Retirement Visa 3 Month Money Seasoning Rule

[Matt the Cat]

Edited August 8, 2007 by Matt the Cat

[Matt the Cat]

"The bottom line, I think, is that the Thai gov't, by continually raising the bar on the visa requirements, is showing they want the Westerners out."

The problem is that you're not thinking. If the Thai governmentt did not want foreigners here, they could get rid of us a lot easier than the method than they're using. They could cancel all visas. It's as simple as that. End of story. There you go.

I think ALL are intensely aware of how arbitrary the system has become. I personally find the hostile and rude treatment and total lack of information dished out by the Asian consulates to an inexcusable DIS-service not only to the visa applicant but to the locals waiting back home.

Again I find the abrasive treatment appalling, inexcusably unnecessary, counter productive and totally NON-Thai.

[Maestro]

Again I find the abrasive treatment appalling, inexcusably unnecessary, counter productive and totally NON-Thai.

Thank you for finally making it clear with your “I find” that you are speaking for yourself. I have seen posts by many other members who voice the opposite opinion. Were their positive experiences with immigration officials perhaps due to their personality? I don’t know.

--------------

Maestro

[Gravelrash]

I certainly noticed a "tough luck" attitude to those with visa difficulties from those without. Visa rules can and have changed and become more difficult for those who thought they were safe. And yeah, I saw it as a let's join the Thais and get rid of the poor folk...some of you should be ashamed of taking that attitude.

I am on a work permit with Business B visa, am seeing my lawyer (for lack of a better description) in a few days to see if I can extend or not, company has been slow due to Thai gvt policies, but that is of course is my problem. Still pay tax etc but apparently if company doesn't make enough, then hit the road Jack. Or been told can inject another million into the company, under the present circumstance I have no desire to bring more money here.

So to those that perversly enjoy seeing others in distress, wait until they get around to your visa category, and let's see how you gloat then. Yes I also know people who are getting out, gotten out already, or have gone to another country "with their business", personally I think I just close it down, sack the staff and their aspirations (3 have bought cars and one a condo since working for me), and move onto another visa type.

[JetsetBkk]

I certainly noticed a "tough luck" attitude to those with visa difficulties from those without. Visa rules can and have changed and become more difficult for those who thought they were safe. And yeah, I saw it as a let's join the Thais and get rid of the poor folk...some of you should be ashamed of taking that attitude.

It's not easy having too much sympathy for people who have not researched their own particular visa's requirements and have lived here barely being able to satisfy those requirements so that when the requirements change they can no longer meet them.

What on earth were they doing here living like that in the first place?

I am on a work permit with Business B visa, am seeing my lawyer (for lack of a better description) in a few days to see if I can extend or not, company has been slow due to Thai gvt policies, but that is of course is my problem. Still pay tax etc but apparently if company doesn't make enough, then hit the road Jack. Or been told can inject another million into the company, under the present circumstance I have no desire to bring more money here.

How many of these requirements were unknown to you when you decided to start your business here?

Have any requirements changed, since you came? If so, why didn't you know they had changed?

So to those that perversly enjoy seeing others in distress, wait until they get around to your visa category, and let's see how you gloat then. Yes I also know people who are getting out, gotten out already, or have gone to another country "with their business", personally I think I just close it down, sack the staff and their aspirations (3 have bought cars and one a condo since working for me), and move onto another visa type.

Nobody's gloating, but maybe they're fed up listening to the guys whose world has gone pear-shaped because they didn't have the foresight to see what was happening, or - as I said earlier - lived here only marginally meeting the requirements, and now cannot.

[JetsetBkk]

It’s hard not to notice how rude the Thai immigration people are particularly in all the Asian countries and all the contradictory information they provide that changes on a daily basis depending on the mood which is always awful.

They've never been rude to me. Maybe it's you.

[Jingthing]

Jetty,

by your kind of arrogant sounding attitude, referring to the hypothetical problems with 3 month money seasoning rules, people should keep 2 million baht in the bank. Just in case. God forbid to be so called marginal. So bottom line you aren't talking about marginal or not marginal, you are talking about people willing to throw money in the toilet (the very rich) and those who are not.

You either meet the requirements or you don't. 800K in the bank is as good as 10 million in the bank, they both qualify.

What people are kvetching about, and justifiably in my view:

rude treatment

power tripping, intimidating people

being treated as suspects, not welcome clients

rules changing too often without proper warning

rules being interpreted, communicated, and enforced inconsistently

lack of compassion/flexibiliy/common sense sometimes in enforcement (I realize this contradicts above)

the rules themselves seeming to be designed to treat all as suspects, rather than going after specific people for specific suspect actions

retroactive enforcement sometimes ruining people's visa sitaution for something they cannot possibly redo (its past)

in the case of the retirement program, one year extensions are not enough, applicants should ideally apply once and accepted for life unless they commit crimes, because they are older people

Edited August 12, 2007 by Jingthing

[melonf]

I am 62 and in a financial position to get a retirement visa. However, I dont want the hassles so I prefer to get a 12 month multiple entry O from the thai consul in my home country and take a trip home every 90 days. No visa renewal hassles, no stress and as I need to come home to visit my elderly mother its a good solution for me.

I also do the 90 day visa run thing in preference to getting an extension available by reason of marriage

I do the rolling 15 months and am happy to return to farangland to visit family and friends.

Now this takes 4 visa runs wasting 8 hours each every 15 months which I reckon averages out at 25 hours per year. So how much total time does obtaining a 12 month extension take? A round trip to Bangkok would take 6 hours but I live within 15 mins of the local immigration office.

