noticed your answer to PumpkinEater and saw that you had some specific and comprehensive guidelines for converting an O-A to an O Visa.  I need to do just that for a retirement extension that ends on July 10th.  I've been here almost 18 years on this annual extension and never realized that

was an O-A rather than an O until just recently when I obtained a new passport and went to the Immigration office to have the old visa placed in the new passport.   No one had ever mentioned IO-approved insurance at any of the extensions, including last year.  Would appreciate very much your sending a PM with that information.  Super Thanks in advance

[DrJack54]

Perfect time for guys with original non O-A

Doing extensions based on retirement to phis it off and exit/re-enter with visa exempt and obtain non O at immigration.

Of course that all depends on imm restrictions at borders etc.

[DrJack54]

Just now, Tasmania Terror said:

Hi Peter Denis

 

I noticed your answer to PumpkinEater and saw that you had some specific and comprehensive guidelines for converting an O-A to an O Visa.  I need to do just that for a retirement extension that ends on July 10th.  I've been here almost 18 years on this annual extension and never realized that

was an O-A rather than an O until just recently when I obtained a new passport and went to the Immigration office to have the old visa placed in the new passport.   No one had ever mentioned IO-approved insurance at any of the extensions, including last year.  Would appreciate very much your sending a PM with that information.  Super Thanks in advance

@Peter Denis

[Peter Denis]

11 hours ago, Tasmania Terror said:

..

No one had ever mentioned IO-approved insurance at any of the extensions, including last year.  Would appreciate very much your sending a PM with that information. 

...

Done, and you are welcome!

[Dene16]

I did my extension of stay in January of this year (800k in bank method) no mention of insurance was mentioned or asked by immigration. Am i missing something or has everything changed in the last couple of months? 

[Peter Denis]

2 minutes ago, Dene16 said:

I did my extension of stay in January of this year (800k in bank method) no mention of insurance was mentioned or asked by immigration. Am i missing something or has everything changed in the last couple of months? 

Thai IO-approved health-insurance is only required when applying for a 1-year extension based on your original Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement.

[PumpkinEater]

GREAT INFO guys...Thanks!

[oldcpu]

On 4/26/2020 at 8:39 PM, Tasmania Terror said:

I noticed your answer to PumpkinEater and saw that you had some specific and comprehensive guidelines for converting an O-A to an O Visa.  I need to do just that for a retirement extension that ends on July 10th.  I've been here almost 18 years on this annual extension and never realized that was an O-A rather than an O until just recently when I obtained a new passport and went to the Immigration office to have the old visa placed in the new passport.   No one had ever mentioned IO-approved insurance at any of the extensions, including last year. 

Note that it may be possible, if you are married with a Thai spouse, to change the basis of your (Type-OA visa) 1-year extension to a one year extension based on "Marriage" instead of the past based on "Retirement".  In this case, you won't have to leave the country and return (on a new Visa).  The financial requirements will be different (less) than that for an extension based on retirement.  However from what I have read there will be a lot more paper work required to prove you are married / still-married if applying for an Extension based on "Marriage".  One important aspect, is in the case of the 1-year extension based on "Marriage", there is no health insurance proof requirement.  

 

Of course if you are not married with a Thai spouse, or if you prefer not to apply for a 1-year extension based on marriage, then Peter Denis has been very helpful with the Type-O retirement visa approach details (which requires one on a Type-OA to leave Thailand and then return to Thailand (possibly on Tourist exempt or Tourist visa), and then after returning to Thailand immediately apply for the Type-O visa, followed later by applying for the 1-year extension based on retirement). 

 

Fortunately the current amnesty to 31-July takes the pressure off here wrt timing / planning this.

Edited April 28, 2020 by oldcpu

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, oldcpu said:

However from what I have read there will be a lot more paper work required to prove you are married / still-married if applying for an Extension based on "Marriage". 

The 'lots' of extra documents required for a marriage extension, which appears a real burden for some, is as follows;

1. Marriage certificate

2. 4/5 photos taken at home. (I print 2 per A4 sheet)

3. Updated Kor Ror 2 (Marriage registration from any Amphoe)

4. The wife must attend.

 

1 and 2, I do at home.

