gearbox Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 My gf ordered 4 cubic metres concrete mix, but by my estimates the truck delivered no more than 2.5 cubic metres. Is there anything she can do about this? How widespread is this practice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KannikaP Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 7 minutes ago, gearbox said: My gf ordered 4 cubic metres concrete mix, but by my estimates the truck delivered no more than 2.5 cubic metres. Is there anything she can do about this? How widespread is this practice? How did you estimate the volume of concrete delivered? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirineou Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 23 minutes ago, KannikaP said: How did you estimate the volume of concrete delivered? Using a concrete calculator it is easy to determine the amount of concrete used. Plenty of free ones online 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will B Good Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 (edited) Wouldn't surprise me if you are correct....Land Of Scams. I see there is a big fuss about fuel pumps at the moment......some guy checked to find he'd been short changed by 5 litres. Edited January 21 by Will B Good 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossy Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 I don't know if it's a standard, but when we built our place, the contractor was rigorous about checking the delivery paperwork for each truck. Of course, without a weighbridge one would have to trust the paperwork! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralf001 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 3 minutes ago, Will B Good said: Wouldn't surprise me if you are correct....Land Of Scams. I see there is a big fuss about fuel pumps at the moment......some guy checked to find he'd been short changed by 5 litres. How did he check ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will B Good Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 2 minutes ago, Ralf001 said: How did he check ? I think he had suspicions they were cheating him.......but not sure of the details.....think it was Chaiyaphum??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will B Good Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 14 minutes ago, Ralf001 said: How did he check ? <link to Bangkok Post removed per forum rules - sorry> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jvs Posted January 21 Popular Post Share Posted January 21 We have always had extra concrete delivered so i always have a patch ready for the excess. 1.5 cubic meters short is a lot! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvs Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 minute ago, Will B Good said: I think he had suspicions they were cheating him.......but not sure of the details.....think it was Chaiyaphum??? He bought 5 liters and checked it later at home i think. This has cost PTT a lot of customers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ralf001 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 10 hours ago, Will B Good said: Was his meter calibrated ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tropicalevo Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 Not much help to you but water trucks short deliver as well. Common scam here on Samui. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenStark Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 I remember when I still cut the lawn by myself, and I had a 3.5 liter jerry can, that they were always able to fill it with almost 4 liter. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeworld Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 (edited) 1 hour ago, gearbox said: My gf ordered 4 cubic metres concrete mix, but by my estimates the truck delivered no more than 2.5 cubic metres. Is there anything she can do about this? How widespread is this practice? Depends on in what you placed the concrete mix (inside a formwork, on the ground etc...) Concrete placed in a formwork would be the most accurate. Concrete placed on/in ground excavations have wide margins for consuming excess concrete and wastage. How was the order volume estimated and were allowances made for wastage? Concrete has an estimated wet mass of about 2600 kg/m³ and generally for concrete placed in forms a waste factor is about 1% extra but if placed on/in ground the wastage could go upto 5% For eg Apparent concrete shortages are sometimes caused for the following reasons: Miscalculations of form volume or slab thickness when actual dimensions exceed the assumed dimensions by a fraction of an inch. For example, a 1/8 inch (3-mm) error in a 4 inch (100-mm) slab would mean a shortage of 3 percent or 1 yd3 in a 32-yd3 (1-m3 in a 32-m3) order. Deflection or distortion of the forms resulting from pressure exerted by the concrete. Irregular subgrade, placement over granular fill, and settlement of subgrade prior to placement. Over the course of a large job, the small amounts of concrete returned each day or used in mud sills or incidental footings. Follow These Rules to Avoid Under-Yield Measure volume needed accurately. Reevaluate required volume towards the end of the pour and inform the concrete producer. Estimate waste and potential increased thickness – order more than required by at least 4 to 10 percent. To check yield use the ASTM C 138 unit weight test method on three samples from three different loads – yield is the total batch weight divided by the average unit weight or density Edited January 21 by freeworld Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
