Thai Wife To Buy Land

[jubby]

We've (I should say my wife) has gone through the process of buying some Land. We are due to visit the land Office on friday with the person who is selling it to get it Finalised.

It seems to have gone relatively smoothly. I can live with the fact that It won't be mine as I have 3 Kids with Thai Nationality and have been assured that the Land will pass to them. One think thats niggling me is I have been asked to sign a document saying the money to purchase it is my wifes not mine. It seems quite a ridiculous request when we have been married for ten years , lived in the UK and have Joint finances and its obviously 'ours'. And I can't think what difference it makes anyway; anyway, I thought I would just check wether this is a new requirement, or wether there is anything sinister behind it, or just another ridiculous OTT rule; before I tell a little white lie to the Authorities ;-)

cheers,

Jubby

[ajannick]

We've (I should say my wife) has gone through the process of buying some Land. We are due to visit the land Office on friday with the person who is selling it to get it Finalised.

It seems to have gone relatively smoothly. I can live with the fact that It won't be mine as I have 3 Kids with Thai Nationality and have been assured that the Land will pass to them. One think thats niggling me is I have been asked to sign a document saying the money to purchase it is my wifes not mine. It seems quite a ridiculous request when we have been married for ten years , lived in the UK and have Joint finances and its obviously 'ours'. And I can't think what difference it makes anyway; anyway, I thought I would just check wether this is a new requirement, or wether there is anything sinister behind it, or just another ridiculous OTT rule; before I tell a little white lie to the Authorities ;-)

cheers,

Jubby

Sounds suspicious to me. In my experience Thai people don't care where the money has come from when selling anything.

When getting a divource all assests aquired during the marriage are supposed to be halfed. However if someone could proove that it was all their own money that was used to purchase a house or land then this may not be the case.

I bet if you refused to sign until you were shown some legal document explaining this, the seller would soon change their tune.

Nick.

[lannarebirth]

We've (I should say my wife) has gone through the process of buying some Land. We are due to visit the land Office on friday with the person who is selling it to get it Finalised.

It seems to have gone relatively smoothly. I can live with the fact that It won't be mine as I have 3 Kids with Thai Nationality and have been assured that the Land will pass to them. One think thats niggling me is I have been asked to sign a document saying the money to purchase it is my wifes not mine. It seems quite a ridiculous request when we have been married for ten years , lived in the UK and have Joint finances and its obviously 'ours'. And I can't think what difference it makes anyway; anyway, I thought I would just check wether this is a new requirement, or wether there is anything sinister behind it, or just another ridiculous OTT rule; before I tell a little white lie to the Authorities ;-)

cheers,

Jubby

Sounds suspicious to me. In my experience Thai people don't care where the money has come from when selling anything.

When getting a divource all assests aquired during the marriage are supposed to be halfed. However if someone could proove that it was all their own money that was used to purchase a house or land then this may not be the case.

I bet if you refused to sign until you were shown some legal document explaining this, the seller would soon change their tune.

Nick.

This response is half correct. The document you have been asked to sign is indeed a requirement of the Thai government. That the land is acquired during marriage does make it a 50% ownership thing to haggle over should you ever split. The best thing you could do is sign the document and keep good records of the paper trail that took the funds from your overseas bank to the sellers pocket.

[jimmym40]

I also agree with above post. Really sounds suspicious. Who is asking you for this statement? Who cares where the money comes from, as long as it's cash? I'm sure the seller doesn't care...

I think the only time this question may arise is when a divorce is involved. I've heard of farang's getting a divorce and if they were able to prove that their house and land was paid for from the their funds only, the better chance of getting an equal settlement.

I'd be very cautious if I were you. Could it be a scam? Any reason to believe your wife might have something "cooking"? Sorry to ask, again, just doesn't sound right...

[Gimbo]

We've (I should say my wife) has gone through the process of buying some Land. We are due to visit the land Office on friday with the person who is selling it to get it Finalised.

