60-day visa exemptions are now unlimited at land borders

[Liquorice]

2 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

We know the 2-entry rule was rescinded, because this stopped being an issue entirely at non-agent-extortion points of entry.  Prior to this change, they wrote (1) and (2) next to land-border visa-exempt entries, to count them, but not any more.

Can you post a link to that order rescinding the limit of VE entries at borders.

 

3 minutes ago, Rob Browder said:

Not exclusively, any more.  When the 60-day exempt was announced, additional reasons now qualifying for their use were added - including visiting family.

Announced by the MFA, not by Immigration.

[Rob Browder]

4 minutes ago, Liquorice said:

Can you post a link to that order rescinding the limit of VE entries at borders.

 

Announced by the MFA, not by Immigration.

The person in question did not enter by land - so this never applied to his case.  As to land-entries, we have posts on this forum of entry stamps, after that policy ended, and the " (1)"  "(2)" counting is over.    The only question is whether you enter at a "bent" entry point, or not.

[transam]

11 minutes ago, Liquorice said:

Can you post a link to that order rescinding the limit of VE entries at borders.

 

Announced by the MFA, not by Immigration.

Perhaps you could ask this chap........🤗

 

 

[Caldera]

3 hours ago, Liquorice said:

Can you post a link to that order rescinding the limit of VE entries at borders.

 

The order seems elusive (I haven't seen it either), but there's no doubt that it was enacted.

 

The proof is in the pudding - countless people have done 3-4 overland visa exempt entries this year. People who had already maxed out their land border entries before the change were later allowed to enter again. Both border run agencies and IOs at land borders across Thailand have advised people that the limit is no longer in force.

 

So let me turn this on its head for you: Can you post a link to a credible report by anyone refused entry specifically for exceeding this limit since the new rules went into effect? Genuinely curious, I haven't seen any.

[Liquorice]

20 hours ago, Caldera said:

The proof is in the pudding - countless people have done 3-4 overland visa exempt entries this year. People who had already maxed out their land border entries before the change were later allowed to enter again. Both border run agencies and IOs at land borders across Thailand have advised people that the limit is no longer in force.

 

So let me turn this on its head for you: Can you post a link to a credible report by anyone refused entry specifically for exceeding this limit since the new rules went into effect? Genuinely curious, I haven't seen any.

The MFA only made an announcement in July.

With 60 days now on entry + 30 day extensions, 3rd or 4th entries wouldn't be due yet.

I've only read of two entries since.

 

To redact their order it would have to be announced in the Royal Gazette, and that hasn't happened.
They may not be enforcing the 2 VE border crossing, but that could change at a whim.

[Liquorice]

23 hours ago, transam said:

Perhaps you could ask this chap........🤗

He's not Immigration or an official.

[transam]

1 hour ago, Liquorice said:

He's not Immigration or an official.

So you are not going to ask him, you would rather ask members on here..................🤭

[Maestro]

This topic is about the new 60-day visa-exempt entry (VE60), which is separate and distinctly different from the 30-day visa exempt entry (VE-30).

 

Therefore, any request for proof of an official rescission of limitations and/or restrictions related to the VE30 are off-topic here.

 

Anyone with knowledge of a publication in the  Royal Gazette of a limit of the number of entries with VE60 within a specific period of time is kindly invited to post the relevant link here.

[Caldera]

3 hours ago, Liquorice said:

The MFA only made an announcement in July.

With 60 days now on entry + 30 day extensions, 3rd or 4th entries wouldn't be due yet.

I've only read of two entries since.

 

You've misread my post, as I wrote that people who had already maxed out their overland visa exempt entries for 2024 under the old rules were nevertheless allowed to enter visa exempt when the new rules came into effect. So those are the ones I mean with 3-4 overland visa exempt entries this year in total - two visa exempt entries under the old rules plus 1-2 visa visa exempt entries under the new rules. There are many of them.

 

I like the interpretation @Maestrohas posted here in the meantime, that the limitation for VE-30 didn't even need to be formally rescinded, because VE-30 entries currently aren't possible as they have been superseded by VE-60 entries for all those who had qualified for VE-30 before (plus many additional nationalities). That's the most sensible explanation for the apparent lack of such an order I've seen to date.

[Liquorice]

2 hours ago, transam said:

So you are not going to ask him, you would rather ask members on here..................🤭

He is a member here, and you quoted his topic, so I don't need to ask him, the same as you didn't.

