Is it necessary to get a 5th covid-19 vaccine dose ?

[Lacessit]

14 minutes ago, GarryP said:

Who gets multiple jabs for things such as tetanus. I think you'll find a single dose will last between 5 and 10 years. You do not need 4 shots in 1 or two years like they are pushing for covid. I can't even remember the last time I had a polio vaccination but probably when I was about 12 and I think it was on a sugar cube. The only case where I have had multiple vaccines in such a short period of time, was post exposure rabies vaccines. And that was due to being bitten by a dog, not interaction with posters frothing at the mouth. 

 

I am not an anti-vaxxer but the whole covid thing has seen has seen both sides of the divide spouting <deleted> and there has been a lot of backpedalling by people at the top of big pharma and health departments. Certainly doesn't instill confidence in the system and veracity of claims as to how wonderful the vax is. As a result, I will not be having any booster until there is solid proof of its efficacy and its long term effects have been fully researched. 

The reason you don't have multiple jabs for tetanus is it's a bacterium, not a virus, and it does not mutate. COVID does. You think you are getting the same flu shot as you were 20 years ago? Of course not.

The only back-pedalling I am aware of is when the WHO stepped back from saying vaccines prevented COVID infection, to the position they prevented serious illness. Which IMO was an honest mistake, before the evidence Sinovac was only 50% effective. I still got Sinovac as being better than nothing.

Your choice if you don't want to have a booster. A better choice for me is to get an antibody test done, so I can make a decision on an informed basis.

I am more concerned with the long-term effects of COVID, than any long-term effects of vaccines. The data coming out of Australia is saying 30% of unvaccinated people develop long COVID, and it's quite nasty.

Imagine you are a non-smoker who overnight becomes a three pack a day smoker. That's what COVID does to the lungs of some people.

 

[rattlesnake]

59 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

An anti-vaxxer is a person who cherry-picks data, and is in denial of the facts, such as an unvaccinated person contracting COVID is 5 or 10 times more likely to occupy an ICU, or suffer the effects of long COVID.

Anti-vaxxers recoil from explaining why the multiple jabs they have had for polio, tetanus, Hep A etc. have not harmed them.

Social media is a haven for nut-jobs who can shriek their beliefs at maximum volume, and support the confirmation biases of one another, while calling sensible people sheeple. O the irony.

Vaccines work, gravity is real, global warming and climate change are facts. Fluoride prevents dental caries. Get used to it.

Please do try to keep up.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/11/23/vaccinated-people-now-make-up-majority-covid-deaths/

Covid is no longer mainly a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Here’s why.

[GarryP]

23 minutes ago, vangrop said:

I was a provax n° one. Untill recently less than 2 months after a fourth dosis I got the disease. IMO they are ineffectieve. They were quickly put together by big Pharma serving them as cashcows. I'm sorry I am not sponsoring any longer big Pharma for their placebo's.

I had two shots and have had covid twice post vaccination. I know the argument is that the vaccine at least reduces the impact when you catch covid, but if you are a healthy individual, I doubt the symptoms would be any worse than I experienced anyway. I have certainly moved in your direction.  

[Lacessit]

20 minutes ago, garrya said:

????

Sheep is sheep can't embellish it anyhow.

People believing in weird chemicals that aren't actually disclosed to the public transparently and sourced in a funny way is strange.

Gravity can't move clouds and apparently bends water. Fluoride does what? Hilarious claims. 

Social media has been brutally censored and if you don't see it, it's weird. 

Cherry pick data? That's exactly the non-peer reviewed convid facts that governments use to enforce ridiculous policies. 

Ask doctors how it all started. 

I'll help you, with an email telling them what their procedure is. 

Gravity is real. Step off the balcony of the fourteenth floor of any condo if you feel like proving it.

The anti-fluoride brigade amuses me, every time they eat canned salmon or drink black tea they are getting a truckload of the compound they get so irate about.

I don't need the help of someone living in some kind of Trumpian parallel universe, thank you.

[PattayaKevin]

I have had 8 covid shots I am eligible for my 9th in a few weeks. I have not had covid yet. I had a small reaction to the 1st vaccine a headache, 2nd vaccine headache again no other reactions since. First vaccine was astrazeneca, 2nd Johnson and Johnson, 3rd Pfizer, 4th astrazeneca, 5th moderna, 6th Pfizer, 7th and 8th moderna. I plan for my 9th vaccine to be moderna again. 

