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Thailand’s cannabis sector faces threat from recreational use ban


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4 minutes ago, MangoKorat said:

When was it ever licensed for recreational use?

a license is clearly currently  not required for recreational use   what on earth are you talking about, 

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44 minutes ago, Dogmatix said:

 

I agree the smoking at that concert should not have happened but the move to ban recreational use was planned long before that.  It was just used as a justification.  Without that they would have found something else.

The ultra-conservatives aka military/elite and conservatives aka PT are in power, aka the dinasaurs. Mostly it's the same globally where the religious conservatives hold the power. Apart from this there is just too much money to be had by high level corruption and drug lords. They went about the whole thing the wrong way here which is typical. Put something in place and then work out how to do it rather than the other way around. I have used this term many times. Empty headed, thought bubble idiots.

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1 hour ago, Trippy said:

The 0.2% limit was for extracts. And the dispensaries in a good tourist location are making bank right now. 

 

2 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

All seems a little strange and contradictory to me - my understanding was that the so called 'Legalisation' only referred to 'Medicinal Use'. I don't ever remember anything stating that recreational use had been legalised.

 

Let's also not forget - the 0.2% THC limit in any case.  Even if recreational use was allowed - 0.2% wouldn't get a gnat high.

 

This cannabis 'decriminalisation' has been a load of tosh from Day 1 - constant flip flopping and contradictions.  Anybody who was stupid enough to invest in the business on the back of such an ambigous and unclear change in the law should have had their head's examined.

 

No sympathy for them really.

 

49 minutes ago, MangoKorat said:

When was it ever licensed for recreational use?

 

45 minutes ago, Bday Prang said:

Ah another of the "but but Anutin said brigade"     Your "understanding" is flawed you need to accept that,  If you require confirmation you only have to open your eyes, 1000's of shops selling and millions of people smoking cannabis all of which contains considerably more than 0.2% THC with no interference from the authorities whatsoever. It really isn't rocket science. But feel free to believe whatever you want no matter how ridiculous it make you look


Whatever you like to think, Anutin did say that recreational use was not permitted and the law had other ways to deal with that.

 

I am happy to provide the links if you think otherwise.

 

He said this before decriminalizing it, anybody who invested in a business for recreational use, was an idiot, and deserve whatever they get.

 

On another note, I am surprised people deal with the retail outlets, when you can go direct of the source and get a much better price. Personally, if it’s going to be sold, I would prefer to see it sold in 7-Elevens.

 

My friend has a large cannabis farm here in Chiangrai and he supplies most of the shops in the town center and another well-known supplier in this forum, so why pay stupid prices?

 

 

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38 minutes ago, Dogmatix said:

 

Weed didn't cause these epidemics but a small minority do progress from cannabis to harder drugs.  From my recollections of decades ago, quite a few went on to try LSD in the 70s which was considered on a par with cannabis but most only tried that a handful of times and gave it up.  Those with money went on to try cocaine and some may have continued with that for a few years just in the student days no one I knew could afford cocaine.  I knew a couple of people who went on to try heroin but they only snorted it and didn't dare shoot it up. It was just a novelty, dare thing for them and they didn't do it for long. But the vast majority of people I knew who used cannabis in my young days never went on to other drugs and most didn't continue much past university, as it was only a social drug amongst students. Nearly all of them became drinkers as they got older instead which led to alcohol problems in some cases but that probably would have happened without cannabis.  

 

I would say that the data about cannabis as a gateway drug is largely inapplicable to places where it is legal.  The main reason that young cannabis users get into drugs like cocaine and heroin is because cannabis is illegal and they have to buy from dealers who introduce them to harder drugs.  People are not going to be turned on to other drugs by legal weed dispensaries.  Without the illegal dealers the gateway doctrine cited by Cholnan is nonsense because there is no gateway. that is not say that no one moves on to harder drugs but there is no overlap of distribution and people are just as likely to go on to harder drugs from speed or alcohol as from weed.

I agree. Dope is not a gateway drug. Simple as that. It's not.

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1 minute ago, Seppius said:

“We can lie around on the beach and enjoy a joint,” says Thodsapol,

 

Isn't smoking on the beach illegal? it is in Pattaya

So is prostitution and standing on the back of a baht bus, yet that's everyday life in Pattaya.