[Liquorice]

1 hour ago, Maestro said:

Anyone with knowledge of a publication in the  Royal Gazette of a limit of the number of entries with VE60 within a specific period of time is kindly invited to post the relevant link here.

Is there an official publication for limited VE entries by air.

No, but Immigration imposes restrictions at their own discretion.

Just my opinion, but only a question of time before we start reading refused VE at a land border.
Time will tell.

[transam]

12 hours ago, Liquorice said:

He is a member here, and you quoted his topic, so I don't need to ask him, the same as you didn't.

I believe he is a visa expert member here, his avatar says so, what are you on here........?   😜

[Maestro]

On 12/16/2024 at 10:02 PM, Liquorice said:

Is there an official publication for limited VE entries by air...

 

 

A limit was published in the Government Gazette for VE30 entries. Someone posted a link to it in this forum but I don't have it available; anyway, it is off topic here.

 

An English translation of the official publication of the VE60 is here:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/12Zn4PQT7dlqS39lhdeEd6HIGXsAeEG8Z/view?usp=drive_link

without any mention of any limitation on the number of entries via any type of entry point, but the announcement states that the VE60 was launched under the authority of the Immigration Act and therefore  Section 12 and all other provisions of that law apply to the VE60. One limitation mentioned in the announcement is the purpose of the visit, ie "Tourism, Work, or Short-Term Business Engagements" 

 

The official text published in the Government Gazette, in Thai language, is here:

https://ratchakitcha.soc.go.th/documents/37563.pdf

 

P.S.  Edit on 20 DEC 2024: I corrected the link for the Thai document

[Liquorice]

6 hours ago, transam said:

I believe he is a visa expert member here, his avatar says so, what are you on here........?   😜

Same as him, a member.

[Maestro]

In the unofficial English translation to which I linked, I found the text "Tourism, Work, or Short-Term Business Engagements" puzzling and this prompted me to take the corresponding Thai text and use Google Translate, which gives quite a different translation: "tourism and telework". I find this equally puzzling.

 

[Maestro]

Removed an abusive post.

 

@transam and @Liquorice  Stop your bickering, please.

[daeumtnaot]

I was asking agents about visa exemptions earlier today and the first thing they asked me was how many times I had a visa exemption via land crossing this year.  They seemed to this you couldn't get more than two.

 

Also, they seemed to think once 2025 rolls in, you'll be starting over at zero.  I.e. even if you've been in Thailand on visa exemptions in 2024, they will start letting you in again in 2025 as if you had not been here.

 

This is all new to me and seems confusing

 

 

[transam]

1 minute ago, daeumtnaot said:

I was asking agents about visa exemptions earlier today and the first thing they asked me was how many times I had a visa exemption via land crossing this year.  They seemed to this you couldn't get more than two.

 

Also, they seemed to think once 2025 rolls in, you'll be starting over at zero.  I.e. even if you've been in Thailand on visa exemptions in 2024, they will start letting you in again in 2025 as if you had not been here.

 

This is all new to me and seems confusing

 

 

It used to be 2 per year at land borders, that has changed.. 

[daeumtnaot]

4 hours ago, transam said:

It used to be 2 per year at land borders, that has changed.. 

So now you can do more than two per year at a land border?  Does the beginning of the  new year make any difference?

[Liquorice]

29 minutes ago, daeumtnaot said:

So now you can do more than two per year at a land border?  Does the beginning of the  new year make any difference?

As it stood previously, it was always 2 land border crossings within a calendar year (Jan - Dec), so yes, the clock reset again at New year.

[Liquorice]

6 hours ago, Maestro said:

In the unofficial English translation to which I linked, I found the text "Tourism, Work, or Short-Term Business Engagements" puzzling and this prompted me to take the corresponding Thai text and use Google Translate, which gives quite a different translation: "tourism and telework". I find this equally puzzling.

 

Telework = digital nomads, a reference to the new DTV ?

 

There is still no evidence of Immigration residing the previous order regarding the limitation of land border crossings.

It appears more a case of non enforcement and leniency until they feel the economy has recovered sufficiently, then they'll revert to the 2 VE land border entries again.

[transam]

11 hours ago, daeumtnaot said:

So now you can do more than two per year at a land border?  Does the beginning of the  new year make any difference?

That's what I was told when I asked the IO at Chong Mek border.

