Thai children losing out on height due to too little milk

[fredwiggy]

6 minutes ago, h90 said:

Soy products are very bad for young boys...... But yes you could replace the milk with a boiled egg, but please not with some soy product

Soy products in moderation aren't bad for anyone not allergic to them. It's when a family uses soy as their main source of protein when a chance for Kawasaki disease can happen. Children here are fed a lot of chicken, eggs, pork and fish and soy , although used, isn't a mainstay, so there is very little risk. Soy has been said to raise estrogen levels but that's still not the case in moderation.

[Gecko123]

Not sure if I like the thought of Thai teenage boys towering over me.

[bignok]

3 hours ago, hotchilli said:

Maybe if the stopped meddling with milk by adding flavourings and other rubbish and actually sponsored natural fresh milk they might be more interested.

So much fake milk. Is there any real milk any more? 

 

https://www.eatingwell.com/article/7944074/foods-with-more-calcium-than-milk/#:~:text=Yogurt,-Pictured Recipe%3A Yogurt&text=Like milk%2C plain yogurt is,same serving size as milk.

 

I worry about drs saying milk is good

[Mr Meeseeks]

53 minutes ago, h90 said:

but I don't see a problem with education on health and hygiene....Thais are pretty clean

When I lived with my ex, her kids would not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before meals. They also did not clean up after themselves. Their bathroom was disgusting, and they had to be forced away from their mobile phones to do basic cleaning tasks. Their mother never saw this as important and it caused many arguments between us. 

 

At my company, the Thai men do not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before eating.

 

Sorry, but in my experience Thais are not clean. 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Thais are genetically short people. Milk won't make a difference. ????

[h90]

16 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Soy products in moderation aren't bad for anyone not allergic to them. It's when a family uses soy as their main source of protein when a chance for Kawasaki disease can happen. Children here are fed a lot of chicken, eggs, pork and fish and soy , although used, isn't a mainstay, so there is very little risk. Soy has been said to raise estrogen levels but that's still not the case in moderation.

yes but small boys are very sensitive on estrogen levels.....it may even happen without having it in the food, but balance it out most of the cases. Even a small amount can be harmful there....And it is an unnecessary risk.

Chicken by the way is the next risk, because of the Salmonella Statica medicine they often get, metabolics of it are function as estrogen....was a big topic years ago in Thailand when boys got breasts from too much KFC.....better leave it out when there are better options like milk, eggs (with quality control), etc

[h90]

8 minutes ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

When I lived with my ex, her kids would not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before meals. They also did not clean up after themselves. Their bathroom was disgusting, and they had to be forced away from their mobile phones to do basic cleaning tasks. Their mother never saw this as important and it caused many arguments between us. 

 

At my company, the Thai men do not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before eating.

 

Sorry, but in my experience Thais are not clean. 

OK....yes I accept that argument, even I think exactly that is even worse in the west. But being a bit of a disgusting pig does not keep you small. You can pee on your fingers and than it a burger and it won't be a problem (I'll get slim watching it....(I am already feeling a bit sick having the picture in my head)) but it is no problem.

the focus on the mobile phone instead of playing outside (lack of exercise, lack of Vitamin D from the sun) is far bigger problem.

[LEXUS 400]

No problem , canabis can make you high !.

[alien365]

What's wrong with being short? I thought many, me included, love short slim Thai women. 

[h90]

2 minutes ago, alien365 said:

What's wrong with being short? I thought many, me included, love short slim Thai women. 

I also love tall slim Thai women....I have no problem if a woman is taller than me....if it is not freakish tall

[keithkarmann]

Not just losing out with height. Mathematics was drilled into children when I was at school and now in Thailand teenagers have no idea about adding, minus, multiplication and division. Times tables are forever in my old brain. Will have to give our six year old daughter extra tuition at least with maths, yesterday she learnt from me the difference between 2 + 5 and 2 × 5, to her both equations came to 7.

[fredwiggy]

15 minutes ago, h90 said:

yes but small boys are very sensitive on estrogen levels.....it may even happen without having it in the food, but balance it out most of the cases. Even a small amount can be harmful there....And it is an unnecessary risk.

