1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Perhaps thats a lesson to carry forwards.

 

Cleaning fee charged if place is left unreasonably dirty.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yes we do charge if excessively dirty but in this case we didn't

7 minutes ago, mr_lob said:

Yes we do charge if excessively dirty but in this case we didn't

 

Don't want to disagree with you and get into an argument... because I completely disagree with the guest instigating law suit based on a review comment...   But... 

 

You didn't consider the place was dirty enough to warrant and additional cleaning charge, but did consider it dirty enough leave a bad review of the guest ??...

 

Genuine questions:

Did you see the place at all ???.... in person or photo's, or were you going by what your cleaner mentioned ?

 

i.e. could your comment have been an over-reaction, or was it really a jeffin mess and they guests really did deserve a negative comment ?

 

 

Personally I think the Op is on a sticky wicket here it would appear he left his review based on a throwaway comment left by his cleaning staff that this villa was more dirty than another villa

no photographic evidence can't even claim to have seen the dirt with his own eyes

How dirty is dirty is impossible to define we know that Howard Hughes definition of dirty was very high

2 families walk into a fast food restaurant at the end of their meals one family took their rubbish and put it in the bins provided the other family just left everything on the table so you could argue one family is more dirtier than the other

for years now large companies in USA and Europe only provide start and end dates of employment for fear of being sued

i know of one manager  that wanted to write war and peace  as a reference  for an employee he sacked for poor performance ( the employee was also porking the manager wife )  Manager reference request was declined by HR and Legal on the grounds that it would leave the company wide open from a legal point of view

Edited February 4, 20242 yr by vinny41
add

24 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

Don't want to disagree with you and get into an argument... because I completely disagree with the guest instigating law suit based on a review comment...   But... 

 

You didn't consider the place was dirty enough to warrant and additional cleaning charge, but did consider it dirty enough leave a bad review of the guest ??...

 

Genuine questions:

Did you see the place at all ???.... in person or photo's, or were you going by what your cleaner mentioned ?

 

i.e. could your comment have been an over-reaction, or was it really a jeffin mess and they guests really did deserve a negative comment ?

 

 

He couldn't make a claim because he didn't have photo evidence which is required.

Never take the word of a cleaner they expect to walk into a villa and the guest has left it spotlessly clean, if they did we wouldn't need the cleaners, 

40 minutes ago, mr_lob said:

Yes we do charge if excessively dirty but in this case we didn't

Maybe you should start adding a cleaning fee, many people do, if not a cleaning fee add it under a management fee, 

43 minutes ago, mr_lob said:

Yes we do charge if excessively dirty but in this case we didn't

How do you charge? direct off the guest or through the resolution center? who decides how dirty it is? 

On 2/2/2024 at 5:16 PM, nikmar said:

im not a solicitor and Ive never been in a similar position - but did you take photos of the villa afer he left?

Under the defamation laws It doesn't matter if what he wrote is true.

Write back to him yourself and tell him that you contacted Airbnb who have removed it. Show a screenshot. 

 

Tell him you are willing to settle outside of court for 50k. But he has to sign an agreement at your attorneys office with a witness there. He must bring his id card and sign a copy of that as you will as well. 

 

In the agreement it must say something along the lines that you didn't do anything wrong or negligent. 

 

Then say he is accepting this 50k to withdraw the case on priviso that the court issue is dropped. 

 

Also must state in the letter that if he or any of the guests in that group persues this further (in the future) they have to pay you back 50% penalty accumulating every year. Hes not allowed to write about this on social media or any internet website. 

 

Tell him if he doesnt accept this deal then you see him in court and look forward to it. 

I have stopped making any review for any goods or services in Thailand since the Koh Chang Seaview case 4 years ago. 

 

But the next level in Thai idiocy will be to sue for not writing a review.

Edited February 4, 20242 yr by Ben Zioner

On 2/2/2024 at 5:24 PM, Kinnock said:

You can't be critical of the guests, or you'll have another defamation case, but you can get factual reports about the case into the media.  Airbnb may be able help with this?

I can remember the Koh Chang Seaview case when Tripadvisor (or Booking), put up a banner on the Property's page warning patrons that the hotel sued for a negative report. Interestingly the hotel has a different name now.