 

I don't think the new year makes any difference unless they change things back to how they were previously...But as I say, this is the border I use...😉

[Maestro]

11 hours ago, Liquorice said:

There is still no evidence of Immigration residing the previous order regarding the limitation of land border crossings.

 

"The previous order" was for the VE30.

 

This topic is about the VE60. The announcement of the VE60 mentioned no limitation on the he number of entries. To the best of my knowledge, no subsequent announcement about a limitation has been made.

[Liquorice]

50 minutes ago, Maestro said:

This topic is about the VE60. The announcement of the VE60 mentioned no limitation on the he number of entries.

Agreed, but neither does it mention 'unlimited' 60 day VE entries.

It's an open book for Immigration to use their discretion.

 

Indeed, we've already had a couple of reports on the forum of being questions on the purpose of their visit, recently entering VE by air.

A personal friend, Thai spouse, been visiting on VE entries for the last 6 years, was pulled aside for the very first time entering at the beginning of November for a planned 5 weeks stay, and told in future to obtain the correct visa for the purpose of his visit. Like others in a similar position, he doesn't stay long enough to process an extension application.

[Katatonica]

4 hours ago, Maestro said:

 

"The previous order" was for the VE30.

 

This topic is about the VE60. The announcement of the VE60 mentioned no limitation on the he number of entries. To the best of my knowledge, no subsequent announcement about a limitation has been made.

 Just reporting my experience then: I was stopped, questioned and allowed in with a caution that if I attempt to enter (Phuket Airport) again on VE-60, (ie after my 3rd time in about 5 months) I will be sent back. I was also informed at Phuket Town immigration office last week that the limit is 2 a year.

[Maestro]

6 hours ago, Liquorice said:

Agreed, but neither does it mention 'unlimited' 60 day VE entries.

It's an open book for Immigration to use their discretion..

 

 

1. In ordinary language and in legal terms, everything that is not limited is unlimited, without the need to explicitly specify that it is unlimited.

 

2. Yes, immigration officials at border entry points have the authority to deny a traveller permission to enter Thailand in accordance with Section 22 of the Immigration Act and to use their discretion in exercising this authority.

 

[Maestro]

4 hours ago, Katatonica said:

 Just reporting my experience then: I was stopped, questioned and allowed in with a caution that if I attempt to enter (Phuket Airport) again on VE-60, (ie after my 3rd time in about 5 months) I will be sent back. I was also informed at Phuket Town immigration office last week that the limit is 2 a year.

 

1. The caution you were given was probably based on Article 12 of the Immigration Act.

 

2. The information you received from the Phuket Town immigration office is wrong, unless an announcement has been published in the Government Gazette stating such blanket limit of VE-60 entries. The immigration official's authority to deny entry under Section 12 is not tied to the number of previous entries made within the year.

[Katatonica]

3 hours ago, Maestro said:

 

1. The caution you were given was probably based on Article 12 of the Immigration Act.

 

2. The information you received from the Phuket Town immigration office is wrong, unless an announcement has been published in the Government Gazette stating such blanket limit of VE-60 entries. The immigration official's authority to deny entry under Section 12 is not tied to the number of previous entries made within the year.

I very much doubt I was denied entry due to contravention of Section 12 of the Immigration Act. I have no idea why I would be. The airport IO's also said the same about my multiple brief entries: 'free visa is not for visit Thai wife.' There was no problem entering whilst holding a Tourist Visa earlier in the year nor for my previous visit on VE-60 with a different IO.

[Caldera]

7 hours ago, Katatonica said:

I very much doubt I was denied entry due to contravention of Section 12 of the Immigration Act. I have no idea why I would be. The airport IO's also said the same about my multiple brief entries: 'free visa is not for visit Thai wife.' There was no problem entering whilst holding a Tourist Visa earlier in the year nor for my previous visit on VE-60 with a different IO.

 

The policy at airports is pretty clear: pay your money or take your chances. That has been the case for a long time.

[hotandsticky]

7 hours ago, Katatonica said:

I very much doubt I was denied entry due to contravention of Section 12 of the Immigration Act. I have no idea why I would be. The airport IO's also said the same about my multiple brief entries: 'free visa is not for visit Thai wife.' There was no problem entering whilst holding a Tourist Visa earlier in the year nor for my previous visit on VE-60 with a different IO.

 

 

I am surprised that you are surprised by the IO's actions.

 

 

The first principle of entry requirements is that you have the visa that is appropriate to your circumstances. VE or TV are not suitable for someone living in Thailand or making regular visits to see their Thai wife.