Need advice re making a rental agreement

[homeseeker]

I have recently viewed a 1 bedroomed place in BKK for rent.I have messaged the owner/landlord that I want to rent it under a 1 year contract starting in about 2 months time subject to contract.. The landlord has agreed the moving in date and also the rent I pay.

There is no agent involved.

I am not familiar with the intracacies of Thai law but :

Until we sign a formal written contract neither me as the tenant nor she as the landlord is bound by our messaging agreement, right?

I have offered to secure the place by putting down 1 month in advance and pay the rest on the I move in and get the keys. Does that sound ok?

 

Any advive on these questions or generally would be appreciated.

 

[Olmate]

'Pay the rest'? 

[Yellowtail]

34 minutes ago, Olmate said:

'Pay the rest'? 

One would expect at least first and last month's rent, yes?

[Yellowtail]

I would meet with them, sign the contract and put the money down, otherwise they can (and should) rent it out from under you. 

 

At the very least, I would get a receipt for the payment stipulating the start-date. 

[Olmate]

1 minute ago, Yellowtail said:

One would expect at least first and last month's rent, yes?

Thats what I asked op.. Maybe he,s paying full 12 mths.? 

[homeseeker]

When I wrote "pay the rest" I meant pay 2 more months. The agreement will be 1 month in advance rental and 2 month security deposit.

Therafter pay monthly rent.

Sorry it not made clear.

 

[Yellowtail]

If you have the dough, you might see what kind of discount you can get by paying for 12 months. 

 

I saved 15% my rental

[bkk6060]

I would only give them one months deposit.  

[NativeBob]

Sounds too complicated. Hey. zis iz Thailadn, folks.

I've been renting rooms (a.k.a. condos), houses, apartments since last century and it was always easy-peasy: 2 month down-payment + 1 month advance = here's your keys and never see you again except every freaking month's 30th.

Contract? just a paper ...

The only thing is slightly important is you should always transfer from your bank account to her/his/it account name. No cash. That's it.

PS: landlord (funny term) can and will kick you out from the room/studio/flat/house anytime it pleases without refund, hang a padlock or change a entrance keys for whatever reason, so behave. No laws apply here.
And yes, renting without paying taxes is illegal.

[Yellowtail]

39 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

 

The only thing is slightly important is you should always transfer from your bank account to her/his/it account name. No cash. That's it.

 

Agree 

[Yellowtail]

41 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

I would only give them one months deposit.  

He has already agreed. Any renegotiation should also include something that benefits the landlord. 

[NativeBob]

17 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

He has already agreed. Any renegotiation should also include something that benefits the landlord. 

Yes, it is and always will be upon agreement. 2+1 months advance is quite popular, but there are many others. I knew once a family that paid quarterly: 4 times a year. More convenient. An Israeli dude who paid whenever he had cash. Turkish jeweler who paid annually. 

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, NativeBob said:

PS: landlord (funny term) can and will kick you out from the room/studio/flat/house anytime it pleases without refund, hang a padlock or change a entrance keys for whatever reason, so behave. No laws apply here.
And yes, renting without paying taxes is illegal.

"...landlord can and will kick you out ... anytime it pleases without refund"

Garbage, as a generalisation, for renters with a lease.

 

"renting without paying taxes is illegal".

That has absolutely nothing to do with you, me or the OP.  It's between him and the Revenue Dept.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, homeseeker said:

When I wrote "pay the rest" I meant pay 2 more months. The agreement will be 1 month in advance rental and 2 month security deposit.

Therafter pay monthly rent.

Sorry it not made clear.

 

Best not to pay more than 1 month security, you probably won't get it back.

I always pass, on rentals that ask for 2 months security.

[Liverpool Lou]

1 hour ago, NativeBob said:

you should always transfer from your bank account to her/his/it account name. No cash.

As long as you get a receipt, what's the difference?  I've been renting here for 27 years and have never had any issues paying cash.

[Liverpool Lou]

49 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

1 hour ago, NativeBob said:

 

The only thing is slightly important is you should always transfer from your bank account to her/his/it account name. No cash. That's it.

 

Expand  

Agree 

Why?

[NativeBob]

1 minute ago, Liverpool Lou said:

As long as you get a receipt, what's the difference?  I've been renting here for 27 years and have never had any issues paying cash.

Utter generalization and misleading. receipt? why should keep paper for years if you can request history from the bank? You keep 'em since 1995? That's dumb thing to do, right?

[NativeBob]

7 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Best not to pay more than 1 month security, you probably won't get it back.

I always pass, on rentals that ask for 2 months security.

Very true. They will always try to keep some. Or delay payment. Or post-date check.
They consider "security deposits" as an "extra bonus" ))))

[Yellowtail]

10 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Best not to pay more than 1 month security, you probably won't get it back.

I always pass, on rentals that ask for 2 months security.

I've always gotten my deposits back, but I have never left early, not provided notice or torn the place up. 

[Yellowtail]

10 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Why?

Because it's easy, I have a permanent, indisputable record , I don't like having to get or keep track of receipts, I do not have to meet with anyone,  and I'm protected against fraud by the landlord or their staff.

 

You like getting the cash, meeting with the landlord, giving them the cash, getting the receipt and filing it away, good for you. I'd rather select the payment and tap send.

[Liverpool Lou]

31 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

36 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

As long as you get a receipt, what's the difference?  I've been renting here for 27 years and have never had any issues paying cash.

Utter generalization and misleading. receipt? why should keep paper for years if you can request history from the bank? You keep 'em since 1995? That's dumb thing to do, right?