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15 minutes ago, Seppius said:

“We can lie around on the beach and enjoy a joint,” says Thodsapol,

 

Isn't smoking on the beach illegal? it is in Pattaya

I've smoked many a joint on a beach. The trick is discression and or respect for others. Sadly individualism is the flavour of the day (has been for a long time) rather than consideration for others.

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9 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

 

 


Whatever you like to think, Anutin did say that recreational use was not permitted and the law had other ways to deal with that.

 

I am happy to provide the links if you think otherwise.

 

He said this before decriminalizing it, anybody who invested in a business for recreational use, was an idiot, and deserve whatever they get.

 

On another note, I am surprised people deal with the retail outlets, when you can go direct of the source and get a much better price. Personally, if it’s going to be sold, I would prefer to see it sold in 7-Elevens.

 

My friend has a large cannabis farm here in Chiangrai and he supplies most of the shops in the town center and another well-known supplier in this forum, so why pay stupid prices?

 

 

         I don't care what Anutin said or didn't say , and you can keep your links, they are as irrelevant as what ever Anutin allegedly said or didn't say.  The fact of the matter is that recreation cannabis is , for the moment at least , freely available for purchase and  consumption by anybody over the minimum age limit provided they are neither pregnant or lactating.  There have been absolutely no reports of people being prosecuted for indulging in recreational use whatsoever.  The proof of the pudding is in the eating ,as they say, and the views of two or three posters on AN are neither here nor there

        I also find it very surprising that anybody buys from the retail outlets, and pays obscene amounts of money, more than they would ever consider paying in their own countries where it is in many cases still illegal ,but then again I guess the bulk of those doing so are short term tourists who have neither the time , inclination or wherewithal to find the source or people connected to it    Those from japan and singapore where it is very frowned upon probably just don't know any better and are only too happy to have access to it at any price if they can consume it without any hassle

        I don't understand why it isn't sold in 7/11 or any other of the mainstream convenience stores either but to be honest I'm not really bothered where they sell it , Personally I have only once ventured into one of the retail places , a few weeks ago i was in Bangkok and curiosity got the better of me I was offered a single ready rolled joint for 600 baht ! by an annoying british guy (southerner )  who was working behind the counter, he also tried to sell me some for 900 baht per gram The second word of my reply to him was "off" 

           I can get 100g for between 400/500 baht locally , jesus I could get a kilo for less than 3000 baht , and even before the deregulation I could get 50 g for 500baht from several sources.  I can't understand why I should pay anymore than that.  

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Wouldn't surprise me if the police have applied some pressure to recriminalize it ,its not the rank and file cops who have issues with it, but some near the top of the table must be missing a bit of tea money.  And the growers who normally provided it must also be feeling the pinch what with the drop in prices, and a lower demand due to more  variety  now being available , brickweed must be almost a thing of the past now, as far as the Thai market is concerned, and they used to produce tonnes of it 20,000 a kilo not that long ago.  A lot of influential people  losing income won't be allowed to continue

 

The concerns of the the health minister are straight out of reefer madness, I doubt he even believes  that rubbish himself ,  They are not actually going to kill the goose that lays the golden egg, its just that there is going to be a change in ownership and a different but somewhat familiar  business model will return 

 

He could have introduced a few regulations limiting its usage in public and by kids (they already done that and it seems to be working) and tasked the police with enforcing them in order to "protect the youth"  you know just like they have traditionally and quite successfully with alcohol   and that would have solved the issue about misuse, but it wouldn't have put any money back into those empty pockets, nothing other than recriminalizing's it  would do that , so that is what will probably  be happening 

 

Just for good measure I predict a dramatic increase in cannabis related news stories around the time of any significant moves by the government on this issue,  non of them will be positive

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6 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

Ah another of the "but but Anutin said brigade"     Your "understanding" is flawed you need to accept that,  If you require confirmation you only have to open your eyes, 1000's of shops selling and millions of people smoking cannabis all of which contains considerably more than 0.2% THC with no interference from the authorities whatsoever. It really isn't rocket science. But feel free to believe whatever you want no matter how ridiculous it make you look

Another one who is unable to hold a discussion without throwing insults and attempting to belittle - and yet you claim its me that looks ridiculous? A man who can't argue without such behaviour is the ridiculous one in my opinion. Of course I've seen all the shops, I'm not blind.

 

My understanding is not flawed at all - unless you can show me the law that allows recreational use. Can you? I am fully aware that the law is being openly flouted and that a blind eye is being turned to that.  That is probably why the current situation has arisen - in that there are now proposals to change the existing regulations.

