Windows 11 - why?

[robblok]

Just now, KannikaP said:

There has always been the multiple SCREEN options since long ago.

I think you are referring to the multiple DESKTOP options

Of course there has been i been using multiple screens forever. However its just a bit easier in win 11 (not that win 10 had many problems)

 

But the multiple desktop is great (for work that is)

[robblok]

The only thing that pisses me off is the information screen on the left if i by accident mouse over it (when i go from one screen to the other) it pops up. I will look how i can disable it late. Otherwise not many problems.

[KannikaP]

1 minute ago, robblok said:

Of course there has been i been using multiple screens forever. However its just a bit easier in win 11 (not that win 10 had many problems)

 

But the multiple desktop is great (for work that is)

I cannot get two desktops with say different background colours to work.

 

[robblok]

2 minutes ago, KannikaP said:

I cannot get two desktops with say different background colours to work.

 

I never tried that, i hardly see the background on the monitors as there are always apps or browsers open. I will check if i can do it later on.

[RocketDog]

3 hours ago, Photoguy21 said:

If you go to Linux, try Linux Mint. I have it on another machine of mine and it is very good

I have been reading and that one is highly regarded. There are so many, and some can be trialed on a thumb drive before wiping windows for good.

Thanks

[RocketDog]

38 minutes ago, BigStar said:

I believe @RocketDog probably knows all about Linux.

 

After looking at what Win 11 offers, I can't see I'd have any need to "upgrade." My lean & mean Win 10 does everything I'll need for the foreseeable future. I'll do just fine after it reaches end-of-life. For that matter, I could even use 7 w/ some good third-party utils. And another thing: Win 8.1 was pretty d_amn good. For the record. ????

 

And I could switch to Linux for most things these days. I'd do so if M'soft tries to force Win 11 on me--which it won't, of course.

 

Reminds me of an old discussion wherein our techies were all jumping on the advanced Windows Vista bandwagon. I waited, correctly figuring it'd be another Windows Me. Skipped it entirely.????

 

I keep a Mint installation updated and use it esp. when traveling. Like it a lot; I'm not going to fool around w/ Arch, btw. However, I'll probably move to a rolling release model and avoid the version upgrades. They aren't that bad w/ Mint's upgrade facility but nonetheless time-consuming and sometimes offer a bit of drama. Thought about Manjaro, but I'm currently trying out OpenSUSE Tumbleweed in a VM, and it's looking mighty fine.

Another vote for Mint.

Thanks

[KannikaP]

2 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

I have been reading and that one is highly regarded. There are so many, and some can be trialed on a thumb drive before wiping windows for good.

Thanks

Tried Linux several times, Mint & Zorin, and always came to the same conclusion.....why try to replace/fix Windows 11 if I know how to use it and it is working perfectly

[RocketDog]

5 hours ago, kennw said:

Cant understand why people reply without the answer to the question, the fact that you are still on windows 7 is of no interest at all.

Isn't the implication quite clear to you? @hotchili is indirectly telling the OP not to upgrade.

 

Every 'step up' with windows leads to more bloatware, slower performance, more seriptitious high jacking of third party apps, update issues, peripherals and drivers that no longer work, and less control of your own machine.

Many people wisely stopped at win7. My machine in my home country is win7 and will stay that way.

 

It's way past time for the world to move on from proprietary operating systems for equipment that is so vital to our lives. Microsoft and Apple deserve neither our trust nor faith. Control of the market, not our welfare, is their only goal.

[toast1]

I've never had this problem with Win10 or Win 11

 

These run great, no problems at all.

 

>bloatware, slower performance, surreptitious high jacking of third party apps, update issues, peripherals and drivers that no longer work, and less control of your own machine.

[robblok]

17 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

Isn't the implication quite clear to you? @hotchili is indirectly telling the OP not to upgrade.

 

Every 'step up' with windows leads to more bloatware, slower performance, more seriptitious high jacking of third party apps, update issues, peripherals and drivers that no longer work, and less control of your own machine.

Many people wisely stopped at win7. My machine in my home country is win7 and will stay that way.

 

It's way past time for the world to move on from proprietary operating systems for equipment that is so vital to our lives. Microsoft and Apple deserve neither our trust nor faith. Control of the market, not our welfare, is their only goal.

Never had those problems but my computers are powerful desktops so i dont have that problem. I would put linux on a computer with lower specs. But for now i like high specs computers as i game too. Use VR and so on. Then linux sucks. Its that simple. 

 

As for moving away from windows, probably over time but as long as so many companies use it and much of the work software is windows it wont happen no matter how much you want it.

