Self Defense

[meom]

I've just spent the last week on a personal safety course in preparation for my next assignment to Saudi Arabia.

Slightly off topic but I hope for you that it included a course in defensive driving which will do you more good than anything else the SAS teach you.

[edd]

I have taught Martial Arts for over 30 years and I agree most of the Arts are more of a sport than a really destructive defense.

I have had the honor of being taught by some of the best Japanese masters as well as Europeans.

I have taught both the British Police and the American Armey and can tell you that the last thing you want to do is go hand to hand with an assailant.

If you can RUN AWAY, there I no disgrace in running, only wisdom.

If you carry an offensive weapon YOU are at risk of being picked up by the police, unless you can give a good reason to have the weapon on your person.

If you are Female and carry a hand bag then a small bottle of spray ammonia cleaner, these can usually be adjusted to spray 6 to 8 ft, aimed at the eyes It is a very effective weapon.

Also carry a small cloth that has been used to clean something, shoes, car windscreen etc.

This is your excuse for carrying the spray.

For a man, as previously stated, a thick belt with a big buckle is quite good to keep someone at a distance also shout at them that you have aids and start spitting at them, it would make any sane person think twice.

In your home as stated before a big club of some sorts is quite good but I prefer a samurai sword but if you want to go for the sward then you MUST get trained to prevent you from cutting your own leg off.

If it comes to Hand To Hand fighting you are literally fighting for your life, you need to be trained well with a good system, the best I have ever taught is called Chin-cok very tough, very nasty, very destructive Not a sport

Best of all DON’T PUT YOUR SELF AN A BAD SITUATION. It’s not TV.

I hope this helps you.

Edited July 16, 2007 by edd

[girlx]

to those who keep parroting "move!", very helpful thank you, but i don't think anywhere else i would go is necessarily safer than where i live (i come from NYC for chrissakes), so the topic is how to protect myself should something happen while i am living alone. most likely it won't happen. does anyone think i could get a good baseball bat in koh samui somewhere? oh lordy, i swoon just trying to imagine myself using it on someone, but i am one of those people who can be very calm in the face of emergencies and if i practice enough that might just work. same as buying a smoke detector.

p.s. really good advice edd

Edited July 16, 2007 by girlx

[Fred Sanford]

I've just spent the last week on a personal safety course in preparation for my next assignment to Saudi Arabia.

The advice I was given is consistent with the advice I was given on the last two such courses I attended.

The best defence you have is to trust your instincts – If your instincts are telling you a place or situation is not safe, then it almost certainly is not – Listen to your instincts and trust what they are telling you.

If you once escape a dangerous situation never go back, not to collect anything/anyone, not with the police or anyone else that you would normally trust – You have been lucky once, do not push your luck.

Do not carry a weapon - you probably do not know how to use it – you are probably not psychologically capable of using it – Attacks happen so qucikly that you probably would not ahve time to use it - You may very well be brining the only weapon to a danagerous situation and it may be taken off you and used on you. A weapon immediately raises the stakes and the tensions. For all the reasons above a weapon may create a false sense of security leading you to go into places/situations you ought to avoid – Again back to trusting your instincts.

The single most common factor in dangerous situations is alcohol - Moderate your drinking in new situations/company and be very observant of the drinking/behaviour of others around you.

Now for all those gun toting rednecks who believe they are man enough to carry and use a weapon, the course I have just been on is run by the UK government and staffed by ex special forces (The real ones, not those dreamers sitting on bar stools down Soi No Hope).

Girlx, if you don’t feel safe, move to where you do.

This is the most useful response to the OP that I can imagine. Take heed of all of this advise and insight. Immaculate post on the subject. I say pin it

[Vampyros Lesbos]

Stunn gun buy one in Patpong Silom they sell them from 1500 THB.

Batong the same special Police use (not the thai police) can crush skulls

Peppar spray sure

Train the dogs to bite if they not older then 3 years old they can still learn.

You do not know if they bite you need to test.

