Stickman Reports Bkk 1st World Prices, 3rd World Quality

[bangkoksingapore]

this thread is strange. you guys cant even agree what the real costs are in London. the prices in Thailand are controlled by a little thing called supply and demand. personally, as a married man without children, i find it hard to spend more then 150k/month in Thailand. i would really have to wake up w/ the initiative of spending money each day to do it.

My friend rents a studio in nyc for half of that amount! So it seems that you guys are just enjoying pitying yourselves, and hey, there is always Cambodia!

[TBWG]

UK versus Thailand.

Yesterday in UK.

Trip to dentist for a clean UK ...Baht 3,400 last time I had it done in LOS Baht 600.

Plus 1 filling 30 mins ..............Baht 8,085 never had 1 in LOS so not sure of cost.

Haircut ..................................Baht 770 in LOS Baht 50 Now I don't have a lot of hair but its the same hair I take to LOS!!

Meal for 3 @ local Thai Restaurant Baht 3,550 similar meal in LOS Baht 500

2 bottles Thai beer ................. Baht 930 in LOS Baht 90

Not very scientific and not sure what it proves, but if like me food and drink play a big part in your life then LOS wins hands down every time.

TBWG

[Tinkelbell]

Hey, man, it's not a matter of money! I *choose* to live in a cardboard box (it has great ventilation!)

Back when backpackers were REAL travellers some were actually pretty close to that.. Hammock, mozzie net and a bit of plastic and the World is your hotel room.

the world can be someone elses toilet too!

Over a decade ago, seeing BKK, the the city of my birth has changed so much and so fast that I couldn't reconize it any more, let alone driving. Usually my friends or member of family would arranged a ride for me everywhere. There was an incident that opened my eyes that showed some farangs especially those backpakers have loosing prestige in which Thais once held highly for western tourists......My friend who was at the wheels did not slow down at the crossing , she was few inches from hitting those backpakers who assumed that they had right- of- way, dashed out from footpath into intersection, it scared out of my wit. Seeing what she just did, I turned to her and said....." It's lousy way to do that to any tourist, you should do anything to make them feel welcome, afterall, they come and spend their money, it's good for our country's economy. She retorted..." Yeah, they come, staying at guesthouse only and eating som-taam, guai-teuw.. i.e at food stalls.

My friend's remark had me thinking: The backpackers are beginning to worn off LOS welcome mat. I do not wish to initiate this bias comment, but this thread prompts me to reveal the reality.

[Jingthing]

Todays backpackers are tomorrow's quality tourists? A backpack is only a suitcase for the young and adventurous. I wore one once proudly. Besides, studies have shown today's backpackers spend alot more than people assume.

[obsession]

Someone said that Bangkok is getting like London!!!

I live in a nice part of London not the best and a way from the worst.

A one bedroom flat 16.5 million baht and rising which is ten times the average wage

an average Thai meal with one beer each no dessert 2760 baht

2 bottles of beer in a pub 490baht

5 takeaway sandwich lunches for work 1200baht

1 bus ride 140 baht

council tax 100,000 baht per year

just owning a car (tax insurance parking permit) 60,000 per year - does not include hp payments, petrol, servicing and wear and tear

cinema 550 baht

dvd hire 275

dvd purchase 1200 baht

massage ( 1 hour) 3450 baht

tee shirt 700 baht+

pair of levi jeans 4140 baht

1kg jasmine rice 140 baht

Just a small selection of prices. Yes I know the earning capacity is higher and relative costs are different but I find my costs are less than half when I am in Bkk.

Yes, the 1st world is a bit more expensive. Nobody is denying that. But Bkk is expensive for the quality received.

I think Bkk property is a lot more than 10 times the average wage.

[Tinkelbell]

Quote

"Todays backpackers are tomorrow's quality tourists?"

I love to tell everyone that UK former PM Tony Blair was once backpacking in SA. The story said that was how he met his future wife-to-be ( Sharon) in LOS. They came back for their second honeymoon a year after he elected to the highest office.

Personally, I alway admire those young globetrotting backpackers for their smart wit and sense of adventure. Some are newly law graduated, take one year off before going to work in highly stress job. Two of well known NY lawyers were featured as backpackers in their younger days few years back.

For those whoever venture in foreign lands, servive on little money, another word...know how to make the most of what so little available got my thump-up.

