Another One (rumor) From Stickman

[Digitalbanana]

In this weeks Stick Mark II?

>>At this stage it is a rumour, and I repeat that, JUST A RUMOUR, but a leak from the Thai embassy in London suggests that the whole visa on arrival / visa exemption system currently in place for visitors to Thailand may be abolished altogether. If that was the case it would mean that EVERY person visiting Thailand would require a visa i.e. you would have to go to a Thai embassy or consulate outside of Thailand and apply for a visa, before entering the country. For a country which receives well in excess of 10 million visitors a year, this could turn out to be an administrative nightmare and it has the potential to put people off visiting Thailand in favour of somewhere else. Can you imagine the queues at Thai missions around the world? Time will tell if this rumour becomes reality.

[Badbanker]

Having 20 years experience in Thailand and having also seen stickman get it wrong on several serious things I do believe this is just another bar story.

While things in Bangkok are a little beyond belief at times, requesting everyone to get a visa before arrival would shoot our recently Tsunami recovered tourist industry in the foot and no one in the Thai government is prepared to shoot their golden goose this way!

Other draconian things maybe!

Bandbanker

[jdinasia]

I heard another rumor too! That they were going to start calling the banana, a walrus!

I don't even see them reducing the number of visa exemptions allowed as it would crimp people doing the SEA backpacker circuit.

[midas]

Having 20 years experience in Thailand and having also seen stickman get it wrong on several serious things I do believe this is just another bar story.

While things in Bangkok are a little beyond belief at times, requesting everyone to get a visa before arrival would shoot our recently Tsunami recovered tourist industry in the foot and no one in the Thai government is prepared to shoot their golden goose this way!

Other draconian things maybe!

Bandbanker

But surely it would be naive to expect the existing set up to last

( I.E no cost and very limited information collated ) - a military government facing

increased security worries could well decide that Thailand should join its neighbours

and require visa applications from everyone?

[kiakaha]

Having 20 years experience in Thailand and having also seen stickman get it wrong on several serious things I do believe this is just another bar story.

While things in Bangkok are a little beyond belief at times, requesting everyone to get a visa before arrival would shoot our recently Tsunami recovered tourist industry in the foot and no one in the Thai government is prepared to shoot their golden goose this way!

Other draconian things maybe!

Bandbanker

..and his banking rant was full of inaccuracies....maybe it should have been titled "banking for english teachers".

I wouldn't use his weeklys as a truly reliable source of information.

[calibanjr.]

Such a ridiculous idea that it sounds highly plausible in this place! Bet the farm Nelly!

Edited May 20, 2007 by calibanjr.

[lazeeboy]

Such a ridiculous idea that it sounds highly plausible in this place! Bet the farm Nelly!

can you imagine it ,icant but in thailand anything can happen and usually does

[pnustedt]

I heard another rumor too! That they were going to start calling the banana, a walrus!

Nah - Thailand will never become a walrus republic!

[dantilley]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China. It will mean a lot of extra admin at first, but the result would probably be that it takes perhaps 3 days to get your tourist visa rather than 1 - not really a problem if you've bought your tickets in February for your holiday in July, as many people do.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of Malaysia as another country in this region which doesn't need a visa to enter the country. Getting a visa is a perfectly accepted and normal part of many western people's planning process when they holiday in Asia. I can't imagine too many people chose Thailand as their holiday destination over, say, Vietnam because with Vietnam they needed to get a visa in advance and they didn't with Thailand.

Would be a bit of a pain in the arse, true, but not the catastrophe that some people here are making it out to be.

[Ned]

I agree with the previous writer that it's highly plausible. I don't agree though that's it's a ridiculous idea. I don't reckon a few thousand less budget travellers changing their plans and not coming here is going to worry those in power too much. They don't have their economic fortunes tied up in cheapo guest houses and noodle stands. If the proprietors of the latter establishments want to take to the streets in protest then they'll end up with a lot of others who are going to feel a rifle butt in their faces in the near future.

[ovenman]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China.

It's not unbelievable and I wouldn't dismiss this rumour out of hand as being impossible, but if true, it's a step in the wrong direction relative to what most other countries are doing. India has floated rumours of creating a visa-free entry (or visa on arrival), visas for Vietnam have become less restrictive over the past so many years, Laos now offers a visa on arrival, Cambodia even has e-visas available. If enacted, this is certainly a step backwards for Thailand (although I also doubt that it would ruin the tourism business).

[Maestro]

In this weeks Stick Mark II?

>>At this stage it is a rumour, and I repeat that, JUST A RUMOUR, but a leak from the Thai embassy in London suggests that the whole visa on arrival / visa exemption system currently in place for visitors to Thailand may be abolished altogether.

What is it called? “Chinese whispers”, I believe.