Chicken by the way is the next risk, because of the Salmonella Statica medicine they often get, metabolics of it are function as estrogen....was a big topic years ago in Thailand when boys got breasts from too much KFC.....better leave it out when there are better options like milk, eggs (with quality control), etc

Like I mentioned, in moderation soy doesn't cause any problems. I myself eat chicken at least three times a week, and have eaten soy products all my life, along with many others I have trained in gyms and given diet advice to, and it has never caused an issue. There have been a few studies showing how soy might hurt some, but the evidence against such is far outweighing any for it. A Chinese man who ate a huge amount of fried chicken doesn't compare to the millions of others who have been eating fried chicken weekly for all of their lives. Fried chicken down south in the US is a given, and you don't hear of it happening there, besides the ones who are obese from a bad diet. Gynecomastia is different. It happens with an imbalance of oestrogen and testosterone and isn't related to diet in any studies. Soy protein is used by many bodybuilders to add more protein to their diets instead of using milk. I used it for years when I was in the gyms, and never saw anyone affected by it, besides the ones using steroids, and they were few and far between, the ones who developed gynecomastia.

[keithkarmann]

33 minutes ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

When I lived with my ex, her kids would not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before meals. They also did not clean up after themselves. Their bathroom was disgusting, and they had to be forced away from their mobile phones to do basic cleaning tasks. Their mother never saw this as important and it caused many arguments between us. 

 

At my company, the Thai men do not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before eating.

 

Sorry, but in my experience Thais are not clean. 

Many times I have refused to eat with my Thai wife's family out of a big bowl in the middle of the floor. Never saw anyone wash their hand before delving into the bowl. What are knives and forks?

[h90]

3 minutes ago, keithkarmann said:

Many times I have refused to eat with my Thai wife's family out of a big bowl in the middle of the floor. Never saw anyone wash their hand before delving into the bowl. What are knives and forks?

Yes I remember epic rants from my wife (Thai) when staff eat together put their spoon into the big bowl in the center instead of having a dedicated one and put it on their dish first.....She refuses to eat together with them...because of that....

You are right.....I wasn't really aware of it, as it is outside my bubble.....

 

[fredwiggy]

37 minutes ago, Mr Meeseeks said:

When I lived with my ex, her kids would not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before meals. They also did not clean up after themselves. Their bathroom was disgusting, and they had to be forced away from their mobile phones to do basic cleaning tasks. Their mother never saw this as important and it caused many arguments between us. 

 

At my company, the Thai men do not wash their hands after going to the toilet or before eating.

 

Sorry, but in my experience Thais are not clean. 

There are pros and cons in that statement. I've been here, and have seen both sides in every family. My ex wife and girlfriend now, although worked a lot on the family's farms, and got very dirty, walking in the muck and wading in the ponds for fish, were, are, very clean when they get home and shower. Their families have shown both sides also. They all shower, sometimes three times a day, and yet eat with hands and share sticky rice, which is a Covid nightmare anyway. I have to teach my 6 year old, who lives with me now, because my ex went to Pattaya to work for a time, and was going back and forth while my ex had her most of the time, to wash her hair by herself, wipe from front to back, and brush her teeth. My gf's son doesn't brush his teeth, although I've suggested it at times. It's like being taught Buddhism since birth. A Christian like myself knows the outcome, but millions are convinced otherwise. That was not meant to start another argument, just to show how a culture does things, while others are more advanced. Granted, there are many people living in my home country of USA, that are downright slobs, so it's not always a regional thing. I have seen many businessmen, while training in a few gyms, not flush the bowl after going number 2, and these same men dressed in suits leaving the gym for work.

[h90]

9 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Like I mentioned, in moderation soy doesn't cause any problems. I myself eat chicken at least three times a week, and have eaten soy products all my life, along with many others I have trained in gyms and given diet advice to, and it has never caused an issue. There have been a few studies showing how soy might hurt some, but the evidence against such is far outweighing any for it. A Chinese man who ate a huge amount of fried chicken doesn't compare to the millions of others who have been eating fried chicken weekly for all of their lives. Fried chicken down south in the US is a given, and you don't hear of it happening there, besides the ones who are obese from a bad diet. Gynecomastia is different. It happens with an imbalance of oestrogen and testosterone and isn't related to diet in any studies. Soy protein is used by many bodybuilders to add more protein to their diets instead of using milk. I used it for years when I was in the gyms, and never saw anyone affected by it, besides the ones using steroids, and they were few and far between, the ones who developed gynecomastia.