Hire some Thai guy to jump into the house and attack you only then will you really see if the dogs bite.

You never know dogs can bite when they want to.

If your dogs die one by one then i suggest you move or get police protection that means they posion them and planning to break into your house. Very common in Thailand outside Bangkok.

Most people are scare for dogs in Thailand and will breake into your house last if you have dogs and the others not have.

Hire some ex military Thai dog trainer there is plenty around, or invite me i come down and train them

Any questions let me know

[bruceboy]

Pepperspray is the only legal option, but of course you'll need some lead-time to get it out to use.

[lazeeboy]

Pepperspray is the only legal option, but of course you'll need some lead-time to get it out to use.

dont dress too pravocative ,dont look strangers in the eye while walking ,scream if you have to ,carry a small stanley knife,if stop say its for sharpening your eye line ,you can also buy a siren 110 or so decibels the sizeof a box of matches ,failing that fall in love with a big guy........

[Misplaced]

While in calm stage, thrust your right or left leg forward to the assailant's groin, scream and run like hel_l. This is the instructions I gave my wife.

Kids, please don't practice this at home.

[Boo]

when out & walking alone always carry keys with the prongs between your fingers. anyone tries to grab you just stab them in the face area & then drag what ever part you have caught, it will hurt them like hel_l & they will looseen their grip enough fo ryou to run. In doors keep a bat or big bit of wood close to your night stand. lie in bed & see how easy it is to reach from a lying down position at different ponts of the ned or else keep a small knife under your pillow. If someone gets in to sexually assult you you can easily grab it & again just stab near the face, anywhere else may not hurt them enough for them to let you loose.

[jetjock]

Anyone that doubts the effectiveness of capsicm pepper spray is either non experienced in its use and has either not used it or been hit with it. If you doubt its effectiveness in deterring an attack suggest you buy a cannister and have someone spray you and see how well you do ! I have done both and assure you it is tremendously effective under most conditions. Some of the big advantages are that it is concealable in the palm of your hand and can have an effective range up over 3 meters depending on the type you buy. It is quicker acting than mace and can be used against animals (mace is ineffective against animals like dogs). Pepper spray is so effective it is carried as protection against bear attacks. Most all methods of self protection have limitations against some drug crazed attackers including pepper spray, tazer (I have seen druggies pull out the tazer dart and keep on coming) and even a .45 not in a lethal place sometimes does not immediately stop them.

As a way of defending yourself I think pepper spray is near the top of practical easily concealable non lethal alternatives. It is also available as a combination pepper/mace formula but have not seen it in Thailand. There is a good reason that almost all police carry it here in the US.

Edited July 16, 2007 by jetjock

[Mai Krap]

inspired by the firearms thread... i live alone (solo female) on an island in the south, and lately there have been many incidents which have shown me that i need some sort of protection for myself nowadays. i have 3 big dogs, but their bark is worse than their bite, and some of the people who might be a threat would know the dogs already. i don't want a gun- i would probably shoot myself in an episode of PMS or something. pepper spray? that's not really that effective is it? there is one mental patient in my village who was oblivious to the blows by 4 large men when he recently went through town waving a knife at people. i doubt pepper spray would deter him if i had a problem with him. does anyone have any good suggestions?

Get yourself a good American made machete like an Ontario which in Thailand will run from 2 to 4 thousand baht. The problem with all Thai knives is the heat treatment which makes them brittle, when they contact steel they often shatter. Most cases of farangs being attacked in their homes at night is at the hands of unskilled but violant criminals who carry cheep Thai swords bought at any night market throughout Thailand. Once this is realized one can prepare a defense that becomes an offense.

The best way to get skills with machetes is by chopping up shrubbery and bamboo and such. After that just remember to attack the hands of an attacker, how far you take it from there is up to you. While smaller knives can give women an extreme advantage over larger men it is more of a challange than long blades of which the machete is the easiest and cheepest available qaulity weapon in Thailand. It is also simple to understand and use and much less likely to be taken away from you than a basesball bat which is a weapon for larger stronger types. Blunt weapons are power weapons and the oppisite of edged weapons which are speed and deception weapons which are more suitable for smaller size and weeker defenders.