If there is indeed such a rumour, my guess is that somebody at the Thai embassy told somebody that Immigration is considering to abolish the rule of maximum 90 visa-exempt days in 6 months and by the time this whisper got to Stick Mark II it got changed to what he wrote in his column.

If anything, this just shows how gullible Stick Mark II is. He should stick to propagating rumours on other subjects, never on visa and Immigration matters.

--------------

Maestro

[dantilley]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China.

It's not unbelievable and I wouldn't dismiss this rumour out of hand as being impossible, but if true, it's a step in the wrong direction relative to what most other countries are doing. India has floated rumours of creating a visa-free entry (or visa on arrival), visas for Vietnam have become less restrictive over the past so many years, Laos now offers a visa on arrival, Cambodia even has e-visas available. If enacted, this is certainly a step backwards for Thailand (although I also doubt that it would ruin the tourism business).

Yes, pretty much agree - probably not a particularly sensible move but not "unbelievable" or "a ridiculous idea" as others have said.

Would have a minimal affect on tourism I think - even backpackers wouldn't really be put out, they'll just have to add "sort out Thai Visa" onto their to-do list as they're swinging in their hammock in their Phnom Penh guest-house planning their return trip to Thailand. And that job of sorting out the visa will just involve handing their passport in at the guest-house reception desk, along with $30 or so, and collecting it again 3 or 4 days later.

Vietnam, India, Laos, Nepal, etc. all get plenty of budget travelers despite needing visas to enter them (I know you can get a Laos visa on arrival, by the way, but not sure if you can at all land borders? Backpackers, if anyone, are more likely to use the more obscure crossing points where they may not be able to get a VOA...)

[cclub75]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China. It will mean a lot of extra admin at first, but the result would probably be that it takes perhaps 3 days to get your tourist visa rather than 1 - not really a problem if you've bought your tickets in February for your holiday in July, as many people do.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of Malaysia as another country in this region which doesn't need a visa to enter the country. Getting a visa is a perfectly accepted and normal part of many western people's planning process when they holiday in Asia. I can't imagine too many people chose Thailand as their holiday destination over, say, Vietnam because with Vietnam they needed to get a visa in advance and they didn't with Thailand.

Indeed. The thai visa exemption system is an exception. For that matter, it wouldn't be ridiculous to scrap it.

Again, people forget the special situation we are in. We have the military at the gvt, for probably a long time, facing "internal security issues" along with a rebellion in the south.

Highly nationalist too.

They are so paranoid that they even asked their embassy in Cambodia to tighten screening of applicants because "international terrorists" could sneak into Thailand... And this is not a rumor.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...newsid=30034562

And a few days after, they start to say that "hundreds of Cambodian Muslims with links to the Jemaah Islamiyah (JI) extremist network had slipped into Thailand".

But do cambodians need ... visa to come to Thailand ?

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=118818

Paranoia again and extreme confusion of a government feeling besieged.

After the visa shake up of october, the next step could be to scrap the visa exemption. No more "calculation" problems at the borders. And after, they will refuse back to back tourist visas (no more than 6 month per year in Thailand, on tourist visas).

Voila. Case closed.

Visa exemption is a symbol of an open society. Exactly the opposite of our times of "war on terror" globally, and the thai junta locally.

From a thai military perspective, again, it makes perfectly sense to tighten the whole visa system. They have started to do it last october.

Why would they stop now ?

[Austhaied]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China. It will mean a lot of extra admin at first, but the result would probably be that it takes perhaps 3 days to get your tourist visa rather than 1 - not really a problem if you've bought your tickets in February for your holiday in July, as many people do.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of Malaysia as another country in this region which doesn't need a visa to enter the country. Getting a visa is a perfectly accepted and normal part of many western people's planning process when they holiday in Asia. I can't imagine too many people chose Thailand as their holiday destination over, say, Vietnam because with Vietnam they needed to get a visa in advance and they didn't with Thailand.

Would be a bit of a pain in the arse, true, but not the catastrophe that some people here are making it out to be.

Off the top of my head i can think of at least 2 other countries in the region that don't require a visa (but will issue visas on arrival).. Indonesia and Singapore. Theres probably more as well..Sorry for being pedantic..

Edited May 20, 2007 by Austhaied

[jdinasia]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China. It will mean a lot of extra admin at first, but the result would probably be that it takes perhaps 3 days to get your tourist visa rather than 1 - not really a problem if you've bought your tickets in February for your holiday in July, as many people do.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of Malaysia as another country in this region which doesn't need a visa to enter the country. Getting a visa is a perfectly accepted and normal part of many western people's planning process when they holiday in Asia. I can't imagine too many people chose Thailand as their holiday destination over, say, Vietnam because with Vietnam they needed to get a visa in advance and they didn't with Thailand.