 

Linux certainly has come a long way.

[BigStar]

2 hours ago, tgw said:

Windows 11 can be considered a technical update.

Question arises, what and why? Hmm. To give a different spin on the OP's question:

 

I think it's to slowly get you used to the idea of Windows as a Service (WaaS).

 

Microsoft has been moving users to this Desktop-as-a-Service (DaaS) model for years now. . . . With all this in mind . . . I see clear signs that Windows 11 is the Trojan horse bringing WaaS to everyone — whether you want it or not. First, Microsoft sneaked a Microsoft subscription manager into the February 2022 Windows 11 update. . . .  Windows 11 Settings menu > Accounts and you'll find a new section called "Your Microsoft account." . . .

 

     --Windows 11: The end of the old-school Windows desktop

 

Uh huh.

Edited April 13, 2022 by BigStar

[RocketDog]

2 hours ago, robblok said:

Never had those problems but my computers are powerful desktops so i dont have that problem. I would put linux on a computer with lower specs. But for now i like high specs computers as i game too. Use VR and so on. Then linux sucks. Its that simple. 

 

As for moving away from windows, probably over time but as long as so many companies use it and much of the work software is windows it wont happen no matter how much you want it.

 

Linux certainly has come a long way.

I'm well accustomed to not getting my way. For your gaming purposes it makes sense. 

At the end of the day open source apps will be the only way to live with the bad actors that always spoil innovation.

 

The more they are embraced the more robust they will become.

[robblok]

1 hour ago, RocketDog said:

I'm well accustomed to not getting my way. For your gaming purposes it makes sense. 

At the end of the day open source apps will be the only way to live with the bad actors that always spoil innovation.

 

The more they are embraced the more robust they will become.

For gaming / for work it all makes sense. If not for work or gaming and you got a lower spec computer then a small operating system would certainly make sense.

 

I have messed around with linux but I don't see the advantages as i have a fast computer with a super fast processor and ddr 5 memory. (great for work and games and VR). So then it makes no sense to use linux.

 

Just like so many things in life our needs and wants are all different so its good there is a lot of choice.

[Dumbfounded]

23 hours ago, Sparktrader said:

2022 shouldnt it be 22? Im using 08.

Windows 8 came out in 2012 ????

[Dumbfounded]

13 hours ago, decca60 said:

Bing is not the best search system and there is no way to have another one

So do you make your 1st search on Bing for Google, Firefox, etc?  Honest question -  if you can't change Bing, does it let you search for other engines without interfering somehow?

[RocketDog]

11 hours ago, robblok said:

For gaming / for work it all makes sense. If not for work or gaming and you got a lower spec computer then a small operating system would certainly make sense.

 

I have messed around with linux but I don't see the advantages as i have a fast computer with a super fast processor and ddr 5 memory. (great for work and games and VR). So then it makes no sense to use linux.

 

Just like so many things in life our needs and wants are all different so its good there is a lot of choice.

For me the major issue with Microsoft is the way they control your machine more than you do.

For years I've been fighting the way Edge browser highjacks file associations. I  have to constantly go into the setting to change the *PDF app from Edge back to Adobe. Finally I found a way to disable edge completely. But why should it be so much effort?

The inability to easily refuse updates which frequently brick many machines, and other issue in the same vein are the friction points. If MS simply made it easier to disable/remove what I don't want it would help my attitude a lot. Simply put, it's just too intrusive to a computing environment.

 

I will admit that excel is a far superior app to competitors and I was a power user in my engineering days. For the most part the Apache and other open source office apps are fully adequate now for me.

 

 

[robblok]

24 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

For me the major issue with Microsoft is the way they control your machine more than you do.

For years I've been fighting the way Edge browser highjacks file associations. I  have to constantly go into the setting to change the *PDF app from Edge back to Adobe. Finally I found a way to disable edge completely. But why should it be so much effort?

The inability to easily refuse updates which frequently brick many machines, and other issue in the same vein are the friction points. If MS simply made it easier to disable/remove what I don't want it would help my attitude a lot. Simply put, it's just too intrusive to a computing environment.

 

I will admit that excel is a far superior app to competitors and I was a power user in my engineering days. For the most part the Apache and other open source office apps are fully adequate now for me.

 

 

I am not sure what you mean with hijacking and edge and file associations. 

 

I mean I use chrome standard and i set my file associations how i want after setting them once they don't change.

 

I have an PDF writer from nitro (to combine and edit PDF's), got some tax software some accounting software and excel.