[Thailand]

2 minutes ago, PattayaKevin said:

I have had 8 covid shots I am eligible for my 9th in a few weeks. I have not had covid yet. I had a small reaction to the 1st vaccine a headache, 2nd vaccine headache again no other reactions since. First vaccine was astrazeneca, 2nd Johnson and Johnson, 3rd Pfizer, 4th astrazeneca, 5th moderna, 6th Pfizer, 7th and 8th moderna. I plan for my 9th vaccine to be moderna again. 

I was looking for the "shocked" emoji but could not find it!

[nigelforbes]

3 minutes ago, PattayaKevin said:

I have had 8 covid shots I am eligible for my 9th in a few weeks. I have not had covid yet. I had a small reaction to the 1st vaccine a headache, 2nd vaccine headache again no other reactions since. First vaccine was astrazeneca, 2nd Johnson and Johnson, 3rd Pfizer, 4th astrazeneca, 5th moderna, 6th Pfizer, 7th and 8th moderna. I plan for my 9th vaccine to be moderna again. 

Are you collecting green shield stamps?

[Lacessit]

10 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

Please do try to keep up.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/11/23/vaccinated-people-now-make-up-majority-covid-deaths/

Covid is no longer mainly a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Here’s why.

So you have a BA in Journalism parrotting data produced by the Kaiser Family Foundation in the absence of any semblance of peer review. Don't waste my time.

Try listing your medical qualifications and experience instead.

[rattlesnake]

8 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

So you have a BA in Journalism parrotting data produced by the Kaiser Family Foundation in the absence of any semblance of peer review. Don't waste my time.

Try listing your medical qualifications and experience instead.

Boy are you in for a shock when reality hits you…

[nigelforbes]

34 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

Please do try to keep up.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/11/23/vaccinated-people-now-make-up-majority-covid-deaths/

Covid is no longer mainly a pandemic of the unvaccinated. Here’s why.

Nonsense, have you even read the article and if so, have you understood any of it!

 

"But efficacy wanes over time, and an analysis out last week from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention highlights the need to get regular booster shots to keep one’s risk of death from the coronavirus low, especially for the elderly".

 

 

[frantick]

To my anti-"I am science" bros. Stop trying to enlighten, you're just wasting your time here; come back in a year. By then the true science should be obvious.

[DezLez]

10 minutes ago, frantick said:

come back in a year. By then the true science should be obvious.

Might be too late by then!

[rattlesnake]

33 minutes ago, nigelforbes said:

Nonsense, have you even read the article and if so, have you understood any of it!

 

"But efficacy wanes over time, and an analysis out last week from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention highlights the need to get regular booster shots to keep one’s risk of death from the coronavirus low, especially for the elderly".

 

 

Funny how there is always a "smart one" to mention I don't read the articles I post and then go quoting stuff that has nothing to do with what I was saying.

 

Yes, I have read it, and again, Covid is no longer mainly a pandemic of the unvaccinated.

 

I know you find it very tough to accept facts when they don't go your way but that's too bad for you I'm afraid.

[nigelforbes]

Just now, rattlesnake said:

Funny how there is always a "smart one" to mention I don't read the articles I post and then go quoting stuff that has nothing to do with what I was saying.

 

Yes, I have read it, and again, Covid is no longer mainly a pandemic of the unvaccinated.

 

I know you find it very tough to accept "facts" when they don't go your way but that's too bad for you I'm afraid.

I'm faced with two choices, either debate the issue or put you on ignore, it's no surprise which way the vote went.

[rattlesnake]

30 minutes ago, frantick said:

To my anti-"I am science" bros. Stop trying to enlighten, you're just wasting your time here; come back in a year. By then the true science should be obvious.

You're right but accountability is very important, those who condoned and promoted this (the worst phase being a year ago) will have to be confronted with their actions.

[rattlesnake]

Just now, nigelforbes said:

I'm faced with two choices, either debate the issue or put you on ignore, it's no surprise which way the vote went.

On nigelforbes' ignore list, I really have hit rock bottom.

 

Indeed, no surprise at all. Ignoring things can work in the short term, never in the long term. Good luck.

[Lacessit]

2 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

On nigelforbes' ignore list, I really have hit rock bottom.