It seems to have gone relatively smoothly. I can live with the fact that It won't be mine as I have 3 Kids with Thai Nationality and have been assured that the Land will pass to them. One think thats niggling me is I have been asked to sign a document saying the money to purchase it is my wifes not mine. It seems quite a ridiculous request when we have been married for ten years , lived in the UK and have Joint finances and its obviously 'ours'. And I can't think what difference it makes anyway; anyway, I thought I would just check wether this is a new requirement, or wether there is anything sinister behind it, or just another ridiculous OTT rule; before I tell a little white lie to the Authorities ;-)

cheers,

Jubby

Sounds suspicious to me. In my experience Thai people don't care where the money has come from when selling anything.

When getting a divource all assests aquired during the marriage are supposed to be halfed. However if someone could proove that it was all their own money that was used to purchase a house or land then this may not be the case.

I bet if you refused to sign until you were shown some legal document explaining this, the seller would soon change their tune.

Nick.

I think I saw something somewhere that if the spuose of a foreigner is buying land in Thailand, she has to document that the money is not coming from him. It's not a scam, it's Thai law.

Someone better informed may be able to confirm it

[goldfinger]

This paper to sign on the land office is normal, if Thai woman and foreign husband are "buying " land in the wifes name.

I assume, if this paper is not signed, the land office will not register the deal.

To get more "security " for you, lease the land from your wife for 30 years-have a look on the forum, there are several threads about this.

[pete_r]

I've signed such a paper when we bought a house last december. It is an official form prepared by the Land Office on the day of purchase.

It was explained to me as a requirement linked to the "foreigners cannot own land" law.

[Crossy]

ASSUMING the document is required by the land office it is quite normal. Make sure you're covered by a lease, usufruct or similar instrument to protect your investment as best you can.

I have an usufruct and my wife has willed the land to me, although I can't own it I will have a year to dispose should she die before I do (unlikely).

Edited August 1, 2007 by Crossy

[jubby]

Yes, Its the Land office who's asking for it. We've been getting a bit of help and advice from a family friend (policeman with a lot of stars and stripes on his uniform

) He doesn't speak english but from what I can gather he reckons the 30 year lease is not quite secure and that there is another option for my wife to sign somesort of paper or register me at the land Office so she can't later Kick me out. Not quite sure, have to look into it more. I'm not worried about my wifes intentions as everything she does is for the Children anyway. I'm just concerned about them asking me to confirm its my wifes money, Its as though no Thai is able to comprehend that we have been married for 10 years, have 3 kids and a normal family relationship , because ofcourse she's only with a Farang for the money, right ! ?

Also excuse my ignorance, whats an usufruct ? Sounds like a scandinavian or German Meal !

Cheers,

Jubby

[jumnien]

Every time my wife buy's land I have to sign the paper that the money is hers or I'll make no claim against it. I don't see any problem with it. If I didn't want her to end up with it I certainly wouldn't be putting it in her name to begin with.

[jubby]

Every time my wife buy's land I have to sign the paper that the money is hers or I'll make no claim against it. I don't see any problem with it. If I didn't want her to end up with it I certainly wouldn't be putting it in her name to begin with.

The Land will be in my wifes name as it is on her ID Card and Thai Passport. Its a good Thai name, I know at least three other Thais with the same Surname.

JUBB - it seems to get translated as KISS... JUBB... JUBB.. Its also my Surname. ;-)

[jumnien]

Well yes, actually my wife registers the property in my last name as well. Interesting quirk.

[joeuk1]

My wife has the same surname as me , she changed Id card passport etc etc to my surname when we were married . We have bought land of course it went into the wifes name i signed a form to say the land was hers . I personally have not done the 30 year lease my wife would sign if it i wanted her to but i have no interest in going this route .

JB

[Lite Beer]

Usufruct is a legal agreement that gives you The Farang the right to live in the house for the rest of your life. No one can throw you out.

[jubby]

Thanks Litebeer,

Thats probably what the policeman was talking about. I'd certainly be happier with one of those. never know what will happen when my wife hits the menapause , or me for that matter ;-)

Is it easy to get, and does it go by that name in Thailand ?