Im not at all a fan of Krav Maga as some have suggested here, the facts are a 140 pound women is no match in any unarmed fight with even a 160 pound men without weapons as womens strength is in the hips and mens strength is upper body. Dont believe the infomercials on such things, a 200 pound man with no training is however weeker than a hundred pound woman with a kitchen knife and a basic stratagy of offense and defense edged weapons. As far as the nutjob who fought four men, In the history of the world Im not aware of one case where a man commited rape after he had both hands chopped off.

Dogs are more of a alarm system unless you have them trained which is both time consuming and very expensive no matter how you look at it. Numbers of dogs will make more noise, and have more ears effectivly making them a better alarm and less prone to poisen. In many cases having dogs will send attackers to an easier target. So dogs, they are a good thing but beware of inbred rotweilers and shepards in Thailand, many children have been savaged in the last few years because of ignorant dog ownership and bad breeding.

There are many videos and other training movies available over the internet, about the only one I would reccomend for machete is done by Datu Kelly Worden which you can do a search for on google. Any specific questions about further training here in Thailand can be sent in PM. Usually one or two groups have some kind of training here every year, one was in Phuket last year.

I hope you find this helpful, you asked for a defense so what I offered is one of the most effective, primitive, and brutal defenses available not based on strength, it is however quite messy

[BambinA]

Self Defense, what should i use?

My dad bought me a baseball bat.

My mom told me to stay away from the risky area.

I,myself have a needle and syringe as a weapon..Amazingly,It works well lol .

[JetsetBkk]

just stab near the face, anywhere else may not hurt them enough for them to let you loose.

Unless they take it away from you and kill you with it. Would you rather be raped or dead?

[canadiangirl]

Hi girlx,

I found a book called "the gift of fear" to be really useful in anticipating/dealing with potentially violent situations. It's not a book on specific techniques, but more a book on how to hone your instincts, get a feel for situations, and become as good as possible at recognizing potentially violent situations before they turn bad, so that you can avoid them. The gist of is that humans are animals like any other, and like other animals, we can pick up on subtle cues and signs of imminent violence, something not quite right, etc.

To me getting a big scary looking dog, one whose bite is worse than it's bark, sounds like a really good idea, especially if being attacked at home is a concern. Maybe keep it from becoming too friendly with other people, if that's possible, so it stays ready to defend you without being a sucker for people you know already.

I've thought about the weapon question myself. A lot of people feel safer having a weapon with them, but I've also read somewhere that soldiers will practice a killing move 1000 times or more before the army will consider it mastered -- what are the chances that I, winging it under pressure, will be successful? Of course, in the situation, one should try anything to survive (I read a story about a woman who managed to kill a cougar with a camping knife, once), but I'm not sure I'd count on a weapon as my self-defense strategy.

In Thailand, and in a close-knit place like KPG that is a bit dodgy, I wonder if a more useful deterrent wouldn't be trying to cultivate relationships with a few influential locals, so if anyone thought of doing anything to harm you, they would get the vibe that something really bad would happen to them?

My friends used to work as self-defense instructors, and they said if someone is on drugs or mentally ill, the only way to stop them is to basically cause permanent damage: it does nothing to hurt them as they won't feel it, you have to kick in their knee so they can't walk, poke out their eyes, cause some serious permanent damage.

[Boo]

Unless they take it away from you and kill you with it. Would you rather be raped or dead?

dead with a damaged & in pain attacker.

[Macx]

A neighbor of mine in the states had an alarm unit that was basically a motion sensor (like those that turn on patio lights) linked to a speaker that produced loud and realistic dog barks. Pretty niffty. I don't know if you can get it in LOS. It would be extra useful/believable if you actually also had real dogs around--it's the one "dog" poison can't kill.

