Non-O retirement as "stop-gap measure" - would this be a good route to take?

[EbhB]

I assume that I will have a bit more than 2 months now to get onto a permanent visa, BUT when it comes to putting up 800.000 baht in a bank... Its just too much, right now.

 

Eventually I will get marriage papers, and will keep pushing that to the max as a parallel track of course - no idea if I can get that done in my home country remotely.

 

Keeping 400.000 here is OK for me, perhaps at 2 separate banks - so that is my planned destination, to be on a marriage extension.

 

Right now on non-B from Penang, gotta sort out letting my company go dormant for a while due to lack of income and also just need to get a permanent stay fixed - thats on top of my list for sure!

 

So what I'm thinking is putting in 400.000 as soon as possible, then let an agent do a non-O retirement & then convert to marriage later.

 

I would then be 400 short of course, got an option on hand where they do flash loans & another where they waive the requirement.

 

Would this be a feasible and kinda safe "bridge" between my current status and being on a marriage extension?

[ubonjoe]

With new amnest you will have until the end of September to sort things out and get married. Just try to build up the money in the 400k baht in the bank until then. After getting married you could apply for a 60 day extension to visit your new wife.

With a extension based upon marriage you can have a work permit and work.

The big problem with going to retirement first is that you probably would not be able to change the reason for your extension to marriage until near the end of it. Most immigration offices will not do it until then.

[Max69xl]

You're going for a 1 year extension, not a permanent visa. 

[Peter Denis]

Excellent advice from UJ (as always).

Without sufficient funds your application for the 1-year extension of stay for reason of RETIREMENT will be rejected.  But not only that, it would also prohibit you from working as you cannot get a work permit on such category of extension.

When you can get married and secure the required marriage documents before the end of the Grace Period (26 sept), you could then apply for a 60-day extension of stay for reason of visiting your wife.  That would give you time till end of November for your application for the 1-year extension for reason of marriage.  In mean time, from now till 26 Sept you can try to get hold of the required 400K on your personal thai bank account.  That 400K needs to be seasoned for 2 months before applying for the 1-year extension (at the end of the 60-days the 60-day extension of stay will provide you).  Once your marriage extension application has been approved (which can take 3-4 weeks), you are free again to use the funds as you please. 

[scotsman]

I have a question for this if you get a visa Agent to get you a retirement extension then you get married you have now got the 400k for the last 2 months seasoned.  Then on the last month of that extension you apply for a change of Extension to marriage will the IO not look at your bank account and see that you did not have the 800k for your retirement extension so your visa extension would be void? or will he know it was done with a visa agent and will not care as the IO has the power to do this?  

Regards 

Scotsman       

[Peter Denis]

18 minutes ago, scotsman said:

I have a question for this if you get a visa Agent to get you a retirement extension then you get married you have now got the 400k for the last 2 months seasoned.  Then on the last month of that extension you apply for a change of Extension to marriage will the IO not look at your bank account and see that you did not have the 800k for your retirement extension so your visa extension would be void? or will he know it was done with a visa agent and will not care as the IO has the power to do this?  

Regards 

Scotsman       

The funds only need to be seasoned for 2 months before the application for the 1-year extension, and when using the money-in-bank method it is either 800K (retirement) or 400K (marriage).

But the problem would be that once his extension application is approved, he cannot switch to another category.  So for a retirement extension, he would then be forced to keep 800K for 3 months in the account, then 400K for the next 7 months and then top up again to 800K during the last two months.  And not only that, but he would not be able to get a Work Permit when having applied for reason of retirement.  So from what he wrote, the retirement application option is totally out of bounds. 

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, scotsman said:

I have a question for this if you get a visa Agent to get you a retirement extension then you get married you have now got the 400k for the last 2 months seasoned.  Then on the last month of that extension you apply for a change of Extension to marriage will the IO not look at your bank account and see that you did not have the 800k for your retirement extension so your visa extension would be void? or will he know it was done with a visa agent and will not care as the IO has the power to do this?  

Regards 

Scotsman       

If you can't provide evidence of 800K in your Thai bank account for the required 3 months after your retirement extension was approved, they could well refuse a change of reason for your next extension.

 

Personally if I were in that position, I'd leave the Country (without a re-entry permit) towards the end of the 1 year retirement extension, which then ends your permission of stay.

Having since married, I'd apply for the single entry Non Imm O Visa at Savannakhet based on marriage, which is a new entry, granting permission of stay for 90 days. Within the last 30 days of that 90 days apply directly for the extension based on marriage, having seasoned the 400K for the required 2 months.

 

 

[EbhB]

Thanks everyone!

 

The main problem is that I do not count on getting the required papers from my home country in anything close to being quickly nor hassle-free... But I'll have my family & friends look into it this coming week!

 

Getting back a work permit will be NO hurry for a year or two, but of course it would be a good thing - perhaps a volunteer visa with an agent is the best stop-gap measure after all...

 

Or possible doing real volunteer work, would need to find an organization in a matter of a week or two - not completely impossible as I've both been buddhist for 25 years AND have translated and notarized the original certificate for that from 94 ????

