Visa Exempt Blocks Anyone?

[Digitalbanana]

Below copy pasted from Stickmans weekly. Make of it what you will.

In what I truly believe is the most confusing of all of the new visa regulations implemented so far - and don't even start to think they have finished - it would seem the visa on arrival - that is the 30 day stamp - is limiting not just in terms of the number of days you stay in a 180 day period, but by the 180 day period itself. This is a little confusing so please bear with me. We know that in a 180 day period you can only stay a maximum of 90 days. That part is easy to understand. What is not clear is that this first visa on arrival essentially creates a "block", and you cannot stay beyond the end of that block. At the end of the 180 days, you MUST leave the country. You can return and a new block would commence. Here's an example. You enter Thailand on October 1st and get a 30 day stamp. That means that the end of the 180 day period is March 27. If you leave Thailand and then return on March 24, you will only be allowed to stay for 3 days at which point you will have to exit the country! It doesn't matter that you didn't exceed the 90 days in 180 day period. This incredibly confusing rule is going to trip up many people and force people who have never even heard the term "visa run" to make a mad dash to the border to remain legal. And of course some visitors to the Kingdom won't even notice that they have only been given a limited number of days in country and will inevitably overstay. Madness, just madness. To really make things worse, the enforcement of the latest round of visa rules seems to be inconsistent. I can only imagine that the poor Immigration officers are confused themselves!

[Maestro]

...from Stickmans weekly...it would seem the visa on arrival - that is the 30 day stamp...

So good old Stickman is another one using “visa on arrival” wrongly for the visa-exempt entry stamp. Who’s going to tell him the difference?

Dear Stickman, if you are reading this, go here to see what a visa on arrival is, and go here to learn about the visa-exempt entry.

--------------

Maestro

[brianwl]

Check out this article in the Phuket Gazette. http://www.phuketgazette.net/news/index.asp?id=5662

[farangsay]

Without nit-picking about the VOA/VE thing this piece does indicate (but not totally

spell out) the effect that this sort of interpretation can have on real tourists.

For several years I would come here from Europe as a "real" tourist and often

twice within a six month period. I never did a visa run , never needed to , I

normally stayed around three weeks. In fact I was surprised one time when my

exit date was extended on re-entering Thailand after a day trip to Vientiane.

Now , was I still that happy-go-lucky fellow , I arrive at Phuket airport on March 24

looking to enjoy the fine entertainment of Patong for a few weeks and they stamp

me in for three days because I spent the first three weeks of October in Thailand.

I'd waste those three days trying to find out <deleted> do I do , <deleted> is a visa run and

the third day enjoying a minivan ride to Ranong and the inestimable pleasure of

a longtail boat ride to Kaw Theung , and the BEST thing about that is I have to do it

again in the reverse order to get back to Patong. I have the remainder of my three

week holiday and say to myself FTFAGOS and go somewhere else next time.

PS Anybody who says TIT is one.

[englishoak]

PS Anybody who says TIT is one.

[Silomfarang]

The "brilliant" thing about the 180 day block thing is that it will catch many tourists unaware (real tourists, not visa runners who live in Thailand and who might be more likely to read this).

There will be more shouting scenes at the Immigration desk at the airport on arrival. There will be even more shouting scenes at departure for those who are going to overstay without realising their stamp was, say 3 days instead of 30. The overstay fee for 27 days is 13 500 B per person. Try to explain that to an Indian family of eight.

I can only congratulate Thai authorities with their successful scheme to piss off visitors and give Thailand a bad reputation abroad.

[Gumballl]

Has Stickman actually been affected by this, or is he just blowing hot air out of his rear end? I have not heard of anyone on this forum complaining about being given only one stamp-on-arrival, and then nearly 5 months later being only given a few days.

I have been issued 4 stamps-on-arrival during a 6 month (180 day) period. Was I lucky? Perhaps so... maybe because it was Songkran when I last got my entry stamp.

[wpcoe]

There have been reports here on this forum that this "90 day block" concept is being applied, although like anything else there is not 100% consistency. People have arrived four days before the fixed 90-day period was to end, and were given only four days to stay in Thailand, regardless of time spent in Thaland during the previous 86 days.

My impression was that the thread Immigration Bureau Clarifies 90-day Rule Change was an unsuccessful attempt to clarify two inconsistently understood/applied interpretations:

-- maximum three entries in 90-day period

-- the "90 day block" concept Stickman talks about

What a confusing mess of gray areas made even grayer!

[lopburi3]

The period is six months - not 90 days - the 90 days is the allowed total stay.

Indeed there were persons in the 5 to 6 month period only provided a stay to take them to the six month date regardless of there total stay days. I believe that interpretation of the rules (I hope) has ended.

[wpcoe]

The period is six months - not 90 days - the 90 days is the allowed total stay.

Good grief! How did I manage to contort six months into 90 days???

Thanks for the correction, lopburi3.

[astral]

Check out this article in the Phuket Gazette. http://www.phuketgazette.net/news/index.asp?id=5662

I do not think the Phuket officer understood the rules either.