 

Legalising cannabis in the way it has been - cloaked as medicinal only whilst openly stating it will attract tourism clearly hasn't fooled the (opposed) public.

 

The portion of the Thai population that are opposed to legalising cannabis is sizeable and backed by some very influencial public figures.  They are not happy at all with cannabis being even partially legalised and they have been lobbying for change - unless you missed the new reports.

 

The authorities, if they are going to do anything at all, need to be clear this time and, if they are going to allay public concern, ensure that enforcement takes place.  You think they won't do it because of external pressure?  I would remind you that we are talking about a country that refused to allow an elected political party into government - with little complaint from the electorate, they can do whatever they want.

 

I am actually for legalisation as it happens - I'm just dealing with facts here and what you have posted is just simply wrong - unless you can prove otherwise.  I repeat, my understanding of the current law is that cannabis is only allowed for medicinal purposes and the maximum THC content allowed is 0.2% - basically hemp!

 

There's an 80kph speed limit on a major road near my home. Most drivers are doing at least 100kph and many 120kph +.  The limit is still 80kph - its the same thing. A law exists but its not enforced.

 

I suspect that whatever the outcome of this threat, the government will have to enforce it this time. The anti cannbis lobby are not going away.

 

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3 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

The concerns of the the health minister are straight out of reefer madness,

There are members here who know me and that I have reason to claim I know a little about the plant - we'll leave it at that - I won't be drawn on that.  My thoughts for much of my life have been, legalise cannabis but hang the guys who peddle addictive drugs.

 

The days of harmless cannabis (and I remain of the opinon that its less harmful than alcohol), are rapidly diminishing and there is now growing, reliable and documented evidence that the strength of some of the current strains can cause psychosis and other problems - especially in young people. 

 

Much of the weed available in the UK these days contains over 30% THC - put quite simply, its enough to blow your socks off. Users these days just want higher and higher THC levels and it is becoming dangerous. Whereas Thailand used to be flooded with rubbish weed - I'm told that some of these mega THC strains are now entering the Thai market.

 

I can't quite work out why somebody wants to get so high that they can't remember it but there you are, that's what the market wants.

 

When I was a kid I'd never even heard of weed until I was over 16 and it was a long time after that before I tried some.  What we smoked then was around 15% THC and although I got high on it, I never lost control.  Now, most schoolkids in the UK have tried cannabis and kids as young as 11 are regular users.  The thought of 11 year old kids using Starwdawg or Godfather scares me.

 

Weed is often no longer the harmless product it used to be and is finding its way into the hands of children - young children.  On that basis alone, I believe that those who would ban it - do in fact have a point.

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22 hours ago, BritManToo said:

My misses came home last night and complained "all the prices are going up except for Yaba".

Apparently Yaba is now 20bht a tab.

What did she make for your tea?

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6 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

brickweed must be almost a thing of the past now, as far as the Thai market is concerned, and they used to produce tonnes of it 20,000 a kilo not that long ago.  A lot of influential people  losing income won't be allowed to continue

Before legalization I was buying brick for 400bht/100gm now it's selling online for 550bht/100gm.

 

Never seen it selling at 20kbht/kg!

Edited by BritManToo
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4 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

Much of the weed available in the UK these days contains over 30% THC - put quite simply, its enough to blow your socks off

Absolute rubbish.  

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4 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

 

When I was a kid I'd never even heard of weed until I was over 16 and it was a long time after that before I tried some.  What we smoked then was around 15% THC

And how exactly did you determine the strength ?    You didn't , you are talking more rubbish

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4 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

 

Weed is often no longer the harmless product it used to be and is finding its way into the hands of children - young children.  On that basis alone, I believe that those who would ban it - do in fact have a point.

More reefer madness rubbish,  " falling into the hands of young children"   the complete  absence of any shock horror news reports of this happening indicates it just does not happen.  Do you honestly think "young children" are sat around craving their first cannabis hit ?  You appear to live in a parallel universe.   Are kids smoking cigarettes in epidemic proportions ?  no they are not , and what about Lao Khao or even  "normal Whisky"  not exactly a national problem either is it?     If it was the case that kids are taking drugs the media would be all over it and they are not    Should motorcycles be banned?  they regularly "fall into the hands" of children many of whom actually drive themselves to school but there is no hysterical comments calling for motorcycles to be taken from the rest of society.   You should stop repeating the rubbish that come out of the mouths of "experts"  it makes you appear as stupid as them   

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4 hours ago, MangoKorat said:

The days of harmless cannabis (and I remain of the opinon that its less harmful than alcohol), are rapidly diminishing and there is now growing, reliable and documented evidence that the strength of some of the current strains can cause psychosis and other problems - especially in young people. 