retarius Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 I suspected this. Whenever we have have building work done, it always seems the loads, for sand, cement, soil or concrete are always short. I always assumed that if you complained you got a punch on the nose or your house burned down. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brianthainess Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 15 minutes ago, retarius said: I always assumed that if you complained you got a punch on the nose or your house burned down. Or both. 😱 👊🏻 🧨 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bday Prang Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 And when you have all stopped worrying about how much concrete has been delivered, which can after all be rectified quite easily by simply ordering some more, you can begin worrying about how much cement was put into the mix in the first place, that is a lot more difficult to correct ( its actually impossible) and can result in structural failure, Not really an issue if only constructing a slab to park a car on, but real cause for concern if building a two or three storey house. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olmate Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 5 minutes ago, brianthainess said: Or both. 😱 👊🏻 🧨 Or your car filled with cement later that night! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyAndyAndy Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 I don't understand how would that scam work? Let's say I'm making concrete patio I and calculate that I need 4 cubic meters. I order 4. But they deliver 2. Half of my pour is empty and I instantly know that I was not given enough? With price 1800 Baht / 1 cubic meter everybody is ordering exactly how much they need. I don't see how could they get away with giving customers just half? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearbox Posted January 21 Author Share Posted January 21 (edited) 1 hour ago, jvs said: We have always had extra concrete delivered so i always have a patch ready for the excess. 1.5 cubic meters short is a lot! I had visitors at that time who happened to know quite a bit about concrete calculations, but even for my not trained eye the concrete was way less. Another truck is on its way with 1 cubic metre, it would be harder to scam with this one. Edited January 21 by gearbox Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearbox Posted January 21 Author Share Posted January 21 16 minutes ago, AndyAndyAndy said: I don't understand how would that scam work? Let's say I'm making concrete patio I and calculate that I need 4 cubic meters. I order 4. But they deliver 2. Half of my pour is empty and I instantly know that I was not given enough? With price 1800 Baht / 1 cubic meter everybody is ordering exactly how much they need. I don't see how could they get away with giving customers just half? Easy...they just pour the concrete and give you official invoice for 4 cubic metres. BTW concrete mix in Samui is 2600 baht per cubic metre, but apparently there are different types of mixes, this one had a lot of small stones inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KannikaP Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 hour ago, Ralf001 said: How did he check ? Can a lot of modern cars with electronic dashboards tell how many litres of fuel are in the tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bday Prang Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 minute ago, gearbox said: Another truck is on its way with 1 cubic metre, it would be harder to scam with this one It won't be any harder for them to scam , it will be exactly the same, they simply put less in , It will just be easier for you to notice, If you were 1.5 cubic meters short, why did you only order 1 additional cubic meter. ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steven100 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 (edited) disregard my question OP .... doesn't matter if you've already ordered more. OP .... was it a concrete slab or foundation ? are you saying you measured what was needed was 4.0m3 was it a mini truck that delivered or a larger normal concrete truck ? I just seen your comment that you ordered more .... that's ok .... Edited January 21 by steven100 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearbox Posted January 21 Author Share Posted January 21 Just now, Bday Prang said: It won't be any harder for them to scam , it will be exactly the same, they simply put less in , It will just be easier for you to notice, If you were 1.5 cubic meters short, why did you only order 1 additional cubic meter. ? Because 4 cubic metres was more than required as per calculations The tradie was calculating 2 cubic metres with his height, it looked thinner to me and said to my gf to order double. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bday Prang Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 22 minutes ago, AndyAndyAndy said: With price 1800 Baht / 1 cubic meter Where i live 1800 / cube is really the cheapest / weakest concrete available, hope you are not building anything were strength is an issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gearbox Posted January 21 Author Share Posted January 21 3 minutes ago, steven100 said: OP .... was it a concrete slab or foundation ? are you saying you measured what was needed was 4.0m3 was it a mini truck that delivered or a larger normal concrete truck ? You are testing my extra thin builder knowledge....it was just extra concrete on top of existing concrete driveway. The truck was normal concrete mixer, I was told they fit in 5 cubic metres. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bday Prang Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 minute ago, gearbox said: Because 4 cubic metres was more than required as per calculations The tradie was calculating 2 cubic metres with his height, it looked thinner to me and said to my gf to order double. Not a bad Idea as long as you have a place available to get rid of any excess Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 minute ago, gearbox said: Because 4 cubic metres was more than required as per calculations The tradie was calculating 2 cubic metres with his height, it looked thinner to me and said to my gf to order double. It wouldn't surprise me at all that a 'fast one' is being pulled in such circumstances... Most people wouldn't check. Its not a hard volume to calculate if the 'shape' is relatively even and depth is consistent. The issue of course, is how to prove it... And, even if it could be proven the response would be 'oops sorry, mistake'... There's simply no incentive for honesty here with things like this (perhaps anywhere). Perhaps its an issue of 'competition' with providers undercutting each other to such a degree that the only way to remain profitable is to 'pull a fast one'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jvs Posted January 21 Share Posted January 21 1 minute ago, gearbox said: You are testing my extra thin builder knowledge....it was just extra concrete on top of existing concrete driveway. The truck was normal concrete mixer, I was told they fit in 5 cubic metres. Very easy to calculate how much you need,lenght x wide x height. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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