Rabies Exposure

[endure]

Stop the flaming and bickering. Holidays are available for those who won't.

[a2396]

The more important issue here is that, in my opinion, Thailand has a dog problem. In particular a lose dog problem. I have never been anywhere in the world where stray dogs, some in packs, wonder about willy-nilly and unrestricted. The mindset here is they seem to be the equivelent of a sacred cow. Where I lived in Malaysia they would shoot loose dogs. China's new one dog policy would be great here.

[lingling]

But the thing is what we 'farang' can do about it ? Nothing. What the Thai can do about it ! everything .

We farang can acknowledge that there is a problem and inform others. Then maybe the Thais who can do something about it will. Or we can just stick our heads in the sand and ignore it.

[bendix]

But the thing is what we 'farang' can do about it ? Nothing. What the Thai can do about it ! everything .

We farang can acknowledge that there is a problem and inform others. Then maybe the Thais who can do something about it will. Or we can just stick our heads in the sand and ignore it.

:D

No, really, I mean it.

:D

[tijnebijn]

But the thing is what we 'farang' can do about it ? Nothing. What the Thai can do about it ! everything .

We farang can acknowledge that there is a problem and inform others. Then maybe the Thais who can do something about it will. Or we can just stick our heads in the sand and ignore it.

To talk with thais to do something about anything I gave up a long time ago .It is the sad truth they just do not care , unless it is next to the 'important' person themselves .

[lingling]

To talk with thais to do something about anything I gave up a long time ago .It is the sad truth they just do not care , unless it is next to the 'important' person themselves .

Wrong attitude. It is a slow process, but nagging works.

[November Rain]

Considering you said this has nothing to do with the closed threads, I'm at a loss to see your point at all.

I'm not expecting you to see my point. The day you have children of your own you will.

Others who have children will most likely understand that 33% bitten by the age of 15, >86% of them by dogs, 80% unprovoked is not a good thing.

Not only do you have problems reading studies & applying the information, as I have already pointed out, you also have problems reading posts, it seems. In the post that you took my quote from (above), it stated that my son had been bitten by a monkey & received rabies jabs. So, I do have a child. I do also, like all parents, take care to protect him from harm. In my town, at this time, harm seems more likely from speeding drivers than soi dogs.

Please note, again, that the statistics you are using relate to dogs in general, not specifically stray dogs (which seem to be the ones you have the problem with) and are not that different from the figures for Australia (1980), where I do not believe they have a significant stray problem as we do in Thailand.

As for solutions; a simple start is spay/neuter programmes (as done already by SDR, Dogchance, Samuidog, SDF and others and about to be started by us in our area). The soi dogs are brought in, neutered, vaccinated against rabies & released when recovered. That reduces population & exposure to rabies (as the dogs will be vaccinated). Neutering can also reduce aggressiveness, which may reduce the number of bites - I am not aware if any studies have been done on that aspect, but it would be interesting to know. If the govt would put their efforts into N&R, as well as the non-profit orgs, I believe the problem would be vastly reduced.

[lingling]

Considering you said this has nothing to do with the closed threads, I'm at a loss to see your point at all.

I'm not expecting you to see my point. The day you have children of your own you will.

Others who have children will most likely understand that 33% bitten by the age of 15, >86% of them by dogs, 80% unprovoked is not a good thing.

Not only do you have problems reading studies & applying the information, as I have already pointed out, you also have problems reading posts, it seems. In the post that you took my quote from (above), it stated that my son had been bitten by a monkey & received rabies jabs. So, I do have a child. I do also, like all parents, take care to protect him from harm. In my town, at this time, harm seems more likely from speeding drivers than soi dogs.

Please note, again, that the statistics you are using relate to dogs in general, not specifically stray dogs (which seem to be the ones you have the problem with) and are not that different from the figures for Australia (1980), where I do not believe they have a significant stray problem as we do in Thailand.

As for solutions; a simple start is spay/neuter programmes (as done already by SDR, Dogchance, Samuidog, SDF and others and about to be started by us in our area). The soi dogs are brought in, neutered, vaccinated against rabies & released when recovered. That reduces population & exposure to rabies (as the dogs will be vaccinated). Neutering can also reduce aggressiveness, which may reduce the number of bites - I am not aware if any studies have been done on that aspect, but it would be interesting to know. If the govt would put their efforts into N&R, as well as the non-profit orgs, I believe the problem would be vastly reduced.