                 Of course it is less harmful than alcohol, at least we can agree on one thing.  So  the few rules regarding alcohol consumption by the young appear to be  sufficient to prevent that happening, (I can't remember ever seeing a drunk kid) yet allow adults to enjoy a drink as and when they want.  Yet when it comes to weed the demand is for a total ban, nothing else will suffice.  There are plenty of things that should not fall into the hands of children, but are not banned  Knives, matches, cigarettes, alcohol, paracetamol,  motorcycles, smartphones, deep holes full of water  , dogs, poisonous plants,  small items that can be swallowed, electrical items, plug sockets   the list is endless, but common sense seems to have prevailed and education is considered sufficient.   What is the difference with cannabis ?

                There is no difference except that none of the other "potential risks" have been the subject of a 100 year campaign of reefer madness style b/s courtesy of the good old USA.  I thought mature adults these days were intelligent enough to see through all that rubbish,  most actually are , but a few  unfortunately remain brainwashed, 

                So to protect the young, licensed cannabis shops, who legally cannot sell to kids, (and which kids never visit) will be forced to close,   The production and use of cannabis will return to how it was pre legalisation, it certainly will not stop.  The next people to be incharge of the retail of cannabis will no longer be required "not to sell to under 21's"  what do you think is likely to happen ?   Do you honestly think its new "illegality " will be any sort of a deterrent?  if you do you are living in cloud cuckoo land.

                Cannabis itself is not a gateway to anything,  but once it becomes illegal again that will change, it will become forbidden fruit, and there is nothing as attractive as that.

                

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           Out of interest where are all these people quoting the % of THC getting their information from ?  Is there now an app on their mobile phones that can give them this information ?  No of course there isn't .  The equipment required to provide this information is rather expensive , no doubt requires some expert training to use , and is  not readily available either to the  smoker or indeed to anybody else.

           Obviously those selling cannabis  will make wild claims about the quality of their product but that is all they are ,  I have smoked cannabis for over  45 years  I don't feel the need to search out the strongest possible weed available, in the same way that I have happily enjoyed a few beers with around 4 - 5% alcohol for most of my life without ever craving spirits containing 40% or more,   

           Yes a small minority of people will have issues with alcohol, either becoming addicted , or unable to control themselves when intoxicated, but only once was it actually banned ( at least in civilised countries)  I believe that didn't work out too well when they tried it either, 

           The decriminalisation  of cannabis from what I can see has not caused the breakdown of society nor has it produced a sub culture of zombies, in fact the only issues I have heard about are a few elderly expats on here who don't like the smell (bless them)

            So  if taking the supply of cannabis out of the hands of responsible regulated vendors and putting it back under the control of mafia type organisations and the corrupt police is considered to be the only way  to end the scourge of misuse and protect the young, why not do the same with alcohol ?  why stop there?  why not put everything that is potentially  risky under the control of criminals, ?  what could possibly go wrong?

 

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7 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

And how exactly did you determine the strength ?    You didn't , you are talking more rubbish

It is not me that is talking rubbish.  You say you have smoked cannabis for 45 years yet you seem to know very little about it.

 

Testing the THC content is actually not that difficult but let's forget claimed or actual strengths and look at it in a different way. When I smoked weed there was no way that 1 joint would leave me comatose. In the UK what was available then was usually Black Moroccan Hash (Resin).  In my area all varieties of actual bud were lumped together and referred to as 'Skunk' and the only people that smoked it were Jamaicans and those who's tolerance was enhanced due to years of smoking.  I would ocassionally try 'Skunk' at parties etc. if nothing else was available.  I have a fairly low tolerance and that 'Skunk' would affect me far more than my usual Hash.  It would not however lead to me either being out of control or comatose.

 

As you should know, there were several strains around a few years back that were actually called Skunk and variations of that title. Although they were stronger than Hash they didn't 'blow your socks off'.  Breeders, seeking to gain market advantage have been crossing strains to find ever stronger varieties and hybrids for years - increases in strength were marginal but continous. Bud, rather than resin became the most popular type of cannabis used throughout Europe. I was not involved with Asia in those days so I have no idea of the evolution of cannabis there.