 

Worst case would be going to an amphur towards the end of September, and then something going wrong, leaving me with NO other option than leaving in a hurry...

[ubonjoe]

11 minutes ago, EbhB said:

The main problem is that I do not count on getting the required papers from my home country in anything close to being quickly nor hassle-free... But I'll have my family & friends look into it this coming week!

What do you have to get from your home country? At most embassies all you do a affirmation of permit to marry without waiting for anything from there.

[Tanoshi]

2 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

What do you have to get from your home country? At most embassies all you do a affirmation of permit to marry without waiting for anything from there.

At a guess, Death certificate or Decree Absolute as proof of marital status.

[Boomer6969]

On 7/18/2020 at 2:51 PM, EbhB said:

perhaps at 2 separate banks

There is no rules that forbids this AFAIK, but it is wise to avoid anything that may trigger the slightest brain activity from the IO handling your case.

[Peter Denis]

11 minutes ago, Boomer6969 said:

There is no rules that forbids this AFAIK, but it is wise to avoid anything that may trigger the slightest brain activity from the IO handling your case.

Absolutely correct.  There have been reports of monthly income transfers not being accepted because:

- instead of one single +40K or +65K transfer in a given month, two or more smaller transfers totalling over +40K or +65K;

- the monthly income transfers were not done at approx 'same time' of the month.

Doing transfers to different personal thai bank-accounts, requires a 'calculator' to check whether the minimum tressholds were met.  Easier to say 'Cannot be done', so recommended not to risk such a response from the immigration officer handling your case, even though the regulations do not prohibit it.

[DrJack54]

OP, I suggest you read advice in post #7 from Tanoshi again. That is best solution.

Obtaining an extension based on retirement with no intention of obtaining a follow up extension but exit country in one years time to obtain non O based on marriage. Perfect.

You would not need keep money in bank after you obtain you extension RE.

 

[EbhB]

19 hours ago, scotsman said:

I have a question for this if you get a visa Agent to get you a retirement extension then you get married you have now got the 400k for the last 2 months seasoned.  Then on the last month of that extension you apply for a change of Extension to marriage will the IO not look at your bank account and see that you did not have the 800k for your retirement extension so your visa extension would be void? or will he know it was done with a visa agent and will not care as the IO has the power to do this?  

Regards 

Scotsman       

I count on 1-2 years of using agents if need be... Also I doubt I'll have a real chance of getting a new business up & running during this time, at least not at the scale that was planned and in the works...

 

But I've been thinking about this dilemma a tiny bit, I guess I'd use agents to get on a marriage visa after doing a volunteer visa anyway - even if everything is as it should be its definitely worth avoiding all hassle!

[EbhB]

16 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

What do you have to get from your home country? At most embassies all you do a affirmation of permit to marry without waiting for anything from there.

The norwegian embassy is just dead horrible... As well as the f...ed up system I basically fled from...

 

According to these bureaucratic psychos I have to apply for a permit to marry from the tax authorities IN Norway!

 

Seem this goes for anyone too, no shortcuts that I am aware of - its some pipeline I bet disgruntled, feminist bureaucrats in Norway has set up with the MFA here...

 

Currently I'm looking into using the virus-scare as an excuse for getting it done remotely, we'll see... I've even contemplated formally moving to Sweden for a year or two to get this and some other things fixed while coming here, but now all that is near impossible of course.

 

Compared to the bureaucrats in what used to be my country the thai ones are polite, effective and flexible!

[EbhB]

3 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

OP, I suggest you read advice in post #7 from Tanoshi again. That is best solution.

Obtaining an extension based on retirement with no intention of obtaining a follow up extension but exit country in one years time to obtain non O based on marriage. Perfect.

You would not need keep money in bank after you obtain you extension RE.

 

It does have merit, this plan... Especially as I could extend for 1 year if conditions for returning are still the same, which is what I personally fear.

 

Will need to chose what track to go down soon anyway, as there will be a lot of work getting the company here into a dormant state for 1-2 years...

[Peter Denis]

2 minutes ago, EbhB said:

.. I guess I'd use agents to get on a marriage visa after doing a volunteer visa anyway - even if everything is as it should be its definitely worth avoiding all hassle!

It's only a hassle at some rogue IOs, but of course they get all the Publicity on the Forum.

At majority of thai IOs you won't have any issues when you meet the requirements, and they will even help you when you unvoluntarily bloopered when collecting the evidence.

Check the stories on your IO by doing a Google search and you will quickly know what to expect.

[EbhB]

13 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

At a guess, Death certificate or Decree Absolute as proof of marital status.

I aint dead yet!!! ????

 

Absolute proof of marital status is easy, did this last autumn from here via my visa guys in Oslo.

 

But I do need that other document that is basically breaking with the human rights: a permit to marry of all things.......

[EbhB]

3 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

It's only a hassle at some rogue IOs, but of course they get all the Publicity on the Forum.

At majority of thai IOs you won't have any issues when you meet the requirements, and they will even help you when you unvoluntarily bloopered when collecting the evidence.

Check the stories on your IO by doing a Google search and you will quickly know what to expect.

Nonthaburi, so some people claim they are very difficult...

