American Banks do not want Overseas Americans

[sqwakvfr]

I am starting to believe my American Bank(USAA FSB) does not want to deal with me because I live in LOS.  Two past incidents make me believe this. I have been with USAA FSB over 30 years and just in the last two years I have encountered issue after issue. Here are two of the most recent examples. 

 

1.  If I want to make an International transfer  out of my US checking account to my Thai Bank account I have to first call and advise of my intent make the transfer.  This is something that was started about a year ago.  Also, the cost to a make single international transfer is now $45.  My US based pension can only be direct deposited into a American Bank account and effectively the Income Transfer method is not not possible for me.

 

2.  5 years ago I got a replacement credit card sent to me in Chiang Mai through Fed Ex.  I got the card in 4 business days from Texas.  Well the same card is due to expire in December 2022 and I called the Bank Credit Card department for the replacement.  The process was similar as before and I was charged the Fed Ex and was told I would get the tracking number in a matter of hours and the card would be delivered in 4 days.

 

None of this happened.  Instead the replacement card was sent to me from Texas through unregistered US Mail.  Of course I never got the card.  So far I have called the bank 10 times in 10 days to get the replacement sent to me through Fed Ex.  As of today no one at the bank can confirm the following:  1) Was the card sent? 2) Where is the Tracking # 3) When will the card arrive?  The thing that really stood out was when one of the managers said “ well sir you live overseas and it will not be easy”.  I think that last statement is very telling

 

Have any other forum members who live in Thailand with US Bank accounts feel the same way>
 

Edited November 22, 2022 by sqwakvfr

[lopburi3]

No more than normal.

 

As for international transfers it is normal fraud prevention to require call in my experience (both with USAA and other US banks).  Rather hard to recover funds from some countries I suspect.  And currently Thailand is a prime transfer stop for Indian scammers so even more of an issue.

 

I normally receive bank cards in normal mail envelopes as this seems to be the safest method (do not call attention to it).  Have never had go missing (but live in Bangkok - upcountry might be more of an issue).

 

You might want to consider direct deposit into Wise account for easy onward transfers to local account - saving use of foreign cards and easy access.  Also transfers to Wise from USAA have not changed.

[sqwakvfr]

5 minutes ago, lopburi3 said:

No more than normal.

 

As for international transfers it is normal fraud prevention to require call in my experience (both with USAA and other US banks).  Rather hard to recover funds from some countries I suspect.  And currently Thailand is a prime transfer stop for Indian scammers so even more of an issue.

 

I normally receive bank cards in normal mail envelopes as this seems to be the safest method (do not call attention to it).  Have never had go missing (but live in Bangkok - upcountry might be more of an issue).

 

You might want to consider direct deposit into Wise account for easy onward transfers to local account - saving use of foreign cards and easy access.  Also transfers to Wise from USAA have not changed.

I asked why i needed to call in first for the transfer and got two reasons:  1) “because the Patriot Act requires it”.  2) A week later I was told “anti-money laundering”.  Both sound like legitimate reasons but the part that really <deleted> me off was this line “We(the bank) can limit the number of transfer at our discretion”.  I asked for an explanation as to what “discretion” meant?  I’m still watering for an answer. 

 

I got burned by US Mail last year.  An investment company in Los Angeles sent a dividend check to me in Chiang Mai through unregistered US Mail.  Of course I never got the check and this started a month journey of phone calls to Los Angeles(of course at 200 AM) to get the missing check voided and then arranging to have a replacement check sent to me through Fed Ex.  I got the check in 4 days and I even got a tracking when it was sent.  From that day on I request any sensitive items sent to me through Fed Ex, UPS or DHL. 

[lopburi3]

3 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

I got burned by US Mail last year.

Last year there was no regular mail service to Thailand - and would take months if ever got here.  Blue Cross in USA was drop shipping mail overseas to get here and even then could take 2 months.  US government mail was also sent from overseas.  COVID has made a mess of the worlds shipping.  Indeed the high payment private firms have been the only reliable transport - and even they have had issues.

 

As for reason both are valid and suspect the money laundering is the key on possible limitations of transfers.

 

Probably best to keep clam and keep accounts open as want to have as much fallback as possible.   Although I did call it quits with the new Twitter - and will live without that.

[Skallywag]

1 hour ago, sqwakvfr said:

I am starting to believe my American Bank(USAA FSB)

Not a National Bank like Bank of America or Wells Fargo BTW.  USAA is one of those "federal thrift" banks that has a very low rating... AKA Federal Savings Banks

 

Best to go with a National Bank when an expat IMO

[Jingthing]

Yes this is a huge issue for many expats and has been for decades.

The Know Your Customer rules influence many banks to dump expat customers once the expat admits it or they discover it.