Indeed. The thai visa exemption system is an exception. For that matter, it wouldn't be ridiculous to scrap it.

Again, people forget the special situation we are in. We have the military at the gvt, for probably a long time, facing "internal security issues" along with a rebellion in the south.

Highly nationalist too.

They are so paranoid that they even asked their embassy in Cambodia to tighten screening of applicants because "international terrorists" could sneak into Thailand... And this is not a rumor.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...newsid=30034562

And a few days after, they start to say that "hundreds of Cambodian Muslims with links to the Jemaah Islamiyah (JI) extremist network had slipped into Thailand".

But do cambodians need ... visa to come to Thailand ?

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=118818

Paranoia again and extreme confusion of a government feeling besieged.

After the visa shake up of october, the next step could be to scrap the visa exemption. No more "calculation" problems at the borders. And after, they will refuse back to back tourist visas (no more than 6 month per year in Thailand, on tourist visas).

Voila. Case closed.

Visa exemption is a symbol of an open society. Exactly the opposite of our times of "war on terror" globally, and the thai junta locally.

From a thai military perspective, again, it makes perfectly sense to tighten the whole visa system. They have started to do it last october.

Why would they stop now ?

you mean by enforcing existing laws? lol ....

why? tourism of course!

[TBWG]

Why is it so unbelievable? Many other countries in Asia require a visa in advance, including large and more developed countries like India and China. It will mean a lot of extra admin at first, but the result would probably be that it takes perhaps 3 days to get your tourist visa rather than 1 - not really a problem if you've bought your tickets in February for your holiday in July, as many people do.

Off the top of my head, I can only think of Malaysia as another country in this region which doesn't need a visa to enter the country. Getting a visa is a perfectly accepted and normal part of many western people's planning process when they holiday in Asia. I can't imagine too many people chose Thailand as their holiday destination over, say, Vietnam because with Vietnam they needed to get a visa in advance and they didn't with Thailand.

Would be a bit of a pain in the arse, true, but not the catastrophe that some people here are making it out to be.

Off the top of my head i can think of at least 2 other countries in the region that don't require a visa (but will issue visas on arrival).. Indonesia and Singapore. Theres probably more as well..Sorry for being pedantic..

Hi

You can add Hong Kong and Macau to the list.

If you think getting a Visa for SE Asia is a pain in the a**e try getting one for the good ol US of A.

TBWG

[jdinasia]

That Evisa from Oz sure was a pain too <not!>

[farangsay]

Off the top of my head i can think of at least 2 other countries in the region that don't require a visa (but will issue visas on arrival).. Indonesia and Singapore. Theres probably more as well..Sorry for being pedantic..

Actually last time I was in Singapore it was "visa exemption , welcome to Singapore Sir" but

that might have been before some of us were born.

In more recent times Cambodia , Laos and Myanmar were issuing COA (cash on arrival) visas for

suitable visitors.

Does pedantic translate as stupid for participating in a thread such as this one , for then I too am guilty?

[Austhaied]

Off the top of my head i can think of at least 2 other countries in the region that don't require a visa (but will issue visas on arrival).. Indonesia and Singapore. Theres probably more as well..Sorry for being pedantic..

Actually last time I was in Singapore it was "visa exemption , welcome to Singapore Sir" but

that might have been before some of us were born.

In more recent times Cambodia , Laos and Myanmar were issuing COA (cash on arrival) visas for

suitable visitors.

Does pedantic translate as stupid for participating in a thread such as this one , for then I too am guilty?

Pedantic..

1. Like a pedant, overly concerned with formal rules and trivial points of learning.

2. Being showy of one’s knowledge, often in a boring manner.

3. Often used to describe a person who emphasizes his/her knowledge through the use of vocabulary; ostentatious in one’s learning.

4. Being finicky or picky with language.

[jdinasia]

5. quoting dictionaries

[farangsay]

Off the top of my head i can think of at least 2 other countries in the region that don't require a visa (but will issue visas on arrival).. Indonesia and Singapore. Theres probably more as well..Sorry for being pedantic..

Actually last time I was in Singapore it was "visa exemption , welcome to Singapore Sir" but

that might have been before some of us were born.

In more recent times Cambodia , Laos and Myanmar were issuing COA (cash on arrival) visas for

suitable visitors.

Does pedantic translate as stupid for participating in a thread such as this one , for then I too am guilty?

Pedantic..

1. Like a pedant, overly concerned with formal rules and trivial points of learning.

2. Being showy of one’s knowledge, often in a boring manner.

3. Often used to describe a person who emphasizes his/her knowledge through the use of vocabulary; ostentatious in one’s learning.

4. Being finicky or picky with language.

Please Sir , which boxes should I tick on my visa application to cover these issues.

Actually , come to think of it , I'm only "finicky or picky" in regard to food or women

so an indication for 1 - 3 will suffice.