3. The wife gets the updated Kor Ror 2, whilst I visit the bank for the financial evidence.

4. We meet at the Immigration office.

 

The negatives;

Marriage extensions aren't issued same day, but some 30 days later, so 2 visits to the IO, but the wife doesn't have to attend to collect the extension stamp.

 

The positives;

If using the 400K, you can withdraw and spend the lot after the extension is granted, just top up to 400K again 2 months before the next application.

 

A further benefit to a marriage extension is that you have the right to work, just need the Work Permit.

Edited April 28, 2020 by Tanoshi

[michel7752]

From what I understand, there are two possibilities for a one year retirement extension at the Thai IO:

1. Based on a 3 moth non O visa. No health insurance will be requested.

2. Based on a 12 month non O-A visa. You have to provide proof of insurance.

 

Both initial visas can be obtained at the Thai Embassy in Switzerland. The requirements and paperwork are exactly the same in both cases, and also the overall cost (considering the additional cost at Thai immigration for extending the O visa once in Thailand). The only - but substantial - difference is the additional request of proof of insurance which the Embassy requests for the non O-A visa.

 

Now my question: Why would somebody retire based on a non O-A visa when everything seems to be easier based on non O visa??? Am I missing something?

And can anybody explain to me the logic for requesting health insurance in one case but not in the other case?

 

(P.S. When Thailand opens again I will have to decide between the two visa. Are there any "hidden" advantages of the O-A visa which I do not realize and which make it worthwhile to go for it?)

[Peter Denis]

8 hours ago, michel7752 said:

Now my question: Why would somebody retire based on a non O-A visa when everything seems to be easier based on non O visa??? Am I missing something?

And can anybody explain to me the logic for requesting health insurance in one case but not in the other case?

When you apply for the Non Imm O-A Visa in your home-country, it provides you with a 1-year MultipleEntry permission to stay when entering Thailand.  When doing a border-run just before the 1-year Visa validity expires, you are once again stamped in for a 1-year permission to stay.

So when timed right the Non Imm O-A Visa will provide you with almost 2 years of IO-hassle free stay in Thailand (with no need to keep money in a thai bank-account).

Before Oct 31, 2019 applying for that Visa was a very good deal.  But with the additional requirement for an IO-approved health-insurance policy, the deal has become far less attractive.

It is still worth considering to apply for the Non Imm O-A Visa when you have international health-insurance or travel-insurance which will cover you when staying in Thailand, provided you can get your insurer to sign the Foreign Insurance Certificate stating that you have a policy which meets the 400K in-patient and 40K out-patient coverage. 

In that case you can even rinse-repeat and re-apply every year or 2nd year when you travel approx once a year to your home-country.  Alternatively, you can switch to a Non Imm O - retirement Visa when the permission to stay of your Non Imm O-A Visa is on the brink of expiry.

>> I PM-ed you a comprehensive guideline document outlining all details/options to apply for or convert to such a Non Imm O - retirement Visa.

In order to access your PM-messages just click the letter-icon next to your Profile when logged-in to the Forum.

 

 

Edited May 2, 2020 by Peter Denis

[Tanoshi]

10 hours ago, michel7752 said:

Now my question: Why would somebody retire based on a non O-A visa when everything seems to be easier based on non O visa??? Am I missing something?

Just to add to Peter's post above.

Every Thai Embassy/Consulate doesn't offer the same types of Visa, or the same requirements.

Unlike Switzerland some only offer the Non O if married/Thai family.

The Non O-A being the only option offered for the purpose of retirement.

 

10 hours ago, michel7752 said:

And can anybody explain to me the logic for requesting health insurance in one case but not in the other case?

The Non O-A is a 'long stay' type Visa, i.e allows a 1 year entry and the reason given at the time of introducing the compulsory Health Insurance was to bring it into line with the Non 0-X Visa, another 'long stay' type Visa which already required Health Insurance.

 

However, prior to the Health Insurance requirement for the Non O-A, Thai hospitals were crying 'foul' of foreigners not paying hospital bills. Whilst there was no evidence to support which group of foreigners were responsible.

Foreigners staying on annual extensions based on retirement at local Immigration offices have to provide proof of finances in a Thai bank.

Foreigners staying on Non O-A Visas, do not.