[basjke]

Hey, man, it's not a matter of money! I *choose* to live in a cardboard box (it has great ventilation!)

Back when backpackers were REAL travellers some were actually pretty close to that.. Hammock, mozzie net and a bit of plastic and the World is your hotel room.

the world can be someone elses toilet too!

Over a decade ago, seeing BKK, the the city of my birth has changed so much and so fast that I couldn't reconize it any more, let alone driving. Usually my friends or member of family would arranged a ride for me everywhere. There was an incident that opened my eyes that showed some farangs especially those backpakers have loosing prestige in which Thais once held highly for western tourists......My friend who was at the wheels did not slow down at the crossing , she was few inches from hitting those backpakers who assumed that they had right- of- way, dashed out from footpath into intersection, it scared out of my wit. : In most european country's they would have right of way according the traffic laws.

o Seeing what she just did, I turned to her and said....." It's lousy way to do that to any tourist, you should do anything to make them feel welcome, afterall, they come and spend their money, it's good for our country's economy. She retorted..." Yeah, they come, staying at guesthouse only and eating som-taam, guai-teuw.. i.e at food stalls.

Your friend sounds like a nationalist me thinks.What's wrong with eating som-taam,guai-teuw in thailand?Isn't that the national dish?

My friend's remark had me thinking: The backpackers are beginning to worn off LOS welcome mat. I do not wish to initiate this bias comment, but this thread prompts me to reveal the reality.

[000]

I have enjoyed reading stickman over the years but for a while now he has been bitching about cost of living in Thailand , imho if he realy feels that strongly about it he knows where the airport is .

JB

Funny that you don't say whether you agree him.

[Boon Mee]

In most european country's they would have right of way according the traffic laws.

Well, they ain't in Kansas now Toto...

[Ijustwannateach]

We're getting a bit off-topic here...

[bkkbaz]

Sorry mate, but thats nonsense. You have almost trebled the uk cost for food alone. The biggest pub chain in the uk ( whetherspoons ) is £3.50 for fish and chips. Maybe the £12.99 pub thought you were a foreigner and gouged you I think you recollect that wrongly.

I recollect it perfectly, thanks. Wetherspoons is MUCH cheaper than most pubs, at least in the South, because they make it up in volume. There wasn't a Wetherspoons branch in the last town I lived in.

Even the Nana hotel disco is over 500 bht to get in. ( dont tell Bendix I was there ) And it doesnt come anywhere near a !st world sound/ light system.

400bt, last I heard, so about £6.

[wilko]

I think some people should go and spend - (yes SPEND!) - a week in London or Paris and then come back and re-think on how expensive Bkk is.

Having said that it is inevitable as a country develops that the cost of living will rise....until one day it will be the same as any country in Europe or America - I suggest that those of you retirees who intend to stay here a while should factor that into your budget for the next ten years - 'coz it ain't gonna get no cheaper.

[samran]

I think some people should go and spend - (yes SPEND!) - a week in London or Paris and then come back and re-think on how expensive Bkk is.

Having said that it is inevitable as a country develops that the cost of living will rise....until one day it will be the same as any country in Europe or America - I suggest that those of you retirees who intend to stay here a while should factor that into your budget for the next ten years - 'coz it ain't gonna get no cheaper.

I know what you are saying, and there will always be differences, some up, some down, differences in quality, quantity and range.

Having lived in London, hardly anywhere compares, but this little comparison for me is a telling one (on a like for like scale). Average grocery shop in london for us was between 50 to 70 pounds. An average shop here for us at say Central supermarket or Chitlom, or even Carefore Rama VI will often bring us up to around 3000 baht.

So some things are approaching the west - on a like for like basis - but you'll make it up in other ways, such as accomadation and transport.

Swings and roundabouts!

[BAF]

Someone said that Bangkok is getting like London!!!

I live in a nice part of London not the best and a way from the worst.

A one bedroom flat 16.5 million baht and rising which is ten times the average wage

Let's try again, just a couple of examples: how often do you find yourself dodging motocys racing on the potholed sidewalks in London? How often do you see unsecured high voltage wires hanging a few feet over your head in London?

And how would you compare the crowding, the smells, the noise, the pollution, the dirtiness?

