Shoppers in England ordered to wear face coverings from July 24

[Bert got kinky]

Just now, tribalfusion001 said:

What problem exactly? Hardly anyone wear masks where I live and the cases of covid-19 are minimal, so what is the problem not wearing one.

 

You are in the UK and you are telling me that the cases of covid-19 are minumal. ????

What a crock.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

9 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

Except these are different times and people are losing their jobs through this crisis, next is the housing market collpase. Everything is linked and unstoppable. People rightly or wrongly are seeing freedoms being taken away. When will this all end?

 

Thailand apparently has no local transmissions but still having to wear masks, so how many more weeks or months will it continue...

Science not your thing then.

 

To remind you, by mid January mask wearing was near 100% across Thailand and by end January shops, supermarkets, markets and public buildings required masks and were checking the temperature of people entering.

 

To date so have not heard a single Thai person complaining about having to wear a mask or that being required to wear a mask is an attack on their freedoms.

 

A consistent, nationwide public health response has received wide support and achieved a remarkable success in combating the spread of this disease here in Thailand.

 

Nobody’s liberty and freedoms are under threat, it is people’s lives and health that are at risk.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, englishoak said:

 

Exactly, there is no consistency, police vans have loads in them with no PPE, shop staff chat with no distance, I work atm just down  the road from Westminster, and often at old bailey care to guess how many MPS courts and staff go about with PPE in or out of chambers ?  less than 10%, thats how seriously its worth taking... yes overly i believe its mostly bs fuelled by the MSM and  mass hysteria.  

Separate two things:

 

1. The incompetence of the government and its response.

 

2. The effectiveness of wide spread mask use in combating the spread of this disease.

 

 

[tribalfusion001]

6 minutes ago, Bert got kinky said:

 

You are in the UK and you are telling me that the cases of covid-19 are minumal. ????

What a crock.

 

 

We have something called a postcode that you can check how many new cases are in your area and where I live it's minimal if not non existent. I don't know anyone who has caught it in the UK or in BKK.

 

Enter postcode and bingo. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51768274

Edited July 14, 2020 by tribalfusion001

[kingdong]

30 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oh it’s them fruit pickers (foreigners) garment factory workers in Leicester (immigrants), multi occupation housing for certain ethnicities (race).

 

Gottya!

the poster you responded to raised points that you addressed by playing the rsce card,                                                                     gertcha

[englishoak]

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

Our [the British Government] policy makers have decided to wait another 11 days to close the barn door after the horse bolted 3 months ago !!!! 

 

To list the dumfvckery I’ve witnessed in the UK: Upon given the goahead to re-open, ’some’ publicans, owners of pubs and companies have complained that they didn’t have enough time to prepare for the re-opening !!! I think they had a weeks notice !!!  (W)TF, if they are not ready, stay closed !!!!!! thats it, re-open when they are capable of getting their S#!t together !!!!

 

Ive not answered your other posts as I dont want to get into a slanging match but as to the above consider this..

 

Those in power, the think tanks, the "scientists" the advisers, the Oxbridge elite decided that 11 days hence on a whim ? or do you maybe suppose this entire time since the very beginning of not stopping fights, or Euro star not doing checks or policing quarantine for arrivals etc etc is mismanagement or actually when you step back and weigh up what they say compared to what they do its all intentional.

 

I am always amused that people dismiss those in powerful decision  making positions as simply being stupid when in fact the reverse is most likely true, its more likely the sheep not paying full attention... 

 

To me its quite clear the UK and other govs have been going the route of herd immunity/virus burn out all along. Despite the MSM narrative and flip flops.. thats makes the most sense to me anyway..

[Chomper Higgot]

8 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

We have something called a postcode that you can check how many new cases are in your area and where I live it's minimal if not non existent. I don't know anyone who has caught it in the UK or in BKK.

 

Enter postcode and bingo. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51768274

Oddly though, a single infection turned into a pandemic.