25 minutes ago, Ben Zioner said:

I can remember the Koh Chang Seaview case when Tripadvisor (or Booking), put up a banner on the Property's page warning patrons that the hotel sued for a negative report. Interestingly the hotel has a different name now.

It was Trip Advisor. it kind of back fired on that hotel they did have a few negative reviews also on other sites, 

That warning is still there on TA but on booking.com they have changed their name, 

Edited February 4, 20242 yr by ChipButty

3 hours ago, Ben Zioner said:

I have stopped making any review for any goods or services in Thailand since the Koh Chang Seaview case 4 years ago. 

 

But the next level in Thai idiocy will be to sue for not writing a review.

Here is a case in Australia where the host contacted a guest because she left a review of ok

https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/rot-in-hell-airbnb-owner-fined-2500-for-harassing-guest-over-review-20220527-p5aozk.html

 

and another one in Canada

https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/roadwarriorvoices/2015/09/01/airbnb-hosts-threatened-to-sue-guests-over-negative-reviews/83071380/

isn't airbnb for short stays ILLEGAL ?

 

several VILLA's ...

 

maybe get a lawyer instead TV advise ?

On 2/3/2024 at 5:46 PM, tgw said:

If proven true, a defamation is not defamation anymore 

 .......

I'm not knowledgable enough of Thai law to give relevant details, 

"If proven true, a defamation is not defamation anymore"

Not according to Thai law. 

On 2/4/2024 at 12:01 PM, FruitPudding said:

 

Thanks for finding the link to prove what I said

 

"Whoever, imputes anything to the other person before a third person in a manner likely to impair the reputation of such other person or to expose such other person to be hated or scorned, is said to commit defamation, and shall be punished with imprisonment not exceeding one year or fined not exceeding twenty thousand Baht, or both."

 

Even if what he said is true, it's still defamation. 

 

20 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

"If proven true, a defamation is not defamation anymore"

Not according to Thai law. 

 

you two, please read the articles of Thai Law :

https://library.siam-legal.com/thai-law/criminal-code-defamation-sections-326-333/

 

Quote

Section 329. Good Faith Statement

A person, in good faith, expresses any opinion or a statement:

1. By way of self-justification or defense, or for the protection of a legitimate interest;
2. In the status of being an official in the exercise of his functions;
3. By way of fair comment on any person or thing subjected to public criticism; or
4. By way of fair report of the open proceeding of any Court or meeting

shall not be guilty of defamation.

Section 330. Truth as a Defense

In case of defamation, if the person prosecuted for defamation can prove that the imputation made by him is true, he shall not be punished. But he shall not be allowed to prove if such imputation concerns personal matters, and such proof will not be benefit to the public.

 

6 hours ago, john donson said:

isn't airbnb for short stays ILLEGAL ?

 

several VILLA's ...

 

maybe get a lawyer instead TV advise ?

It depends as the OP says he has a small resort and has a hotel license so not illegal to do STR, 

56 minutes ago, tgw said:

 

 

you two, please read the articles of Thai Law :

https://library.siam-legal.com/thai-law/criminal-code-defamation-sections-326-333/

 

 

Section 329. Good Faith Statement

 

A person, in good faith, expresses any opinion or a statement:

1. By way of self-justification or defense, or for the protection of a legitimate interest;           Not the case
2. In the status of being an official in the exercise of his functions;                                            
3. By way of fair comment on any person or thing subjected to public criticism; or                  Not the case 
4. By way of fair report of the open proceeding of any Court or meeting

shall not be guilty of defamation.

Section 330. Truth as a Defense

 

In case of defamation, if the person prosecuted for defamation can prove that the imputation made by him is true, he shall not be punished. But he shall not be allowed to prove if such imputation concerns personal matters, and such proof will not be benefit to the public.

 

*UPDATE*

Staff attended court a few weeks ago. The lawyer was very ill prepared and fumbled his way through bits of paper. He seemed to think airbnb was like facebook or instagram...he had no idea that only airbnb hosts to whom he had made a booking request could see his review score.

Twice he took our staff out of the courtroom to try to get a large cash settlement, saying "i've asked for 300k so what will you pay me"?

Staff stuck to her guns and said "nothing, zero".

A week later we heard from the court that they rejected the case from him, so all ended well.