NON-THAI REVENUE ON A RETIREMENT VISA

[Virtualrecluse]

I'm not in LOS atm. I make a living teaching online (yes, you guessed, Chinese students). Now I know you are not supposed to be earning money while on anything other than a work visa, so my question is: If you get a monthly amount paid into your Thai bank a/c from abroad or via an online payment platform, would your bank inform the Immigration Dept.? The amount might fluctuate between 40-80,000 THB per month.

[Jingthing]

I can't answer your specify query but I think it would be cleaner for you if you transferred money into Thailand from an account in your home country that had your name on it rather than a third party. Transferring money into Thailand for you to spend or bank here is a good thing for Thailand. That's kind of our purpose.

[beano2274]

If it is going to your country then you send to Thailand you could say it was a Pension

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, beano2274 said:

If it is going to your country then you send to Thailand you could say it was a Pension

He doesn't need to say anything if he isn't using an income method. The sums he mentions include some transfers under 65K per month so I just assumed he was going to use the 800K baht bank method. The issue I see with third party "payments" that aren't normal transfers from his same name account abroad is that such regular "payments" do suggest that he is working in some way.

[Virtualrecluse]

16 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

He doesn't need to say anything if he isn't using an income method. The sums he mentions include some transfers under 65K per month so I just assumed he was going to use the 800K baht bank method. The issue I see with third party "payments" that aren't normal transfers from his same name account abroad is that such regular "payments" do suggest that he is working in some way.

yes, I intend to use the 800K method.  But would a bank 'flag' such payments? Or just be happy that money is going into the account. 

[Jingthing]

6 minutes ago, Virtualrecluse said:

yes, I intend to use the 800K method.  But would a bank 'flag' such payments? Or just be happy that money is going into the account. 

My assumption is that no, banks won't flag that. You'll need to go in to the bank once a year to get your annual immigration letter showing the 800K balance. Immigration will however be seeing your entire banking record for the entire year every year on each new application. It's always possible that they might ask about the source of your transfers. They have the legal right to ask anything they want. They are police. That's a reason I suggest you just look like a more "normal" retired expat and do your transfers from a home country account in your name. 

The general "rule" for people doing your kind of thing is to NOT involve the Thai financial system in any way in your business activities. Getting your regular payments paid directly into your Thai bank account is definitely not following that general guideline.

Edited March 20, 2021 by Jingthing

[beano2274]

I will use the same method of 800000 in the bank but with regular payments to Thailand, all coming from Europe

Edited March 20, 2021 by beano2274

[Jingthing]

What the OP wants to do is kind of grey area. Yes you are banned from working in Thailand on a retirement extension but there is no ban on working outside of Thailand. Even if the OP wanted to get a work permit for his activity, he couldn't. He's of course not taking work away from a Thai teaching students in China. Immigration isn't actively going after this kind of activity. However, it's still prudent to be discreet and separate that work activity from the Thai financial system. If it was me, I would not have such work payments sent directly to my Thai bank account. 

[beano2274]

Actually why not have an account for the 800000 and keep it there, and use the money that you get from teaching as spending money, you only have to show the detials to the 800000 to Immigration the other account has nothing to do with them

 

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, beano2274 said:

Actually why not have an account for the 800000 and keep it there, and use the money that you get from teaching as spending money, you only have to show the detials to the 800000 to Immigration the other account has nothing to do with them

 

That is true.

In fact he could open an account at another bank than the 800K account bank.

That account would not be shown to immigration unless for some reason he needed it if his 800K account fell under. (Multiple accounts can be used to meet financial requirements.) 

I still think even that plan is more exposure than he needs considering the not working in Thailand rule. 

What if the banks are cooperating with immigration in ways we don't know about?

Edited March 20, 2021 by Jingthing

[Virtualrecluse]

good, useful answers so far - thanks to all of you. I was wondering if Immigration gets to see your entire bank movements over the year. In that case, the solution might lie in having the 800K in one a/c and receiving the monthly income into a separate a/c. Surely, they would not have the time/means to inspect more than your primary bank a/c...

[Jingthing]

I'm wondering if you're opening a potential taxation can of worms having work payments paid directly into a Thai bank account for work that you're obviously doing in Thailand. Of course maybe that's why you don't want to do what I suggested, to have the income paid to your home country, for tax reasons. 