 

Use dropbox business a lot, got microsoft to do list use google sheets too.

 

File extensions are not a problem.

 

I can easily refuse any update that i want ok eventually you will have to do them but you can postpone when you want. Also my machine has never been bricked. But that is probably because of the kind of machine i use. I use high spec machines and that means newer machines so probably more compatible. 

 

Linux is a <deleted> shoot for drivers so i would not call that an improvement. Most updated drivers are for windows not linux. Anyway not really here to defend windows as its not perfect. But at the same time i think your overstating the problem a bit. But maybe your more sensitive to stuf like that. I don't mind setting file extensions once and making sure my browser is chrome. Its not that hard, its harder to customize linux then windows (takes more settings ect).  You seem to be competent with linux so if you have that level of knowledge doing it on a windows machine should be easy.

[JeffersLos]

I just upgraded to W11 from W10, and it's very nice, very smooth. 

 

A new i3 machine, and in the upgrade 10 years of bookmarks and passwords came with it. ????

 

The Home edition is great. A happy W11 user. ???? 

[KannikaP]

22 hours ago, RocketDog said:

My machine in my home country is win7 and will stay that way.

Together with Model T Ford you drive?   LOL

[toast1]

I find Windows 10 and 11 fast, efficient, reliable and easy to use.

Never had a problem on any of the PCs I use.

 

[RocketDog]

2 hours ago, KannikaP said:

Together with Model T Ford you drive?   LOL

Yep. Together with 2000 Rav4 I drive in America.

I will never buy an electric vehicle either until there is no choice.

If I ever have to  buy a car with all the electronic surveillance <deleted> I'll rip it out too.

[RocketDog]

U

9 hours ago, robblok said:

I am not sure what you mean with hijacking and edge and file associations. 

 

I mean I use chrome standard and i set my file associations how i want after setting them once they don't change.

 

I have an PDF writer from nitro (to combine and edit PDF's), got some tax software some accounting software and excel.

 

Use dropbox business a lot, got microsoft to do list use google sheets too.

 

File extensions are not a problem.

 

I can easily refuse any update that i want ok eventually you will have to do them but you can postpone when you want. Also my machine has never been bricked. But that is probably because of the kind of machine i use. I use high spec machines and that means newer machines so probably more compatible. 

 

Linux is a <deleted> shoot for drivers so i would not call that an improvement. Most updated drivers are for windows not linux. Anyway not really here to defend windows as its not perfect. But at the same time i think your overstating the problem a bit. But maybe your more sensitive to stuf like that. I don't mind setting file extensions once and making sure my browser is chrome. Its not that hard, its harder to customize linux then windows (takes more settings ect).  You seem to be competent with linux so if you have that level of knowledge doing it on a windows machine should be easy.

If you install acrobat Edge regularly changes the default file  association to itself. It does this with photo viewers and other things. Just do a web search on the topic and you'll I'm not saying it changes all associations but the PDF is definitely one it does. There were multiple fixes on the web over the years but none worked, even registry hacks. They work for a while, data or minutes, and then revert. Finally I saw an article that grouse about these and other Edge issues and showed a way to disable Edge, so I did it. In short my objection is MS over-riding my choices to push their products. They have a long history of doing this, most visibly their Internet Explorer browser. I've read that they're at it again with first releases of win11. They've even been taken to court over it in other countries in years past.

 

As for updates, yes, you can delay them but you can't stop them. Don't you find that troubling? You bought your machine and their software but you can't call the shots on your own equipment. That is totally unacceptable to me. I would buya car that only allowed me to buy gas or oil ftom a particular brand. It's the same thing. Also, you are surely aware that many people live in dear of 'update Tuesday ' wondering if their machines will boot after updates are installed. I finally found a way around that too. A small exe file that tells the registry not to update until 2029. I haven't suffered the update paranoia they sell for over two years now.

 

I looked at nitro and ended up buying Wonder share Element  PDF editor. I trialed nitro but Windershare element is much better. I bought a lifetime license for $129. I get regular improvement updates as well. I used acrobat for years but they went to an annual subscription plan and since each new version kept getting more bloated and the interface more confusing I finally dumped it. BTW when I installed Wondershare and Edge pulled the same trick until I disabled it.

 

I de-googled myself last year as well, dumping every app from them on my desktop and phone. I don't use Google maps, mail, calendar, photo, or chrome, or any of their 'free' cloud apps. (Read the EULA for your Google Sheets and you might be shocked to learn that you have given them license to everything you put in them.)  I value my privacy too much and I don't want to be data to be sold. They are way too subversive and deceptive for my taste. Their motto "Do no evil" is a really sadistic joke.