This is the point of this thread and Stickman's. Getting in Bangkok the same quality as in London or New York for a given product or service usually means they cost equal or MORE and when you are getting in Bangkok a cheaper price than in London or New York for a given product or service usually means that you are getting a worse quality...

an average Thai meal with one beer each no dessert 2760 baht

Since I don't usually eat Thai food (nor in LOS nor in my homecountry) I can't comment much but in Italy a Thai meal costs less than a Thai meal in a comparable restaurant in Thailand (the comparison comes directly from my wife).

2 bottles of beer in a pub 490baht

How much are you paying for 2 bottles of beer in a pub in Thailand? Same brand? If not, how do you rate the one you usually drink in Thailand compared to the one you usually drink in the UK?

5 takeaway sandwich lunches for work 1200baht

Do you find the same or comparable sandwiches in Thailand? How much are they?

5 takaway "paninis" (think about Subway quality) are 400-700 baht in Italy in every bakery/grocery stores (they make them before you on your instructions, again think about Subway). It's CHEAPER and TASTIER than Bangkok.

1 bus ride 140 baht

Much cheaper in Thailand but would you compare the buses themselves and their service in London with what you find in Bangkok??

Do you usually take buses in Bangkok like you do in London? Why?

BTW, an "integrated ticket" with 75 minutes of unlimited bus and trams rides plus 1 subway ride from whichever station to whichever station is 45 Baht in Milan (around 55 baht in Rome, IIRC) MUCH CHEAPER than Bangkok and much higher quality of service (the subway+skytrain systems are much newer and more modern -and much more expensive- in Bangkok but the bus system is simply from a world apart compared to Milan's bus+tram systems).

council tax 100,000 baht per year

Not comparable with Bangkok I agree, then again look at the Bangkok infrastructure and services and London's...

just owning a car (tax insurance parking permit) 60,000 per year - does not include hp payments, petrol, servicing and wear and tear

Since you are not telling what car you have we can't compare but a typical 3.0L pickup with a good coverage can approach or pass that sum.

BTW in Italy with an online insurance company I am paying Baht 16,000/year including many optional coverages which are simply not available in Thailand. Annual road tax for my car is Baht 6500/year and would be around Baht 4000 in Thailand. A good coverage in Thailand is around 5-6% of the values of the car so in my case that would be Baht 33800/in Thailand...

Servicing my car in Italy is costlier than Thailand (but the spares are usually cheaper) but the service (and the warranty on the work done) is simply not comparable...

New cars cost around the same and often less in Italy (pickups excluded which have a very small market here), used cars cost much less and middle and luxury cars cost MUCH MUCH less. AFAIK it's about the same in the UK and it's certainly the same in France and Germany.

cinema 550 baht

Much cheaper in Thailand, then again I don't get the movie cut in movie theathers here (agree it doesn't happen in BKK but in the provinces does) or censored/edited and people don't usually talk among themselves or on the phones. And the ones who do are are quickly "put in their place"...

BTW 300-400 in Italy, some weekdays evenings are 150 baht...

dvd hire 275

dvd purchase 1200 baht

Much cheaper in BKK but in London I suppose you are renting original good quality disks not cheap low quality copies as it too often happens in LOS...

BTW renting DVDs with subscription cards it can work out practically the same price here in Italy that it is in Bangkok (with subscription cards as well).

DVD purchases (original) are the same price and oftentimes less (not to talk about the choice I have here and don't have in Bangkok).

massage ( 1 hour) 3450 baht

One area where Thailand wins on all counts, then again the cost is mainly labour here and we have already talked about it...

BTW, the costs in the better (legit) massage places in BKK are the same and even more but I can't compare since I don't know what you get in London for 3450 Baht.

tee shirt 700 baht+

pair of levi jeans 4140 baht

The same which applies to DVD applies here as well...

I don't know what kind of T-shirts (brand, quality) you are talking about but Levi's jeans are 2000/3500 Baht here. I think they cost more in BKK (not sure since I have never bought apparel in Thailand besides dirt cheap "disposable" clothing which is available in Italy as well anyway for just slightly more)

1kg jasmine rice 140 baht

Much cheaper in Thailand (20 Baht/kg?).

My wife is paying 65 baht/kg here in Italy (she buys 25 kgs sacks).

Just a small selection of prices. Yes I know the earning capacity is higher and relative costs are different but I find my costs are less than half when I am in Bkk.