 

 

[tribalfusion001]

For the people who are not in the UK at present you not seeing the slowdown in the high streets with the social distancing measures. Forcing people to wear masks in shops will mean people will just shop online instead. Boris Johnson has been clueless since start of this crisis and this will kill off any recovery in retail shops.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, englishoak said:

Ive not answered your other posts as I dont want to get into a slanging match but as to the above consider this..

 

Those in power, the think tanks, the "scientists" the advisers, the Oxbridge elite decided that 11 days hence on a whim ? or do you maybe suppose this entire time since the very beginning of not stopping fights, or Euro star not doing checks or policing quarantine for arrivals etc etc is mismanagement or actually when you step back and weigh up what they say compared to what they do its all intentional.

 

I am always amused that people dismiss those in powerful decision  making positions as simply being stupid when in fact the reverse is most likely true, its more likely the sheep not paying full attention... 

 

To me its quite clear the UK and other govs have been going the route of herd immunity/virus burn out all along. Despite the MSM narrative and flip flops.. thats makes the most sense to me anyway..

Ah, conspiracy of ‘those in power’.

 

I doubt the virus is listening.

[tribalfusion001]

3 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Oddly though, a single infection turned into a pandemic.

 

 

Which most people don't die of, 530,000 out of 7.8 billion, scary stuff to destroy economies worldwide.

Edited July 14, 2020 by tribalfusion001

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

Which most people don't die off, 530,000 out of 7.8 billion, scary stuff to destroy economies worldwide.

It’s not done yet.

[tribalfusion001]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

It’s not done yet.

Correct, the economic meltdown will be worse.

[richard_smith237]

25 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

There is no evidence of herd immunity being attainable for this disease.

 

 

There is no evidence otherwise. What there is evidence of is 4 different Coronaviruses (229E & NL63 alpha coronaviruses, OC43 & HKU1 beta coronaviruses) which cause the an estimated 30% of common colds which do carry some form of immunity ranging from 1 year to *3 years (*reports vary).

 

If we were to go back in time carrying one of those coronaviruses or one of the more recent rhinovirus we could potentially wipe out a community or worse, we (humans) seem to have evolved immunity as the virus evolves.

 

But.... (dot dot dot, for effect) this virus is new... Novel, its not recognised in any other human coronavirus strains and is thus ‘fresh’ (if there is such a thing). It is unknown whether any existing immunity to to the ‘other’ (listed above) coronaviruseses offers any immunity to SARS-CoV-2. 

 

There are so many questions.

 

One of which involves 'antigentetic drift’ - after year of research IF a vaccine can be found, will it work against a virus which may have evolved? 

 

Immunity may be the only thing we have.

 

 

 

 

[Bert got kinky]

 

Look, this is easy to understand.

If you are stupid enough to not protect yourself then that is fine, it’s called Darwinism.

However, if you are so stupid that your tiny self-ego & arrogance can and will endanger other lives, then you are just plain nasty.

 

[Chomper Higgot]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

There is no evidence otherwise. What there is evidence of is 4 different Coronaviruses (229E & NL63 alpha coronaviruses, OC43 & HKU1 beta coronaviruses) which cause the an estimated 30% of common colds which do carry some form of immunity ranging from 1 year to *3 years (*reports vary).

 

If we were to go back in time carrying one of those coronaviruses or one of the more recent rhinovirus we could potentially wipe out a community or worse, we (humans) seem to have evolved immunity as the virus evolves.

 

But.... (dot dot dot, for effect) this virus is new... Novel, its not recognised in any other human coronavirus strains and is thus ‘fresh’ (if there is such a thing). It is unknown whether any existing immunity to to the ‘other’ (listed above) coronaviruseses offers any immunity to SARS-CoV-2. 

 

There are so many questions.

 

One of which involves 'antigentetic drift’ - after year of research IF a vaccine can be found, will it work against a virus which may have evolved? 

 

Immunity may be the only thing we have.

 

 

 

 

Without evidence there is no basis to claim Herd immunity is going to help combat this disease.

[richard_smith237]

18 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

We have something called a postcode that you can check how many new cases are in your area and where I live it's minimal if not non existent. I don't know anyone who has caught it in the UK or in BKK.

