SURVEY: Omicron--Dangerous, Worrisome or Overblown?

[TropicalGuy]

SA data is political & unaccountable so Ignore.False Comparison with UK.

SA Population COMPLETELY Different Health Profile to UK :Covid - Vulnerable DNA, Widespread Poverty, Chronically Bad Health, Highly Unfit with Massive Underlying Conditions.????

 

We know mRNA Boosters raise Omicron Protection levels over 50%.????
From near Zero it seems with AZ primary vax.
Protection Improves further & substantially by being FIT.
Time is Up Now w/Omicron, for Abuser Unfit / Unvaxxed.
Self -Abusers with Obesity/ Alcoholism/Smoking / Drug problems have been on Notice to QUIT and get FIT since March 2020. Too Late Now.????

 

[Danderman123]

20 minutes ago, fjb 24 said:

WHAT! Are you serious! 555

So. vaccinated people don't spread covid.

Ouch, that's a mega false porkie and I would say something, but I best not. I think it's better to ignore you.

Vaccinated people are up to 90% protected from Delta infection. We don’t have the data yet on Omicron.

 

But unvaccinated people have no protection, and spread Covid widely. As we see in Real Life.

[Danderman123]

7 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Death WITH, or FROM?

Underlying health problems, obese, smoke, use drugs etc etc etc.

Not enough info as yet, and will we ever know the truth?

Soon, there will be hundreds dead from Omicron, and you will have to find another talking point to waste our time with.

 

[Danderman123]

22 minutes ago, fjb 24 said:

No, but some would, liberal prosecutors likely.

So, if a murderer should be convicted for killing somebody, don’t you think that Covid should be stopped?

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, Danderman123 said:

Soon, there will be hundreds dead from Omicron, and you will have to find another talking point to waste our time with.

 

Right now the infection rate is rising rapidly, hospitalizations are following the curve.

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

11 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Death WITH, or FROM?

Underlying health problems, obese, smoke, use drugs etc etc etc.

Not enough info as yet, and will we ever know the truth?

Here’s some truth, millions of people live with chronic underlying health conditions, many for years or decades.

 

Here’s another truth, Doctors (who are trained in matters of health) determine the cause of death and sign the death certificates.

 

 

[Bkk Brian]

1 hour ago, fjb 24 said:

Too bad, BUT the reality is you just don't like the factual data, figures, charts, evidence, etc that goes against your ideology, that you really hate so much. I know this, it's human nature. Serious character flaw to be so full of hate.

"factual data, figures, charts, evidence"

????

Edited December 20, 2021 by Bkk Brian

[Kadilo]

1 hour ago, fjb 24 said:

Too bad, BUT the reality is you just don't like the factual data, figures, charts, evidence, etc that goes against your ideology, that you really hate so much. I know this, it's human nature. Serious character flaw to be so full of hate.

Indeed, but sadly the norm for some. You carry on, it’s refreshing to read different posts of view. Dont be put off by the usual negative responses. 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Kadilo

[Bkk Brian]

7 minutes ago, fjb 24 said:

See, in your head 24/7 ....just like trump is.

 

Whats trump got to do with Omicron.................................that fool left office a long time ago anyway 

[Rimmer]

A series of off topic troll attacks on another member have been removed

[Virt]

1 hour ago, fjb 24 said:

Check this, is this a chart showing hospitalizations of vaxxed and unvaxxed? I don't see the data presented in Eng.

Thanks for your assistance.

It's from the danish national serum institute.

 

It shows an important thing.

The unvaccinated are admitted to  hospitals 4 times more often compared to fully vaccinated people, when you look at the full picture.

 

31,7 pr 100,000 unvaccinated is in hospital.

7.5 pr 100,000 fully vaccinated is in hospital.

 

This picture is a bit blurred since it's only natural that those above 80 has a higher risk of getting admitted to hospital if they get COVID, so let's take a look at the younger generation.

 

If you look at the age groups below 75, the amount of unvaccinated people in hospital are way higher than fully vaccinated people.

 

Look at the age groups 20-74 in the left down corner.

The unvaxxed group are the light blue column.

Then look at those age 40-64.

More than 8 x unvaccinated in hospital compared to fully vaccinated.