The government has already tried neutering programmes several times but with 110k estimated strays and a few hundred thousand more let onto the streets by their owners that has not been very successful. Instead, rabies incidence is going up. Read the links I posted.

And again, the day you have children of your own you will probably see the dog problem from a different angle.

[November Rain]

^^^ I do have a son!!! How many times do I need to say it?

[jackr]

My son was bitten on the face in a restaurant not long back... luckily it healed pretty well and there hopefully won't be too much scarring. Could have taken his eye out! Neutering is defo the way to go but for now, best to round em up in a field and bomb the b@stards!

[lingling]

My son was bitten on the face in a restaurant not long back... luckily it healed pretty well and there hopefully won't be too much scarring. Could have taken his eye out! Neutering is defo the way to go but for now, best to round em up in a field and bomb the b@stards!

Ouch, lucky he didn't lose his eye or catch any diseases. Was the dog taken care of and autopsied? (A brain tissue biopsy is needed for rabies screening)

[sriracha john]

Is rabies really that serious here in Thailand/ I would like more proof, please.

You'll find some more facts in this article:

http://www.soonak.com/PDF/JMATVol88_No1_120.pdf

More than 400,000 persons required rabies post-exposure prophylaxis (PEP) in 2003, more than 4 times as many as those in 1991 [93,641 cases in 1991; 183,815 in 1996 and 350,535 in 2001].

As the number of soi dogs continues to proliferate and with the human population increasing as well which would bring the two into more and more frequent contact with each other and in addition to the ever-increasing trend cited, I think it's safe to say that those numbers will likely surpass half a million for 2007.

That's a staggering amount and this issue needs to be definitively addressed.

Edited June 29, 2007 by sriracha john

[kmart]

Sort of off-topic, but kind of a surreal memory: I remember one time in Phuket, when some stray dogs bit the child of a tourist family and the resulting headlines / adverse affect on tourism shock-horror forced the local bigwig into doing something.... His solution; a gang of islamic kids going round armed with a jam-jar filled with Strichnyne and a spike on a long bamboo pole.

These kids would dip the spike in the pot of poison and go around jabbing it into strays around the beaches and restaurants of Patong, in the daytime, in full view of horrified tourist families and everybody else. The dogs died in agony, foaming at the mouth, and screaming in pain, btw. Great advert for "Amazing Thailand" or whatever slogan was doing the rounds at the time....

Careful what you wish for.

[sbk]

Personal attacks on other members have been deleted. Further such posts will result in suspension.

[Gary A]

There is no doubt that rabies is a serious problem. On the other hand I have seen children that should be locked up and their parents flogged for NOT teaching their children to respect animals.

[sriracha john]

Some additional information on the topic:

The infectious agent - Rhabdoviridae Lyssavirus

Method of Transmission - Bites of infected animals pass the virus on through saliva.

Symptoms of the infected animal - Irritation, aggressiveness, disorientation.

Ultimately, convulsions lead to death.

Rabies in humans:

Edited June 29, 2007 by sriracha john

[lingling]

Method of Transmission - Bites of infected animals pass the virus on through saliva.

Also worth noting is that it can be transferred without a bite - a friendly lick from an infected animal can sometimes be enough. There was a tourist girl a couple of years ago who died after having played with an infected dog in TH. She was never bitten, just played with it. Should be somewhere in the news forum.

Edited June 29, 2007 by lingling

[sriracha john]

Members of the forum, raise your hand if you encounter a similar-appearing dog in Thailand on an all-to-frequent basis?

[sbk]

posts referencing ways to poison dogs have been deleted. It has already been stated by moderators that it is not acceptable. If you must continue this dialog do so by personal message. Further such posts will be be deleted and posters warned.

[Jet Gorgon]

My son was bitten on the face in a restaurant not long back... luckily it healed pretty well and there hopefully won't be too much scarring.

And where were you in the restaurant when your son got bitten, Mr Jack? Ohhhhh. Drinking with the buds. Yep, blame the stray animals.

