TAT: Thailand needs high earning, high quality tourists - "value over volume" to get 80% back by 2023

[Pravda]

1 minute ago, Kaopad999 said:

Yes, my story is similar to yours. My first time in Thailand was the year 2011 for a 2 month stay, i liked it so much at the time, I deiced moved here 2012 (been here ever sine) . 

My feelings are exactly the same as yours. i have also often wondered if it's just me becoming more cynical with older age, but after hearing many other people say the same thing, i'm starting to think that there must be some truth in it. 
I also feel that the people are not as open and friendly as they were back then, which would make sense given that the country is being run by a xenophobic government.

 

Been a member of the Thai forums for 20 years, years before I moved to Thailand. It's always the same thing. Thailand didn't change. You did. Actually in my opinion Thailand has much improved since my first backpacking trip in 2003. 

[Mac Mickmanus]

2 minutes ago, Pravda said:

 

Been a member of the Thai forums for 20 years, years before I moved to Thailand. It's always the same thing. Thailand didn't change. You did. Actually in my opinion Thailand has much improved since my first backpacking trip in 2003. 

Thailand has changed a lot over the last 20 years  , visa restrictions and licensing laws to name but two things that have drastically changed recently 

[mokwit]

5 minutes ago, Kaopad999 said:

I also feel that the people are not as open and friendly as they were back then

Having been here since 1995, I have to say I feel the complete opposite, IMO at street level Thailand has never been friendlier, or more accurately the ordinary Thai no longer has that reserve about engaging with foreigners. I have to exchange greetings with so many people when i am out and about in my area that sometimes it is almost too much for me - I feel like buying a false nose and mustache just to get the relief of being incognito  - yes I know, I should make the effort. -

[MasterBaker]

this is as stupid as making Pattaya a family resort. Sex industry was killed then, now tourism industry will be slaughtered too

[MichiganMarty]

what you want or need is not the same as what you'll get

[AussieBob9999]

58 minutes ago, Andrew65 said:

I remember about 15 years ago they reckoned they were going to make Koh Chang a high-end kind of place, never happened.

I had a very wealthy (probably $10 million+) Swedish friend who spent many years living in Thailand. His thoughts were that Thailand was not developed enough or 'clean' enough for him. For some years he had talked of going to live in Spain.

Hua Hin?  Lots of Scandinavian Expats have left there since 2015.  When we were there looking at Golf Courses, one of the the Course Managers tried to sell me his house, as did a few others while we were there (2 weeks). 

[John Drake]

2 hours ago, Banana7 said:

Here is what sidewalks look like on Pattaya Klang, a major street in Pattaya. Pattaya is one of the major top 4 international tourist destinations in Thailand. Sidewalks, pedestrian walkways are in pathetic shape. Pattaya Tai sidewalk has been under construction for more than a year and still not finished and parts of the new sidewalk are already breaking.

 

Tourists, whether local or international, don't want to come to places with infrastructure that is falling apart.

 

Quality tourists want to come to high quality destinations, not places as shown in the below photos.

 

 

 

Adventure tour!

[AussieBob9999]

53 minutes ago, aussiexpat said:

Last time I checked I retired at 52 and am worth about 3 million in Australia and about US$1 mill in Thailand...so target for Thai scam

 

But I'm not coming as long as they can 40 cycle me a positive PCR on arrival and lock me up for 14 days

Ditto - except for the part about $3 mill Aus ????

[Jimbo2014]

Not sure high quality tourists like high quality pollution, high levels of corruption and high volume road accidents.    Might need to look at whats on offer.

[wensiensheng]

3 hours ago, AussieBob9999 said:

Very true. 

 

And my question is how do they know that amount - what methods do they use to count tourist expenditures while they are in the country.  I guarantee they are not counting how much they spend with street vendors or local malls and markets or restaurants and bars etc. because there is no way they can count that.  So what are they counting.  TAT reckons Chinese tourists spend more than any other tourists - how do they know that. I reckon their spending numbers are as valid as their arrivals numbers - fantasies created to suit their narrative. 

 

I think they do exit surveys at the airport departure lounges. People are asked what they spent and how happy they were.