I reckon it takes a little less time to get an extension, but not much. At the end of the day my visa is little more secure into the bargain and surely a lot less worry

[JetsetBkk]

Jetty,

Hi, Jingy!

by your kind of arrogant sounding attitude, referring to the hypothetical problems with 3 month money seasoning rules,

Guess what happened when people started talking about the "3 month seasoning" rule in this forum. This was before it was announced by immigration anywhere - just a few guys mentioning it on this forum. This happened about 4 months before my extension was due. So what did I do? Did I run around like a chicken with it's head cut off? Did I post here "Oh my God, what am I going to do? Is it real? How can they be so mean? I never did anything wrong, etc, etc."

No, I didn't do that. Instead I sent a letter to my bank to get my money transferred to Thailand straight way - 3 months early. I didn't hear of anybody being thrown out for not having it "seasoned". I did hear several people were told that it was OK for this time, but next year they must have it 3 months early. (Oh, those inconsistent officials! Why didn't they chuck them out of the country like the rules said they should've? )

people should keep 2 million baht in the bank. Just in case. God forbid to be so called marginal. So bottom line you aren't talking about marginal or not marginal, you are talking about people willing to throw money in the toilet (the very rich) and those who are not. You either meet the requirements or you don't. 800K in the bank is as good as 10 million in the bank, they both qualify

No, I am talking about "marginal". Having said that, I do have one year's money sitting in a bank abroad readily available in case an emergency arises. Don't you? Doesn't everybody who has decided to move half way around the world have some emergency funds readily available? If not, I'd call that "marginal".

What people are kvetching about, and justifiably in my view:

rude treatment - OK, but I've never had immigration people being rude to me

power tripping, intimidating people - maybe you're easily intimidated?

being treated as suspects, not welcome clients - it's their job to weed out the farang crooks, pimps, illegal workers, etc.

rules changing too often without proper warning - agreed! A bit of a pain, but they give you a month's notice for this new bank letter/form requirement, in the form of a one month extension

rules being interpreted, communicated, and enforced inconsistently - so that's why I try to interpret them in the toughest way, and not assume (for example) that the "3 month seasoning" was fake

lack of compassion/flexibiliy/common sense sometimes in enforcement (I realize this contradicts above)

the rules themselves seeming to be designed to treat all as suspects, rather than going after specific people for specific suspect actions - I think it's a lot easier for them to try to fish for the undesirables at extension renewal time rather than go looking for them

retroactive enforcement sometimes ruining people's visa situation for something they cannot possibly redo (its past) - has that actually happened?

in the case of the retirement program, one year extensions are not enough, applicants should ideally apply once and accepted for life unless they commit crimes, because they are older people - that would be nice, but let's keep it real!

Edited August 12, 2007 by JetsetBkk

[Jingthing]

There is too much in your rebuttal for me to chew at this moment, but two points:

I do have one year's money sitting in a bank abroad readily available in case an emergency arises. Don't you? Doesn't everybody who has decided to move half way around the world have some emergency funds readily available? If not, I'd call that "marginal".

NO! (Well, certainly not one year EXTRA). Why on earth would you put any more money in the bank at no or little interest in Thailand when you can have it invested! How ridiculous! I have over here exactly what is required with an extra buffer for reasonably forseeable emergencies. Not everyone is as rich or as wasteful an investor as you, I can assure you. Money is meant to be USED. If I need extra baht, I can wire it any any time and it is in Thailand in a few days max.

retroactive enforcement sometimes ruining people's visa situation for something they cannot possibly redo (its past) - has that actually happened?YES!

When they made the 3 month seasoning rule it was immediately effective and strictly enforced to all FIRST TIME extenders of O visas in Thailand. That was most definitely a window that caught some people. They could not possibly wire money in the past, after they learned the rule, NOW COULD THEY? That was totally absurd to enforce so quickly without lead time.

Edited August 12, 2007 by Jingthing

[JetsetBkk]

There is too much in your rebuttal for me to chew at this moment, but two points:

I do have one year's money sitting in a bank abroad readily available in case an emergency arises. Don't you? Doesn't everybody who has decided to move half way around the world have some emergency funds readily available? If not, I'd call that "marginal".

NO! (Well, certainly not one year EXTRA). Why on earth would you put any more money in the bank at no or little interest in Thailand when you can have it invested! How ridiculous! I have over here exactly what is required with an extra buffer for reasonably forseeable emergencies. Not everyone is as rich or as wasteful an investor as you, I can assure you. Money is meant to be USED. If I need extra baht, I can wire it any any time and it is in Thailand in a few days max.

Whoops! You missed a word in my post - "abroad". Sure, it's not in Thailand earning 0% interest for the reasons you have given.

retroactive enforcement sometimes ruining people's visa situation for something they cannot possibly redo (its past) - has that actually happened?YES!

When they made the 3 month seasoning rule it was immediately effective and strictly enforced to all FIRST TIME extenders of O visas in Thailand. That was most definitely a window that caught some people. They could not possibly wire money in the past, after they learned the rule, NOW COULD THEY? That was totally absurd to enforce so quickly without lead time.

Do you have any links to posts from people who actually had to leave the country because of this. Or were they given a short duration extension instead - like with this new "proof of foreign transfer" requirement.

[Jingthing]

Yes, I missed the word abroad. Of course, people retiring need resources. Duh.

No, I am not a lawyer with cases for you but I know they were enforcing this. A short or 30 day extension would not have covered 3 months. This was just an example of the kind of thing they have done, have done, and are capable of doing.