 

I started computing in 1975 on a medical research grant.. My first computer was a single board KIM-1 with a 1 MHz 6502 processor (same as first apple machine), 2k x8 ROM, and 1k x8 ram, a hex keyboard, a 6 character hex display, and a csssete recorder interface. A year later I coupled it via a current loop interface to a teletype printer and was in tall grass. I programmed in assembly language by hand to take blood pressure data on the test calves and to control the artificial heart we implanted.

 

So I have very rigid opinions about computing machines and believe that I use them instead of them using me.

 

So I've had my day in the sun and and am from another generation. I'm far from being a Luddite though. I had a consulting company for 30 and we designed custom interface boards for IBM/Intel style computers. We programmed the machine and built the boards to make the machine do what we wanted. If it didn't we burned it until it did.

 

I've often said that I'm glad Microsoft doesn't sell airplanes if they crashed as often as there software does. Remember MS made a bid for the industrial market with their CE operating system and it was universally rejected by the industrial and scientific community.

 

Never have so many people known so little about the machines that are so much a part of their daily lives. I still believe society will pay a price for that ignorance, if we aren't already. Like do many other things I've think we've reached or passed a tipping point, climate change being a prime example.

 

But, as I say, I'm part of a fading generation. Unix distros are not as polished and drivers can be a problem but they fit my personal philosophy of computing much better. Information and software wants to be free and transparent. The big tech conglomerates desperately don't want that to happen. They want to own us, our equipment, and our personal data. It's a brave new world and personally I'm happy to be on my way out instead of my way in.

To each his own and good luck.

[KannikaP]

10 hours ago, RocketDog said:

I  have to constantly go into the setting to change the *PDF app from Edge back to Adobe. Finally I found a way to disable edge completely. But why should it be so much effort?

If that is so much effort, I suggest you stop using a computer.

[toast1]

Windows 10 has not crashed or had a fault in 5 years, on any of the 5 PC's I use. 

It is reliable, fast and efficient. 

 

Windows 11 is fast and efficient. 

It repairs its self or reinstalls easily.

Edge is excellent, never had a problem, great with PDF's.

 

I can't think why anyone would want to not use it, unless on an lower powered PC.

But new PCs are so cheap and powerful, that hardly seems necessary.

 

 

 

 

Edited April 14, 2022 by toast1

[KannikaP]

51 minutes ago, RocketDog said:

f you install acrobat Edge

Hmmmm. Give up on computers Mr Dog

[KhaoYai]

On 4/13/2022 at 2:20 AM, decca60 said:

Bing is not the best search system and there is no way to have another one

What? Is that correct? Surely that's illegal?

[robblok]

13 hours ago, RocketDog said:

U

If you install acrobat Edge regularly changes the default file  association to itself. It does this with photo viewers and other things. Just do a web search on the topic and you'll I'm not saying it changes all associations but the PDF is definitely one it does. There were multiple fixes on the web over the years but none worked, even registry hacks. They work for a while, data or minutes, and then revert. Finally I saw an article that grouse about these and other Edge issues and showed a way to disable Edge, so I did it. In short my objection is MS over-riding my choices to push their products. They have a long history of doing this, most visibly their Internet Explorer browser. I've read that they're at it again with first releases of win11. They've even been taken to court over it in other countries in years past.

 

As for updates, yes, you can delay them but you can't stop them. Don't you find that troubling? You bought your machine and their software but you can't call the shots on your own equipment. That is totally unacceptable to me. I would buya car that only allowed me to buy gas or oil ftom a particular brand. It's the same thing. Also, you are surely aware that many people live in dear of 'update Tuesday ' wondering if their machines will boot after updates are installed. I finally found a way around that too. A small exe file that tells the registry not to update until 2029. I haven't suffered the update paranoia they sell for over two years now.

 

I looked at nitro and ended up buying Wonder share Element  PDF editor. I trialed nitro but Windershare element is much better. I bought a lifetime license for $129. I get regular improvement updates as well. I used acrobat for years but they went to an annual subscription plan and since each new version kept getting more bloated and the interface more confusing I finally dumped it. BTW when I installed Wondershare and Edge pulled the same trick until I disabled it.

 

I de-googled myself last year as well, dumping every app from them on my desktop and phone. I don't use Google maps, mail, calendar, photo, or chrome, or any of their 'free' cloud apps. (Read the EULA for your Google Sheets and you might be shocked to learn that you have given them license to everything you put in them.)  I value my privacy too much and I don't want to be data to be sold. They are way too subversive and deceptive for my taste. Their motto "Do no evil" is a really sadistic joke.