 

Indeed, no surprise at all. Ignoring things can work in the short term, never in the long term. Good luck.

Does that work the same way when you ignore my request to post your medical qualifications and experience?

[Lucky Bones]

8 hours ago, papa al said:

I'm fat.

I'm old.

I had covid 2x.

Delta & omicron.

Not bad.  Mild & fleeting.

Should I rely on natural immunity,

or should I now risk the provisional vaccine.?

 

 

Oh look! 

Beer o'clock.

To hell with everything else that may or may not kill us at our age.????????

[Lucky Bones]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

An anti-vaxxer is a person who cherry-picks data, and is in denial of the facts, such as an unvaccinated person contracting COVID is 5 or 10 times more likely to occupy an ICU, or suffer the effects of long COVID.

Anti-vaxxers recoil from explaining why the multiple jabs they have had for polio, tetanus, Hep A etc. have not harmed them.

Social media is a haven for nut-jobs who can shriek their beliefs at maximum volume, and support the confirmation biases of one another, while calling sensible people sheeple. O the irony.

Vaccines work, gravity is real, global warming and climate change are facts. Fluoride prevents dental caries. Get used to it.

Well, that is a new slant on the meaning of a "anti-vaxer."

Must be a personal interpretation with journalistic licence thrown in.

Websters probably sums it up in way fewer words.????????

[rattlesnake]

22 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Does that work the same way when you ignore my request to post your medical qualifications and experience?

Right, the "listen to the experts" slogan.

 

The issue with this rationale is that when the experts express concern or criticism of the pharmaceutical doxa, they are no longer listened to or considered to be experts. 

 

A very accommodating notion of science indeed. You're in with it, you're an expert. You're not in with it, you're a "misinformation spreader".

 

I could give you a whole list of scientists who have more relevant experience in the matter than you, yet you would (conveniently) refuse to read or listen to them and all you would be capable of retorting would be the usual newspeak such as "conspiracy theory", "misinformation" and a few elements of pseudo-psychiatric rhetoric such as "nutters" or "loonies".

 

Preposterous as always but I expected nothing less.

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

You have no idea whether it will do any harm or not. I know people who have been seriously harmed.

So do I, and I've heard on the news that someone died because of the jab.

 

https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/475109/man-s-death-ruled-a-result-of-rare-reaction-to-covid-19-vaccine

Dunedin plumber Rory Nairn died from myocarditis caused by the Pfizer Covid-19 vaccine, a coroner has found.

It is the second death ruled to have been caused by the vaccine.

 

Get another dose regularly, OMG! The drug companies must be lovin' it.

[thaibeachlovers]

33 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Does that work the same way when you ignore my request to post your medical qualifications and experience?

Will you accept a coroner has medical qualifications? See my previous post.

[thaibeachlovers]

1 hour ago, Lacessit said:

Gravity is real. Step off the balcony of the fourteenth floor of any condo if you feel like proving it.

The anti-fluoride brigade amuses me, every time they eat canned salmon or drink black tea they are getting a truckload of the compound they get so irate about.

I don't need the help of someone living in some kind of Trumpian parallel universe, thank you.

I see you managed to shoe horn him into that. Just can't get over him, apparently, as keep putting him into as many posts as possible.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Anti-vaxxers recoil from explaining why the multiple jabs they have had for polio, tetanus, Hep A etc. have not harmed them.

Probably because they were developed over years, not rushed like that pfizer thing using "new technology" LOL.

I did have 2 jabs, but not of pfizer and they didn't work either.

I've had colds that were worse.

[Lacessit]

8 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

Right, the "listen to the experts" slogan.

 

The issue with this rationale is that when the experts express concern or criticism of the pharmaceutical doxa, they are no longer listened to or considered to be experts. 

 

A very accommodating notion of science indeed. You're in with it, you're an expert. You're not in with it, you're a "misinformation spreader".

 

I could give you a whole list of scientists who have more relevant experience in the matter than you, yet you would (conveniently) refuse to read or listen to them and all you would be capable of retorting would be the usual newspeak such as "conspiracy theory", "misinformation" and a few elements of pseudo-psychiatric rhetoric such as "nutters" or "loonies".

 

Preposterous as always but I expected nothing less.