Yes of course you are right it is a quantity issue. I would guess isolated Soy protein is no problem at all....I as child (I guess just before puberty??, but can't remember)I developed a bit of nipples. The doctor told to not freak out, most of the time it resolves itself....but keep looking at it.....Got complete away and I don't even have the man boobs the beer drinking farangs usually have. Different than testosterone you can eat estrogen...and it is now already discussed in USA if the estrogen mimicking substances MAY cause some mental issues....The chicken issue was in Thailand and it was young boys who developed breasts.....but yes huge amounts they spoke about >3 times per day KFC. I would guess in US there is a better food safety.

As you write "besides the ones who are obese from a bad diet." You have fat obese kids and the soy thing on top of it.

You are thinking of some healthy exercising man. I think of already bad eating lazy boys pre puperty...who have already several problems.

Lactose in milk can be easily removed if that is a problem in Thailand. So I don't see any benefit from the Soy.
 

[ChipButty]

25 minutes ago, keithkarmann said:

Not just losing out with height. Mathematics was drilled into children when I was at school and now in Thailand teenagers have no idea about adding, minus, multiplication and division. Times tables are forever in my old brain. Will have to give our six year old daughter extra tuition at least with maths, yesterday she learnt from me the difference between 2 + 5 and 2 × 5, to her both equations came to 7.

Seems like they dont do mental arithmetic in Thailand even at my ripe old age my brain works faster than the midget on her calculator 

[h90]

15 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

There are pros and cons in that statement. I've been here, and have seen both sides in every family. My ex wife and girlfriend now, although worked a lot on the family's farms, and got very dirty, walking in the muck and wading in the ponds for fish, were, are, very clean when they get home and shower. Their families have shown both sides also. They all shower, sometimes three times a day, and yet eat with hands and share sticky rice, which is a Covid nightmare anyway. I have to teach my 6 year old, who lives with me now, because my ex went to Pattaya to work for a time, and was going back and forth while my ex had her most of the time, to wash her hair by herself, wipe from front to back, and brush her teeth. My gf's son doesn't brush his teeth, although I've suggested it at times. It's like being taught Buddhism since birth. A Christian like myself knows the outcome, but millions are convinced otherwise. That was not meant to start another argument, just to show how a culture does things, while others are more advanced. Granted, there are many people living in my home country of USA, that are downright slobs, so it's not always a regional thing. I have seen many businessmen, while training in a few gyms, not flush the bowl after going number 2, and these same men dressed in suits leaving the gym for work.

I don't see any health problem sharing sticky rice with their fingers...not a problem....not cleaning teeth is a problem....(which is strange because why would humans need it while no other animal needs it?? Maybe because we don't eat natural food??).

not flow the bowl ????I guess I know why I train at home.....

[h90]

4 minutes ago, ChipButty said:

Seems like they dont do mental arithmetic in Thailand even at my ripe old age my brain works faster than the midget on her calculator 

I have seen people on the market amazed that I could give something like 140 Baht after buying 2 beer for 70 Baht, before she put it into the calculator...
Real simple things....not 17 beers at 63.3 Baht...just 2x70.

[fredwiggy]

8 minutes ago, h90 said:

Yes of course you are right it is a quantity issue. I would guess isolated Soy protein is no problem at all....I as child (I guess just before puberty??, but can't remember)I developed a bit of nipples. The doctor told to not freak out, most of the time it resolves itself....but keep looking at it.....Got complete away and I don't even have the man boobs the beer drinking farangs usually have. Different than testosterone you can eat estrogen...and it is now already discussed in USA if the estrogen mimicking substances MAY cause some mental issues....The chicken issue was in Thailand and it was young boys who developed breasts.....but yes huge amounts they spoke about >3 times per day KFC. I would guess in US there is a better food safety.

As you write "besides the ones who are obese from a bad diet." You have fat obese kids and the soy thing on top of it.

You are thinking of some healthy exercising man. I think of already bad eating lazy boys pre puperty...who have already several problems.

Lactose in milk can be easily removed if that is a problem in Thailand. So I don't see any benefit from the Soy.
 