 

Worst case, if getting into real trouble I'd ask the husband of my wifes sister to come along in uniform, the family is all army & police ????

 

Same for getting the amphur past the last bump!

[EbhB]

Since I posted this thread, I do see another, optimal way forward:

 

1. I simply keep the company running with 2 workers, the work permit and visa while 400.000 is in the bank

2. Once I get the papers I apply for converting from the non-B to marriage IF this is feasible

 

I would still have the dilemma of having to apply late, and would need a fallback if something goes wrong with the amphur or immigration...

 

Does anyone know if marriage papers that are almost complete and a process that is underway could be enough for an extension if the worst happens?

 

I could also get this through a general embassy letter that states that I need to stay on for a while, this is what my corporate lawyer gave me as an option.

 

Or simply having an agent "on the standby" of course...

[Peter Denis]

26 minutes ago, EbhB said:

Nonthaburi, so some people claim they are very difficult...

 

Worst case, if getting into real trouble I'd ask the husband of my wifes sister to come along in uniform, the family is all army & police ????

 

Same for getting the amphur past the last bump!

Oops, Nonthaburi!  Prepare for the worst...
But with an armed escort, it will probably go a lot smoother... ????

[Tanoshi]

48 minutes ago, EbhB said:

But I've been thinking about this dilemma a tiny bit, I guess I'd use agents to get on a marriage visa after doing a volunteer visa anyway - even if everything is as it should be its definitely worth avoiding all hassle!

By Marriage Visa (non existent) do you mean a Non O Visa based on marriage, or an extension of your permission of stay (a permit, not a Visa) at local Immigration offices, based on marriage to a Thai.

If the latter agents, can't assist unless you legitimately meet all the requirements, as your application has to be approved at regional level. (They can't do 'dodgy' extensions based on marriage).

[EbhB]

3 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

By Marriage Visa (non existent) do you mean a Non O Visa based on marriage, or an extension of your permission of stay (a permit, not a Visa) at local Immigration offices, based on marriage to a Thai.

If the latter agents, can't assist unless you legitimately meet all the requirements, as your application has to be approved at regional level. (They can't do 'dodgy' extensions based on marriage).

...thats right, forgot about that part!

 

How many moving pieces has this beast machine GOT? And by that I mean not only here, but the combined beast of my country and here...

 

Once again then the feasible route seems to just get "something that works" for a year or two...

[Tanoshi]

14 minutes ago, EbhB said:

...thats right, forgot about that part!

 

How many moving pieces has this beast machine GOT? And by that I mean not only here, but the combined beast of my country and here...

 

Once again then the feasible route seems to just get "something that works" for a year or two...

Once the borders reopen you could obtain a Non O Multi entry Visa from Savannakhet with no financial proof required based on marriage to a Thai. The Non O ME Visa allows 90 day entries, each of which can be extended by a further 60 days at local Immigration for 1,900 BHT.

If used to it's potential you can stay for almost 17 months with only 3 border runs and 3 60 day extensions.

 

Alternatively, you could obtain the Non O single entry from Savannakhet with no financial proof required.

This would grant you a 90 day entry, which could be extended for a further 60 days if required, or having that Visa, you can apply to extend your permission of stay for 1 year based on marriage at local Immigration, 1,900 BHT.

 

Being on a Non O Visa or 1 year extension based on marriage allows you to legally work in Thailand, although you need to still apply for a work permit.

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, EbhB said:

1. I simply keep the company running with 2 workers, the work permit and visa while 400.000 is in the bank

2. Once I get the papers I apply for converting from the non-B to marriage IF this is feasible

When does your current permission of stay end and when do you expect your (I assume) divorce to be completed. 

[Peter Denis]

12 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

Once the borders reopen you could obtain a Non O Multi entry Visa from Savannakhet with no financial proof required based on marriage to a Thai.

...

@EbhB > If you are interested in applying for the 90-day or the 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa based on marriage to a Thai, let me know and I will PM you some practical information on how to apply for it at the thai consulates of Savannakhet or Ho Chi Min City.

When living in Bangkok (or CM) area, applying at HCMC is actually quicker than going to Savannakhet as there were (at least before Covid) cheap return-flights for under 2.000 THB.

[EbhB]

49 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

@EbhB > If you are interested in applying for the 90-day or the 1-year MultipleEntry Non Imm O Visa based on marriage to a Thai, let me know and I will PM you some practical information on how to apply for it at the thai consulates of Savannakhet or Ho Chi Min City.

When living in Bangkok (or CM) area, applying at HCMC is actually quicker than going to Savannakhet as there were (at least before Covid) cheap return-flights for under 2.000 THB.

Thanks a lot, but what I am aiming for is NOT leaving Thailand at all for a year or two... I'm golden as far as visas go at the moment with non-B from Penang & a work permit, its just that the travelling I planned to do anyway is 100% impossible...

[EbhB]

55 minutes ago, Tanoshi said:

When does your current permission of stay end and when do you expect your (I assume) divorce to be completed. 

No divorce, just over-zealous bureaucrats.......... As well as a society where everything is done ONE way, and through online portals all over the place.

 

One of the things I want to be rid of!