 

Neither do I... But the census data for England and Wales shows 55,000 more deaths so far this year than the 5 year average (from 2014 to 2019) shows - that is alarming. 

 

Raw facts here: 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

 

publishedweek262020.xlsx

[tribalfusion001]

2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Neither do I... But the census data for England and Wales shows 55,000 more deaths so far this year than the 5 year average (from 2014 to 2019) shows - that is alarming. 

 

Raw facts here: 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

 

publishedweek262020.xlsx 190.8 kB · 0 downloads

And 96% or so had multiple exisiting medical conditions. A friend of mine in the pub told me last week he knew someone who died of covid-19, the person had terminal cancer.

[Chomper Higgot]

8 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

You need to get out more and start living rather than worrying about a virus. If you want to wear a mask for the next year or two up to you.

 

All Lives Matter is not correct, do some research it's either Black Lives Matter or nothing. If black lives don't matter, then no lives matter.

Are you sure you know which thread you are posting in?

 

[tribalfusion001]

Just now, Chomper Higgot said:

Are you sure you know which thread you are posting in?

 

It's in his signature.

[richard_smith237]

27 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

30 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

There is no evidence otherwise. What there is evidence of is 4 different Coronaviruses (229E & NL63 alpha coronaviruses, OC43 & HKU1 beta coronaviruses) which cause the an estimated 30% of common colds which do carry some form of immunity ranging from 1 year to *3 years (*reports vary).

 

If we were to go back in time carrying one of those coronaviruses or one of the more recent rhinovirus we could potentially wipe out a community or worse, we (humans) seem to have evolved immunity as the virus evolves.

 

But.... (dot dot dot, for effect) this virus is new... Novel, its not recognised in any other human coronavirus strains and is thus ‘fresh’ (if there is such a thing). It is unknown whether any existing immunity to to the ‘other’ (listed above) coronaviruseses offers any immunity to SARS-CoV-2. 

 

There are so many questions.

 

One of which involves 'antigentetic drift’ - after year of research IF a vaccine can be found, will it work against a virus which may have evolved? 

 

Immunity may be the only thing we have.

 

 

 

 

Without evidence there is no basis to claim Herd immunity is going to help combat this disease.

Herd Immunity was effective against Smallpox, with the onset of medical knowledge herd immunity along with vaccination has been essential in eradicating many other major diseases - obviously this is not in question to anyone other than an ‘anti-vaxxer’

 

Herd Immunity would only be effective against SARS-CoV-2 if those who are carrying it are not contagious and can’t carry it to those at risk. Herd Immunity from Measles worked exactly the same way, but with the assistance of effective vaccines. 

 

Does someone have a ‘Cold’ or the ‘Flu’ if they are not showing symptoms? - thats one of the questions being asked of SARS-CoV-2; is someone who’s breathed in the Virus contagious>? Will it multiply in their body without the carrier showing any signs or symptoms? Is that person immune but still going to spread the virus to others? The idea of asymptomatic transmission may be flawed. 

 

IF that person is immune, how did he become immune? Immune because he was exposed to one of the other coronaviruses? or exposed specifically to SARS-CoV-2 previously?

 

One of the key factors in fighting Covid-19 is to establish if a person can develop immunity to SARS-CoV-2, I’m at a lost as to how we do not yet know this information. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited July 14, 2020 by richard_smith237

[Chomper Higgot]

7 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

And 96% or so had multiple exisiting medical conditions. A friend of mine in the pub told me last week he knew someone who died of covid-19, the person had terminal cancer.

So that’s where you get your ‘facts’.

[tribalfusion001]

2 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So that’s where you get your ‘facts’.

I get facts from lots of places and the facts are the majority of the people who die from covid-19 have multiple underlying medical conditions.

[richard_smith237]

8 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

11 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Neither do I... But the census data for England and Wales shows 55,000 more deaths so far this year than the 5 year average (from 2014 to 2019) shows - that is alarming. 

 

Raw facts here: 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

 

publishedweek262020.xlsx 190.8 kB · 0 downloads

And 96% or so had multiple exisiting medical conditions. A friend of mine in the pub told me last week he knew someone who died of covid-19, the person had terminal cancer.