I'm talking about how milk isn't necessary for humans, and that soy isn't a problem, unless for some it's consumed in large amounts. The diet here isn't all healthy. Thai's eat rice almost every meal. White rice, which converts to sugar quickly, lending to many developing diabetes. Pork isn't the healthiest meat, but lean pork is okay if eaten moderately. Chicken is lean, but too much of it can cause problems for some. Fish is about the healthiest, leanest protein from animals you can eat, but too much of some is high in mercury, which isn't a good thing. All in moderation is what you're supposed to do anyway. The local stores here have drinks, up to 95%, which are loaded with sugar. That, along with daily rice, other snacks high in fats, is a ticking time bomb for children. Of course, the obese rate in Thailand is low compared to the US and other countries, but it's steadily increasing yearly because of their diets. Kids all usually start out thin, with some exceptions where they are given too much junk from toddler age, as I see here a lot, and some kids are very fat entering the first grade, but worldwide, most children are lean until they reach teenage or young adult years. It's then when what their parents taught them backfires, as it's the parents fault for not teaching them proper nutrition, and giving them too much junk just to appease them works against them, as they'll never know what right to eat unless their expanding waistlines tells them it's time for a change, and they look for advice from others who know.

[fredwiggy]

11 minutes ago, h90 said:

I don't see any health problem sharing sticky rice with their fingers...not a problem....not cleaning teeth is a problem....(which is strange because why would humans need it while no other animal needs it?? Maybe because we don't eat natural food??).

not flow the bowl ????I guess I know why I train at home.....

Most animals don't live long enough to where teeth maintenance matters, although a bad diet for domestic animals does hurt their chances of longevity. Deer, for example, eat a lot of food that's hard, and their teeth wear down and they die a lot of the time because they can no longer eat. On sharing sticky rice, think about it. You put your hands in that rice, then into your mouth, then repeat, as well as all others sharing it with you. You are eating saliva from them,and I'm sure Covid has taken quite a few because of this, along with getting sick from any and all other transferable diseases.

[ikke1959]

maybe real milk would solve some problems instead of water with some powder... and of course maybe the parents are too busy with their cell phones to feed the kids in time.

[h90]

7 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

I'm talking about how milk isn't necessary for humans, and that soy isn't a problem, unless for some it's consumed in large amounts. The diet here isn't all healthy. Thai's eat rice almost every meal. White rice, which converts to sugar quickly, lending to many developing diabetes. Pork isn't the healthiest meat, but lean pork is okay if eaten moderately. Chicken is lean, but too much of it can cause problems for some. Fish is about the healthiest, leanest protein from animals you can eat, but too much of some is high in mercury, which isn't a good thing. All in moderation is what you're supposed to do anyway. The local stores here have drinks, up to 95%, which are loaded with sugar. That, along with daily rice, other snacks high in fats, is a ticking time bomb for children. Of course, the obese rate in Thailand is low compared to the US and other countries, but it's steadily increasing yearly because of their diets. Kids all usually start out thin, with some exceptions where they are given too much junk from toddler age, as I see here a lot, and some kids are very fat entering the first grade, but worldwide, most children are lean until they reach teenage or young adult years. It's then when what their parents taught them backfires, as it's the parents fault for not teaching them proper nutrition, and giving them too much junk just to appease them works against them, as they'll never know what right to eat unless their expanding waistlines tells them it's time for a change, and they look for advice from others who know.

While I do agree on the white rice it puzzles me why in the past they eat the same amount of white rice and it wasn't a problem. My theory is that the rice is less of a problem than sweet drinks from coke to iced coffee mixed with ice cream...But I am not sure if I am right on that.

I disagree with the lean pork....we eat too less good fat and too much cheap carbs....eat the fat pork and cut the rice. Fat meat keeps you full. I hear my staff on the phone what food they should bring home....the fragments Mickey Mouse Pizza (whatever it is) chocolate....etc....The girls on diet, fill themself up with some pills, don't eat but drink three big iced coffee (tons of sugar and palm oil (that white milk substitute)).

And everyone eat that industrial produced food instead of cooking themself.....We tried to convince staff that they cook for lunch in the company...we even paid the food. They didn't want to do it...Fried egg is already too much work

[fredwiggy]

1 minute ago, h90 said:

While I do agree on the white rice it puzzles me why in the past they eat the same amount of white rice and it wasn't a problem. My theory is that the rice is less of a problem than sweet drinks from coke to iced coffee mixed with ice cream...But I am not sure if I am right on that.

