Sudden Joint Pain

[Mickeymaus]

1 minute ago, VocalNeal said:

 

You've got more patience than me. Still no answer.

There are not many rheumatologists in my area and so I don't want to reveal my location. It is not important anyway.

[Gulfsailor]

Be careful with general vitamin B supplements. Most have extremely high amounts of B6. B6 toxicity can lead to all kinds of neurological problems. If you worry about B12 deficiency it’s best to take specific B12 supplements. But check the label because even some of those have added B6. 

[Sheryl]

2 minutes ago, Mickeymaus said:

There are not many rheumatologists in my area and so I don't want to reveal my location. It is not important anyway.

It would have enabled me to give you specific recommendation on where to go and maybe even a specific doctor.

[Mickeymaus]

3 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

You absolutely should not try to pressure a doctor into prescribing these very serious medications for a disease you cleatly do not have.

 

Again: see a neurologist.

Promised. Before I start with something like MTX I will try a neurologist. MTX is really the last resort.

 

In respect of these sublingual Vitamin B 12 pills. Do you know if normal pills have the same effect if I bite on them so that they break and then I keep the contents under the tongue for a while. I could not find any information on the Internet. 

[Sheryl]

Just now, Mickeymaus said:

Promised. Before I start with something like MTX I will try a neurologist. MTX is really the last resort.

 

In respect of these sublingual Vitamin B 12 pills. Do you know if normal pills have the same effect if I bite on them so that they break and then I keep the contents under the tongue for a while. I could not find any information on the Internet. 

They may but will taste awful. You'd need to keep them thete until fully dissolved.

 

Should not take mote than a couple of days to receive from lazada.

[Mickeymaus]

6 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

It would have enabled me to give you specific recommendation on where to go and maybe even a specific doctor.

I sent you a private message with the location. 

[Skallywag]

On 6/23/2021 at 9:07 AM, Mickeymaus said:

I suddenly got joint pain

Try smoking a joint...  “Cannabinoids stop the transmission of pain and decrease inflammation, and that's very important for people with joint issues.”

Drink lots of water or beer also

 

BTW - I am not a doctor.

 

Good luck and stay positive

 

Peace

Edited June 25, 2021 by Skallywag

[Mickeymaus]

31 minutes ago, Skallywag said:

Try smoking a joint...  “Cannabinoids stop the transmission of pain and decrease inflammation, and that's very important for people with joint issues.”

Drink lots of water or beer also

 

BTW - I am not a doctor.

 

Good luck and stay positive

 

Peace

I would try a joint immediately. It might as the name suggests help with joint problems ???? But better not in Thailand. In respect of beer - if it is really a nerve problem then this would not be a good idea.

 

If I am honest. This problem gets so much on my nerves already - in this respect beer could really help... 8 months already and not even an idea so far what it can be. 

[rumak]

1 hour ago, Mickeymaus said:

If not I perhaps will ask a doctor to give me MTX to check if this works. But I really want to avoid such drugs that suppress the immune system if possible.

 

OF course I am not a specialist ......... but.......  agree with you that taking pills should be avoided if at all possible.    I live with some stiffness in my fingers ,  and various aches and pains occasionally .   you are 66      i am 70     

From what you have described it is difficult to figure out.  Maybe even for many doctors.

My experience with the body is that ONLY when I found an exceptional doctor was there a

correct diagnosis  ( bursitis once.....after seeing my third doctor) .   Also back pain i went through an MRI  only to have 3 doctors struggle to explain it.... and of course go to the usual anti-inflamatory and do these stretches spiel .

I use a ball for my foot .... some ice water for my fingers.....  and I walk as much as i can.

 

i just looked but could not find the ice method i use (not needed by me every day) 

I have a small pot with handle i half fill with water.  Put in freezer .   When taken out frozen I add some water to the top and place my hand in until it gets really cold .  Massaging the fingers during the immersion also helps to get into the joints.    I do each hand (actually if you can get both hands in at once its quicker)  three times.

Then dump out the water, put the ice back into freezer for next time.  Easy ...

Try this a few times a day and see how it works.

Never did on feet,  but why not ?    brrrrrrrrr

[VocalNeal]

4 hours ago, Mickeymaus said:

There are not many rheumatologists in my area and so I don't want to reveal my location. It is not important anyway.

 

You might need a neurologist is I think what the offer  was. But hey.

[Mickeymaus]

11 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

 

You might need a neurologist is I think what the offer  was. But hey.