[canadiangirl]

One thing that I don't think any of us have been considering in our advice is the likelihood of multiple attackers. Reading the various threads about thai-on-farang revenge fights, a lot of people mention that if you get into a fight with a Thai, all of his mates will most likely join in as well, ending up with some kind of 10-against-1 situation. Reading what news there is about sexual assaults in Thailand (from the ever-entertaining Pattaya news, for example, or threads on TV) -- it seems like a lot of situations involve multiple attackers.

That's such a tricky situation to defend against, I really don't know what to say. A few big, mean dogs who don't like anyone but you seems to be the best option. Is it an option for you to have any live-in staff? Or maybe tell everyone in your village a ghost visits your house at night?

[Jet Gorgon]

Hi, Girlx. Based on your info, you live out in a small beach village. I take it the "deranged" man is part of a local family who likely think he's harmless. You and your dogs are known in the village. You must have friends there, no?

I would not get a weapon. If you don't know how to use it, attackers will grab it and use it on you.

I lived in small villages, semi-secluded jungles and remote locations in Thailand. I never locked my door unless I was out for a few hours with my dogs. A few men tried to get near my house or accost me. I don't get scared, I get angry. My neighbours played security watch because I was part of the community, my dogs barked and kept people away from my house and if someone tried to grab me, I slapped off their hold and shouted "Arai na?" and then "Bai". Thai men usually hate direct confrontations.

I've never faced a group of attackers, but I always tried to be pleasant if I met someone on my jungle path to the village. Sawasdee ka is enough.

I think explaining the situation to someone you respect in the village will get some airtime -- you know the info network by now. Hopefully you made friends or command respect from the villagers; that counts for alot. I never felt scared in Thailand; sorry that you do.

[justagirl]

Girlx, have you considered having surgery done to your dogs so they can no longer bark, but only bite? Loads of my dad's friends had surgery done like this to their dogs.........

How about a baseball bat?

[November Rain]

Girlx, have you considered having surgery done to your dogs so they can no longer bark, but only bite? Loads of my dad's friends had surgery done like this to their dogs.........

<deleted>? Are you serious?

Words fail me. I can't even think of what to say to a suggestion like that...

[Jet Gorgon]

Seconded, NR. Hate to see you with vocal chords removed and drowning in deep waters, Justagirl.

[Dustoff]

Girlx, have you considered having surgery done to your dogs so they can no longer bark, but only bite? Loads of my dad's friends had surgery done like this to their dogs.........

How about a baseball bat?

Hoo boy, this one is going to draw some off-topic comments!

There are many people, myself included as a dog trainer/lover, who would be tempted to use that baseball bat on people who would surgically alter an animal to compensate for their lack of training or compassion for their family pet.

Dogs have emotions and, if loved and cared for, they do not have to be trained to protect their owners any more than I would have to be trained to be willing to protect my wife and family. They also are very sensitive to situations that just do not feel right and I have seen this happen likely a thousand times even in small or very mild-mannered dogs that you would not otherwise consider a serious defender.

We have a little 20kg Thai Ridgeback whom my wife loves and hugs on a regular basis and I have no doubt that this dog would give his life in her defense even though he is incredibly sweet and gentle. I have trained him not to bark unless someone is actually at our gate or may possibly enter our yard which is one of the easiest things to teach a dog.

Somehow I cannot imagine that cutting my dog's throat and teaching him to bite is going to work out in the best interests of me, my wife, or anyone else in our neighborhood. Our beloved dog however is considered a friend by everyone in our neighborhood but would pose a very serious challenge to any would-be attacker/burglar.

When it comes to dogs, you get back at least as much as you give...

[Who, me ?]

can we consider brain removal on human when they write real stupid posts ?

[mrtoad]

There are many frms of self defence, but I think that what GuestHouse has mentioned in his thread pretty much sums it.

Dealing with a Mentally Ill Patient:

Having worked in HMP's and Secure hospitals in the UK, much of the training is based on using de-escalation techniques and awarenees. These are seriously the first and most important tools in staying safe.