Thailand is full of wild things: soi dogs and cats, scorpions, centipedes, drunks on bikes. You all complain about the dogs but seeing as how your taxes are so high, it seems you can't contribute to dog rescue centres that try to take care of these problems. What moaners. I got bit by lots of dogs in Thailand and never got a rabies shot (oh, that's why she's mad!). My neighbour's dog in Canada bit me last week because I wanted the financial calculator that he had between his jaws. My neighbours think I will sue. Geez. It's life. I grabbed the calc, dog bit me, I bashed him on the nose, and he dropped the calculator. I washed off my arm. Big deal. Get on with it.

Donate to your local animal rescue centres and maybe the four-legged creatures, who have as much right as you to be here, will diminish in population. Then you can start on killing off the other things that intrude on your life, like the cries of your neighbour's baby or the husband's snoring. Chill out.

[jackr]

My son was bitten on the face in a restaurant not long back... luckily it healed pretty well and there hopefully won't be too much scarring.

And where were you in the restaurant when your son got bitten, Mr Jack? Ohhhhh. Drinking with the buds. Yep, blame the stray animals.

Thailand is full of wild things: soi dogs and cats, scorpions, centipedes, drunks on bikes. You all complain about the dogs but seeing as how your taxes are so high, it seems you can't contribute to dog rescue centres that try to take care of these problems. What moaners. I got bit by lots of dogs in Thailand and never got a rabies shot (oh, that's why she's mad!). My neighbour's dog in Canada bit me last week because I wanted the financial calculator that he had between his jaws. My neighbours think I will sue. Geez. It's life. I grabbed the calc, dog bit me, I bashed him on the nose, and he dropped the calculator. I washed off my arm. Big deal. Get on with it.

Donate to your local animal rescue centres and maybe the four-legged creatures, who have as much right as you to be here, will diminish in population. Then you can start on killing off the other things that intrude on your life, like the cries of your neighbour's baby or the husband's snoring. Chill out.

The dippy doogooder animal lover brigade have been rattled.

No, I wasn't actually. I was more upset with the restaurateurs than the dog for encouraging the thing into the restaurant and feeding it, but by your reasoning I should probably blame myself for moving to Muang Thai and invading the dog's space

Btw, my son is now doing well thanks for asking. I pray that your son or daughter never go though the same ordeal - ohhh, what's that, you don't have any because you'd rather spend the money on a necklace for little Fido?

[meom]

Method of Transmission - Bites of infected animals pass the virus on through saliva.

Also worth noting is that it can be transferred without a bite - a friendly lick from an infected animal can sometimes be enough. There was a tourist girl a couple of years ago who died after having played with an infected dog in TH. She was never bitten, just played with it. Should be somewhere in the news forum.

I think it's sort of standard procedure that when you get bitten by an animal you take a rabies shot just in case since most of the time the offending animal has run away so you can't really check if the animal in question had rabies or not.

I could be wrong but believe that the majority of stray dogs don't carry the rabies virus so a lot what you write is more scaremongering than anything else. That's ok because it's no fun to be bitten by a dog or any other animal for that matter.

[Jet Gorgon]

Like I said before, donate to the local dog rescue centres. In some areas, you just call them and they come and take the dogs; at the very least, they'll jab for rabies and neuter/spay the animals before releasing. November Rain runs a dog charity in Hua Hin and would likely be kind enough to explain these programmes, as would other TV members, like Nienke. Soi dogs may be a nuisance or dangerous to some, but so are many things.

During my long stay in Thailand, I only heard of one case of rabies (north Koh Phangnan, and I think the dog was bitten by a rabid bat; Sbk, do you know more?). We vaccinated every dog we could find when that happened. There is one island near Samui that is dog free (Ko Tan?), although it has thousands of bats (probably the reason for the absence of dogs -- the high-pitched radar squeaks). Maybe dog haters could mport some bats into their neighbourhoods or develop a whistle with that frequency -- hey, make millions!

Oh, I did not intend to sound uncaring about your son, Jackr; of course, it must have been a terrifying experience for him and for your family. Glad to hear he is recovering well.

[endure]

As this thread appears to have run its course and has turned into a magnet for personal remarks it's now closed.