My location is really not important. She sent me already a recommendation with a private message - I asked to send it like this. But in the end - to cut a long story short many doctors were a big disappointment especially here in Thailand. One time I even got a false statement that I have cancer. But they have great dentists. At least I have one. But please don't ask me now for the location of this dentist ????

[Mickeymaus]

Just got back the results from the Vitamin B12 test and sadly this is not the problem. The value was 706 pg/ml. A normal range is from 187 to 883. I didn't take any Vitamin sublements for a week before the test. ESR was 19. Normal range is 0 to 20. So back to square 1.

 

 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Mickeymaus

[Mickeymaus]

On 6/25/2021 at 11:59 AM, Gulfsailor said:

Be careful with general vitamin B supplements. Most have extremely high amounts of B6. B6 toxicity can lead to all kinds of neurological problems. If you worry about B12 deficiency it’s best to take specific B12 supplements. But check the label because even some of those have added B6. 

This is an important advice. I was reading about B vitamins and found this information too. 

[Sheryl]

9 hours ago, Mickeymaus said:

Just got back the results from the Vitamin B12 test and sadly this is not the problem. The value was 706 pg/ml. A normal range is from 187 to 883. I didn't take any Vitamin sublements for a week before the test. ESR was 19. Normal range is 0 to 20. So back to square 1.

 

 

Did you check CRP?

[Nojohndoe]

If along with your apparent routine use of vitamin supplements you also use mineral supplements that are excessive in provision of phosphates over and above what a reasonably healthy diet provides that can also manifest in joint pains.

[Lacessit]

On 6/25/2021 at 11:56 AM, Mickeymaus said:

There are not many rheumatologists in my area and so I don't want to reveal my location. It is not important anyway.

Just PM Sheryl, then you are only revealing your location to her.

It's important because she can steer you to a doctor with a good reputation. She has done it for me.

Edit: Missed the 25/6 message.

Edited July 8, 2021 by Lacessit

[Mickeymaus]

2 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Did you check CRP?

The rheumatologist did this. I even got checked for Chikungunya. Of course RF and all possible other inflammation markers were checked in the meantime several times with several months between them. All don't show any inflammation - not even a small one.

 

Today I had a lot of pain again in all fingers and toes. Have it every day but not so bad. I found stories of other people with a similar experience. The doctor refused to acknowledge their problem as RA. But after a certain time inflammation markers went up and the symptoms were more clear.

 

Now it is nine months already. I am worried that I might start too late with an RA treatment. But I am still not sure if it is RA. All the symptoms like sudden pain (it was suddenly there and didn't start slowly) in all toes and fingers and always symmetric point in this direction. And there are seronegative cases without inflammation markers. But I also have to admit that I never saw a person with RA in my life. And I am not happy to start with DMART or other drugs that suppress the immune system. Especially not now where we have Covid. I don't know what to do next if I am honest. A Vitamin B12 problem would have been great... 

 

Edited July 8, 2021 by Mickeymaus

[Mickeymaus]

2 hours ago, Nojohndoe said:

If along with your apparent routine use of vitamin supplements you also use mineral supplements that are excessive in provision of phosphates over and above what a reasonably healthy diet provides that can also manifest in joint pains.

I don't take mineral supplements. Centrum vitamins I take sometimes but not every day and only half a pill. Vitamin B supplements perhaps once a week. 

 

In the many months I tried many things. I didn't drink Pepsi Max for many weeks (you write phosphates), I didn't eat some things like eggs for many weeks, I didn't drink juice for many weeks, no alcohol for many weeks, I am not fat but I got rid of 8 Kilo, no salt, sugar I avoid anyway and whatever. Took Tumeric, Fish Oil and Ginger. Nothing changed anything. 

[Sheryl]

1 hour ago, Mickeymaus said:

The rheumatologist did this. I even got checked for Chikungunya. Of course RF and all possible other inflammation markers were checked in the meantime several times with several months between them. All don't show any inflammation - not even a small one.

 

Today I had a lot of pain again in all fingers and toes. Have it every day but not so bad. I found stories of other people with a similar experience. The doctor refused to acknowledge their problem as RA. But after a certain time inflammation markers went up and the symptoms were more clear.

 

Now it is nine months already. I am worried that I might start too late with an RA treatment. But I am still not sure if it is RA. All the symptoms like sudden pain (it was suddenly there and didn't start slowly) in all toes and fingers and always symmetric point in this direction. And there are seronegative cases without inflammation markers. But I also have to admit that I never saw a person with RA in my life. And I am not happy to start with DMART or other drugs that suppress the immune system. Especially not now where we have Covid. I don't know what to do next if I am honest. A Vitamin B12 problem would have been great... 