I disagree with the lean pork....we eat too less good fat and too much cheap carbs....eat the fat pork and cut the rice. Fat meat keeps you full. I hear my staff on the phone what food they should bring home....the fragments Mickey Mouse Pizza (whatever it is) chocolate....etc....The girls on diet, fill themself up with some pills, don't eat but drink three big iced coffee (tons of sugar and palm oil (that white milk substitute)).

And everyone eat that industrial produced food instead of cooking themself.....We tried to convince staff that they cook for lunch in the company...we even paid the food. They didn't want to do it...Fried egg is already too much work

It IS because of the western food that's been introduced here over the years. You can eat white rice, chicken, fish, pork, buffalo and bugs all day and not get fat. But diabetes, if it's in your genetic history, comes out a lot because of eating too much white rice. You can be small, like my ex's mom, who doesn't weigh 45 kilos, and has been taking insulin for as long as I've known her, over 6 years. There are thousands like her here, small, light and diabetic, because of it. Eating more western junk makes Thais fatter every year.

[h90]

9 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

Most animals don't live long enough to where teeth maintenance matters, although a bad diet for domestic animals does hurt their chances of longevity. Deer, for example, eat a lot of food that's hard, and their teeth wear down and they die a lot of the time because they can no longer eat. On sharing sticky rice, think about it. You put your hands in that rice, then into your mouth, then repeat, as well as all others sharing it with you. You are eating saliva from them,and I'm sure Covid has taken quite a few because of this, along with getting sick from any and all other transferable diseases.

Covid: theoretical yes. But when they sit together and talk close to each other, they anyway either get it or don't get it, no matter the food. As mostly it comes from particle in the air.....And they talk while eating with not only microscopic particle flying thru the air.

Here in the company staff was distancing themself from each other and wearing masks. At lunch, at the way too small table they sit together with shoulder contact, no mask talking, laughing etc.....than afterwards put on the mask again and distance.
That makes like zero sense to me.

But the Covid scare in the company ended long ago....they only wear the mask on the motorbike or when they clean something alone outside in the sun, but not in the closed aircon rooms when they are together
(I am not exaggerating.....) I don't care....
 

[h90]

3 minutes ago, fredwiggy said:

It IS because of the western food that's been introduced here over the years. You can eat white rice, chicken, fish, pork, buffalo and bugs all day and not get fat. But diabetes, if it's in your genetic history, comes out a lot because of eating too much white rice. You can be small, like my ex's mom, who doesn't weigh 45 kilos, and has been taking insulin for as long as I've known her, over 6 years. There are thousands like her here, small, light and diabetic, because of it. Eating more western junk makes Thais fatter every year.

But why was that not a problem 20 years ago....or was it a problem than and I just didn't know it?

yes had 2 in the office below 30 I guess more like 25....needed insulin, Type 2....but fat and eat junk all day. Changing their food didn't come into their mind.

Another fat staff which is not working with us anymore, but still a friend...diabetics type 2.

Not my business but I wonder why they don't do something?? No knowledge? Don't care? In that young age with type 2 there are many ways...some more moderate some more extreme but you can get rid of it or massive reduce the problem.

[watchcat]

4 hours ago, TheFishman1 said:

Milk id very expensive here

Yes but it's free in the non private schools, but many of the students don't drink 'plain' milk.

Edited June 19, 2023 by watchcat

[Lacessit]

4 hours ago, HappyExpat57 said:

Rubbish. Humans are NOT meant to drink cow's milk. This was a bullsh!t campaign from the dairy conglomerates decades ago, same as the C&H pure cane sugar monsters.

Milk contains protein, fat and sugar ( lactose ). All of which are essential for any mammalian species in the early stages of life to grow fast, because when humans are born, they are helpless.

True, human milk is better due to specific antibodies. However, cow's milk is an adequate substitute.

Putting it bluntly, you don't know what you are talking about.

[MrJ2U]

Milk is expensive in Thailand despite being the largest producer in Southeast Asia.

 

Lower the price and people will buy it. 

[Guderian]

They may not be growing tall, but some of them are expanding in other ways, and it's probably not due to excessive milk drinking, lol.

 

Edited June 19, 2023 by Guderian