Italy moves to rescue 1,200 migrants on boats

[RayC]

3 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Refugees are supposed to be seeking temporary refuge until they can return to their homeland. It is not a substitute for immigration.

That may be the theory but the real world is a bit different.

 

Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq, Iran, etc. have been unstable for decades and show no signs of returning to normal any time soon. To all extents and purposes, refugees from these countries are immigrants and imo should be aided to integrate into their 'new' societies, so that they contribute towards it.

 

What would you have done with Jewish refugees who fled Nazi Germany? Sent them all back to Germany in 1945?

 

3 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

Generally, they flee trouble and are supposed to stop in the first safe country they enter.

And what about the effects on the countries where they land? Should the rest of Europe effectively say to Greece, Italy and Turkey, 'Not our problem'?

 

3 hours ago, Hanaguma said:

They are not to "shop around" for the best deal or be picky about where they temporarily are housed. 

And I would guess that, in practice, very few do "shop around".

 

As I said previously, imo Italy is a wonderful country but I doubt that many refugees are as enamoured with it as I am, and would be perfectly happy to be relocated to another European state (as would those arriving in Greece and Turkey).

 

In the case of those arriving in the UK, they probably have a family member/ friend in the UK. Hopefully, this would make it easier for the individual to integrate into British society. Isn't that in everyone's best interests?

[thaibeachlovers]

12 hours ago, RayC said:

I'm not sure what you mean?

 

My interpretation - which obviously may be completely incorrect - is that this means asylum seekers cannot become permanent residents/ citizens of the country in which they seek refuge? Instead, they are held in what sounds like some sort of "open prison" where they remain until their home country is deemed to be safe? 

 

As I said, this might be a complete misinterpretation. If so, apologies.

 

"Any" implies refugees as well as economic migrant. 

 

Isn't that what happens in the UK currently?

You are correct. A q jumper should never be allowed to become a citizen or why would any bother with joining the q?

Yes, asylum seekers should be held in a safe place, not necessarily in the country of their choosing, till their country is safe to return to.

Would not be applicable to undocumented economic migrants as they would be deported as soon as identified as such.

IMO any undocumented arrival from a "safe" country is an economic arrival.

 

A q jumper refers also to a genuine refugee that leaves the first safe country they come to and pays criminals to transport them to a country of their choosing.

 

Isn't that what happens in the UK currently?

I'm not in the UK to be sure, but it doesn't appear to be so.

[thaibeachlovers]

7 hours ago, RayC said:

Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq, Iran, etc. have been unstable for decades and show no signs of returning to normal any time soon. To all extents and purposes, refugees from these countries are immigrants and imo should be aided to integrate into their 'new' societies, so that they contribute towards it.

Why? That's all very well in theory, but in practice it seems that they don't want to integrate but choose to try and change their new home to resemble the place they came from.

I have no problem with giving them safe refuge, even if in another country, indefinitely. After all most Syrian refugees live in camps in Turkey. Perhaps helping the Turks making those camps better would lead to a reduction in numbers paying criminals to go to Europe.

[thaibeachlovers]

7 hours ago, RayC said:

What would you have done with Jewish refugees who fled Nazi Germany? Sent them all back to Germany in 1945?

No, as I've already said, give them safe refuge till it was safe for them to return, or go elsewhere, like Israel.