Similarly Tourists staying for shorter periods, do not.

To apply compulsory Health Insurance to Tourists could have had a catastrophic effect on their numbers.

The Non O-A therefore became the easy target, although there was little evidence to support the theory it was this group who were absconding without paying their medical bills.

 

The reasoning and logic behind some of Immigrations decisions can rarely be understood or explained.

Edited May 2, 2020 by Tanoshi

[JimGant]

On 4/28/2020 at 3:00 PM, Tanoshi said:

The 'lots' of extra documents required for a marriage extension, which appears a real burden for some, is as follows;

1. Marriage certificate

It gets a lot more complicated if your marriage certificate is a foreign one. First, you need to visit your embassy and get an affidavit as to the authenticity of your foreign marriage certificate. Then, the marriage certificate and affidavit need to be translated into Thai. Then, these documents need to be blessed by MFA, after which you can present them to your amphur to obtain your Kor Ror 22. But, some have posted that you need, in the case of a US citizen, a State Department confirmation of marriage. And, some amphurs require a certification of your passport. Yes, "lots" of extra documents; and as some wags have suggested, just get divorced and remarried in Thailand -- much less hassle.

Of course, after going through all of this, and finally getting your extension based on marriage -- your wife dies or splits. BEEEEP! Seven days to leave Thailand and re-address the situation. No, if somehow you're able to use retirement requirements for your extension, makes sense to do so.

 

Oh, yeah -- if somehow you wanted to got the Kor Ror 22 route for a marriage extension, you couldn't do so now, as your embassy/consulate is closed, thus no required affidavits possible.

Edited May 2, 2020 by JimGant

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Of course, after going through all of this, and finally getting your extension based on marriage -- your wife dies or splits. BEEEEP! Seven days to leave Thailand and re-address the situation.

In case of death the extension remains valid until it expires. If she leaves it would be about the same. If you divorce your wife it does end on the date of divorce but divorce does not happen quickly which would allow time to prepare the paperwork to apply for an extension based upon retirement.

[Tanoshi]

4 minutes ago, JimGant said:

It gets a lot more complicated if your marriage certificate is a foreign one. First, you need to visit your embassy and get an affidavit as to the authenticity of your foreign marriage certificate. Then, the marriage certificate and affidavit need to be translated into Thai. Then, these documents need to be blessed by MFA, after which you can present them to your amphur to obtain your Kor Ror 22. But, some have posted that you need, in the case of a US citizen, a State Department confirmation of marriage. And, some amphurs require a certification of your passport. Yes, "lots" of extra documents; and as some wags have suggested, just get divorced and remarried in Thailand -- much less hassle.

If you married in your home Country, if you'd done your research beforehand, you'd complete the legalisation process of your foreign marriage and registration, long before you apply for an extension based on marriage.

It's not as easy for certain nationalities as it is for US citizens.

 

8 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Of course, after going through all of this, and finally getting your extension based on marriage -- your wife dies or splits. BEEEEP! Seven days to leave Thailand and re-address the situation. No, if somehow you're able to use retirement requirements for your extension, makes sense to do so.

Totally wrong.

[JimGant]

21 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

If you married in your home Country, if you'd done your research beforehand, you'd complete the legalisation process of your foreign marriage and registration, long before you apply for an extension based on marriage.

Not if you had planned to extend on retirement requirements, if the financial addition of 400k wasn't too much of a burden. Some of us here on retirement extensions, because of the medical insurance requirement for renewed retirement O-A extensions, are now being faced with trying the marriage extension option -- and ambush we never saw coming. So, your "done your research beforehand" is nonsensical for this situation. Retirement extensions vs marriage extensions have long made more sense, unless you couldn't meet, or didn't want to meet, the financials.

 

And, yeah, as Joe says: The marriage extension doesn't end as fast as I indicated, should something happen to the marriage. Still, being settled into a retirement extension upfront, assuming the extra financial requirement isn't a factor, would seem a prudent decision.

Edited May 2, 2020 by JimGant

[Tanoshi]

3 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Retirement extensions vs marriage extensions have long made more sense, unless you couldn't meet the financials.

Nothing to do with financials. It's being on the correct extension for your purpose of stay in Thailand.