[Virtualrecluse]

Just now, Jingthing said:

I'm wondering if you're opening a potential taxation can of worms having work payments paid directly into a Thai bank account for work that you're obviously doing in Thailand. Of course maybe that's why you don't want to do what I suggested, to have the income paid to your home country, for tax reasons. 

Precisely. Have been on a work permit for the past few years (up to 2020) and having the money paid in each month has not been an issue. But, looking ahead to the possibility of returning on a retirement visa, I'm trying to foresee any potential hiccups. 

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, Virtualrecluse said:

Precisely. Have been on a work permit for the past few years (up to 2020) and having the money paid in each month has not been an issue. But, looking ahead to the possibility of returning on a retirement visa, I'm trying to foresee any potential hiccups. 

Yeah I have no idea of Thai tax laws but there are lots of people here that do. Also your home country matters, especially if you're American. 

[ubonjoe]

Not specific to Chiang Mai. Moved to the Thai visas and etc forum.

[ubonjoe]

7 hours ago, Virtualrecluse said:

good, useful answers so far - thanks to all of you. I was wondering if Immigration gets to see your entire bank movements over the year. In that case, the solution might lie in having the 800K in one a/c and receiving the monthly income into a separate a/c. Surely, they would not have the time/means to inspect more than your primary bank a/c...

Banks do not report anything to immigration. Same for the revenue department other than interest earned on accounts.

You will not have a problem as long as you keep a low profile on what you are doing.

[crazykopite]

On 3/21/2021 at 12:20 AM, Jingthing said:

My assumption is that no, banks won't flag that. You'll need to go in to the bank once a year to get your annual immigration letter showing the 800K balance. Immigration will however be seeing your entire banking record for the entire year every year on each new application. It's always possible that they might ask about the source of your transfers. They have the legal right to ask anything they want. They are police. That's a reason I suggest you just look like a more "normal" retired expat and do your transfers from a home country account in your name. 

The general "rule" for people doing your kind of thing is to NOT involve the Thai financial system in any way in your business activities. Getting your regular payments paid directly into your Thai bank account is definitely not following that general guideline.

All you need to do is have two Thai bank accounts one with the 800k for your retirement and the other as your everyday expenses that’s what I have . This way you only have to present your bank letter and statement for your 800 k account 

[placnx]

On 3/21/2021 at 12:49 AM, Virtualrecluse said:

Precisely. Have been on a work permit for the past few years (up to 2020) and having the money paid in each month has not been an issue. But, looking ahead to the possibility of returning on a retirement visa, I'm trying to foresee any potential hiccups. 

As long as you're not American, subject to tax on worldwide income, why don't you have an account in your home country? You probably wouldn't incur any income tax at home if you are a resident here. Of course you would need to verify this with a tax accountant.

[dontpanic]

Why not just get a transferwise account. They give you a bank account and sort code/swift details, have your salary paid into this, exchange to Thai baht within the app and just withdraw in Thailand with the transferwise atm card with good rates. No need to have anything sent to a Thai bank account and nothing in the system then. 

[khunPer]

On 3/20/2021 at 4:59 PM, Virtualrecluse said:

Now I know you are not supposed to be earning money while on anything other than a work visa, so my question is: If you get a monthly amount paid into your Thai bank a/c from abroad or via an online payment platform, would your bank inform the Immigration Dept.? The amount might fluctuate between 40-80,000 THB per month.

Being a tax-resident has nothing to do with your visa or work permit, you are tax-resident when staying 180 days in Thailand within a calendar year.

 

When you are a tax-resident, any foreign earnings are income-taxable in Thailand – however, depending on any special agreements in a Double Taxation Agreement between your home country and Thailand – as long as the foreign income is transferred into Thailand during the same calendar year as it earned; if it's transferred the follow calendar year, or any later year, it's considered savings that are free from income tax.

 

If you are not tax resident in Thailand nobody cares, as long as you are not white washing money.

 

Thai banks are not giving any information to an immigration office, that's why many folks need to bring bank statements and bank letter, when they are extending permission to stay, based on terms where you need to show foreign income and/or bank deposit...????