 

Even the group from age 20-35 has 6 x more unvaccinated in hospitals compared to fully vaccinated.

 

I left out mentioning the ones partly vaccinated, because they are in the twilight zone, and not fair to incorporate them into any of the other two groups.

 

Overall this chart is quite a good indicator showing why it is a good idea to take the vaccine.

[Kadilo]

Today’s UK Covid update:

 

 

 

New cases up around 1,700. 
New Deaths with Covid sharp fall to 44 along with a fall of 133 in hospital with Covid. 
 

Johnson called a cabinet meeting to discuss the situation. Summary of which from the BBC:

 

• As a result ministers have to "reserve the possibility of taking further action" to protect public health and the NHS - with a range of measures being considered and "nothing" ruled out
• The PM acknowledged the impact of recent behavioural changes by some people - such as booking cancellations - on businesses including the hospitality industry - saying the economic impacts would be kept "under constant review"
• He insisted a photo of a gathering in the Downing Street garden while the UK was under Covid restrictions last year, was of "people at work, talking about work" (lol)

He also said “it could not get more urgent”…………….so for now we will do nothing, so clearly not that urgent 

 

I think it’s called Political Paralysis, his own party are holding him to ransom and today  the “gathering” pics from last May where he held a “business” meeting with his wife, baby and others in the gardens of number 10 with wine, no social distancing and mixing of households…….despite a televised briefing by Hancock the same evening telling everyone not to. 
 

Another “do what I say not what I do” moment from the crippled, dysfunctional leaderless government  

 

Edited December 20, 2021 by Kadilo

[i84teen]

5 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Huh?

 

[Scott]

A post violating Fair Use Policy has been removed along with replies.

 

[TorquayFan]

Mommysboy thanks for that - that's 'superimmunity' where Covid is caught AFTER being double vaxed. Unfortunately, it seems Omicron can evade the immunity in those infected BEFORE and vaxed later.

 

I wonder if those reinfected in this way then get that 'superimmunity' second time around ? Who knows?

 

(The DM despite being widely regarded as a 'rag' seems to me one of the best MSM in publishing Covid details).

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by TorquayFan
tidy up

[Bkk Brian]

Interesting figures here from the UK and how this may play out in other countries including Thailand?

 

Numbers now for Omicron have dipped, Omicron is slowing slightly in its growth. 2 new official confirmed Omicron deaths bringing the total to 14, hospitalizations just 129 at the moment.

 

This is encouraging at the moment and as a couple of experts have stated that the UK should hold off more serious measures to see how this plays out.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1042543/20211220_OS_Daily_Omicron_Overview.pdf

Edited December 21, 2021 by Bkk Brian

[TorquayFan]

BKK Brian - thanks for that and it's 'encouraging' as you say.

 

Quite a few people follow (Dr) John Campbell - I only do so occasionally. But when JC reviewed the latest data from an RSA Hospital report recently, he concluded with words to the effect that as Omicron takes over, with symptoms less severe, it might prove to be the beginning of the end of the pandemic. Nice idea but at the time I thought he was being EXTREMELY optimistic. Interesting though.

 

Myself I don't understand how one variant can replace another - seems logical to me that a new variant would be additional ? Or is it only that if a new variant gobbles up all the victims first, there's none left for the others, (if you see what I mean).

[i84teen]

The omicron situation is waning in strength and has mild symptoms similar to the common cold.

1. New cases are dropping now in S Africa.
2. Delta cases are surging across Europe, USA and other highly vaccinated countries
3. Covid death rates in S Africa are lower than Thailand and a fraction of death rates in Europe, USA and many other highly vaccinated countries
4. omicron infections are increasing dramatically in  NY and NJ where it accounts for 13% of covid cases in those states despite high vaccination rates.

Notes;

1. WHO advises caution: “Do not underestimate Omicron”

2. CDC officials said they do not yet have estimates of how many hospitalizations or deaths are due to omicron

3. UK reports 12 deaths on 12,133 omicron cases

4. U.S. records first death believed related to Omicron variant**

5. ** extensive searches reveal no know omicron deaths aside from one noted above

6. "Omicron cases are expected to peak in a matter of weeks...."