You've countered an unbiased fact (source provided) with a made up % and a dumbed down anecdote. 

 

Look at the link and if you are capable of handling the raw data (the xls sheet) spend 5 minutes thinking about the data you see. 

 

There are 55000 excess deaths so far this year (in England and Wales) - How do you (@tribalfusion001) explain that?

 

 

 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

It seems there’s an explanation to the refusal to wear masks in the face of a deadly virus that spreads via aerosols in the breath of those infected:

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-8519169/Real-covidiots-People-refuse-wear-mask-lower-cognitive-ability-new-study-shows.html

[englishoak]

21 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Neither do I... But the census data for England and Wales shows 55,000 more deaths so far this year than the 5 year average (from 2014 to 2019) shows - that is alarming. 

 

Raw facts here: 

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/weeklyprovisionalfiguresondeathsregisteredinenglandandwales

 

 

 

publishedweek262020.xlsx 190.8 kB · 0 downloads

 

What is often overlooked is how many conditions medicine and medical science has been able to help, allowing people to extend life that would have a few decades or even years ago died from their conditions ... As medicine advances ive no doubt this trend will continue, along with peoples fears about dying... Not to mention the population size now compared to previous pandemics in % and fatality, 

 

As religion fades and the promise of a life or new after it makes people all the more mortal and scared of dying.

 

Any vaccine has serious side effects for a certain %, Vaccinating 8 billion is going to have  complications medically for millions just by current acceptable ratios.. i'll go with herd immunity or simply living with it being in the world like all the other viruses both known and yet to be uncovered  thanks

Edited July 14, 2020 by englishoak

[mike787]

good luck with that...

[tribalfusion001]

4 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

You've countered an unbiased fact (source provided) with a made up % and a dumbed down anecdote. 

 

Look at the link and if you are capable of handling the raw data (the xls sheet) spend 5 minutes thinking about the data you see. 

 

There are 55000 excess deaths so far this year (in England and Wales) - How do you (@tribalfusion001) explain that?

 

 

 

 

 

All of the deaths from yesterday were from 72 to 95 and had multiple underlying conditions. This is the same everyday and the % is around 96%.

[OZinPattaya]

England is a follower, not a leader. So who cares about the sentiments of England?

[richard_smith237]

2 minutes ago, tribalfusion001 said:

6 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So that’s where you get your ‘facts’.

I get facts from lots of places and the facts are the majority of the people who die from covid-19 have multiple underlying medical conditions.

 

That seems to be the case (many people who have died from Covid-19 have had underlying medial conditions). 

It's been a commonly presented argument. 

 

There are those who ‘probably’ would have passed within the last couple of weeks anyway who have succumbed to Covid-19, they would likely have succumbed to a regular cold or a dose of the trots. 

 

There are those who have underlying conditions, but would probably have survived the next 6 months without catching a cold etc, but Covid-19 was so contagious it stole 6 months of their life. 

 

There are those with diabetes, Asthma, heart problems, those who are over weight... etc...   Having an underlying serious condition does not nullify the death statistic if Covid-19 has been ’steeling time’ from people lives.

 

 

 

[tribalfusion001]

1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

That seems to be the case (many people who have died from Covid-19 have had underlying medial conditions). 

It's been a commonly presented argument. 

 

There are those who ‘probably’ would have passed within the last couple of weeks anyway who have succumbed to Covid-19, they would likely have succumbed to a regular cold or a dose of the trots. 

 

There are those who have underlying conditions, but would probably have survived the next 6 months without catching a cold etc, but Covid-19 was so contagious it stole 6 months of their life. 

 

There are those with diabetes, Asthma, heart problems, those who are over weight... etc...   Having an underlying serious condition does not nullify the death statistic if Covid-19 has been ’steeling time’ from people lives.

 

 

 

So giving people an extra 6 to 9 months is worth this economic damage? This is not going to stop, the damage will only get worse, it's now unstoppable. Forcing people to wear a mask in a shop is not going to be the start of the rebound, it's going to be the reverse.