 

it’s very easy to skew those surveys by targeting a certain type of person to be surveyed. Not saying TAT did that, but it can easily be done.

Usually a 3rd party company would be employed to do the survey, but if they want to be employed again, they better come up with the right answers. Not saying they did that either, but it’s easily done.

 

and then there’s the sample size, the few times that TAT has revealed that, it’s been ridiculously low, certainly not statistically relevant.

[malibukid]

and Malta is legalizing cannabis

[mokwit]

6 minutes ago, AussieBob9999 said:

Hua Hin?  Lots of Scandinavian Expats have left there since 2015. 

The end of easy to get double entry tourist visas probably didn't help with the Swedish overwinter market - sure they can stay 6 months just do all the paperwork and financials for the new 6 mth tourist visa or OA if 50+ - or maybe they decided Thailand could stick it.

[TheFishman1]

Get rid of the thia pass TIT

[AussieBob9999]

3 minutes ago, wensiensheng said:

I think they do exit surveys at the airport departure lounges. People are asked what they spent and how happy they were.

 

it’s very easy to skew those surveys by targeting a certain type of person to be surveyed. Not saying TAT did that, but it can easily be done.

Usually a 3rd party company would be employed to do the survey, but if they want to be employed again, they better come up with the right answers. Not saying they did that either, but it’s easily done.

 

and then there’s the sample size, the few times that TAT has revealed that, it’s been ridiculously low, certainly not statistically relevant.

That makes sense and is probably right on the nose.  TAT is all about the narrative, which is what the Govt wants to achieve - more Chinese tourists and less Western expats - but rich western tourists OK. 

[SAFETY FIRST]

2 hours ago, Banana7 said:

Here is what sidewalks look like on Pattaya Klang, a major street in Pattaya. Pattaya is one of the major top 4 international tourist destinations in Thailand. Sidewalks, pedestrian walkways are in pathetic shape. Pattaya Tai sidewalk has been under construction for more than a year and still not finished and parts of the new sidewalk are already breaking.

 

Tourists, whether local or international, don't want to come to places with infrastructure that is falling apart.

 

Quality tourists want to come to high quality destinations, not places as shown in the below photos.

 

 

 

This is an unfair post.

 

Pictures of Ongoing work. 
Thai basher, eeh? Lots here I can see, negative comments, etc. Most I reckon are coming from those abroad. 

 

Yes, the worksite is a little different to what we are used to but so are the prices..... council fees, water rates, internet charges etc. 
You want the cake and eat it too. 

 

I like Thailand the way it is, it's not perfect but nor am I. 

 

Yes the OP is asking for quality tourists, it's a fair request. I reckon they should also ask for normal tourists, some of the freaks and weirdos, oddballs and misfits I see arriving is alarming. 
 

[malibukid]

5 hours ago, Kenny202 said:

Typical Thailand. First rate high spending tourists but 3rd rate accommodation, service, safety and scammers. As usual dreaming. You don't get nothing for nothin, and near enough is good enough and a lot of talk ain't gonna cut it. I remember Thailand Tourism was well on the wane before Covid and any hotels I been to in the last few years may have had a nice facade and front of house but go to your room and it was back to the 90's. Many of these places have had little maintenance or upgrades (apart from a lick of paint) since opening. I note 3 lines down in my newsfeed the headline "Taxi driver charged with negligence in death of tourist" lol. I hope Thailand never goes down the route of our foreign Nanny states but if they want to attract even middle class tourists they are going to have to up their game with some basic regulations and high penalties particularly with regards to safety. Last "tour" I went on down near Hua Hin, picked up to go on a boat in a dirty old ute with seats in the back. The driver was an imbecile 80km hour on dirt roads. Cut the corner and slid out. tree branch came in through the back and cut up my wife's arm. That was the end of that dropped on the side if the road. That night at dinner we were told by people that completed the "tour" an elderly man fell down into the water and hurt his leg when the ramp to the boat gave way. Not my first experience of this either. Sitting in a speedboat off Phuket in a speedboat going to an island, 1 meter swell and these fools flat strap with 2 x 250hp Yamahas on the back. Plenty of terrified old people on the boat too and nothing to hang on to. I don't know what was worse that or the night mare transfer back to the hotel in the van from hell.

and they demand that you speak Thai!  only place in the world that they speak Thai i keep telling them.