 

I started computing in 1975 on a medical research grant.. My first computer was a single board KIM-1 with a 1 MHz 6502 processor (same as first apple machine), 2k x8 ROM, and 1k x8 ram, a hex keyboard, a 6 character hex display, and a csssete recorder interface. A year later I coupled it via a current loop interface to a teletype printer and was in tall grass. I programmed in assembly language by hand to take blood pressure data on the test calves and to control the artificial heart we implanted.

 

So I have very rigid opinions about computing machines and believe that I use them instead of them using me.

 

So I've had my day in the sun and and am from another generation. I'm far from being a Luddite though. I had a consulting company for 30 and we designed custom interface boards for IBM/Intel style computers. We programmed the machine and built the boards to make the machine do what we wanted. If it didn't we burned it until it did.

 

I've often said that I'm glad Microsoft doesn't sell airplanes if they crashed as often as there software does. Remember MS made a bid for the industrial market with their CE operating system and it was universally rejected by the industrial and scientific community.

 

Never have so many people known so little about the machines that are so much a part of their daily lives. I still believe society will pay a price for that ignorance, if we aren't already. Like do many other things I've think we've reached or passed a tipping point, climate change being a prime example.

 

But, as I say, I'm part of a fading generation. Unix distros are not as polished and drivers can be a problem but they fit my personal philosophy of computing much better. Information and software wants to be free and transparent. The big tech conglomerates desperately don't want that to happen. They want to own us, our equipment, and our personal data. It's a brave new world and personally I'm happy to be on my way out instead of my way in.

To each his own and good luck.

You are one of the paranoid generation. I get that there are people like that who want total control.

 

So you would ignore it when your car is called back for a production fault ? I mean you want total control over your car. Same thing with updates you just take them as they are needed. 

 

I do know data is mined i don't see a problem with it that is my way of paying for their services. If i want to be anonymous i will use TOR.

 

As for the remark for good thing MS does not sell planes, that is a strange comparison. But maybe that is what you want a ridiculous comparison. You should think long and hard as you don't seem to be stupid so you should be able to figure out what is wrong with your statement.

 

You and I are different does not make your opinion invalid. I just don't have the same concerns you have. I do think your a bit too rigid but that is your choice. I grew up with computers i started with a video pack, comodore 16, 64 amiga... pc.. and so on. I can program a bit too but not too much.

 

Anyway like i said its good we are different and there are many choices. You don't like windows play with linux.

[Bruno123]

21 hours ago, JeffersLos said:

I just upgraded to W11 from W10, and it's very nice, very smooth. 

 

A new i3 machine, and in the upgrade 10 years of bookmarks and passwords came with it. ????

 

The Home edition is great. A happy W11 user. ???? 

 

Home...first in line for Updates...whoopee! ????

[Photoguy21]

On 4/13/2022 at 3:22 PM, BigStar said:

I believe @RocketDog probably knows all about Linux.

 

After looking at what Win 11 offers, I can't see I'd have any need to "upgrade." My lean & mean Win 10 does everything I'll need for the foreseeable future. I'll do just fine after it reaches end-of-life. For that matter, I could even use 7 w/ some good third-party utils. And another thing: Win 8.1 was pretty d_amn good. For the record. ????

 

And I could switch to Linux for most things these days. I'd do so if M'soft tries to force Win 11 on me--which it won't, of course.

 

Reminds me of an old discussion wherein our techies were all jumping on the advanced Windows Vista bandwagon. I waited, correctly figuring it'd be another Windows Me. Skipped it entirely.????

 

I keep a Mint installation updated and use it esp. when traveling. Like it a lot; I'm not going to fool around w/ Arch, btw. However, I'll probably move to a rolling release model and avoid the version upgrades. They aren't that bad w/ Mint's upgrade facility but nonetheless time-consuming and sometimes offer a bit of drama. Thought about Manjaro, but I'm currently trying out OpenSUSE Tumbleweed in a VM, and it's looking mighty fine.

I agree. I dont see anything in Win 11 that I really need or care about. You use Mint the same way I do. It is my travel system and i just update every so often at home.

[moogradod]

Only one poster mentioned support. Support for Win10 will run out in 2023 and with support I mean mostly security updates. Or who wants to work with a vulnerable OS ?

 

I actually do not know the exact date when Win10 support runs out. By that time I consider upgrading a must. Not for functional purposes at all, though.