When did farang start to mean a white person

[GroveHillWanderer]

4 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

Just wondering when farang became a white western person.

It has always meant that. Over the years, probably because they heard it being used for a particular subset of foreigners, quite a few people seem to have come to the mistaken conclusion that it refers to all foreigners.

 

It doesn't, and never has. Thai has always had a number of different words to designate foreigners from different parts of the world.

 

So for instance, "farang" has never been used to refer to Indians, Chinese, or any other Asians, for that matter.

[FarAngMoh]

57 minutes ago, Slip said:

Heya newbie! When people object to other people mistreating them or a 3rd set of people because of the colour of their skin, that isn't "woke nonsense", that is decent behaviour.   If you welcome racism, perhaps you are lucky enough not to have suffered from it.

As a non-Asian minority who has lived in Asia for over half of my life, I have had plenty of opportunities to be offended, but always chose not to.

Thank you for calling me a newbie, I see you are just calling it like it is… I am new to this forum and take no offense to it.
 

Since the woke thing happened long after I left the Western world, I probably have more of an Asian view. No offense intended.

Edited November 29, 2022 by FarAngMoh

[garrya]

It's an interesting question which I have discussed with dozens of Thais. They all claim that farang has always been the white people, Arabs and Asian people aren't considered farang but called different "names," and Africans are the "kon dam" (black person). But they may have been wrong on this. 

Edited November 29, 2022 by garrya

[Barnet1900]

1 hour ago, FarAngMoh said:

If a Thai moved to a Western country, I’m sure they hear themselves being referred to as Asian (or worse) all of the time.

No they wouldn't. In the UK if people know you're from Thailand your Thai. China Chinese, Japanese etc 

 

Certainly wouldn't be called out as Asian on TV. Thai food, Chinese, Japanese..not Asian food. The list goes on and on. Aharn Farang. No differentiation attempted at all. Total ignorance and bliss.

 

We call Germans, Italians, Dutch by their nationality not European. If you called someone from New Zealand an Aussie and found out it was wrong you'd never do it again.

 

Whatever its roots and connotations it should change in this day and age considering the volume of different nationalities here.

 

I've heard elderly people call people derogatory names out of naievity. No offense meant but doesn't mean it shouldn't be stopped.

 

Totally wrong.

 

[Neeranam]

4 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

 Khairks

Kaek? There is no plural, same as 'farang;

[Neeranam]

9 minutes ago, Barnet1900 said:

No they wouldn't. In the UK if people know you're from Thailand your Thai. China Chinese, Japanese etc 

Not when I lived there, we used to say <deleted> or Chinky, for all Asians. 

[Neeranam]

5 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

My interpretation from everyone Thai and non Thai was that it was a foreigner meaning that it was multi cultural and multi colored.

Farang means white foreigner, not all foreigners

[ballpoint]

Arabs and Persians have been referring to white people as al-Faranj and Farangi respectively since the time of the crusades, the term coming from the word Frank, which was based on the Germanic tribe of that name, located in part of where France is now, and then more generally anyone of Western European origin.  The term Farangi was likely introduced to Thailand by Arab and Indian Traders in the Ayutthaya period, as it was first used back then to refer to (the mainly Portuguese) European traders visiting the country at that time.  Therefore, the term Farang has likely been used by Thais as meaning "white person" from the 1300's, and definitely was used in the 1500's.

 

Many Polynesian Pacific islands also refer to white people as Palangi, a derivation of Farang, with the exception of New Zealand, where we are officially classed as Pakeha.

[GroveHillWanderer]

16 minutes ago, garrya said:

It's an interesting question which I have discussed with dozens of Thais. They all claim that farang has always been the white people, Arabs and Asian people aren't considered farang but called different "names," and Africans are the "kon dam" (black person). But they may have been wrong on this. 

They might have been wrong - but they weren't. Arabs, Indians, Africans, Chinese and other non-Thai Asians are not referred to by Thais as farang and never were.

[Phnom Penh Trader]

45 minutes ago, stoner said:

so is my wife canadian inuit or asian ? im so confused now ????

 

Wave a Som Tam under her nose and you will soon find out!

[garrya]

48 minutes ago, stoner said:

so is my wife canadian inuit or asian ? im so confused now ????

 

Check her passport. Government knows better ????

[GammaGlobulin]

Farang does not mean Foreigner! 

 

For example, Indians are foreigners. 

 

But in passa Thai, Indians are not Farang. 

 

Indians, in passa Thai, are Kek. 

 

I'm sure you can understand the logic of this. 

 

If not, then just spend an hour searching on Google Scholar. 

 

 

[Slip]

53 minutes ago, FarAngMoh said:

As a non-Asian minority who has lived in Asia for over half of my life, I have had plenty of opportunities to be offended, but always chose not to.

Thank you for calling me a newbie, I see you are just calling it like it is… I am new to this forum and take no offense to it.
 

Since the woke thing happened long after I left the Western world, I probably have more of an Asian view. No offense intended.

Thanks for a thoughtful response, and perhaps I should apologise for the 'newbie' comment- but they put it right there in your blurb at first, so I always think of it as being a bit of a rite of passage.  All the same sorry if it made you feel remarked upon.