What I find preposterous is the fact social media has empowered people of limited education to be so massively influential. No scientific training, no critical thinking skills, yet they consider their "life experience" to be superior to those who have done the hard yards in chemistry, physics and biology. I'll guarantee 99.99% of them have never read R H Thouless, or have any understanding of what the laws of thermodynamics mean.

Telling me I am spreading misinformation is the same inversion of truth Trump uses, very effectively with people who are too dumb to realize they are being used.

I do read contrary points of view. I then put them under the microscope of what is verifiable fact, what is belief, what is exaggeration, and what has been peer-reviewed by credible organizations.

I suspect the list of scientists you may or may not be able to produce will turn out to be those individuals with a specific axe to grind, or financially motivated to express a certain point of view. IIRC, quite a few scientists still work for the tobacco industry.

[garrya]

32 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

Right, the "listen to the experts" slogan.

 

The issue with this rationale is that when the experts express concern or criticism of the pharmaceutical doxa, they are no longer listened to or considered to be experts. 

 

A very accommodating notion of science indeed. You're in with it, you're an expert. You're not in with it, you're a "misinformation spreader".

 

I could give you a whole list of scientists who have more relevant experience in the matter than you, yet you would (conveniently) refuse to read or listen to them and all you would be capable of retorting would be the usual newspeak such as "conspiracy theory", "misinformation" and a few elements of pseudo-psychiatric rhetoric such as "nutters" or "loonies".

 

Preposterous as always but I expected nothing less.

Good one. 

Not saying the "experts" are on whose payroll?? Either pharma or governments. 

If we follow the money, we'll find science ????

[Lacessit]

26 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I see you managed to shoe horn him into that. Just can't get over him, apparently, as keep putting him into as many posts as possible.

 

I put you on ignore many moons ago, I see no reason to change the situation.

[rattlesnake]

51 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

What I find preposterous is the fact social media has empowered people of limited education to be so massively influential. No scientific training, no critical thinking skills, yet they consider their "life experience" to be superior to those who have done the hard yards in chemistry, physics and biology. I'll guarantee 99.99% of them have never read R H Thouless, or have any understanding of what the laws of thermodynamics mean.

Telling me I am spreading misinformation is the same inversion of truth Trump uses, very effectively with people who are too dumb to realize they are being used.

I do read contrary points of view. I then put them under the microscope of what is verifiable fact, what is belief, what is exaggeration, and what has been peer-reviewed by credible organizations.

I suspect the list of scientists you may or may not be able to produce will turn out to be those individuals with a specific axe to grind, or financially motivated to express a certain point of view. IIRC, quite a few scientists still work for the tobacco industry.

What I find preposterous is the fact social media has empowered people of limited education to be so massively influential.

There is a big misunderstanding here: social media platforms banned and vilified all the credible, educated people who were formulating criticism. They are powerful censorship tools often wielded for political purposes.

 

Telling me I am spreading misinformation is the same inversion of truth Trump uses, very effectively with people who are too dumb to realize they are being used.

I don't see how this has anything to do with Trump and, again, insulting people's intelligence is not really relevant.

 

I do read contrary points of view. I then put them under the microscope of what is verifiable fact, what is belief, what is exaggeration, and what has been peer-reviewed by credible organizations.

This is one of the core issues: what is a "credible organization", who draws that list and are they financially independent from those in favour of which they are ruling?

 

I suspect the list of scientists you may or may not be able to produce will turn out to be those individuals with a specific axe to grind, or financially motivated to express a certain point of view.

Most of them have lost a lot more than they would have gained if they had just gone along with it. I could PM you some of them and some things they said but somehow I doubt you will be interested.

[Lorry]

11 hours ago, Lacessit said:

You can get tested for COVID antibodies at a pathology laboratory. IIRC, it cost me 500 baht.

I can't remember the unit of measure. I was told by a staff member if I had a count above 2500, I might be asked to donate blood to assist seriously ill COVID patients.

Perhaps Sheryl can comment on what antibody level would make further jabs unnecessary.

That level is unknown, unfortunately. 

The  measurements of antibody levels aren't even standardized. 

Others have completely different values, eg you may be good to donate plasma if over 850.

If you really want to know your immune status you should also measure neutralizing antibodies,  more expensive (maybe 3000) and not done everywhere. 

But you still won't know whether you should get a booster or not.

[Celsius]

Is Thailand still using the vaccines from yesteryear because in the west they adjusted them for new variants.

 

If these still old vaccines then why even bother?