[AussieBob9999]

1 minute ago, mokwit said:

The end of easy to get double entry tourist visas probably didn't help with the Swedish overwinter market - sure they can stay 6 months just do all the paperwork and financials for the new 6 mth tourist visa or OA if 50+ - or maybe they decided Thailand could stick it.

I have a mate who is from Sweden - he did not live in Hua Hin, but he said the end of easy Visas did a lot of damage to those Scandinavians who wanted 6+6. That plus to general decline in Hua Hin, especially the golfing tours decline, lead to many leaving.  

[Guderian]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Noteworthy in the Phuket Sandbox revival this year was the fact that each tourist spent 70,000 baht, he said. 

Big deal. Over the years in Pattaya I've seen and often met plenty of visitors who are happy to spend 30,000+ Baht a night on having fun here. And that's just what they spent in the bars, their food and hotel costs were on top. I met one guy in a bar beer in Jomtien who was on the last day of his holiday, and the night before he'd gone through 200,000 Baht in drinks, ringing the bell and bar fines. I thought he was making it up, but one of the service ladies I knew well had been with him and she confirmed it. Drop the focus on so-called "quality tourists", why would they want to come to a place with dirty beaches and a murky sea like Pattaya anyway, not to mention the endless scams, lack of pavements and dangerous traffic? Concentrate instead on what Pattaya (and Phuket to a lesser extent) is great at, providing endless fun for sex-starved foreigners.

[mokwit]

5 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

some of the freaks and weirdos, oddballs and misfits I see arriving is alarming. 

Are you one of the "good" falangs? Years ago a female EVP of Bangkok Bank went on record in the Bangkok Post as saying that farang retirees in Thailand were wierdos that no other country would take. They are not sharing your prejudices, they are making their own judgements - and you might not be judged as positively as you think.

Edited December 15, 2021 by mokwit

[Nupy147]

High spending tourists on what!

with more Omicron cases forecasted for January, not quite the proper incentive for most tourists let alone the “high spender”

[mokwit]

7 minutes ago, Guderian said:

the night before he'd gone through 200,000 Baht in drinks, ringing the bell and bar fines.

Years ago I saw a guy with maybe 10 or 12 ladies in tow - smart guy, he did it right and they were costing him Bt500 each hard cash plus meals and accommodation. He had the time of his life for not that much money.

[Skeptic7]

16 minutes ago, mokwit said:

Having been here since 1995, I have to say I feel the complete opposite, IMO at street level Thailand has never been friendlier, or more accurately the ordinary Thai no longer has that reserve about engaging with foreigners. I have to exchange greetings with so many people when i am out and about in my area that sometimes it is almost too much for me - I feel like buying a false nose and mustache just to get the relief of being incognito  - yes I know, I should make the effort. -

About the same, 1992. But we must be somehow sharing a thread spanning the Multiverse!  I could not possibly disagree with you more if I was paid to. I don't see any of what you are experiencing, nor have I in better part of a decade. Am envious of your version of The Bizarre-O World you're in.

[malibukid]

4 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

You may be right, but having lived here for a while, you should know by now, that none of this is appreciated, but that Thailand wants high-spending, overpaying tourists, who throw their money 'out of the window' for just a few days, before heading back to their home country. What long-term tourists or expats do to benefit Thailand's economy or population in the long term (spending way more long-term than a tourist, who's here for a week or two) is not what the ruling class  (and some in the tourism industry) care about.