I doubt about "less than half" (you haven't quoted the Thai equivalent prices) but are you getting the same as in London? This is the whole point.

And please bear in mind that London is one of the most expensive cities in the world. Almost all of the other Western cities where you find the exact same Western standard of goods and services are MUCH CHEAPER than London. In other words, your costs would be "less than half" even in some Western cities and maintaining the same Western standards as in London which you simply don't find in Thailand...

Edited August 12, 2007 by BAF

[al warner]

Will i still be able to get 3 chang for 100b in Khonburi?

[BAF]

Will i still be able to get 3 chang for 100b in Khonburi?

Oh yeah, forgot about the beer...

In a Rome or Milan mall a sixpack of "cheap" Italian brews (Peroni, Nastro Azzurro, Birra Moretti etc) cost around the same of a sixpack of the "best" Thai brews (Singha and Chang) in a Bangkok mall...

...and I don't have to worry about dangerous chemicals and addictives.

I don't comment about the taste since it's a personal matter, I personally like Italian brews much better and would LOVE to be able to drink them in Thailand's bars and nightclubs.

[al warner]

Will i still be able to get 3 chang for 100b in Khonburi?

Oh yeah, forgot about the beer...

In a Rome or Milan mall a sixpack of "cheap" Italian brews (Peroni, Nastro Azzurro, Birra Moretti etc) cost around the same of a sixpack of the "best" Thai brews (Singha and Chang) in a Bangkok mall...

...and I don't have to worry about dangerous chemicals and addictives.

I don't comment about the taste since it's a personal matter, I personally like Italian brews much better and would LOVE to be able to drink them in Thailand's bars and nightclubs.

The chemicals do worry me a bit to be honest.

But it's 3 beers. For 100b. So the belly gets bigger, much to the amusement of my genetically perfect in-laws.

[rychrde]

Someone said that Bangkok is getting like London!!!

I live in a nice part of London not the best and a way from the worst.

A one bedroom flat 16.5 million baht and rising which is ten times the average wage

Let's try again, just a couple of examples: how often do you find yourself dodging motocys racing on the potholed sidewalks in London? How often do you see unsecured high voltage wires hanging a few feet over your head in London?

And how would you compare the crowding, the smells, the noise, the pollution, the dirtiness?

This is the point of this thread and Stickman's. Getting in Bangkok the same quality as in London or New York for a given product or service usually means they cost equal or MORE and when you are getting in Bangkok a cheaper price than in London or New York for a given product or service usually means that you are getting a worse quality...

an average Thai meal with one beer each no dessert 2760 baht

Since I don't usually eat Thai food (nor in LOS nor in my homecountry) I can't comment much but in Italy a Thai meal costs less than a Thai meal in a comparable restaurant in Thailand (the comparison comes directly from my wife).

2 bottles of beer in a pub 490baht

How much are you paying for 2 bottles of beer in a pub in Thailand? Same brand? If not, how do you rate the one you usually drink in Thailand compared to the one you usually drink in the UK?

5 takeaway sandwich lunches for work 1200baht

Do you find the same or comparable sandwiches in Thailand? How much are they?

5 takaway "paninis" (think about Subway quality) are 400-700 baht in Italy in every bakery/grocery stores (they make them before you on your instructions, again think about Subway). It's CHEAPER and TASTIER than Bangkok.

1 bus ride 140 baht

Much cheaper in Thailand but would you compare the buses themselves and their service in London with what you find in Bangkok??

Do you usually take buses in Bangkok like you do in London? Why?

BTW, an "integrated ticket" with 75 minutes of unlimited bus and trams rides plus 1 subway ride from whichever station to whichever station is 45 Baht in Milan (around 55 baht in Rome, IIRC) MUCH CHEAPER than Bangkok and much higher quality of service (the subway+skytrain systems are much newer and more modern -and much more expensive- in Bangkok but the bus system is simply from a world apart compared to Milan's bus+tram systems).

council tax 100,000 baht per year

Not comparable with Bangkok I agree, then again look at the Bangkok infrastructure and services and London's...

just owning a car (tax insurance parking permit) 60,000 per year - does not include hp payments, petrol, servicing and wear and tear

Since you are not telling what car you have we can't compare but a typical 3.0L pickup with a good coverage can approach or pass that sum.