It was never stated that we are limited to THREE visa exemption stamps,

just 90 days of stay in 6 months.

Now if yuo use all the 30 days of the Visa Exemption that will be only 3,

but of you only stay a few days each on each trip it could be many more.........

[dogleg]

Has Stickman actually been affected by this, or is he just blowing hot air out of his rear end? I have not heard of anyone on this forum complaining about being given only one stamp-on-arrival, and then nearly 5 months later being only given a few days.

I have been issued 4 stamps-on-arrival during a 6 month (180 day) period. Was I lucky? Perhaps so... maybe because it was Songkran when I last got my entry stamp.

Guy in front of me at laemPae?? two weeks ago got stuck by this. he got 3 days 'gratis' on re-entry from Cambodia to go to jomtien immigration, get a 7 day extension then return to the border after his 180 days was up. Madness

[Dupont]

Has Stickman actually been affected by this, or is he just blowing hot air out of his rear end? I have not heard of anyone on this forum complaining about being given only one stamp-on-arrival, and then nearly 5 months later being only given a few days.

I have been issued 4 stamps-on-arrival during a 6 month (180 day) period. Was I lucky? Perhaps so... maybe because it was Songkran when I last got my entry stamp.

Guy in front of me at laemPae?? two weeks ago got stuck by this. he got 3 days 'gratis' on re-entry from Cambodia to go to jomtien immigration, get a 7 day extension then return to the border after his 180 days was up. Madness

Don't see the problem!

If he has enough dosh to stay here for 6 months on holiday and then apply for even more time here, he has enough to get proper visas, stay out of the country for a few days rather than going to Jomtiem and back or fly home and get a one year visa.

He is a tourist after all isn't he!

The point you are missing is that these rules are flushing out MANY illegal bar, restaurant, dive shop, tour agency and real estate business people and making life easier for those of us that have always been legal, registered our businesses, paid tax, insurance, paid for work permits etc.

The absolute majority of people adversely affected are working here illegally. Go on a Visa bus and everybody is handing out business cards, even the ones going for Tourist Visas. One or two bizarre sob stories shouldn't change this.

Really don't give a damm about anybody caught up in this and I suggest people read the posts about how to obtain proper visas and work permits rather than whine on here constantly about it.

[torrenova]

The point you are missing is that these rules are flushing out MANY illegal bar, restaurant, dive shop, tour agency and real estate business people and making life easier for those of us that have always been legal, registered our businesses, paid tax, insurance, paid for work permits etc.

The absolute majority of people adversely affected are working here illegally. Go on a Visa bus and everybody is handing out business cards, even the ones going for Tourist Visas. One or two bizarre sob stories shouldn't change this.

Really don't give a damm about anybody caught up in this and I suggest people read the posts about how to obtain proper visas and work permits rather than whine on here constantly about it.

You make a valid point about illegality but you should also state the numerous ways in which the Thai government frustrates people who want to go "legal". If they made life easier, people would get the correct paperwork. I do not know anyone here who likes visa runs or who wants to fly back to their home country to get another visa etc. All that wasted money could remain in Thailand as taxation and fees etc. However, people are not stupid, they will not show their hand until they are sure it will not be clamped !

[brianwl]

I tend to think the Thai Government knows exactly what they are doing by making things difficult. To my understanding the intent is two fold, first is to catch the creeps that steal from the Government and people by not paying taxes and having work permits. The second is to make things as frustrating as possible to keep the crooks out that the first idea does not catch.

Unfortunately, it does not appear there can be any middle road here because the crooks are rather crafty.

I was in Phuket last Sep - Dec. From my arrival in Sep - late Oct the only place you could find a dive instructor was at a dive shop or maybe a resort. By the first week of Nov there were signs popping up all over the place for dive instructors. Several bars had signs out front. Were these legal? Don't know, but one would tend to think not.

The point you are missing is that these rules are flushing out MANY illegal bar, restaurant, dive shop, tour agency and real estate business people and making life easier for those of us that have always been legal, registered our businesses, paid tax, insurance, paid for work permits etc.

The absolute majority of people adversely affected are working here illegally. Go on a Visa bus and everybody is handing out business cards, even the ones going for Tourist Visas. One or two bizarre sob stories shouldn't change this.

Really don't give a damm about anybody caught up in this and I suggest people read the posts about how to obtain proper visas and work permits rather than whine on here constantly about it.

You make a valid point about illegality but you should also state the numerous ways in which the Thai government frustrates people who want to go "legal". If they made life easier, people would get the correct paperwork. I do not know anyone here who likes visa runs or who wants to fly back to their home country to get another visa etc. All that wasted money could remain in Thailand as taxation and fees etc. However, people are not stupid, they will not show their hand until they are sure it will not be clamped !

[torrenova]

Make it easy to be legit and people will not bother to find ways around it. Keep it difficult and they will avoid the issue. You've thousands of guys using at least 100k a year to renew visas.