[Badbanker]

So here we have it. Thailand has the most successful tourist industry in the world. Many other countries have come here to examine this success and try to emulate it. It means BIG bucks for anyone that can achieve it.

One of the basic tenants of Thailands tourism success is the VOA. Malaysia, Singapore and Indonesia locally also have VOA and are trying desperately to boost their lagging tourism market. If Thailand was to change this it WOULD have a negative effect and casue Thailand to lose tourist dollars to these 3 countries or the indochins countries, something THailand I believe would never agree to.

Paid for VOA is still going to make big lines and big headaches for many people. Again not something the Thai tourism industry wants or needs. Thailand is seen as being welcoming, something we may not be seen as if we start taking money up front.

Badbanker

[siampaulibuyasia]

hello, i live here and my daughter is coming here for 2 months from the UK i have been told by a friend now that it is possible for her to get stopped coming here until she gets a 60 day visa is this true now ? can she get stopped at heathrow and stopped coming here until she gets a 60 day visa from the UK ??

[calibanjr.]

hello, i live here and my daughter is coming here for 2 months from the UK i have been told by a friend now that it is possible for her to get stopped coming here until she gets a 60 day visa is this true now ? can she get stopped at heathrow and stopped coming here until she gets a 60 day visa from the UK ??

If she's coming here for two months, why even worry, have her get the Tourist Visa. She won't have to sweat the rumor-mill, and won't have to make a visa run even if she wants to stay three months (extension)!

Personally, I'd recommend anybody to get a Tourist Visa from home unless there are emergency time constraints on their travel. It's just a worry that can be sorted out in advance.

[lopburi3]

You must have an outbound ticket within 30 days to qualify for 30 day visa exempt entry. She would not have that and the airline could well tell her she can not board. Have her get a tourist visa.

[dantilley]

One of the basic tenants of Thailands tourism success is the VOA.

Rubbish. You think when people are leafing through the travel brochures and deciding where to go they think "hang on, you don't need a visa for Thailand do you? Well, that's a weight off my mind, forget all this research let's go there."

It will make little to no difference to people's holiday decisions - if they're planning a 2 week package holiday, they just post their passport off along with a cheque some time in the many months before they leave, and it comes back in the mail a few days later with a visa in it. If they're backpacking around the region, they just hand their passport in at their hotel in whichever neighbouring country they're in and it is given back to them a few days later with a visa in it.

Incidentally, Vietnam has one of the most booming tourist industries in Asia, yet requires a visa to enter.

All of this may be moot anyway if the "rumour" is just the result of Chinese whispers as Maestro suggested.

[gregchambers]

Sounds like someone from VFS has had a word with the powers that be, shown them how they can rake off a huge sum with no cash outlay from letting them do the tourist visa for them - has to be a winner for a cash strapped government.

[JR Texas]

Sounds like someone from VFS has had a word with the powers that be, shown them how they can rake off a huge sum with no cash outlay from letting them do the tourist visa for them - has to be a winner for a cash strapped government.

JR Texas: Many of the previous comments reveal the curious assumption that getting a VE at the border involves less screening for possible criminal behavior that getting a TV at an external embassy. It doesn't!

To get a VE now, you must first exit Thailand (check #1), then you enter another country (check #2), then you exit the country (check #3), then you enter Thailand (check #4). All done via computer checks and police intuition/experience.

The myth that continues to persist is that the computer checks are inadequate and therefore some Three Stooges official working outside of Thailand at an embassy can do a better job finding the "bad guy."

Beware of the securitization of migration......especially the attempt to link migration to crime/terrorism. It is this type of faulty and xenophobic thinking that puts pressure on govts. to stop immigration and to start enacting policies to force expats out.

The amazing thing to me is that so many grandfathered in expats in Thailand embrace the securitization myth and have no idea how it might eventually lead to the visa bar being raised right up to their necks.

"All in all its (Thailand's visa/business rules) just another brick in the Wall."

--Pink Floyd

[jeebusjones]

So here we have it. Thailand has the most successful tourist industry in the world. Many other countries have come here to examine this success and try to emulate it. It means BIG bucks for anyone that can achieve it.

Thailand is not even close to having the world's most successful tourist industry. For number of arrivals per year, the top three are:

1 - France 77 million

2 - Spain 52.3 million

3 - USA 41.9 million

With roughly 12 million per year, Thailand doesn't even make the top ten, and comes behind Turkey.

For number of $$ earned from tourism, the top three are:

1 - USA $66.7 Billion

2 - Spain $33.8 Billion

3 - France $32.7 billion

Again, Thailand doesn't make the top ten. I can't find statistics for how much Thailand earns, but as I recall it accounts for 5% of the Thai economy.

Mark me down as Pedantic definition 1.

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Tourism_Rankings)