BTW in Italy with an online insurance company I am paying Baht 16,000/year including many optional coverages which are simply not available in Thailand. Annual road tax for my car is Baht 6500/year and would be around Baht 4000 in Thailand. A good coverage in Thailand is around 5-6% of the values of the car so in my case that would be Baht 33800/in Thailand...

Servicing my car in Italy is costlier than Thailand (but the spares are usually cheaper) but the service (and the warranty on the work done) is simply not comparable...

New cars cost around the same and often less in Italy (pickups excluded which have a very small market here), used cars cost much less and middle and luxury cars cost MUCH MUCH less. AFAIK it's about the same in the UK and it's certainly the same in France and Germany.

cinema 550 baht

Much cheaper in Thailand, then again I don't get the movie cut in movie theathers here (agree it doesn't happen in BKK but in the provinces does) or censored/edited and people don't usually talk among themselves or on the phones. And the ones who do are are quickly "put in their place"...

BTW 300-400 in Italy, some weekdays evenings are 150 baht...

dvd hire 275

dvd purchase 1200 baht

Much cheaper in BKK but in London I suppose you are renting original good quality disks not cheap low quality copies as it too often happens in LOS...

BTW renting DVDs with subscription cards it can work out practically the same price here in Italy that it is in Bangkok (with subscription cards as well).

DVD purchases (original) are the same price and oftentimes less (not to talk about the choice I have here and don't have in Bangkok).

massage ( 1 hour) 3450 baht

One area where Thailand wins on all counts, then again the cost is mainly labour here and we have already talked about it...

BTW, the costs in the better (legit) massage places in BKK are the same and even more but I can't compare since I don't know what you get in London for 3450 Baht.

tee shirt 700 baht+

pair of levi jeans 4140 baht

The same which applies to DVD applies here as well...

I don't know what kind of T-shirts (brand, quality) you are talking about but Levi's jeans are 2000/3500 Baht here. I think they cost more in BKK (not sure since I have never bought apparel in Thailand besides dirt cheap "disposable" clothing which is available in Italy as well anyway for just slightly more)

1kg jasmine rice 140 baht

Much cheaper in Thailand (20 Baht/kg?).

My wife is paying 65 baht/kg here in Italy (she buys 25 kgs sacks).

Just a small selection of prices. Yes I know the earning capacity is higher and relative costs are different but I find my costs are less than half when I am in Bkk.

I doubt about "less than half" (you haven't quoted the Thai equivalent prices) but are you getting the same as in London? This is the whole point.

And please bear in mind that London is one of the most expensive cities in the world. Almost all of the other Western cities where you find the exact same Western standard of goods and services are MUCH CHEAPER than London. In other words, your costs would be "less than half" even in some Western cities and maintaining the same Western standards as in London which you simply don't find in Thailand...

mmm... where exactly in Italy do you get your prices from?

admittedly, Italian food on a quality per price comparison with London is still better, but last time I was there I was being charged for the air I breathed.

And yes, London must be now one of the most expensive cities on the planet - even my brother in Tokyo thinks so.

rych

Edited August 12, 2007 by rychrde

[bangkoksingapore]

"Since I don't usually eat Thai food (nor in LOS nor in my homecountry) I can't comment much but in Italy a Thai meal costs less than a Thai meal in a comparable restaurant in Thailand (the comparison comes directly from my wife)."

What?

[BAF]

The chemicals do worry me a bit to be honest.

But it's 3 beers. For 100b.

Exactly the OP's point. You get a better deal in Bangkok if you are willing to compromise on the quality of what you get.

[BAF]

mmm... where exactly in Italy do you get your prices from?

I wrote where, Milano and Roma. Prices for the Thai rice and the insurance of my car is for my 45,000 pop hometown (the rice would be less in a bigger city, the insurance slightly more).

Which of my quoted prices do you disagree on?

admittedly, Italian food on a quality per price comparison with London is still better, but last time I was there I was being charged for the air I breathed.

Examples?

And yes, London must be now one of the most expensive cities on the planet - even my brother in Tokyo thinks so.

Exactly. And you get the same Western standards you get in London pretty much everywhere in the West for much better prices so if all Bangkok can hope for is to be cheaper than London (for a much lower standard of goods and services)... well, it says it all no?

All these London based guys who praise Bangkok prices should be praising other Western cities prices instead, where for less money than in London they would get the same quality as in London.