 

It is definitely not RA. It does not appear to be an inflammatory condition of any type.

 

In RA in addition to inflammation markers there are clinical signs on Xray etc. which you apparently do nto have.  You need to abandon this self diagnosis and look elsewhere.

 

As previously advised, you need to see a neurologist.

 

 

[Mickeymaus]

6 hours ago, Sheryl said:

It is definitely not RA. It does not appear to be an inflammatory condition of any type.

 

In RA in addition to inflammation markers there are clinical signs on Xray etc. which you apparently do nto have.  You need to abandon this self diagnosis and look elsewhere.

 

As previously advised, you need to see a neurologist.

 

 

I will try a neurologist. But I don't have any of the symptoms below. I only have pain when I move my joints and no numbness, tingling or whatever is listed below. 

 

Common signs and symptoms of neuropathy include:

Tingling (“pins and needles”) or numbness, especially in the hands and feet. Sensations can spread to the arms and legs.Sharp, burning, throbbing, stabbing or electric-like pain.Changes in sensation. Severe pain, especially at night. Inability to feel pain, pressure, temperature or touch. Extreme sensitivity to touch.Falling, loss of coordination.Not being able to feel things in your feet and hands – feeling like you’re wearing socks or gloves when you’re not.Muscle weakness, difficulty walking or moving your arms or legs.Muscle twitching, cramps and/or spasms.Inability to move a part of the body (paralysis). Loss of muscle control, loss of muscle tone or dropping things out of your hand.Low blood pressure or abnormal heart rate, which causes dizziness when standing up, fainting or lightheadedness.Sweating too much or not enough in relation to the temperature or degree or exertion.Problems with bladder (urination), digestion (including bloating, nausea/vomiting) and bowels (including diarrhea, constipation).Sexual function problems.Weight loss (unintentional).

[Sheryl]

4 minutes ago, Mickeymaus said:

I will try a neurologist. But I don't have any of the symptoms below. I only have pain when I move my joints and no numbness, tingling or whatever is listed below. 

 

Common signs and symptoms of neuropathy include:

Tingling (“pins and needles”) or numbness, especially in the hands and feet. Sensations can spread to the arms and legs.Sharp, burning, throbbing, stabbing or electric-like pain.Changes in sensation. Severe pain, especially at night. Inability to feel pain, pressure, temperature or touch. Extreme sensitivity to touch.Falling, loss of coordination.Not being able to feel things in your feet and hands – feeling like you’re wearing socks or gloves when you’re not.Muscle weakness, difficulty walking or moving your arms or legs.Muscle twitching, cramps and/or spasms.Inability to move a part of the body (paralysis). Loss of muscle control, loss of muscle tone or dropping things out of your hand.Low blood pressure or abnormal heart rate, which causes dizziness when standing up, fainting or lightheadedness.Sweating too much or not enough in relation to the temperature or degree or exertion.Problems with bladder (urination), digestion (including bloating, nausea/vomiting) and bowels (including diarrhea, constipation).Sexual function problems.Weight loss (unintentional).

It is not at all necessary (or even common) to have all the symptoms mentioned.

 

Pain in fingers and toes is plenty.

 

Google really, really really is not suited to making medical diagnoses.  What it does is just go through every article ever written about a condition (some of which may have used a totally different definition than others) and then list every symptom ever mentioned in any article, ever. It does not give you a sense for which are common and which are rare and certainly does nto provide the diagnostic criteria nor information of how to make a differential diagnosis.

 

If it is nto a neurological issue then the remaining possiblility is that the problem is circulatory. As the finders and toes are the most distal parts of the body they will suffer first (and most) if there is any circulatory impairment).

[Mickeymaus]

15 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

It is not at all necessary (or even common) to have all the symptoms mentioned.

 

Pain in fingers and toes is plenty.

 

Google really, really really is not suited to making medical diagnoses.  What it does is just go through every article ever written about a condition (some of which may have used a totally different definition than others) and then list every symptom ever mentioned in any article, ever. It does not give you a sense for which are common and which are rare and certainly does nto provide the diagnostic criteria nor information of how to make a differential diagnosis.

 

If it is nto a neurological issue then the remaining possiblility is that the problem is circulatory. As the finders and toes are the most distal parts of the body they will suffer first (and most) if there is any circulatory impairment).

I will check with the neurologist. But take a circulatory impairment. This does not develop within an hour and at so many joints at the same time. It really was like this. I didn't have any joint problems before this hour. It started suddenly. At first I thought it came quickly and it will disappear quickly and I didn't care much. But so far it didn't disappear.