Cheers,

Jubby

[paulsmithson]

one very real danger ( God forbid it ever happens) is iF your wife dies before you ---greed may motivate relatives to take over her posessions and you could possibley be forced out. Protect yourself and the kids from all eventualities.

Get a usufruct

[ricklev]

I think you might find a visit to a farang lawyer worth the money.

[frikkiedeboer]

Yes, Its the Land office who's asking for it. We've been getting a bit of help and advice from a family friend (policeman with a lot of stars and stripes on his uniform

) He doesn't speak english but from what I can gather he reckons the 30 year lease is not quite secure and that there is another option for my wife to sign somesort of paper or register me at the land Office so she can't later Kick me out. Not quite sure, have to look into it more. I'm not worried about my wifes intentions as everything she does is for the Children anyway. I'm just concerned about them asking me to confirm its my wifes money, Its as though no Thai is able to comprehend that we have been married for 10 years, have 3 kids and a normal family relationship , because ofcourse she's only with a Farang for the money, right ! ?

Also excuse my ignorance, whats an usufruct ? Sounds like a scandinavian or German Meal !

Cheers,

Jubby

the 30 year lease is about the easiest way to go and if registered at the land office is 100% safe. (but only for 30 years). why not put the land in the kids' names. they cannot sell the land until they come of age, and if you worry about your own kids selling your land out from under you, (happens in thailand), then protect your rights with a lease as well.

[think_too_mut]

We've (I should say my wife) has gone through the process of buying some Land. We are due to visit the land Office on friday with the person who is selling it to get it Finalised.

It seems to have gone relatively smoothly. I can live with the fact that It won't be mine as I have 3 Kids with Thai Nationality and have been assured that the Land will pass to them. One think thats niggling me is I have been asked to sign a document saying the money to purchase it is my wifes not mine.

A year ago, some people's house got burnt to the shell (saw it, know them). To recover, they parceled the land they have been trying to sell it.

No many takers, only 4 of 10 lots were sold. And they built a bare shell and live there.

My wife told me she wanted that land, a lot at the intersection. 30K baht half rai. While there, she shopped for 2 lots.

It took 3 ATM withdrawals and later she complained that 2000B for milestones to mark her new property and to get it into the land books was time consuming and expensive.

Signatures? Leases? Nothing. If worse comes to worse, she will have a place to camp on.

[donx]

My wife recently bought land in Tha Sala of Nakhon Si Thammarat province. I was there at the land office with our kids ready and waiting to sign away my rights to the land. The kids were getting fussy and I was told to go take the kids to Tesco Lotus and wait there until the transaction was finished. I was told that the reason I wouldn't need to sign anything is because my wife never changed her Thai citizen ID card and since it still is in her maiden name, there is no need for me to do anything. Obviously the land officials saw me waiting there with her with our kids (one was only 17 months old). I really expected to receive a call while waiting telling me to get my ass back over there as fast as I can to sign that piece of paper. That never happened.

[jubby]

Just been trying to research more info on the usafruct and failed miserably. I did note however that the '1 rai' rule has gone, which I didn't know about. Things do seem to be slowly getting fairer/better over here. Maybe in a few years the paper I sign won't be legal anymore.

Can anyone who has one tell me how to get a usufruct ? Do I need to visit a Lawyer or are they available elsewhere ?

Thanks.

Jubby

[pete_r]

Some threads on usufruct (with answers from Sunbelt):

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=83374

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=80200

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=48519

[gregb]

We've (I should say my wife) has gone through the process of buying some Land. We are due to visit the land Office on friday with the person who is selling it to get it Finalised.

It seems to have gone relatively smoothly. I can live with the fact that It won't be mine as I have 3 Kids with Thai Nationality and have been assured that the Land will pass to them. One think thats niggling me is I have been asked to sign a document saying the money to purchase it is my wifes not mine. It seems quite a ridiculous request when we have been married for ten years , lived in the UK and have Joint finances and its obviously 'ours'. And I can't think what difference it makes anyway; anyway, I thought I would just check wether this is a new requirement, or wether there is anything sinister behind it, or just another ridiculous OTT rule; before I tell a little white lie to the Authorities ;-)

cheers,

Jubby

You have to sign it or your wife can not purchase the land. By law in Thailand, marital assets are shared 50/50 between the wife and the husband. In this case, since you can't own the land, the government requires you to state that the land is only hers. They changed this rule about 7 years ago. Before that time, the rule was "once the woman marries a foreigner, she loses her right to land ownership."