[al warner]

The chemicals do worry me a bit to be honest.

But it's 3 beers. For 100b.

Exactly the OP's point. You get a better deal in Bangkok if you are willing to compromise on the quality of what you get.

I'm in Khonburi.

figuratively at the moment...

[BAF]

"Since I don't usually eat Thai food (nor in LOS nor in my homecountry) I can't comment much but in Italy a Thai meal costs less than a Thai meal in a comparable restaurant in Thailand (the comparison comes directly from my wife)."

What?

The Thai meals which are cheaper in Bangkok are those cooked and sold on the pavement or in the lower class of restaurants (the ones whose standards, hygiene etc wouldn't be allowed in the West).

[capaotung]

Todays backpackers are tomorrow's quality tourists?

Maybe but I like to keep well away from KaoSanRoad... They don't do much good to promote a good image of us farangs amongst the Thais.

[englishoak]

Maybe but I like to keep well away from KaoSanRoad... They don't do much good to promote a good image of us farangs amongst the Thais.

Do you mean Backpackers or younger people ?? I suspect you mean the latter........ Most of the Kaosanroad are not backpackers but young tourists ........ very different crowd.

[Ulysses G.]

When I first came here I was a backpacker, but I spent a heck of a lot of money.

I just HATE spending insane amounts of money for a place to sleep every night as you have to in the Western World which is why I hardly ever traveled there.

I don't mind spending money on good food, clothing, drink, etc., but $100. dollars per night just for a place to sleep is absurd.

[wilko]

Comparing like with like has its drawbacks - e.g. butter, Marmite, Cod, Parmigiana, Pok-Pok, even the cost of cars - you have to make changes when you move from one country to another - the cost of sandwiches? Baking is an imported art

[kankaroo]

Bangkok is getting like London, Sticks right about the pricing thing, but thats why I usually stay the hel_l away Bangkok

I cant think of anything that i pay for when in Thailand that compares with the prices i pay in London , the only and nearest thing i can think of is a cup of starbucks coffee and i think its 30/50 percent cheaper in Thailand to uk .

JB

Ps i think some people just like to complaine about everything like my next door neigbour that complained about the birds singing in the trees

Well alcohol in (most) bars is more expensive or the same price as in the UK when you consider that they are mostly sold in small bottles. If you consider the average pint of beer is between 2.30 - 2.60 GBP and the same quantity of beer in TL over 3 squid. However it is usually higher percentage. Anyway what do I care as I cant even afford to go out drinking here in the UK anyway, never mind get on a plane to BKK Sob !

PS : I must be an irritable sod too coz if I had a shotgun last time I lived in BKK I would have used it on this particular bird that woke me up every morning around 5am with the loudest continual squawk you have ever heard ! And considering I donate to different animal charities..............

[chinthee]

Bangkok is getting like London, Sticks right about the pricing thing, but thats why I usually stay the hel_l away Bangkok

I cant think of anything that i pay for when in Thailand that compares with the prices i pay in London , the only and nearest thing i can think of is a cup of starbucks coffee and i think its 30/50 percent cheaper in Thailand to uk .

JB

Ps i think some people just like to complaine about everything like my next door neigbour that complained about the birds singing in the trees

Well alcohol in (most) bars is more expensive or the same price as in the UK when you consider that they are mostly sold in small bottles. If you consider the average pint of beer is between 2.30 - 2.60 GBP and the same quantity of beer in TL over 3 squid. However it is usually higher percentage. Anyway what do I care as I cant even afford to go out drinking here in the UK anyway, never mind get on a plane to BKK Sob !

PS : I must be an irritable sod too coz if I had a shotgun last time I lived in BKK I would have used it on this particular bird that woke me up every morning around 5am with the loudest continual squawk you have ever heard ! And considering I donate to different animal charities..............

That bird is a Minah bird, Indian Minah, or in Thai a "Nok eeyan." You were saying...

[kankaroo]

Todays backpackers are tomorrow's quality tourists?

Maybe but I like to keep well away from KaoSanRoad... They don't do much good to promote a good image of us farangs amongst the Thais.

Well it depends on how you look at it. I imagine some of the older generation may not be too pleased brushing shoulders with some of the elements founds wandering in the KSR area (unless they are sellingb them something).

And look how many young Thais love to go there for fun ! It is a change for them. Horses for courses I believe.