I am no expert, so I don't know how deadly omicron is or will become but at this time it's nowhere near as lethal as Delta (numbers speak for themselves) when considering the case fatality rate especially in S Africa and UK and only mild cold like symptoms and no severe illness's, infections, etc noted till date.

Edited December 21, 2021 by i84teen

[Bkk Brian]

14 minutes ago, TorquayFan said:

BKK Brian - thanks for that and it's 'encouraging' as you say.

 

Quite a few people follow (Dr) John Campbell - I only do so occasionally. But when JC reviewed the latest data from an RSA Hospital report recently, he concluded with words to the effect that as Omicron takes over, with symptoms less severe, it might prove to be the beginning of the end of the pandemic. Nice idea but at the time I thought he was being EXTREMELY optimistic. Interesting though.

 

Myself I don't understand how one variant can replace another - seems logical to me that a new variant would be additional ? Or is it only that if a new variant gobbles up all the victims first, there's none left for the others, (if you see what I mean).

Yes I would also say he was being overly optimistic in that first video although he did backtrack in a later video and said numbers would rise to a million a day! I don't pay much attention to him to be honest, his explanations of studies can all be found before he announces them through the direct sources but he does provide a useful explanation as he see's it through his eyes.

 

Anyway I did forget to mention in my post the massive wall of immunity the UK has built through its vaccination process and that now seems to be paying off. So this may not bode well for countries that have still got a long way to go with vaccines?

 

Indications are that Omicron may kill off delta but there are also questions being raised that they may live together? 

Edited December 21, 2021 by Bkk Brian

[Chomper Higgot]

25 minutes ago, i84teen said:

The omicron situation is waning in strength and has mild symptoms similar to the common cold.

1. New cases are dropping now in S Africa.
2. Delta cases are surging across Europe, USA and other highly vaccinated countries
3. Covid death rates in S Africa are lower than Thailand and a fraction of death rates in Europe, USA and many other highly vaccinated countries
4. omicron infections are increasing dramatically in  NY and NJ where it accounts for 13% of covid cases in those states despite high vaccination rates.

Notes;

1. WHO advises caution: “Do not underestimate Omicron”

2. CDC officials said they do not yet have estimates of how many hospitalizations or deaths are due to omicron

3. UK reports 12 deaths on 12,133 omicron cases

4. U.S. records first death believed related to Omicron variant**

5. ** extensive searches reveal no know omicron deaths aside from one noted above

6. "Omicron cases are expected to peak in a matter of weeks...."

I am no expert, so I don't know how deadly omicron is or will become but at this time it's nowhere near as lethal as Delta (numbers speak for themselves) when considering the case fatality rate especially in S Africa and UK and only mild cold like symptoms and no severe illness's, infections, etc noted till date.

The lethality of the variant is only part of the equation.

 

How fast is it filling hospital beds and how does a person infected with Omicron know they don’t have delta (and therefore require to follow Delta protocols)?

 

But yes if it’s killing fewer, that is very good news.

[Rimmer]

Some off topic posts dragging Boris Johnson into the topic have been removed also replies

[i84teen]

1 hour ago, Chomper Higgot said:

How fast is it filling hospital beds

I don't believe hospitals are filling up with omicron patients as of today's reports, neither are the morgues.

Use your common sense in protecting yourself against covid as you normally do.

• "Omicron Isn’t Fueling Surge in Hospitalizations: Virus Update"
• Omicron surge is causing far less hospitalization than Delta did, South Africa minister says: 1.7% instead of 19%"
• Early data suggests South Africa’s Covid hospitalizations are lower in the Omicron wave, but caveats apply.

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, i84teen said:

I don't believe hospitals are filling up with omicron patients as of today's reports, neither are the morgues.

Use your common sense in protecting yourself against covid as you normally do.

• "Omicron Isn’t Fueling Surge in Hospitalizations: Virus Update"
• Omicron surge is causing far less hospitalization than Delta did, South Africa minister says: 1.7% instead of 19%"
• Early data suggests South Africa’s Covid hospitalizations are lower in the Omicron wave, but caveats apply.

I hope you are correct on both points but observe the following:

 

Your links all relate to SA and has as been discussed the data from that country may for numerous significant reasons not translate to the experiences of other nations.