Nothing stopping you keeping the extra 400K in a fixed term account.

A marriage extension also has the advantage of taking up employment, with only the WP required.

[JimGant]

2 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

A marriage extension also has the advantage of taking up employment, with only the WP required.

Good point.

[sscc]

A simple question related to Non-O Retirement Visa. 

 

Is Non-O valid for one year or 3 months ?. 

How is the extension procedure, is it required to leave the Kingdom and come back in every year or every 3 months ?

 

 

 

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, sscc said:

A simple question related to Non-O Retirement Visa.

If you have a multiple entry non-o visa issued by an embassy or consulate it allows a unlimited 90 day entries for a year from the date of issue. If a single entry non-o visa it only allows one 90 day entry.

If you extend a 90 day entry from a non-o visa for one year based on retirement at a immigration office it allows you to stay for a year and you can apply for a new one year after year.

[Peter Denis]

10 minutes ago, sscc said:

A simple question related to Non-O Retirement Visa. 

 

Is Non-O valid for one year or 3 months ?. 

How is the extension procedure, is it required to leave the Kingdom and come back in every year or every 3 months ?

A 90-day SingleEntry Non Imm O Visa is void when used.

A 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa is valid for 1 year.

Both Non Imm O Visa provide you on entry with a 90-day permission to stay.

 

But the 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa, allows you during the 1-year Visa validity to exit and re-enter Thailand, and doing so you will then be stamped in once again for a 90-day permission to stay.  So when timed right such a 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa can provide you with almost 15+2 months of IO hassle free long-stay in Thailand.

 

Note 1: If married to a thai national you can instead of exiting the country when the 90-day permission to stay is due to expire, also apply for a 60-day extension at your local IO for reason of visiting your wife / dependant child.  Such 60-day extension can be done once per entry.

 

Note 2: Both the 90-day SingleEntry Non Imm O Visa and the 1-year Multiple Entry Non Imm O Visa, also allow you to apply for a 1-year extension of stay at your local IO.

When using the money-in-bank method, the required 800K (retirement) or 400K (marriage) need to be seasoned for 2 months (some IOs require 3 months) at the moment of application.

[Andre0720]

On ‎4‎/‎26‎/‎2020 at 3:59 PM, Peter Denis said:

I am in almost same situation as yourself. 

I entered Thailand with a Non Imm O-A Visa valid till 16 June 2020.

But I made a trip to Cambodia end of January and re-entered Thailand on that Non Imm O-A Visa and was provided once again a 1-year permission to stay till 29 January 2021.

Obviously I'd like to have the opportunity to do a border-run just before my Visa validity expires (16 June 2020), as that would provide me once again with a full-year permission to stay (till June 2021).  However, it looks with present border-situation that that will probably not be possible, and that I will lose the 4.5 months extra permission to stay that would provide me.

Since your permission to stay expires 4 July 2020 you are even less lucky, as it looks that you will probably lose the full 2nd year a border-run before 23th of June would provide you.

But at least till 31 July you will be covered by the Amnesty.

However, if you intend to stay long-term in Thailand it would be wise to already open a personal thai bank-account, and ensure that by end of May you either transfer 800K to that bank-account or start doing monthly transfers of 65K (with foreign origins proven). 

If the Amnesty is lifted end of July (and not extended), you would then be ready to apply for a 1-year extension of your present Non Imm O-A Visa at your local IO.  A first application for such  extension requires the seasoning of the money-in-bank funds for 2 months, or at least 2 monthly transfers of 65K.

Be aware that the 1-year extension of your Non Imm O-A Visa for reason of retirement also requires a thai IO-approved health-insurance policy.

 

I am also in that same situation, as I entered Thailand with a Non Imm O-A visa valid until Sept 22 2020.

Anybody's crystal ball can tell me the odds that I have to be able to do a border run before this Sept 20, allowing me another one year permission to stay.

I have been insured by BUPA-AETNA for 2 millions for quite a few years now...

[ubonjoe]

6 minutes ago, Andre0720 said:

Anybody's crystal ball can tell me the odds that I have to be able to do a border run before this Sept 20, allowing me another one year permission to stay.

I would say that odds are very good that you will be able to do it before September 20th unless there is a 2nd wave of infections.