So count yourself lucky the Thai government has become enlightened and sign the paper. My wife and I own 3 properties, and I have had to sign every time. There is nothing suspicious going on here. It's a standard government issued form. You have no choice. Sign the paper or don't buy the property. The government doesn't care either way. The law is the law.

[jubby]

You have to sign it or your wife can not purchase the land. By law in Thailand, marital assets are shared 50/50 between the wife and the husband. In this case, since you can't own the land, the government requires you to state that the land is only hers. They changed this rule about 7 years ago. Before that time, the rule was "once the woman marries a foreigner, she loses her right to land ownership."

So count yourself lucky the Thai government has become enlightened and sign the paper. My wife and I own 3 properties, and I have had to sign every time. There is nothing suspicious going on here. It's a standard government issued form. You have no choice. Sign the paper or don't buy the property. The government doesn't care either way. The law is the law.

Yes, Its all good ;-) I'll sign it, Its definately an improvement to the last rule. Just wanted to know what it was about.

Cheers,

Jubby

[edwinchester]

My wife(Thai) bought some land in Thailand last year.

When she went to the Amphur to change to her details on the Chanote they saw from her id card that she was married to a farang.

Guy who did the transfers couldnt be bothered to see me and go through the neccessary paperwork that I had to sign and did the chanote in her name anyway! TIT.

Guess I have a claim to some Thai soil after all?

[jubby]

Just thinking.... with the marital assets 50/50 thing ....... You'll have to excuse me its early, but here goes ...

If my wife Buys Land with a House already in situ and I sign the paper , Im signing away rights to the House as well !?

If I buy Land and then build a House Later with my (our) money, I'll have 50/50 claim to the House !?

Jubby

[Monkeypants]

Guess I have a claim to some Thai soil after all?

ummmmm'....... nope

Come on you don't think by someone by-passing the correct procedure that this entitles you to own soil, do you?

Edited August 2, 2007 by Monkeypants

[Monkeypants]

Just thinking.... with the marital assets 50/50 thing ....... You'll have to excuse me its early, but here goes ...

If my wife Buys Land with a House already in situ and I sign the paper , Im signing away rights to the House as well !?

If I buy Land and then build a House Later with my (our) money, I'll have 50/50 claim to the House !?

Jubby

Not exactly, you can own the bricks and mortar, but you cannot own the land that it sits on, and at anytime that your other half wants to sell the land she can, irespective of who owns the house, unless you get a lease on the land for 30 years from your other half at which point you own the lease for the land and house. ok?

Marriage is a 50/50 thing .....But the reason for you to sign the official form at the land office is to say that you as a non Thai national cannot bring the land into a 50/50 dispute if the need arises because you a non Thai cannot own land.... thats it.

Edited August 2, 2007 by Monkeypants

[UnknownPoster]

Years ago, a Thai lady, married to a Farang, lost her right to own land in Thailand.

The rule was recently changed (10 years ago?) but the Farang must sign off, giving her 100% ownership.

[gregb]

My wife(Thai) bought some land in Thailand last year.

When she went to the Amphur to change to her details on the Chanote they saw from her id card that she was married to a farang.

Guy who did the transfers couldnt be bothered to see me and go through the neccessary paperwork that I had to sign and did the chanote in her name anyway! TIT.

Guess I have a claim to some Thai soil after all?

Actually, what it probably means is the transfer was illegal and can be declared either null and void (meaning you have no claim to the land at all), or else a complaint could mandate a court ordered immediate sale (meaning you'll have to pay taxes again to "sell" the land to your wife). I would consult a lawyer if I were you. Not sure if it's really a problem or not, but I wouldn't risk it. Generally it is best to make sure the law is followed, even if it isn't convenient for the government official. It's for your own protection.