You may think paying cash is dumb but you haven't explained why.  As I said, I've never had a problem and I haven't needed receipts from 27 years ago.   

 

You thin k that trying to order bank statements here from 27 years ago is easier than taking a receipt out of a drawer?

[NativeBob]

11 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I've always gotten my deposits back, but I have never left early, not provided notice or torn the place up. 

Maybe its a question of numbers? I never paid more than 12K/m, so didn't care much about "sec.deposits". But those with much bigger rent - yep, that will be different picture. 

My last one is the 2 stores house (not a town house in god-forsaken Nontaburi) for 10K. Painted, fixed it and upgraded myself and don't care about deposit. 

[Liverpool Lou]

4 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

24 minutes ago, Liverpool Lou said:

Why?

Because it's easy, I have a permanent, indisputable record , I don't like having to get or keep track of receipts, I do not have to meet with anyone,  and I'm protected against fraud by the landlord or their staff.

So is cash with a receipt, I have permanent, indisputable record also and I am just as well protected against fraud! 

 

I'm not saying that bank transfers are not good, I'm saying that there is no downside to cash (apart from your paranoia of "having to meet people"!) and that bank payments are not the only way rent "should" be paid.

[Liverpool Lou]

25 minutes ago, NativeBob said:

Very true. They will always try to keep some. Or delay payment. Or post-date check.
They consider "security deposits" as an "extra bonus" ))))

That's b0llocks again, as a Thai-bashers over-generalisation.

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

I've always gotten my deposits back, but I have never left early, not provided notice or torn the place up. 

Me neither but a nice  little old Thai lady kept one of my 6kbht deposits.

Then the Thai landlady from hell handed back my deposit no problem.

So far 3x returned, 1 time not returned (2x guest house, 2x house).

 

You can never tell what the owner will do, so best only to pay 1 month.

Sure, I can see you're trying to dis me because that's the sort of poster you are. But in reality I'm the perfect tenant, no parties, noise, hookers or accidents in my homes, I fix all those little problems myself (tap washers, door hinges, faulty locks, electrical faults), I just sit and watch TV ...... anything even slightly naughty happens out of sight of the gossipy Thai neighbours.

[bkk6060]

Well, there certainly have been a share of posts over the years here from people not getting their deposits back.  I would insist on one month only.

 

Also, paying 12 month in advance seems not the smart thing to do.  

What if you don't like it and want to move?

The neighbors are noisy and up all hours.

They opened a new bar next door and you have boom boom music till 2am.

Something happens to you physically and you are forced to move.

If you have family back home, what if there is an emergency and you need to leave the country.

I could go on and on with scenarios.

 

If you have to leave either way you will probably lose your deposit.  But, paying all the rest upfront will probably all be lost also.  Sometimes life gets in the way of plans seems kind of dumb to pay all in advance.

[Yellowtail]

1 hour ago, Liverpool Lou said:

So is cash with a receipt, I have permanent, indisputable record also and I am just as well protected against fraud! 

 

I'm not saying that bank transfers are not good, I'm saying that there is no downside to cash (apart from your paranoia of "having to meet people"!) and that bank payments are not the only way rent "should" be paid.

You're right dude 

[Yellowtail]

12 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Me neither but a nice  little old Thai lady kept one of my 6kbht deposits.

Then the Thai landlady from hell handed back my deposit no problem.

So far 3x returned, 1 time not returned (2x guest house, 2x house).

So you've gotten it back 75% of the time. 

 

12 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

You can never tell what the owner will do, so best only to pay 1 month.

Absolutely. It is best to pay the minimum amount possible, but if it's a great place with low rent, I would not get too caught up with insisting on something the the owner will not go for. 

 

12 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Sure, I can see you're trying to dis me because that's the sort of poster you are. But in reality I'm the perfect tenant, no parties, noise, hookers or accidents in my homes, I just sit and watch TV ...... anything even slightly naughty happens out of sight of the gossipy Thai neighbours.

Sorry, I was not trying to "dis" you, but I see how it sounded that way. You've generally gotten your deposit back as have I. My "dis" is for the people that claim that Thais never return the deposit. I think the people saying that are likely bad tenants. 

 

I agree, pay as little deposit as possible, and plan on not getting it back, but why pass on a place you love or that is really cheap for an extra month of rent for a deposit if you planning on staying for a few years? 

 

A place I'm renting now I paid a year, and got a 15% discount and only paid one month deposit. Got the same deal the second year as well. 

[Pmbkk]

 

I rent out some of my personal Condos, I've hardly ever kept any deposit - even when I should.

 

Most people tend to renew so I take that into consideration.

 

We did rent a condo for 6 months as ours were rented - and even though we returned it in better condition than we got it the landlady was refusing to return the deposit. We spoke to the agent and got our full deposit back.

 

Re the contract - check your get out clauses, when the landlord can ask you to leave and what notice you need to give as circumstances change. In my experience in Thailand they are usually fixed length(12 months) - I offer an option of notice period to both parties and penalties either party would incur. I also ask for 2 months deposit which again in my experience is pretty standard and covers me if someone doesn't pay the rent within 15 days.

 

 

 

 

[Pmbkk]

3 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Also, paying 12 month in advance seems not the smart thing to do.  

 

A close friend(English) of mine did this in Spain and it wasn't feasible for him to use the condo for a year ( he actually signed a 3 year lease ) during Covid - no return on his lease payment.

 

Unless you know the house/area very well I'd advice against it.

 

You never know what's around the corner.