 

My common sense says get vaccinated, get a booster and the science based public health advice.

 

Others have a completely different idea of what constitutes common sense in these matters.

[Danderman123]

3 hours ago, TorquayFan said:

BKK Brian - thanks for that and it's 'encouraging' as you say.

 

Quite a few people follow (Dr) John Campbell - I only do so occasionally. But when JC reviewed the latest data from an RSA Hospital report recently, he concluded with words to the effect that as Omicron takes over, with symptoms less severe, it might prove to be the beginning of the end of the pandemic. Nice idea but at the time I thought he was being EXTREMELY optimistic. Interesting though.

 

Myself I don't understand how one variant can replace another - seems logical to me that a new variant would be additional ? Or is it only that if a new variant gobbles up all the victims first, there's none left for the others, (if you see what I mean).

Good question. 

 

There may be a pool of individuals liable to infection, ie people with a lot of daily contact with others, and if they are infected with Omicron first, they may have immunity against Delta. 

[i84teen]

13 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

Your links all relate to SA and has as been discussed the data from that country may for numerous significant reasons not translate to the experiences of other nations

And why would it, S Africa is one of a only a few country's currently with omicron as the dominant variant, Botswana is close at 48%. I have checked and no countries are reporting sharp increases in hospitalizations yet, but somewhere I read that >70% of new infections in US now (Date Expl reports about 20%) are omicron variant but hospitals are not reporting increased hospitalizations that I can see. Very infections indeed, like an R_1.5 or higher, but not associated with severe illness to speak of.

As for booster shots, there have been no clinical trials to assess its safety and efficacy anywhere in the world AFAIK.
We should first gather the clinical data of the third dose so that we can make out how safe and effective it is. Without proper studies, I would not take an untested booster vaccine. There is always the risk of Antibody-dependent Enhancement (ADE).

To each his own though.

 

 

[Danderman123]

31 minutes ago, i84teen said:

 

We should first gather the clinical data of the third dose so that we can make out how safe and effective it is. Without proper studies, I would not take an untested booster vaccine. There is always the risk of Antibody-dependent Enhancement (ADE).

To each his own though.

 

 

There have been proper studies, the boosters are safe. 

 

 

[Chomper Higgot]

1 hour ago, i84teen said:

And why would it, S Africa is one of a only a few country's currently with omicron as the dominant variant, Botswana is close at 48%. I have checked and no countries are reporting sharp increases in hospitalizations yet, but somewhere I read that >70% of new infections in US now (Date Expl reports about 20%) are omicron variant but hospitals are not reporting increased hospitalizations that I can see. Very infections indeed, like an R_1.5 or higher, but not associated with severe illness to speak of.

As for booster shots, there have been no clinical trials to assess its safety and efficacy anywhere in the world AFAIK.
We should first gather the clinical data of the third dose so that we can make out how safe and effective it is. Without proper studies, I would not take an untested booster vaccine. There is always the risk of Antibody-dependent Enhancement (ADE).

To each his own though.

 

 

I sincerely hope Omicron does not cause high numbers of hospitalizations, but there is currently insufficient data to say whether or not it does.

 

What we do know is highly contagious and those infected are unable to work during their illness, this alone is cause for concern.

[i84teen]

3 hours ago, Danderman123 said:

proper studies

What studies are you referring to? Clinical trials? Have a link?

I believe the Phase 2/3  segments are ongoing and will be completed in 2023.

 

[Danderman123]

11 minutes ago, i84teen said:

What studies are you referring to? Clinical trials? Have a link?

I believe the Phase 2/3  segments are ongoing and will be completed in 2023.

 

Boosters are the same formulation as the original vaccine, which is well tested.

 

if you are so worried about unknown substances in your body, why don’t you worry about the Covid virus? That has killed over 5 million people, so far. 

[Chomper Higgot]

33 minutes ago, i84teen said:

What studies are you referring to? Clinical trials? Have a link?

I believe the Phase 2/3  segments are ongoing and will be completed in 2023.

 

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/covid-19-booster-vaccines-are-they-safe-and-effective

 

and

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0140673621027173

Edited December 21, 2021 by Chomper Higgot