 

I agree with your view on not getting uptight about the small stuff, and as a middle aged white male I haven't had much to worry about, but for sure many others have, and to them racism or such is more immediate.  This is the thing I feel we are all duty bound as decent people to be mindful of. 

 

I also left before 'woke' was even thought of, and I don't know how to go about it or deal with it now.  Happily hiding out here has been effective so far 55.

[it is what it is]

3 hours ago, fusion58 said:

Many Thais with whom I've broached the subject insist that "farang" translates to "foreigner," but when I ask "are Japanese or Korean people also farangs?" then the reply is always an emphatic "no." Something doesn't jibe here!

it's, i believe, connected to a word referring to the colonial french in neighboring countries

[hotandsticky]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

Kaek? There is no plural, same as 'farang;

Indians..... I have always known it as Kaek but today read it as "Kairks".

 

Of course it is plural if there is more than one Indian!

[Neeranam]

25 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Indians..... I have always known it as Kaek but today read it as "Kairks".

 

Of course it is plural if there is more than one Indian!

It's a Thai word, so not Pluralable. 

[hotandsticky]

5 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

It's a Thai word, so not Pluralable. 

Farangs is plural 

[ozimoron]

4 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Farangs is plural 

Farangs is not a word.

[Myran]

13 minutes ago, hotandsticky said:

Farangs is plural 

Certainly not. One farang, many farang.

[Phnom Penh Trader]

3 hours ago, Neeranam said:

Kaek? There is no plural, same as 'farang;

Kaek is racist for Indians,Jaek is racist for Chinese and Farang is racist for whitey/honkey/cracker end of story!

[tgw]

36 minutes ago, Phnom Penh Trader said:

Kaek is racist for Indians,Jaek is racist for Chinese and Farang is racist for whitey/honkey/cracker end of story!

I don't agree. An average Thai calling caucasian people farang is more or less equivalent to a westerner saying someone is black. It usually doesn't carry judgement and is mostly descriptive.

[Phnom Penh Trader]

2 hours ago, tgw said:

I don't agree. An average Thai calling caucasian people farang is more or less equivalent to a westerner saying someone is black. It usually doesn't carry judgement and is mostly descriptive.

Do you speak,read or write Thai as I can do all three?

[tgw]

19 minutes ago, Phnom Penh Trader said:

Do you speak,read or write Thai as I can do all three?

I see, please let me delete my opinion then

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

Just wondering when farang became a white western person.

LOL.

It's what they called French people hundreds of years ago, and came to mean any white western person.

 

Sooooo it's ALWAYS been a white western person.

12 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

My interpretation from everyone Thai and non Thai was that it was a foreigner meaning that it was multi cultural and multi colored.

Were they all rainbows?

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, Phnom Penh Trader said:

Kaek is racist for Indians,Jaek is racist for Chinese and Farang is racist for whitey/honkey/cracker end of story!

Rubbish.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

Farangs is plural 

Need an eye's rolling emoji here.

[sezze]

8 hours ago, connda said:

When I'm in a group of Thais and hear the word, "Farang", I know exactly who they are talking about, and at the point I tend to focus in on the conversation.  It's fun catching them saying something derogatory (it doesn't happy often but it does happen) and then saying something that lets them know I heard and understood them, usually with me grinning and making direct eye-contact.  Major loss of face.  But most of the time it's a simply descriptor that identifies one person out of a crowd, or a specific somebody who lives in a Tambon that is rather free of Westerners.

Other than that though, I don't care.  I live in an area where I'm one out of another two 'farangs' in our Tambon, and I don't know either of them personally.  Just the way I like it.

Well isn't that the case everywhere around the world (before the woke thing) . If you see somebody with a different skin color and you need to know who that is , you do pronounce him as the "person with that color" . In Thailand that means "farang" if you are a white person. I do not call it racist in anyway . Only be offenced if they do know who you are and keep on calling you farang instead of your name.

[thaibeachlovers]

7 hours ago, it is what it is said:

it's, i believe, connected to a word referring to the colonial french in neighboring countries

From everything I've learned in my decades in LOS, that that is correct.

 

IMO trying to make it multicultural is wokeness in action.

 

BTW, whatever anyone says, nothing I learned about if says that it's racist, but I guess people of a certain mind set see racism in everything.

Edited November 29, 2022 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

8 hours ago, connda said:

When I'm in a group of Thais and hear the word, "Farang", I know exactly who they are talking about, and at the point I tend to focus in on the conversation.  It's fun catching them saying something derogatory (it doesn't happy often but it does happen) and then saying something that lets them know I heard and understood them, usually with me grinning and making direct eye-contact.  Major loss of face. 

When I lived in the village and heard them talking about the farang I had no wish to know what they were saying, as if derogatory what would I do then- leave the village?

 

Never a good idea to make Thais lose face in front of their friends. They'll get you in the end.

[thaibeachlovers]

5 hours ago, hotandsticky said:

Farangs is plural 

Are you saying fruit is fruits if more than one fruit?