However, the courses are nrmally then broken into further segmments - Breakaway, which is a series of techniques designed to avoid physical attack and escape from the agressor. This course designed by trainers , is perfect for individuals, loneworkers etc. Please don't listen to Boo's ridicolous advice about causing permanent damage to restarin a mentally Ill patient.

The further bolt on is the C & R (Control& Restratint) - these techniques are based primarily on Akido and have evolved within the NHS, Police and Prison services. They are only to be used in groups of three. Although, in the PS the control is based more on pain as a control, whereas the NHS version now tends to work on limiting movement in a safe and secure hold.

What I will also point out, an acutely ill metal patient are quite often oblivious to pain and are unaware of there actions. If you get in a situation with someone like this just leave the area as quickly as possible!!! Do not confront someone like this, it should be left to professionals who should medicate them properly.

One thing that I can remeber from my training in the prison service, was if the guy is carring a gun you let him have what he wants. You don not confrnt him or try to be a hero- the same goes for someone carrying a knife. Yes. we did get taught how to disarm the person, but the reality is very different from a simulated trainig environment.

If you must carry a werapon, then you have tO be prepared to use, because if you don't I really beleive that instead of making the situation safer you could well increase the danger. If you musy use something, a pepper spray/ mace can be very effective.

All in all, if you are living somewhere and dn't feel safe then you should re-evaluate your place of residence and maybe move.

Just a quick question to canadian girl, do you seriously believe the nonsense that your so called self defence instructors told you? Cause permanent damage. What total and utter BS.

Okay, apologise for the long post, but I just sometimes wish that people had a little more understanding and empathy about people with a Mental Illness, rather than just basing it on ignorance and fear.

[sbk]

Hi, Girlx. Based on your info, you live out in a small beach village. I take it the "deranged" man is part of a local family who likely think he's harmless. You and your dogs are known in the village. You must have friends there, no?

I would not get a weapon. If you don't know how to use it, attackers will grab it and use it on you.

I lived in small villages, semi-secluded jungles and remote locations in Thailand. I never locked my door unless I was out for a few hours with my dogs. A few men tried to get near my house or accost me. I don't get scared, I get angry. My neighbours played security watch because I was part of the community, my dogs barked and kept people away from my house and if someone tried to grab me, I slapped off their hold and shouted "Arai na?" and then "Bai". Thai men usually hate direct confrontations.

I've never faced a group of attackers, but I always tried to be pleasant if I met someone on my jungle path to the village. Sawasdee ka is enough.

I think explaining the situation to someone you respect in the village will get some airtime -- you know the info network by now. Hopefully you made friends or command respect from the villagers; that counts for alot. I never felt scared in Thailand; sorry that you do.

Best advice here IMO.

[sbk]

Posts of extreme negativity towards Thais have been removed. Please read the forum rules before posting

3) Religious or racial slurs, rude and degrading comments towards women, or extremely negative views of Thailand will not be tolerated.

Further such posts will be deleted and the poster warned.

[justagirl]

Seconded, NR. Hate to see you with vocal chords removed and drowning in deep waters, Justagirl.

Have you ever owned Acres of land? Maybe, some landowners will understand this practice. I know what you mean about the "dog's rights" and all those animal affection, but I'm not talking about butchering the dog for Christ's sake.

[justagirl]

can we consider brain removal on human when they write real stupid posts ?

Don't call my post "stupid posts" just because you don't agree with what I write. There's a big world out there...................

[GracelessFawn]

Girlx, have you considered having surgery done to your dogs so they can no longer bark, but only bite? Loads of my dad's friends had surgery done like this to their dogs.........

How about a baseball bat?

You gotta be kidding me.

Justagirl, you're my mate in real life, but can't really agree to this post.

[sbk]

Yes, well, the local vet wouldn't even consider doing such a surgery and I sincerely doubt girlx would go to all the trouble to do something like this to her 3 dogs when she lives over the mountain on the other side of the island in a small village, not acreage.

So, since none of it has anything even remotely to do with helping girlx out, lets drop it, shall we?