 

In the UK, people started growing weed either commercially or at home and the market, in the main changed from imported resin to home grown weed.  That change meant that a grower could easily try out the constant stream of new varieties, mainly from European breeders but increasingly from the USA.  Then the Californian varieties arrived.  A simplified way of describing that change was that these new varieties - Stardawg for the masses and Gelato's, Cake's for the connoisseurs, provided a smoke that would in fact 'blow you socks off'. 

 

For many years, Stardawg was by far the most popular and remains very popular today. The main reason for that is because it is relatively easy to grow compared to some of the other Californian strains, it provides a decent yield and most importantly (to users), well grown Dawg is as strong as hell. And 'Strong as Hell' is exactly what the market wants.

 

Your argument about THC's has no basis. I didn't mention THC above but everything I have written is factual.  The weed/resin/cake that is smoked today is far stronger that than it ever was.  I have always dismissed claims about cannabis being harmful until a few years ago. 

 

The evidence presented by clinicians not governments, with regard to mental illness, is now convincing and proven.  The massive increase in the strength of weed is the main driver of that as also acknowledged by those clinician and the harmful effects are far worse in young people.

 

Whilst I was a strong supporter of the right to use cannabis for 90% of my life - that advent of these potent strains has changed my views.

 

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8 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

So to protect the young, licensed cannabis shops, who legally cannot sell to kids, (and which kids never visit) will be forced to close,   The production and use of cannabis will return to how it was pre legalisation, it certainly will not stop.  The next people to be incharge of the retail of cannabis will no longer be required "not to sell to under 21's"  what do you think is likely to happen ?   Do you honestly think its new "illegality " will be any sort of a deterrent?  if you do you are living in cloud cuckoo land.

Low prices = weed that is far more easily available to kids.  And what has happened to prices in Thailand?

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29 minutes ago, MangoKorat said:

Low prices = weed that is far more easily available to kids.  And what has happened to prices in Thailand?

Yaba pills are now only 20bht each, even cheaper and more available than cannabis.

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10 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

More reefer madness rubbish,  " falling into the hands of young children"   the complete  absence of any shock horror news reports of this happening indicates it just does not happen.  Do you honestly think "young children" are sat around craving their first cannabis hit ?  You appear to live in a parallel universe.

Listen - this is a very serious matter, far more serious than your stupid opinions.

 

I know the cannabis business extremely well, I was part of it. I do not live in a parallel universe at all, I live in the real world.  I have more knowledge about weed in my big toe nail than you appear to have in total. I know very well what has happened in the UK and large parts of Europe since the Albanians drove prices down.  There are kids in the UK smoking extremely strong new strains of weed and in doing so, causing serious damage to their health.

 

Legalisation in Thailand has also driven prices down and if you care to read the Thai press, you would note that exactly the same is happening there. Some of those news reports have also made it on to this site I seem to remember. I am not allowed to post details of many available reports due to forum rules but you can easliy find them if you'd stop simply trying to be right and accept the truth!

 

The facts are:

 

1. The 'newer, more potent strains of cannabis are now proven to be harmful - especially to developing brains.

2. In countries where cannabis prices have fallen, there is clear evidence that it is now readliy available AND being used by children.

3. The 'legalisation' of cannabis in Thailand has lead to a massive decrease in prices

 

My girlfriend in Korat has a 13 year old daughter who tells us that weed is easliy available to her and being used already by some of her classmates. Wake up! Just because you enjoy a smoke doesn't make it safe for kids.

 

I could go on and on but people like you will argue black is white - your need to be right comes above all else. I am not looking at this from the side of legalisation or criminalisation - my concern is purely for the kids.

 

Here's just one report!

 

https://www.todayonline.com/world/trending-photos-kids-young-9-smoking-cannabis-pattaya-beach-spark-outrage-2064341

 

 

Edited by MangoKorat
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10 hours ago, Bday Prang said:

Absolute rubbish.  

The only rubbish is your ignorance.  I used to produce it!

 

Basic fluid THC test kits start at around £25 and will test 3 samples.

 

TLC test kits (much more accurate) cost around £150 but will test up to 25 samples.

 

Professional growers normally use an analyser linked to an app on their phone that costs around £1000.

 

I know for a fact that the last time I tested any cannabis on that device the range was between 27% and 33%.

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