Many of us (including me) play complex masking games to pose as U.S. residents to avoid such problems.

For example sometimes they will elevate an issue to an order to VISIT A LOCAL BRANCH with no other option. Good luck with that from Thailand. 

There are definitely regulatory issues with brokerage accounts especially with buying mutual funds.

 

Any expat that hasn't been hit with problems yet, just wait, you will. 

Think your cool now? Policies change, banks get bought.

Don't even get started with cell phone 2FA requirements.

It's an ever shifting mine field.

As far as wires, currently I am only using State Department Federal Credit Union which is definitely as expat friendly as it gets as it's possible to open an account with them after you move abroad.

Once I got a call to confirm a wire and I asked why they are calling when they didn't before, and I kind of sort of got them to reveal it was because it was over 10,000 dollars.

Seems kind of crazy to me, sent to the same name (me) and the same instructions several times.

Edited November 22, 2022 by Jingthing

[lopburi3]

11 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

and I kind of sort of got them to reveal it was because it was over 10,000 dollars.

Seems kind of crazy to me, sent to the same name (me) and the same instructions several times.

Yes crazy but computer logic is still a bit lacking - needs a set amount to key on.  But this is nothing new as 10k has been a trigger as far back as I can recall (actually in Florida it was changed to 4k when I had to buy a house in 1989 due to the drug money there).

[livram]

7 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Yes this is a huge issue for many expats and has been for decades.

The Know Your Customer rules influence many banks to dump expat customers once the expat admits it or they discover it.

Many of us (including me) play complex masking games to pose as U.S. residents to avoid such problems.

For example sometimes they will elevate an issue to an order to VISIT A LOCAL BRANCH with no other option. Good luck with that from Thailand. 

There are definitely regulatory issues with brokerage accounts especially with buying mutual funds.

 

Any expat that hasn't been hit with problems yet, just wait, you will. 

Think your cool now? Policies change, banks get bought.

Don't even get started with cell phone 2FA requirements.

It's an ever shifting mine field.

As far as wires, currently I am only using State Department Federal Credit Union which is definitely as expat friendly as it gets as it's possible to open an account with them after you move abroad.

Once I got a call to confirm a wire and I asked why they are calling when they didn't before, and I kind of sort of got them to reveal it was because it was over 10,000 dollars.

Seems kind of crazy to me, sent to the same name (me) and the same instructions several times.

USFCU and transfer to Thailand via WISE has worked great for me for several years now. I haven't been to the States in 30 years and had no problem opening account with SDFCU. No hassles and quick to answer questions.

[JimGant]

On 11/22/2022 at 10:06 AM, sqwakvfr said:

If I want to make an International transfer  out of my US checking account to my Thai Bank account I have to first call and advise of my intent make the transfer.  This is something that was started about a year ago.  Also, the cost to a make single international transfer is now $45.

I've been with USAA for 55 years, and, yes, the service has shown some noticeable deterioration in the last few years. But, I've used them for international wire transfers for years, and the price has been $45 for as long as I can remember ($20wire, $25 international transfer fee). And, yes, you've always had to do it by phone -- online wire transfers are only for domestic transfers. And part of the questioning drill is "purpose of wire." This is required by anti-laundering laws -- but easy enough to state "living expenses." (Stating "funding international drug cartel" may slow down your transfer.)

 

I haven't sent a wire in several years, as Wise is cheaper for amounts below around $25k. If they've tightened up their questioning for transfers, this would be understandable, since they were recently hit with a $140M fine for sloppy anti-laundering policies.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/17/business/usaa-fine-money-laundering.html

 

My address with USAA is my Thai address, and when credit/debit cards renew, they automatically send by regular post to my Thai address. This, historically, proved slow -- but sure. However, last time I asked to have the card "expedited" via FedEx. No problem -- just pay a $6 fee. And card arrived in a couple of days.

 

Last month I had a fraudulent credit card charge -- discovered, interestingly, because that online purchase attempt used the wrong expiration date of the card. Anyway, USAA security dep't was called, and they sent a new card right away -- via FedEx (by request), for no charge, being a fraud replacement. Got card in three days, and could track all the way. Fortunately, FedEx, unlike the local post office, is well aware of my location out in the boondocks, so I never have delivery hickups with them.

 

I used to feel kinda special with USAA, being retired military (they even address you by rank -- a little corny, but reminds me of when I didn't have arthritis and other aches.) But, yeah, the last few years have shown deterioration in service. And I'm afraid that anti-laundering fine may tighten up on expats with foreign addresses. And even those with mail forwarding addresses, which they had no problem with when I used one a few years back, designating the address as both mail and physical address. No questions asked.