 

Arrive as a tourist for 10 days, spending 100,000 baht, they want you,

but living here, spending a million baht over the length of a year, they despise you...

of course they do. why?  for one we come from the leading in my case the richest country on the planet and we went to the top universities that most Thai's can only dream of and our governments are far more democratic and offer far more benefits to those that are not as fortunate for various reasons.  not to mention the fact the every American has their day in court, including due process and the rule of law.  try suing a big company here in LOS, good luck

[ThaiFelix]

5 hours ago, webfact said:

Thailand needs high quality tourists

If you want high quality tourists you need to provide high quality services eg

 

High quality ladyboys who pick pocket you in the streets, not old uglies

High quality immigration officers that fleece you if you want to stay longer,

High quality gem scams instead ofd the tired ones at Wat Po

High quality national Parks where double pricing robs you blind

High quality bar girls who actually go to the hotel with you after instead of only scamming you for drinks and tips all night

High quality coral you can touch before hitting you with high quality fines

High quality jet skis yo get scammed for repairs even though you only sat on it for holiday snaps

High quality drains to fall down or low power lines to decapitate you

The list goes on and on.

 

 

[Skeptic7]

3 hours ago, Banana7 said:

Here is what sidewalks look like on Pattaya Klang

Spot on. And we could show similar or worse in every other city. This place is ridiculous. 

[mut462]

Does this guy/gvmt/country not know what the majority of tourists come to Thailand for?

[mokwit]

9 minutes ago, Skeptic7 said:

About the same, 1992. But we must be somehow sharing a thread spanning the Multiverse!  I could not possibly disagree with you more if I was paid to. I don't see any of what you are experiencing, nor have I in better part of a decade. Am envious of your version of The Bizarre-O World you're in.

This is not my experience in upmarket malls etc. I could also tell you that I worked with primarily Thai Chinese and continue to have 'business networking' relations with them, but am not 'friends' with any of them - they are too insular for that - my friends from work are one or two Thai aristos and that's it.

Edited December 15, 2021 by mokwit

[AussieBob9999]

5 minutes ago, SAFETY FIRST said:

This is an unfair post.

Pictures of Ongoing work. 
Thai basher, eeh? Lots here I can see, negative comments, etc. Most I reckon are coming from those abroad. 

Yes, the worksite is a little different to what we are used to but so are the prices..... council fees, water rates, internet charges etc. 
You want the cake and eat it too. 

I like Thailand the way it is, it's not perfect but nor am I. 

Yes the OP is asking for quality tourists, it's a fair request. I reckon they should also ask for normal tourists, some of the freaks and weirdos, oddballs and misfits I see arriving is alarming. 
 

I like Thailand too - but to deny the truth is not a viable solution to the problem - that is the Thai way - they just let it all go.  But to show you the truth - all it takes is google. Type 'dangerous sidewalks Thailand' and then click on 'Images' - there for all to see - including motorbikes riding on them - and blocked walks forcing people to walk on the road - and low hanging dangerous poles/awnings that hit Expats in head/eye - and lets not forget the electricity poles and wires everywhere.  Then do it for Singapore -  none of that - in that country it is all about trying to stop bicycle riders going too fast. 

 

Hey - I agree - it is what it is - but the fact is that TAT is saying they want only high quality rich tourists - but their 'product' does not suit that demographic - around SEAsia that is Singapore and Macau and maybe still Hong Kong.  The Thailand tourism 'fit' has been for decades mainly about backpackers, value family tourists, adventurers, sexpats and retirees/expats - they should live with that and not drive them away.  Sure there are some high end places in Thailand offering 5 star luxury resorts for the rich - but they aint coming in anywhere near the numbers they are claiming and they never will.   Come on - think about it - you are a millionaire - you might try one of the exclusive 5 star resorts on a Thai island maybe - but you aint gonna do it again - not as much as Monaco, Maldives, St Kitts, Paris, New York, Hawaii, Aspen, Seychelles, etc etc etc.  They are kidding themselves going for that market as their main target group. 

 

   

[MaiDong]

3 hours ago, Banana7 said:

Here is what sidewalks look like on Pattaya Klang, a major street in Pattaya. Pattaya is one of the major top 4 international tourist destinations in Thailand. Sidewalks, pedestrian walkways are in pathetic shape. Pattaya Tai sidewalk has been under construction for more than a year and still not finished and parts of the new sidewalk are already breaking.

 

Tourists, whether local or international, don't want to come to places with infrastructure that is falling apart.

 

Quality tourists want to come to high quality destinations, not places as shown in the below photos.

 

 

 

I love that last photo! It's so 'Thai'!! 

[John Drake]

I'm low spending and low quality. I fit in just fine.